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Post by lawrieleslie on Sept 29, 2024 6:33:10 GMT
Seen it time and time again and opposition just press & harass the back 4 stopping any meaningful forward movement. However in the odd time we do move forward the midfield don’t seem to have any idea what to do and nobody is making any space or diagonal runs at the opposition. As someone says it’s basic training ground stuff.
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Post by emretezzy on Sept 29, 2024 6:37:01 GMT
Seen it time and time again and opposition just press & harass the back 4 stopping any meaningful forward movement. However in the odd time we do move forward the midfield don’t seem to have any idea what to do and nobody is making any space or diagonal runs at the opposition. As someone says it’s basic training ground stuff. They let us piss about with it yesterday along the back. They got in shape and the moment we played it forward they basically won it back straight away. They are taking breaks from pressing knowing we don't have one bit of quality to break through lines. It's embarrassing. I don't think there is any greater ridicule in football where they let you keep it along the back four as they know as soon as you try and play it forward you'll just lose it. |
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Post by emretezzy on Sept 29, 2024 6:45:01 GMT
My take is that it should have been easier for us to play away than at home.
The midfield is shite. The defense is shite. But we do at least have pace and the ability to play on the counter.
I'd have played deep, written off trying to play through midfield as they can't and just used them as shields to be as close to the back 4 as possible.
I'd have kept Koumas, Million, Cannon (Gallagher) high up the pitch and when we turned over the ball. Play it up as quick as we could and try and hit them on the counter.
We've conceded 5 goals already, it's just not going to work. We've got to be compact and hit teams with the only plus point we have.
At home is going to be difficult as fans are going to want front-foot football but away from home it would have been fine.
Instead we got 1000 passes between Wilmot and Gibson that allowed Middlesborough to get back in shape.
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Post by collo68 on Sept 29, 2024 7:01:48 GMT
Just watched the Chelsea vs Brighton highlights on MOTD. Six goals in that fixture, at least half of them come from teams trying to play out from the back under too much pressure and then eventually making a mistake. Conceding that many goals to silly mistakes is crazy. I accept that logic that you'll occasionally concede playing that way but, over the course of a whole season it's preferable to always hoofing it out and giving up possession. But some of the goals that get given away in recent years, with squads that very obviously aren't technically good enough to play like 2008 Barcelona, is just silly. I don't fully understand why coaches at every level of the game are under the thrall of this one specific way of playing. It's not good for the tactical diversity of the sport. Players are basically having all creativity coached out of them and forced to follow very rigid systems rather than feeling empowered to use their best judgement about how to play their way out of situations. It's actually a pretty weird to think that footballers are, as a whole, technically better than they've ever been but are given a lot less creative than they were 20 years ago. Spot on, goals are conceded like this in nearly every Premier league game, it’s pathetic |
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Post by ethers26 on Sept 29, 2024 7:05:10 GMT
We’ve a trio of the worst footballing centre backs in the clubs history, so what they’ve seen in training this week to think that this is the best way forward, temporary or otherwise, is scary. It doesn't matter what he sees in training, he won't change or adapt Typically arrogant Spanish manager thinking "their" way is the correct way to play football Nobody here asked for it either - it's boring as fuck and I'd go so far as saying it's ruining the game |
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Post by baconburger on Sept 29, 2024 7:22:32 GMT
I thought Rowlett had come back. People are saying we should give the new coach time, but the sad fact is we now know the style of football he prefers. It is not nice, it is not ambitious it is not exciting, and most importantly it will not win us games. I don't blame any of the players, if you tell me they are not good enough, I say it is not their fault they are playing, they didn't put their own name on the sheet. We,as a team have within two games gone back five seasons in our capabilities, and no matter what anybody says Schumacher was taking us forward. The progress may have been slow, but two weeks ago we were in a better place than we are today. I would like to see Coates, Walters, and the manager gone as soon as possible, and if at all possible Schumacher reinstated. Between them Walters and Coates have torn the heart out of the club and the supporters. I’ve got no idea what style of football NP prefers but if whatever we were even trying to do yesterday has anything to do with it he can fuck right off. I can take ineffective I’m pretty used to that but that was going to be fucking horrible to watch win lose or draw. This could turn very dirty, very quickly. |
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Post by cheshirepotter on Sept 29, 2024 7:26:45 GMT
It’s overated and will cost us a countless number of goals. I just don’t get what we’re trying to do with this ridiculous slow, passive build up or backwards and sideways passing. We don’t even do it at pace. It’s just ridiculous. Now that Gallaghers back we’d be better off hoofing it up to him and waiting for the loose balls to fall for us or winning the odd foul. Other teams know how to target us as we don’t have the players to play the Man City way. Agree. It’s crap. |
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Post by baconburger on Sept 29, 2024 7:34:47 GMT
Burger and Thompson is the midfield, the 10 role doesn’t come in if you can’t get the ball to them? I keep saying it’s nothing to do with systems they are just not good enough they can’t do it. Tell me when we had a worse back4, midfield and forward line? I can’t remember. Out of that side only the goalkeeper just and Manhoef deserve to be in the 11? Am I wrong? What can you expect other than what we are getting? I bet Narcis can believe the deal he’s been handed. Explain how we won at Plymouth then with the same team? Just about. We haven’t played well in the league once this season. Problem is I’d rather us be trying to do something decent and not pulling it off than us just setting out to be shit like yesterday. I’d rather watch paint dry than that whatever the outcome. The amount of excitement that sort of football will provide will be absolutely minimal whatever the outcome. With two strikes of his axe JW has got rid of anything that looked remotely positive at the club. |
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Post by Chewbacca the Wookie on Sept 29, 2024 7:34:57 GMT
Gibson made 104 passes! I'd be amazed if one of our central defenders had ever done that before. Own half passesBoro 192 Stoke 361 Opposition half passesBoro 240 Stoke 82 Opposition box touchesBoro 38 Stoke 10 Most passesGibson 104
Wilmot 69
Thompson 63Hackney 61 Ayling 59 Morris 58 Edmundson 50 Borges 44 Rose 36 McGree 36 Tchamadeu 30
Bocat 29Dijksteel 28 Johansson 24Azaz 2 Bae 22Dieng 21 Burger 18I’d be interested to know of this 104 passes - How many were further than 10 yards - How many were forwards I’d estimate maybe 10 percent tops. |
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Post by J-Roar on Sept 29, 2024 8:00:30 GMT
The argument of “we are trying to be Man City” & “very few teams can do it” is nonsense. The idea is to keep the ball, draw the opponent towards the ball and beat the press. It’s not rocket science & footballers at this level should be able to comfortably control and play a ball around even under relative pressure. Time and time again since our return to Division one I’ve seen opponents retain the ball and build up patiently. As a fanbase, we moan so much when a ball is played backwards and sideways. We have to accept that at times it needs to be done, but I constantly hear “launch it forward” etc. Now the problem is the manager seems set on his philosophy that he can’t see the wood for the trees. This group cannot do what he wants, even at a basic level. You have Wilmott & Gibson who just can’t do it and they will never be comfortable at doing it. Infront of them you have Thompson in a role that is vital to how Pèlach wants to play. He’s simply not a Championship level player. You need someone who can play forwards and be brave in possession & Thompson is the opposite of that. This is what makes it pure madness to sack a manager just after the transfer window closes & bring in someone who’s principles differ so greatly from what the squad is capable of. Unless you've got great players it doesn't work. And on top of that it's utterly tedious to watch. |
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Post by Biblical on Sept 29, 2024 8:13:50 GMT
He wasn’t alone in being utterly shite but if Thompson starts the next game we may as well pack it in.
He’s fucking wank and how he was given an extra year on his contract is unfathomable.
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Post by jeycov on Sept 29, 2024 8:20:09 GMT
Ranieri , when managing Leicester to win the Premiership, spoke of the urgency to play the ball through midfield as quickly as possible. And it worked for those players - positive attacking football
Man City have the players to pass the ball around at the back, build up play ( laborishly slow at times) then pick a pass to players competent enough to convert the chances
Life in the championship is very different
Successful teams are playing to their strengths, we need to do the same
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Post by emretezzy on Sept 29, 2024 8:20:36 GMT
He wasn’t alone in being utterly shite but if Thompson starts the next game we may as well pack it in. He’s fucking wank and how he was given an extra year on his contract is unfathomable. I think the worrying thing with him is Pelach will be happy with him. Meaningless passess is known as retaining possession. |
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Post by fradleyhomes on Sept 29, 2024 8:25:58 GMT
Last season Jon Walters repeatedly mentioned the DNA of our club and what was required etc...
What the new manager is trying to implement is not in the DNA of our club.
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Post by delilahwhy on Sept 29, 2024 8:29:29 GMT
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Post by Numismatist on Sept 29, 2024 8:30:01 GMT
The passing in the own box thing is insanity and hair raising to watch. No upside.
I have a slightly different take on the along the back four stuff for prolonged periods; perhaps it’s a tactic to enable us to last longer in matches given it expends little energy, mindful of our pitiful fitness levels. Either way, it’s garbage to watch.
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Post by J-Roar on Sept 29, 2024 9:18:41 GMT
The passing in the own box thing is insanity and hair raising to watch. No upside. I have a slightly different take on the along the back four stuff for prolonged periods; perhaps it’s a tactic to enable us to last longer in matches given it expends little energy, mindful of our pitiful fitness levels. Either way, it’s garbage to watch. I think of it as a defibrillator- kicks me back into life after 10 mins of building to passing and possession stats. |
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Post by Biblical on Sept 29, 2024 9:27:18 GMT
Stats and data ruin everything, from the NHS to education, and now football. Spreadsheet soccer has given us this 'Great squad™', which is anything but. Used to see multiple thunderbastards every week watching highlights. Rarely see them in an entire season nowadays. |
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Post by Numismatist on Sept 29, 2024 9:56:42 GMT
The passing in the own box thing is insanity and hair raising to watch. No upside. I have a slightly different take on the along the back four stuff for prolonged periods; perhaps it’s a tactic to enable us to last longer in matches given it expends little energy, mindful of our pitiful fitness levels. Either way, it’s garbage to watch. I think of it as a defibrillator- kicks me back into life after 10 mins of building to passing and possession stats. I’ve heard Ben Gibson was keen to champion Narcis as gaffer as he’s on a 5k bonus for every pass over 100 per match. |
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Post by pushon on Sept 29, 2024 9:58:56 GMT
Seen it time and time again and opposition just press & harass the back 4 stopping any meaningful forward movement. However in the odd time we do move forward the midfield don’t seem to have any idea what to do and nobody is making any space or diagonal runs at the opposition. As someone says it’s basic training ground stuff. They let us piss about with it yesterday along the back. They got in shape and the moment we played it forward they basically won it back straight away. They are taking breaks from pressing knowing we don't have one bit of quality to break through lines. It's embarrassing. I don't think there is any greater ridicule in football where they let you keep it along the back four as they know as soon as you try and play it forward you'll just lose it. Exactly this👍 'They' Stood there laughing 😆 |
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Post by boweryboy on Sept 29, 2024 10:39:50 GMT
And why would you carry on doing it when you are losing, when you are winning maybe, but that's not going to happen soon, what we ended up doing was defending a two nil defeat, how do we manage to get it so wrong, season after season,for me we are rock bottom in everything we do,I fear that this season is finally it for us,or will another influx of players save us,i think not.
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Post by biglad180 on Sept 29, 2024 10:54:24 GMT
this building up from the back football as made the game so slow and boring,time for us to kick it in the head far to many goals are conceded by teams playing that way lets get the balls to our wingers who are decent players,so they can get the balls to our attackers then and only then can we say our strikers are shit, if they don,t provide the goals,we can go as far as England people always saying we have great players we might have but they are so slow in the build up and boring to watch,
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Post by jokker on Sept 29, 2024 11:12:31 GMT
I'm sure Pelach - and AN and SS before him - had them moving around in progressive playing all the time. It just goes out the window as the defenders try to remember why they are doing it... But they weren't doing it, the midfield I mean, from minute one they just stood there, it's baffling. Back to the training with extra specific drills: how to move your legs, lads... |
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Post by jokker on Sept 29, 2024 11:14:27 GMT
It’s a shit way of playing football, it always has been. It’s only good when you have world class players,. Hughes did have Bojan...and Muni et al. |
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Post by greenhoff on Sept 29, 2024 11:56:23 GMT
Last season Jon Walters repeatedly mentioned the DNA of our club and what was required etc... What the new manager is trying to implement is not in the DNA of our club. Which begs the question what was Jon Walters thinking bringing him in ? |
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Post by stoke1989 on Sept 29, 2024 12:00:46 GMT
Wonder what minute an "attack, attack, attack" will ring around?
I'll go 7
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Post by greyface on Sept 29, 2024 12:02:25 GMT
Each time he tries this, we're going to get beat. Do I think he's going to change his mind about using this tactic? Sadly no There is no way he will change his mind / philosophy. Schumacher did when he had to which was credit to him even if it came from player pressure. This guy will absolutely not do that. It will take us down with very few fans there to watch it. In my opinion. Looking forward to the car crash on Wednesday in a weird sadistic way. |
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Post by greyface on Sept 29, 2024 12:06:56 GMT
I was watching Plymouth last night playing out from the back and executing it rather well against Luton, granted luton didn't look up for the fight at all and they didn't turn up but they played through the pitch rather well and only recycled the ball by going back when nothing going forward was on other than that they were looking to play forward today it seemed we messed about with the ball at the back numerous times then when we did look to go forward we didn't seem to have a clue what to do with it at all which then resulted in us going sideways and back it's so frustrating when you see teams over the years in the championship competently play out from the back (Swansea, Brentford come to mind) Punctuation. |
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Post by figo85 on Sept 29, 2024 12:24:32 GMT
We’ve a trio of the worst footballing centre backs in the clubs history, so what they’ve seen in training this week to think that this is the best way forward, temporary or otherwise, is scary. It doesn't matter what he sees in training, he won't change or adapt Typically arrogant Spanish manager thinking "their" way is the correct way to play football Nobody here asked for it either - it's boring as fuck and I'd go so far as saying it's ruining the game I said to my old man that it was terrible, within the first few minutes. If this is the tripe he’s planning to offer up to us, we’re in full a long old season (till Christmas). |
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Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Sept 29, 2024 12:45:41 GMT
Gibson made 104 passes! I'd be amazed if one of our central defenders had ever done that before. Own half passesBoro 192 Stoke 361 Opposition half passesBoro 240 Stoke 82 Opposition box touchesBoro 38 Stoke 10 Most passesGibson 104
Wilmot 69
Thompson 63Hackney 61 Ayling 59 Morris 58 Edmundson 50 Borges 44 Rose 36 McGree 36 Tchamadeu 30
Bocat 29Dijksteel 28 Johansson 24Azaz 2 Bae 22Dieng 21 Burger 18I’d be interested to know of this 104 passes - How many were further than 10 yards - How many were forwards I’d estimate maybe 10 percent tops. Shut up he's a proper footballing center back! 😅 Watching the WSL, Man City v Brighton. They're coaching any semblance of individuality out of the women's game now, pass, pass, pass go nowhere! |
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