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Post by greyman on Mar 27, 2019 15:15:36 GMT
I don't have an agenda. I'm pointing out that both made choices based on the rules. As have many of McLean's English born team mates. That is all there is to it. And Rice actually is English. I just wish he'd keep his trap shut because all he's doing is giving people ammunition. Just to point out I wasn't saying you yourself had an agenda mate. Nothing wrong with a healthy debate. Fair enough. I'm generally on McLean's side and I think he should be free to wear what he likes and think what he likes. But he doesn't do himself any favours. Somebody should sit down with him and create an alternative scenario in which an English protestant joins Derry City and turns his back on the tricolour, quotes members of the Parachute Regiment and mouths off about the English born players who have played for Ireland, then moans endlessly about the treatment he gets from fans.
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Post by greyman on Mar 27, 2019 12:53:53 GMT
The article doesn't mention the number of English born players in the Irish squad either. JM changed / chose teams based on the rules and so did Declan Rice. He can't object to Rice doing it when he did too along with several of his current team mates. Rice and McClean's situations were not the same. McClean was not allowed to represent Ireland before the law change where as Rice has always had both options. Rice made three appearance's for the senior team, McClean turned down the opportunity to represent the North at senior level. Completely different. People with an anti-McClean agenda often only state half truths and misinformation. This filters through to morons who believe everything they read and then the dye is set. I don't have an agenda. I'm pointing out that both made choices based on the rules. As have many of McLean's English born team mates. That is all there is to it. And Rice actually is English. I just wish he'd keep his trap shut because all he's doing is giving people ammunition.
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Post by greyman on Mar 27, 2019 11:49:33 GMT
Maclean hitting out at Declan Rice. linkHis statement makes no sense. He played for the N.I under 21's. So either he's a Hypocrite, or not too bright. Or both. It is important to point out that McClean only had the option of playing for Ireland after he had already played for the North at U21's or whatever. As soon as the rules permitted those born in the North to switch and represent Ireland, that's what he did. Obviously painting the full picture didn't suit the article writers agenda. The article doesn't mention the number of English born players in the Irish squad either. JM changed / chose teams based on the rules and so did Declan Rice. He can't object to Rice doing it when he did too along with several of his current team mates.
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Post by greyman on Mar 27, 2019 10:42:13 GMT
Declan Rice was born in Kingston upon Thames. So he's playing for his birth nation, unlike James McLean. I just wish McLean would help himself.
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Post by greyman on Mar 25, 2019 10:05:14 GMT
Anyone remember when we played Coventry at the Brit when he was their manager? We had an appalling ref that day (and I think there might even have been a fan got onto the pitch to have a go at him) and after the game our manager (GT, Quitters or TP?)had a go at the ref in his post match interview and Gary backed him up and said he was one of the worst managers he had seen that season. Top bloke is Gary. I think Dave Kevan was in charge, after the Quitter did his flit. Pulis was manager that day
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Post by greyman on Mar 25, 2019 10:01:58 GMT
Anyone remember when we played Coventry at the Brit when he was their manager? We had an appalling ref that day (and I think there might even have been a fan got onto the pitch to have a go at him) and after the game our manager (GT, Quitters or TP?)had a go at the ref in his post match interview and Gary backed him up and said he was one of the worst managers he had seen that season. Top bloke is Gary. The ref was Andy Hall. By some distance the most abject refereeing performance I've ever seen.
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Post by greyman on Mar 22, 2019 12:01:17 GMT
I am guessing that its a preagreed punishment between Brum and the EFL so no appeal (even if they have the right to) Interesting they have taken it now (as little prospect of play offs), not in relegation bother even after it, so a good time to take it if there is one. They're two bad results from being dragged into into it and they've just lost four games on the bounce.
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Post by greyman on Mar 5, 2019 15:36:20 GMT
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Post by greyman on Mar 5, 2019 7:00:32 GMT
From The Times today.
Football fans need help in their fight against bad owners Henry Winter, chief football writer
Two men with a ladder did the honours at Bloomfield Road yesterday, one holding the steps steady, the other climbing up and removing an advertisement for Oyston’s estate agency. It will take longer to expunge completely the taint of the Oyston family on this famous old ground but thanks to Blackpool’s indefatigable supporters, the fumigation process is under way.
Invited to join “the big clean-up”, fans reported eagerly for duty to clear the North Stand, some clutching tangerine buckets. As fans prepared to return to the stadium after the ousting of the Oystons, the cleansing was symbolic as well as much needed. Scrubbing away the guilt of the authorities will take rather longer.
It is a stain on the name of the EFL, arguably the Premier League initially, that it failed to act when it became apparent that the Oystons’ running of the club involved running it down. The EFL meets tomorrow to decide whether to deduct points from Blackpool for going into receivership, a possibility causing understandable outrage as the League itself failed to call the odious Oystons to account, to question their motives and antics, to ask where all the Premier League money had gone.
Blackpool Supporters’ Trust, and tireless “Oyston Out” campaigners such as its chairman Christine Seddon, showed more backbone, showing up EFL inaction.
It is the fans who are the true guardians of the game, protecting clubs, promoting integrity, cherishing history and resisting the charlatans. It is the fans who shake buckets and raise funds, organise boycotts, lobby MPs, and print up protest paraphernalia, even ensuring they have the required fire certificates to take banners into grounds.
The EFL, FA and Premier League should think about the two men and a ladder, and the tens of thousands of supporters protesting about controversial owners from Blackpool to Bolton Wanderers, Charlton Athletic to Coventry City, Port Vale and beyond.
Many well-intentioned people inhabit the corridors of power, and some follow clubs who have slid down the pyramid thanks to uncaring, unthinking owners, yet the leadership of these national bodies have let them, the clubs and the game down. They stand accused of being Neros in blazers, fiddling while clubs burn.
The governance of English football is at a key moment. The three main footballing authorities interview for new chief executives, who could, if enlightened, make a real difference to safeguarding clubs. If the Premier League simply seeks an exec who does not worry about the soul of the game, or the match-going supporters, just somebody who can get top dollar, pound or yen from broadcasters, then it is to be hoped the FA and EFL appoint individuals with some empathy with the game, with the character to stand up to those owners harming clubs.
It’s happening again, the curse of unpopular owners now striking at Vale.
Fans march from Burslem Town Hall to Vale Park, opposing the retired businessman Norman Smurthwaite, demanding to know where recent windfalls, from the sale of Jordan Hugill and Checkatrade and FA Cup runs, have gone and why he won’t sell at a sensible price.
Last weekend during the League Two game at Notts County’s Meadow Lane, 1,200 travelling Vale fans chanted “Norman Smurthwaite, get out of our club”.
These are passionate fans, mobilising to defend their club, taking it in their stride when Vale Social gets flooded so the Supporters’ Club meeting is moved to Burslem Golf Club. “We are facing football oblivion,” the supporters’ club chairman Mark Porter told the gathering. Vale are perilously close to slipping into non-League.
Echoing Manchester United fans’ early “green and gold” protest against the unloved Glazer family, Vale supporters adopted their historic colours “Black and Gold Until It’s Sold”. The Stoke Sentinel ran a “Vale in Crisis” series and although Vale’s travails have not registered widely on the national agenda, their problems fill another episode in the tragi-drama afflicting the game.
Take Charlton Athletic, a once model club turned into a soap opera by the Belgian businessmen Roland Duchâtelet, whose recent utterances, including the proposal of selling the club to the EFL, suggest somebody bordering on the deluded. Again, fans have rallied to their club’s aid, and if some of their more extreme tactics have cost them some sympathy, at least Charlton devotees have acted while the EFL hesitates.
The game is crying out for leaders with courage. The old notion that it is an owner’s business to do with a club as he or she sees fit is outdated and morally wrong anyway. Trashing a club is bringing the game into disrepute. The EFL should be having a word with Ken Anderson, the rather strange owner of Bolton Wanderers. Life is bleeding from the Championship club. “Bolton close training ground because of food shortage,” read the headline in The Bolton News yesterday. Staff have not been paid for February. As the authorities look on, it is left to the Bolton Wanderers Supporters’ Trust to consider having a (large) whip-round to help. The authorities plead it is out of their hands, that the Owners’ and Directors’ test, the check formerly known as the Fit and Proper Persons’ test, means that, effectively, they can allow anybody to swan in and mess about with an English institution providing they don’t have a criminal record. As the sad, old saying in football goes, Robert Mugabe could buy an English club and the EFL would wave him through.
The FA, supposedly the guardian of the game, should become more involved, asking more questions. How is Sisu, the wretched hedge fund draining the life from Coventry City, allowed to get away with years of silence, litigation, and damaging a historic club? Because the authorities did not act. Is Joy Seppala, chief executive of Sisu, one of the most loathed people in football, standing accused of utter contempt for Coventry fans and English football?
Yes, and the EFL and FA should have summoned Seppala to explain her plans for Coventry. Is Seppala really as heartless as depicted? All the signs are that she is. Get out of our sport.
It should embarrass the EFL that Coventry have to inform the League by today where they will be playing next season. It could be the Ricoh, owned by the rugby club Wasps, who will not extend the lease because of Sisu legal wrangles, or elsewhere. Coventry council leader George Duggins, of Longford Ward, Coventry, pleaded with Sisu not to “play Russian roulette with the future of our great football club”. There have even been questions in the House. But not enough from the EFL. So it has been left to fans to campaign and pray. Coventry would be dead without their supporters, waving their “Save Our Club” placards.
And how would officials at the EFL, the Premier League and the FA feel if a name so synonymous with the heart of football, who brought in some of the most significant innovations in the game such as all-seater stands, disappeared on their watch? Shame.
Clubs can survive bad owners, like Leyton Orient in the Francesco Becchetti era and Portsmouth under the questionable likes of Vladimir Antonov, through the constancy of fans. O’s supporters stayed loyal and now have proper owners in Nigel Travis and Kent Teague. Pompey Supporters’ Trust saved a national treasure with all the commitment and expertise of those who raised the Mary Rose. The Eisner family, mainly the American businessman Michael and his son Eric, have come in and proved capable and caring owners of Portsmouth. Importantly, they listen and engage, and genuinely seem to enjoy the Pompey experience.
Years of protests appear to have paid off at Ewood Park where Blackburn Rovers’ owners, Venky’s, the Indian family poultry firm, seem to have heeded fans’ anger at their chaotic management. They are not interfering, they are not listening to the wrong people, not relying on agents with agendas, and Ewood Park is a much better place. One family member quietly travels to Ewood to watch games. Yet Rovers fans understandably are cautious. It seems only yesterday they were smuggling chickens on to the pitch to hold up games and holding up banners reading “Made in Blackburn, Destroyed in India”.
The authorities, including the three new leaders when appointed, must begin to follow fans in standing up to rogue owners and, if necessary, getting the ladder out and bringing them down a peg or two.
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Post by greyman on Feb 26, 2019 15:51:13 GMT
You missed out Harry Kane. On loan at Orient, Millwall, Norwich and Leicester. Breakthrough season at Spurs age 21. I assume the 3rd player on the above list is Harry Kane - unless he has a brother of whom I was unaware! Defoe is another one - who gained experience on a season long loan at Bornemouth (for whom he scored against us) before returning to West Ham's first team the following season. Bugger edited it
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Post by greyman on Feb 26, 2019 9:10:45 GMT
Under Rowett we conceded at a rate of 1.15 goals per League game. Under Jones that has declined to 1.38. Rowett's run rate of points per game was piss poor but would not have got us relegated. Jones current run rate shows a decline to less than one point per game and is relegation form. It is - as you say - early days and its not his squad. However the same could have been said for Lambert last season - who in league position terms took over a worse situation - however precious little patience was afforded to him. Jones has the advantage of being third, he can play the "give me more time card" and use the two previous managers as an example. Lambert should've been given some backing in January - not signing a striker cost us our place in the premier league. Rowett should've been given more time, expectations were ridiculously high and he was doing an okay but largely uninspiring job, given 18 months I think he could have put a decent team together. NJ will surely get more time despite the horrendous start, sacking him in the summer would put us back to square one and the rebuild starts all over again. Back him and give him a few years minimum and fingers crossed he delivers a side akin to his team at Luton. The problem with Rowett wasn't just his performance, despite the tedium. I would have given him as much time as I'm prepared to give Jones given the shambles both inherited. His fatal mistake was making stupid comments about the supporters.
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Post by greyman on Feb 26, 2019 7:51:25 GMT
Easy Here's ten: Beckham, Lampard,Kane,Darren Sturridge, Andy Cole, Welbeck,John Terry,Victor Moses, Ashley Cole and Danny Rose. All loaned out and come back to their parent clubs and gone with successful careers. You missed out Harry Kane. On loan at Orient, Millwall, Norwich and Leicester. Breakthrough season at Spurs age 21.
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Post by greyman on Feb 22, 2019 15:37:43 GMT
No I wasn't. You're going to have to try a lot harder than this. Sorry my mistake. Apology accepted. I don't know why you say you were at Layer Road. You weren't even a Stoke fan back then as you've admitted yourself.
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Post by greyman on Feb 22, 2019 13:58:30 GMT
Remember. It's only what you say happened. The truth is different. This is just like that time you were cheering on in the away end the day we were relegated. Is this how it works? I was in the away end at Layer Road cheering on my team. You were in Belgium crawling up a non entity fat mans anus cheering on his meat coated colon! No I wasn't. You're going to have to try a lot harder than this.
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Post by greyman on Feb 22, 2019 13:19:08 GMT
You're going to have to try much harder. I understand your sense of shame. I'd feel exactly the same way if I'd done what you did. Remember. It's only what you say happened. The truth is different. This is just like that time you were cheering on in the away end the day we were relegated. Is this how it works?
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Post by greyman on Feb 22, 2019 8:56:17 GMT
This reminds me of that time you said you hoped we'd get relegated so a certain manager could come back because he's bigger than the club. If you deny you said it, that just proves you said it. *How this works. Just like when you missed us getting promoted to make a childish point about a great manager in our history to fellate a fat nobody in our history. Oh hang on....that is actually true isn't it! You're going to have to try much harder.
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Post by greyman on Feb 22, 2019 6:16:14 GMT
How interesting. So glad that you gave us the benefit of your, shall we say, "vivid" imagination. My pleasure, clem. Always willing to educate pro bono. This reminds me of that time you said you hoped we'd get relegated so a certain manager could come back because he's bigger than the club. If you deny you said it, that just proves you said it. *How this works.
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Post by greyman on Feb 19, 2019 12:52:07 GMT
Man alive. The majority of people on this thread will be eligible for jury duty. I would be absolutely petrified if I was being tried with you lot deciding my fate! He has been arrested on SUSPICION of driving with excess alcohol. That was PROBABLY as a result of a roadside specimen bring provided. That is all we know. What I know is roadside specimens are not evidential and are notoriously unreliable. He may have blown under at the police station on the evidential intoxylyser therefore no charge, certainly the press don't report any charge. That is before we even consider the circumstances regarding his arrest. He MIGHT (although unlikely) have a defence of duress. He POSSIBLY has a special reasons argument. But let's forget all the imponderables and get him sacked dead quick. Who's up for a pitch fork protest down Clayton Woods! If you think it's bad on here wait until you're called for actual jury service. When I was my fellow jurors wanted to watch Jeremy Kyle instead of Homes under the Hammer! When they started to discuss the 'brilliant' Mrs Browns Boys I went to the desk and asked, as I was my mum's full time carer, could I be excused! Luckily they let me go! Unlike the poor bastard who was sent down by them for looking a bit funny.
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Post by greyman on Feb 19, 2019 12:49:34 GMT
Anyone complaining about women's high pitched voices in the commentary is basically answering their own question about sexism in football. I'm sure there was similar outrage when women first read the news on "the wireless". I can only assume that, with that user name, you're being ironic
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Post by greyman on Feb 19, 2019 9:48:56 GMT
If the male pundits were better, there may be some valid criticism. But Alex Scott is clearly a better pundit than some idiot like Danny Murphy muttering the sort of inane bullshit anybody could come out with.
So, I'm all for it. Although I'd like to see anybody who says about games that 'the women could teach the men a thing or two' attacked with a cattle prod live on air. Either that or set up the match to end the argument once and for all.
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Post by greyman on Feb 18, 2019 18:28:25 GMT
If they're going to be seeking legal advice about sacking this waste of space, they should throw Mark Cartwright's name into the hat while they're there. Enough. The clearout should be starting now and go right to the top.
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 13:51:40 GMT
The point is, and I don't know why I bother, that nobody has ever said 'goals don't matter'. You made that up. And repeating it doesn't make it true. This is exactly like that time you made a living as a twink in the Bangkok Hilton. #pray4goals #wontsomeonethinkofthedenderbenders This is exactly like the time you walked one thousand miles just to be the man who walked one thousand miles to fall down at my door. I'm still looking forward to you pointing out when I - or anybody else for that matter - have ever said 'goals don't matter'. Should be easy given your attachment to the idea.
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 12:34:14 GMT
No I didn't. This is exactly like the time you robbed from your own gran. Really. Old Stokie told me that you were there. A full turnout on the 'Parade of the wankstains'. When goals mattered. The point is, and I don't know why I bother, that nobody has ever said 'goals don't matter'. You made that up. And repeating it doesn't make it true. This is exactly like that time you made a living as a twink in the Bangkok Hilton.
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 12:21:17 GMT
Hey mate. I don't make the rules about how you debate on here. It's like the time you killed that puppy. You did go to Dendleeuw to rim a fat Dutchman because goals mattered then, didn't they mate? No straw, just the facts! No I didn't. This is exactly like the time you robbed from your own gran.
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 12:06:34 GMT
I know. It's like that time yesterday even before the game had kicked off you said Jones should be sacked. You can deny it but that just proves you said it. Is there a time when goals will matter or will you be in Denderleeuw by then? Hey mate. I don't make the rules about how you debate on here. It's like the time you killed that puppy.
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 11:27:36 GMT
Well, no and no. I'm sure everybody is as fascinated and interested in your relentless strawmanning as I am. So let's call it a day there. I've got work to do and you need to lie down. Ah, the last resort of the man who has been exposed for the Pulis obsessed hypocrite he is! The strawman comes out. The Oatcake's very own Godwin's Rule I know. It's like that time yesterday even before the game had kicked off you said Jones should be sacked. You can deny it but that just proves you said it.
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 11:20:09 GMT
I mentioned it to my lad because some people are still hung up on Pulis. This thread absolutely proves it but there are others. My point is exactly that people should stop going on about him. It's history. You haven't explained the goals thing at all. You created a straw man argument and you've been called out on it. That is all. Nobody has ever said 'goals don't matter'. You made it up. There's plenty of examples on this board in the last 7 days saying that results and goals don't matter, 'just support the team/manger. etc. 'nothing else matters' and you're going down the exact same road. So entirely independently of this board you brought up Pulis in a conversation about Jones, something I can assure you I have not done in any of personal conversations about Jones on the basis of it being completely irrelevant. Worrying? A tad? Well, no and no. I'm sure everybody is as fascinated and interested in your relentless strawmanning as I am. So let's call it a day there. I've got work to do and you need to lie down.
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 11:01:09 GMT
You compared Pulis's spending on players with recent managers IN THIS THREAD. You dragged up the whole boring PHW thing IN THIS THREAD. And you did it before I'd even mentioned him. IN THIS THREAD. It was other people who were comparing Jones to Pulis, not me. I asked them to stop. And still am. And guess what, you still haven't answered the question. Who has ever said 'goals don't matter'? I didn't bring Pulis up though it was in response to other people comparing the two. It's clear from your conversation with your son, which took place prior to and outside of the microcosm of this thread that you are absolutely obsessed with Pulis and want to transfer opinions on to others that simply don't exist, most likely to assuage your own hypocrisy on the matter! I've explained the goals thing. Take it or leave it. I mentioned it to my lad because some people are still hung up on Pulis. This thread absolutely proves it but there are others. My point is exactly that people should stop going on about him. It's history. You haven't explained the goals thing at all. You created a straw man argument and you've been called out on it. That is all. Nobody has ever said 'goals don't matter'. You made it up.
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 10:48:19 GMT
You're right. It is exactly like arguing with a six year old. So, because I'm the adult in this conversation and you're behaving like a child: I don't believe it's about Pulis. But some people do. That's my point. It's about Nathan Jones. There are people on here openly comparing the two, including you. And you need to stop it. If nobody ever mentioned Pulis ever again on here, it would suit me fine. I'm not defending 'shot shy'. I haven't defended anything or criticised anything. I just think we should give the bloke time and judge him then. That's the grown up thing to do. And you still haven't answered that question. It's almost like you made the whole thing up. Where have I compared Jones to Pulis? More utter bollocks. I didn't bring Pulis into it and its you who has come up with some weird association between Jones and Pulis, resurrecting ancient conflicts in the process. I've explained what amuses me about your stance on the two managers and goals. Take it or leave it. You compared Pulis's spending on players with recent managers IN THIS THREAD. You dragged up the whole boring PHW thing IN THIS THREAD. And you did it before I'd even mentioned him. IN THIS THREAD. It was other people who were comparing Jones to Pulis, not me. I asked them to stop. And still am. And guess what, you still haven't answered the question. Who has ever said 'goals don't matter'?
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Post by greyman on Feb 14, 2019 10:26:39 GMT
Which I said AFTER you'd brought Pulis into it with the tedious Pulista / Wankstain thing. Anyway go take one of your HRT pills and come back with an answer to the question of who said 'goals don't matter'. Fuck me it's like arguing with a six year old. If you really believe this is about Pulis, which you clearly do, I fear for your mental fortitude. It amuses me that you travelled to Belgium to suck fat Dutch todger because you found shot shy Pulisball shit and now you're defending shot shy shit to the hilt and somehow still blaming Pulis for it! It' a work of genius really! You're right. It is exactly like arguing with a six year old. So, because I'm the adult in this conversation and you're behaving like a child: I don't believe it's about Pulis. But some people do. That's my point. It's about Nathan Jones. There are people on here openly comparing the two, including you. And you need to stop it. If nobody ever mentioned Pulis ever again on here, it would suit me fine. I'm not defending 'shot shy'. I haven't defended anything or criticised anything. I just think we should give the bloke time and judge him then. That's the grown up thing to do. And you still haven't answered that question. It's almost like you made the whole thing up.
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