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Post by Gods on Sept 2, 2024 21:52:30 GMT
How would a system of asylum look if you could apply for asylum in the UK from overseas as it seems many on here would like?
There are 8 billion people on the planet. Let's say conservatively that 6 billion of them live in countries where people are routinely persecuted on grounds of religion, gender, ethnicity, opposition to the incumbent government, sexual orientation whatever it may be.
Every single one of them would have a valid case for applying for asylum in the UK wouldn't they.
We can't run a tiny island like that, can we, what am I missing?
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 3, 2024 7:21:06 GMT
6 billion people are not going to apply for asylum in the UK. The vast majority of people do not want leave their country of origin and of those that do the majority do it by applying for work visas. Even if 6 billion people suddenly did decide to seek asylum in the UK it isn't going to top of many lists of place to go- the emerging economies like South Korea are a way more attractive proposition.
A country may have a less than ideal regime but the bar for an asylum claim is quite high. The countries with the highest rate of asylum seekers to the UK are Albania, Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq and Syria. I don't think anyone is going to argue with the last four but Albania clearly stands out. The UK government has put in place an agreement with Albania to return migrants from Albania on the basis that Albania might be a bit shit bit it's not routinely a threat to life and limb.
In terms of migration the biggest threat isn't economic migration or asylum - it's the millions of people who will be displaced as a result of sea level rises due to climate change. That is going to both an international and national crisis that makes the current "crisis" look insignificant. London and much of the east coast are going to be underwater by the end of the century - that's what you call a housing crisis.
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Post by phileetin on Sept 3, 2024 8:27:01 GMT
so they will all be heading to the midlands then ?
i'll start buying houses in mow cop .
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Post by wannabee on Sept 3, 2024 9:33:05 GMT
How would a system of asylum look if you could apply for asylum in the UK from overseas as it seems many on here would like? There are 8 billion people on the planet. Let's say conservatively that 6 billion of them live in countries where people are routinely persecuted on grounds of religion, gender, ethnicity, opposition to the incumbent government, sexual orientation whatever it may be. Every single one of them would have a valid case for applying for asylum in the UK wouldn't they. We can't run a tiny island like that, can we, what am I missing? With respect Gods you are missing quite a bit As with mislabeling of Political Party's a good place to start may be to get the terminology correct before assessing the size of the problem, which isn't 6Bn A "Refugee" is a person who has fled their Home Country because of a risk to their human rights and safety An "Asylum Seeker" is a person who has fled their Home Country because of a risk to their human rights and safety but has yet to have their Refugee Status recognized by the authorities they made an application There is no internationally recognized definition of a "Migrant" Some migrants leave their country because they want to work, study or join family, Others feel they must leave because of poverty, political unrest, gang violence, natural disasters Some may be Brits who have decided they prefer to live on the Costa del Sol. Although Migrants don't fit the legal category of Refugee or Asylum Seeker some could be in danger if sent back to their Home Country Then you have other categories like: Refugees under UNHCR and UNRWA protection these are people who remain in their Home Country or in a neighbouring one but in Camps protected by UN. Examples would be Palestinians, Syrians, Afghanistans etc These are Refugees but are generally not going anywhere "Internally displaced persons" these are people who haven't left their Home Country but have been displaced by Earthquakes, War, Drought etc Most of these are in sub Saharan Africa but includes Ukrainians and Turks due to recent Earthquake. These too fit the legal definition of a Refugee but are also not going anywhere, for now. So let's put some numbers on it but it changes daily At end of 2023 there were 26M Refugees 6.9M Asylum Seekers, 37.6M under UN Protection and 68.3M internally displaced So where do Refugees go if not internally or under UN Protection. 90% go to a neighbouring Country they have no desire to leave their Home Country and maybe they are optimists that they can return. The Three Countries who are hosting the most Refugees are Turkey 3.3M Germany 2.5M and Ethiopia 1.6M And what are the UK numbers. Difficult to get accurate figures from Home Office but an estimate of settled Refugees in UK including Hong Kongers is between 300/500K. On Asylum Seekers there are currently about 130K Asylum Seekers who have made an application and are awaiting Home Office first response. In 2023 of the Asylum Applications Home reviewed 63% were granted and passed to Refugee Status, this used to be a higher percentage about 80% maybe Home Office are becoming more stringent. There are also 75K Asylum Seekers who under a new Home Office Policy decided they wouldn't review anymore applications and instead placed people in Hotel Accommodation and forget about them. You're opening question deserves an attempt to answer what can UK do to reduce the problem Probably the biggest thing would be not to participate in Wars or Supply Arms and Ammunition to those that do. Not moan when UK honours it's COP pledge to give £11.6Bn to help the Climate Crisis. If not resolved there will be multi millions displaced due to drought or soil erosion and the small percentage of people that end up in UK as Asylum Seekers will cost far far more. Don't try and make Political Capital by using the Overseas Aid Budget to pay for crass decisions of accommodating Asylum Seekers in Hotels. This doesn't nothing to fix and shifts the problem Don't make other crass decisions like stopping funding to UNRWA, thankfully now reversed, the UN Agency specifically set up to help the 6M Palestinians Refugees in Gaza, West Bank, Jordan and Lebanon Don't ponder if France is a friend or an enemy but rather be a Leader and act collectively with Europe to try and come up with solutions. Remember 90% of Refugees are in a neighbouring Countries, try and collectively address why people become Refugees in the first place So Gods no there are not 6Bn people trying to come to UK. Worldwide it's a 100+M problem, in Europe maybe a 1/2M problem and in UK a fraction of that.
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Post by Northy on Sept 3, 2024 11:16:23 GMT
You enter the country illegally, your actions make it illegal, some go onto try and claim asylum, some don't (as they know it wouldn't be granted) and disappear into the black economy. What is the percentage of those crossing the channel fleeing from war and persecution to be able to claim asylum, do you know? If they rent does that make their actions entering the country illegal? Unless you are coming from Ukraine or Hong Kong, it is impossible for ANY asylum seeker to enter the UK legally. And an asylum seeker is not allowed to seek asylum in the UK, unless they make that application on British soil. Do you see what the issue might be here? You come through a legal route to the UK, like an airport or a port with your passport, you don't throw it away before you get here so the authorities dont know who you are. The boat people pay thousands to the smugglers, why not apply for a visa and a ferry ticket ?
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Post by Gods on Sept 3, 2024 12:07:42 GMT
How would a system of asylum look if you could apply for asylum in the UK from overseas as it seems many on here would like? There are 8 billion people on the planet. Let's say conservatively that 6 billion of them live in countries where people are routinely persecuted on grounds of religion, gender, ethnicity, opposition to the incumbent government, sexual orientation whatever it may be. Every single one of them would have a valid case for applying for asylum in the UK wouldn't they. We can't run a tiny island like that, can we, what am I missing? With respect Gods you are missing quite a bit As with mislabeling of Political Party's a good place to start may be to get the terminology correct before assessing the size of the problem, which isn't 6Bn A "Refugee" is a person who has fled their Home Country because of a risk to their human rights and safety An "Asylum Seeker" is a person who has fled their Home Country because of a risk to their human rights and safety but has yet to have their Refugee Status recognized by the authorities they made an application There is no internationally recognized definition of a "Migrant" Some migrants leave their country because they want to work, study or join family, Others feel they must leave because of poverty, political unrest, gang violence, natural disasters Some may be Brits who have decided they prefer to live on the Costa del Sol. Although Migrants don't fit the legal category of Refugee or Asylum Seeker some could be in danger if sent back to their Home Country Then you have other categories like: Refugees under UNHCR and UNRWA protection these are people who remain in their Home Country or in a neighbouring one but in Camps protected by UN. Examples would be Palestinians, Syrians, Afghanistans etc These are Refugees but are generally not going anywhere "Internally displaced persons" these are people who haven't left their Home Country but have been displaced by Earthquakes, War, Drought etc Most of these are in sub Saharan Africa but includes Ukrainians and Turks due to recent Earthquake. These too fit the legal definition of a Refugee but are also not going anywhere, for now. So let's put some numbers on it but it changes daily At end of 2023 there were 26M Refugees 6.9M Asylum Seekers, 37.6M under UN Protection and 68.3M internally displaced So where do Refugees go if not internally or under UN Protection. 90% go to a neighbouring Country they have no desire to leave their Home Country and maybe they are optimists that they can return. The Three Countries who are hosting the most Refugees are Turkey 3.3M Germany 2.5M and Ethiopia 1.6M And what are the UK numbers. Difficult to get accurate figures from Home Office but an estimate of settled Refugees in UK including Hong Kongers is between 300/500K. On Asylum Seekers there are currently about 130K Asylum Seekers who have made an application and are awaiting Home Office first response. In 2023 of the Asylum Applications Home reviewed 63% were granted and passed to Refugee Status, this used to be a higher percentage about 80% maybe Home Office are becoming more stringent. There are also 75K Asylum Seekers who under a new Home Office Policy decided they wouldn't review anymore applications and instead placed people in Hotel Accommodation and forget about them. You're opening question deserves an attempt to answer what can UK do to reduce the problem Probably the biggest thing would be not to participate in Wars or Supply Arms and Ammunition to those that do. Not moan when UK honours it's COP pledge to give £11.6Bn to help the Climate Crisis. If not resolved there will be multi millions displaced due to drought or soil erosion and the small percentage of people that end up in UK as Asylum Seekers will cost far far more. Don't try and make Political Capital by using the Overseas Aid Budget to pay for crass decisions of accommodating Asylum Seekers in Hotels. This doesn't nothing to fix and shifts the problem Don't make other crass decisions like stopping funding to UNRWA, thankfully now reversed, the UN Agency specifically set up to help the 6M Palestinians Refugees in Gaza, West Bank, Jordan and Lebanon Don't ponder if France is a friend or an enemy but rather be a Leader and act collectively with Europe to try and come up with solutions. Remember 90% of Refugees are in a neighbouring Countries, try and collectively address why people become Refugees in the first place So Gods no there are not 6Bn people trying to come to UK. Worldwide it's a 100+M problem, in Europe maybe a 1/2M problem and in UK a fraction of that. I think it was you that pointed out people have to arrive on these shores in rubber boats because there is no way to apply for asylum from outside the UK? If there were such a way to apply, and perhaps there should be, I was trying to understand practically speaking, how that might work. Would anyone with a valid case be admitted or would there be a quota? Is it first come / first served or would there be a ballot? Perhaps priority would be on the perceived level of suffering? I really, genuinely don't know how such a system would work.
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Post by oggyoggy on Sept 3, 2024 12:13:14 GMT
How would a system of asylum look if you could apply for asylum in the UK from overseas as it seems many on here would like? There are 8 billion people on the planet. Let's say conservatively that 6 billion of them live in countries where people are routinely persecuted on grounds of religion, gender, ethnicity, opposition to the incumbent government, sexual orientation whatever it may be. Every single one of them would have a valid case for applying for asylum in the UK wouldn't they. We can't run a tiny island like that, can we, what am I missing? You are missing an understanding of immigration laws.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 12:29:58 GMT
Unless you are coming from Ukraine or Hong Kong, it is impossible for ANY asylum seeker to enter the UK legally. And an asylum seeker is not allowed to seek asylum in the UK, unless they make that application on British soil. Do you see what the issue might be here? You come through a legal route to the UK, like an airport or a port with your passport, you don't throw it away before you get here so the authorities dont know who you are. The boat people pay thousands to the smugglers, why not apply for a visa and a ferry ticket ? The legal routes don't exist, that's the point. Don't you think they'd rather pay for a plane ticket and a visa, than risk dying in the channel at the hands of gangsters?
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Post by Eggybread on Sept 3, 2024 12:36:12 GMT
Unless you are coming from Ukraine or Hong Kong, it is impossible for ANY asylum seeker to enter the UK legally. And an asylum seeker is not allowed to seek asylum in the UK, unless they make that application on British soil. Do you see what the issue might be here? You come through a legal route to the UK, like an airport or a port with your passport, you don't throw it away before you get here so the authorities dont know who you are. The boat people pay thousands to the smugglers, why not apply for a visa and a ferry ticket ? Im not sure that the people who are coming over the channel (not all) can actually get UK visitor visas and passports in the countries they are fleeing.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Sept 3, 2024 12:52:33 GMT
Unless you are coming from Ukraine or Hong Kong, it is impossible for ANY asylum seeker to enter the UK legally. And an asylum seeker is not allowed to seek asylum in the UK, unless they make that application on British soil. Do you see what the issue might be here? You come through a legal route to the UK, like an airport or a port with your passport, you don't throw it away before you get here so the authorities dont know who you are. The boat people pay thousands to the smugglers, why not apply for a visa and a ferry ticket ? Because visa applications are only valid if you have a job in a limited range of roles where there are skill shortages or are coming over as a fee paying student. If you haven't got a visa you will get turned back at a port or airport. There are a very limited number of countries where you can apply for asylum while overseas (eg Ukraine and Hong Kong). The only way anyone else can apply for asylum is to arrive in the UK by boat or smuggled in in a car or lorry. The system we have put in place (or rather the complete lack of a sytem) has created a black market economy in people smuggling and profiteering from over priced hotel accommodation and put desperate people at risk of drowning in the English Channel.
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Post by wannabee on Sept 3, 2024 14:11:34 GMT
With respect Gods you are missing quite a bit As with mislabeling of Political Party's a good place to start may be to get the terminology correct before assessing the size of the problem, which isn't 6Bn A "Refugee" is a person who has fled their Home Country because of a risk to their human rights and safety An "Asylum Seeker" is a person who has fled their Home Country because of a risk to their human rights and safety but has yet to have their Refugee Status recognized by the authorities they made an application There is no internationally recognized definition of a "Migrant" Some migrants leave their country because they want to work, study or join family, Others feel they must leave because of poverty, political unrest, gang violence, natural disasters Some may be Brits who have decided they prefer to live on the Costa del Sol. Although Migrants don't fit the legal category of Refugee or Asylum Seeker some could be in danger if sent back to their Home Country Then you have other categories like: Refugees under UNHCR and UNRWA protection these are people who remain in their Home Country or in a neighbouring one but in Camps protected by UN. Examples would be Palestinians, Syrians, Afghanistans etc These are Refugees but are generally not going anywhere "Internally displaced persons" these are people who haven't left their Home Country but have been displaced by Earthquakes, War, Drought etc Most of these are in sub Saharan Africa but includes Ukrainians and Turks due to recent Earthquake. These too fit the legal definition of a Refugee but are also not going anywhere, for now. So let's put some numbers on it but it changes daily At end of 2023 there were 26M Refugees 6.9M Asylum Seekers, 37.6M under UN Protection and 68.3M internally displaced So where do Refugees go if not internally or under UN Protection. 90% go to a neighbouring Country they have no desire to leave their Home Country and maybe they are optimists that they can return. The Three Countries who are hosting the most Refugees are Turkey 3.3M Germany 2.5M and Ethiopia 1.6M And what are the UK numbers. Difficult to get accurate figures from Home Office but an estimate of settled Refugees in UK including Hong Kongers is between 300/500K. On Asylum Seekers there are currently about 130K Asylum Seekers who have made an application and are awaiting Home Office first response. In 2023 of the Asylum Applications Home reviewed 63% were granted and passed to Refugee Status, this used to be a higher percentage about 80% maybe Home Office are becoming more stringent. There are also 75K Asylum Seekers who under a new Home Office Policy decided they wouldn't review anymore applications and instead placed people in Hotel Accommodation and forget about them. You're opening question deserves an attempt to answer what can UK do to reduce the problem Probably the biggest thing would be not to participate in Wars or Supply Arms and Ammunition to those that do. Not moan when UK honours it's COP pledge to give £11.6Bn to help the Climate Crisis. If not resolved there will be multi millions displaced due to drought or soil erosion and the small percentage of people that end up in UK as Asylum Seekers will cost far far more. Don't try and make Political Capital by using the Overseas Aid Budget to pay for crass decisions of accommodating Asylum Seekers in Hotels. This doesn't nothing to fix and shifts the problem Don't make other crass decisions like stopping funding to UNRWA, thankfully now reversed, the UN Agency specifically set up to help the 6M Palestinians Refugees in Gaza, West Bank, Jordan and Lebanon Don't ponder if France is a friend or an enemy but rather be a Leader and act collectively with Europe to try and come up with solutions. Remember 90% of Refugees are in a neighbouring Countries, try and collectively address why people become Refugees in the first place So Gods no there are not 6Bn people trying to come to UK. Worldwide it's a 100+M problem, in Europe maybe a 1/2M problem and in UK a fraction of that. I think it was you that pointed out people have to arrive on these shores in rubber boats because there is no way to apply for asylum from outside the UK? If there were such a way to apply, and perhaps there should be, I was trying to understand practically speaking, how that might work. Would anyone with a valid case be admitted or would there be a quota? Is it first come / first served or would there be a ballot? Perhaps priority would be on the perceived level of suffering? I really, genuinely don't know how such a system would work. I and others have pointed out that there is no legal method an asylum seeker can make an application for a remain to stay in UK other than by turning up. I tried to explain above that this isn't a uniquely UK problem and although worldwide from UK perspective has to addressed at a European Level. Much play has been made by Conservative/Reform Politicians that Australia solved the boat Asylum Seeking problem. I have never heard any of them mention that Australia is one of only 23 Countries that participate in the UNHCR Asylum Resettlement Program. Last year Australia accepted 36K Asylum Seekers under this Program mainly from Iran, Syria and India. The main difference between them and those arriving by boat to UK is that their bona fides were established beforehand and People Smugglers weren't paid a load of money and they arrived in an orderly fashion. If you consider Australia population at about a third of UK Australia received about the same number relative to population. Que someone pointing out land mass, there's always one. In 2023 about 1.1M Asylum Seekers landed in Europe This is about 0.0013% of the Population Another myth that needs to be dispelled is that these people are Queue Jumpers (and we know how Brits love a Queue) You can't jump a queue that doesn't exist The best option is to address the conditions why people become Asylum Seekers as I outlined above Failing that surely it's not beyond the collective wit of European Countries to cooperate and share the burden and the solution with or without UNHCR. This would also benefit Women and Children who are less likely to use the currently more hazardous routes Setting up safe and legal routes shouldn't be a pull factor and Country Quotas should be established It can not be expected that Europe can solve the problems of every Asylum Seeker. If once this type of scheme is up and running any Asylum Seeker that tries to circumvent should be detained in a safe and secure environment if unable to return to Home Country for a period of say 2 years. This may seem harsh if the definition of an Asylum Seeker is met but their primary objective of being safe is met and they can use the time to learn language and other skills. These are just some thoughts better minds in Governments can surely come up with something better than the chaos we have now.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 14:55:51 GMT
I think it was you that pointed out people have to arrive on these shores in rubber boats because there is no way to apply for asylum from outside the UK? If there were such a way to apply, and perhaps there should be, I was trying to understand practically speaking, how that might work. Would anyone with a valid case be admitted or would there be a quota? Is it first come / first served or would there be a ballot? Perhaps priority would be on the perceived level of suffering? I really, genuinely don't know how such a system would work. I and others have pointed out that there is no legal method an asylum seeker can make an application for a remain to stay in UK other than by turning up. I tried to explain above that this isn't a uniquely UK problem and although worldwide from UK perspective has to addressed at a European Level. Much play has been made by Conservative/Reform Politicians that Australia solved the boat Asylum Seeking problem. I have never heard any of them mention that Australia is one of only 23 Countries that participate in the UNHCR Asylum Resettlement Program. Last year Australia accepted 36K Asylum Seekers under this Program mainly from Iran, Syria and India. The main difference between them and those arriving by boat to UK is that their bona fides were established beforehand and People Smugglers weren't paid a load of money and they arrived in an orderly fashion. If you consider Australia population at about a third of UK Australia received about the same number relative to population. Que someone pointing out land mass, there's always one. In 2023 about 1.1M Asylum Seekers landed in Europe This is about 0.0013% of the Population Another myth that needs to be dispelled is that these people are Queue Jumpers (and we know how Brits love a Queue) You can't jump a queue that doesn't exist The best option is to address the conditions why people become Asylum Seekers as I outlined above Failing that surely it's not beyond the collective wit of European Countries to cooperate and share the burden and the solution with or without UNHCR. This would also benefit Women and Children who are less likely to use the currently more hazardous routes Setting up safe and legal routes shouldn't be a pull factor and Country Quotas should be established It can not be expected that Europe can solve the problems of every Asylum Seeker. If once this type of scheme is up and running any Asylum Seeker that tries to circumvent should be detained in a safe and secure environment if unable to return to Home Country for a period of say 2 years. This may seem harsh if the definition of an Asylum Seeker is met but their primary objective of being safe is met and they can use the time to learn language and other skills. These are just some thoughts better minds in Governments can surely come up with something better than the chaos we have now. Perfectly put.
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Post by Northy on Sept 3, 2024 15:20:41 GMT
You come through a legal route to the UK, like an airport or a port with your passport, you don't throw it away before you get here so the authorities dont know who you are. The boat people pay thousands to the smugglers, why not apply for a visa and a ferry ticket ? Because visa applications are only valid if you have a job in a limited range of roles where there are skill shortages or are coming over as a fee paying student. If you haven't got a visa you will get turned back at a port or airport. There are a very limited number of countries where you can apply for asylum while overseas (eg Ukraine and Hong Kong). The only way anyone else can apply for asylum is to arrive in the UK by boat or smuggled in in a car or lorry. The system we have put in place (or rather the complete lack of a sytem) has created a black market economy in people smuggling and profiteering from over priced hotel accommodation and put desperate people at risk of drowning in the English Channel. What about a Tourist Visa ?
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Post by Northy on Sept 3, 2024 15:22:33 GMT
You come through a legal route to the UK, like an airport or a port with your passport, you don't throw it away before you get here so the authorities dont know who you are. The boat people pay thousands to the smugglers, why not apply for a visa and a ferry ticket ? The legal routes don't exist, that's the point. Don't you think they'd rather pay for a plane ticket and a visa, than risk dying in the channel at the hands of gangsters? Come on a tourist visa and claim asylum here, people have done that when coming here for sport.
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Post by Veritas on Sept 3, 2024 15:44:50 GMT
The legal routes don't exist, that's the point. Don't you think they'd rather pay for a plane ticket and a visa, than risk dying in the channel at the hands of gangsters? Come on a tourist visa and claim asylum here, people have done that when coming here for sport. In the past some East European athletes did do that but changes brought by the last government mean that option is now specifically prohibited. The logic was to encourage people to apply while in refugee camps the reality has been a massive increase in cross channel boats!
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Post by lawrieleslie on Sept 3, 2024 16:26:59 GMT
I think it was you that pointed out people have to arrive on these shores in rubber boats because there is no way to apply for asylum from outside the UK? If there were such a way to apply, and perhaps there should be, I was trying to understand practically speaking, how that might work. Would anyone with a valid case be admitted or would there be a quota? Is it first come / first served or would there be a ballot? Perhaps priority would be on the perceived level of suffering? I really, genuinely don't know how such a system would work. I and others have pointed out that there is no legal method an asylum seeker can make an application for a remain to stay in UK other than by turning up. I tried to explain above that this isn't a uniquely UK problem and although worldwide from UK perspective has to addressed at a European Level. Much play has been made by Conservative/Reform Politicians that Australia solved the boat Asylum Seeking problem. I have never heard any of them mention that Australia is one of only 23 Countries that participate in the UNHCR Asylum Resettlement Program. Last year Australia accepted 36K Asylum Seekers under this Program mainly from Iran, Syria and India. The main difference between them and those arriving by boat to UK is that their bona fides were established beforehand and People Smugglers weren't paid a load of money and they arrived in an orderly fashion. If you consider Australia population at about a third of UK Australia received about the same number relative to population. Que someone pointing out land mass, there's always one. In 2023 about 1.1M Asylum Seekers landed in Europe This is about 0.0013% of the Population Another myth that needs to be dispelled is that these people are Queue Jumpers (and we know how Brits love a Queue) You can't jump a queue that doesn't exist The best option is to address the conditions why people become Asylum Seekers as I outlined above Failing that surely it's not beyond the collective wit of European Countries to cooperate and share the burden and the solution with or without UNHCR. This would also benefit Women and Children who are less likely to use the currently more hazardous routes Setting up safe and legal routes shouldn't be a pull factor and Country Quotas should be established It can not be expected that Europe can solve the problems of every Asylum Seeker. If once this type of scheme is up and running any Asylum Seeker that tries to circumvent should be detained in a safe and secure environment if unable to return to Home Country for a period of say 2 years. This may seem harsh if the definition of an Asylum Seeker is met but their primary objective of being safe is met and they can use the time to learn language and other skills. These are just some thoughts better minds in Governments can surely come up with something better than the chaos we have now. Get your point but your figures are way out. If 1.1 million represents just 0.0013% of the population of Europe that makes the population of Europe 8.4 billion. The population of Europe is actually around 744 million. 1.1 million represents around 0.15% of the population of Europe. Your welcome
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 19:10:22 GMT
The legal routes don't exist, that's the point. Don't you think they'd rather pay for a plane ticket and a visa, than risk dying in the channel at the hands of gangsters? Come on a tourist visa and claim asylum here
So go on, why do you think they don't take that 'option' then and prefer to spend thousands on risking drowning in the Channel instead?
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 3, 2024 19:12:53 GMT
I and others have pointed out that there is no legal method an asylum seeker can make an application for a remain to stay in UK other than by turning up. I tried to explain above that this isn't a uniquely UK problem and although worldwide from UK perspective has to addressed at a European Level. Much play has been made by Conservative/Reform Politicians that Australia solved the boat Asylum Seeking problem. I have never heard any of them mention that Australia is one of only 23 Countries that participate in the UNHCR Asylum Resettlement Program. Last year Australia accepted 36K Asylum Seekers under this Program mainly from Iran, Syria and India. The main difference between them and those arriving by boat to UK is that their bona fides were established beforehand and People Smugglers weren't paid a load of money and they arrived in an orderly fashion. If you consider Australia population at about a third of UK Australia received about the same number relative to population. Que someone pointing out land mass, there's always one. In 2023 about 1.1M Asylum Seekers landed in Europe This is about 0.0013% of the Population Another myth that needs to be dispelled is that these people are Queue Jumpers (and we know how Brits love a Queue) You can't jump a queue that doesn't exist The best option is to address the conditions why people become Asylum Seekers as I outlined above Failing that surely it's not beyond the collective wit of European Countries to cooperate and share the burden and the solution with or without UNHCR. This would also benefit Women and Children who are less likely to use the currently more hazardous routes Setting up safe and legal routes shouldn't be a pull factor and Country Quotas should be established It can not be expected that Europe can solve the problems of every Asylum Seeker. If once this type of scheme is up and running any Asylum Seeker that tries to circumvent should be detained in a safe and secure environment if unable to return to Home Country for a period of say 2 years. This may seem harsh if the definition of an Asylum Seeker is met but their primary objective of being safe is met and they can use the time to learn language and other skills. These are just some thoughts better minds in Governments can surely come up with something better than the chaos we have now. Get your point but your figures are way out. If 1.1 million represents just 0.0013% of the population of Europe that makes the population of Europe 8.4 billion. The population of Europe is actually around 744 million. 1.1 million represents around 0.15% of the population of Europe. Your welcome Thank god someone can be arsed to scrutinise wannabees made up stats. I generally fall asleep half way through reading his posts😉
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 19:16:39 GMT
Get your point but your figures are way out. If 1.1 million represents just 0.0013% of the population of Europe that makes the population of Europe 8.4 billion. The population of Europe is actually around 744 million. 1.1 million represents around 0.15% of the population of Europe. Your welcome Thank god someone can be arsed to scrutinise wannabees made up stats. I generally fall asleep half way through reading his posts😉
Is that really all you took away from his (excellent) post?
The amount of zeros in the figure he mistakenly quoted, is pretty irrelevant in the context of the rest of the post isn’t it?
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 3, 2024 19:18:49 GMT
Thank god someone can be arsed to scrutinise wannabees made up stats. I generally fall asleep half way through reading his posts😉
Is that really all you took away from his (excellent) post?
The amount of zeros in the figure he mistakenly quoted, is pretty irrelevant in the context of the rest of the post is it?
Cheer up eh
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 19:20:47 GMT
Is that really all you took away from his (excellent) post?
The amount of zeros in the figure he mistakenly quoted, is pretty irrelevant in the context of the rest of the post is it?
Cheer up eh
I'm buzzing off my tits mate, it was you who said that you were falling asleep ...
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 3, 2024 19:27:35 GMT
I'm buzzing off my tits mate, it was you who said that you were falling asleep ... You’re not with Ely are you?
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 19:29:16 GMT
I'm buzzing off my tits mate, it was you who said that you were falling asleep ... You’re not with Ely are you?
I wish ...
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Post by knype on Sept 3, 2024 19:55:17 GMT
Thank god someone can be arsed to scrutinise wannabees made up stats. I generally fall asleep half way through reading his posts😉 Is that really all you took away from his (excellent) post? The amount of zeros in the figure he mistakenly quoted, is pretty irrelevant in the context of the rest of the post is it?
No, it's misinformation and misleading?
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Post by Paul Spencer on Sept 3, 2024 20:00:25 GMT
Is that really all you took away from his (excellent) post? The amount of zeros in the figure he mistakenly quoted, is pretty irrelevant in the context of the rest of the post is it?
No, it's misinformation and misleading? If you think that it's relevant in the context of his entire post, then that's your prerogative knype. From where I'm sitting, take those two zeros out of the figure and it makes abosulety no difference whatsoever to the point he was making.
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Post by Gods on Sept 3, 2024 20:53:16 GMT
I and others have pointed out that there is no legal method an asylum seeker can make an application for a remain to stay in UK other than by turning up. I tried to explain above that this isn't a uniquely UK problem and although worldwide from UK perspective has to addressed at a European Level. Much play has been made by Conservative/Reform Politicians that Australia solved the boat Asylum Seeking problem. I have never heard any of them mention that Australia is one of only 23 Countries that participate in the UNHCR Asylum Resettlement Program. Last year Australia accepted 36K Asylum Seekers under this Program mainly from Iran, Syria and India. The main difference between them and those arriving by boat to UK is that their bona fides were established beforehand and People Smugglers weren't paid a load of money and they arrived in an orderly fashion. If you consider Australia population at about a third of UK Australia received about the same number relative to population. Que someone pointing out land mass, there's always one. In 2023 about 1.1M Asylum Seekers landed in Europe This is about 0.0013% of the Population Another myth that needs to be dispelled is that these people are Queue Jumpers (and we know how Brits love a Queue) You can't jump a queue that doesn't exist The best option is to address the conditions why people become Asylum Seekers as I outlined above Failing that surely it's not beyond the collective wit of European Countries to cooperate and share the burden and the solution with or without UNHCR. This would also benefit Women and Children who are less likely to use the currently more hazardous routes Setting up safe and legal routes shouldn't be a pull factor and Country Quotas should be established It can not be expected that Europe can solve the problems of every Asylum Seeker. If once this type of scheme is up and running any Asylum Seeker that tries to circumvent should be detained in a safe and secure environment if unable to return to Home Country for a period of say 2 years. This may seem harsh if the definition of an Asylum Seeker is met but their primary objective of being safe is met and they can use the time to learn language and other skills. These are just some thoughts better minds in Governments can surely come up with something better than the chaos we have now. Get your point but your figures are way out. If 1.1 million represents just 0.0013% of the population of Europe that makes the population of Europe 8.4 billion. The population of Europe is actually around 744 million. 1.1 million represents around 0.15% of the population of Europe. Your welcome I'm sure he will reply, no doubt at great length! But my guess is he was referring to the population of the world not Europe. The population of the world is about 8 billion.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Sept 3, 2024 21:11:44 GMT
7,007 illegal migrants since the 4th July,hes doing jackshit about it😡 12 dead today of which 6 were children and in total 10 females
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 3, 2024 21:28:08 GMT
7,007 illegal migrants since the 4th July,hes doing jackshit about it😡 12 dead today of which 6 were children and in total 10 females He’ll never do anything about it, it’s good for him, his voters and all the sanctimonious crusaders that pollute the British isles to let these illegals into the country, who cares about a few deaths along the way.
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Post by iancransonsknees on Sept 3, 2024 21:53:37 GMT
7,007 illegal migrants since the 4th July,hes doing jackshit about it😡 12 dead today of which 6 were children and in total 10 females He’ll never do anything about it, it’s good for him, his voters and all the sanctimonious crusaders that pollute the British isles to let these illegals into the country, who cares about a few deaths along the way. Probably get shares in a rubber dinghy firm and makes the tools that build/fix outboard motors.
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Post by Gods on Sept 3, 2024 22:13:16 GMT
Unless you have UNLIMITED safe and legal routes they are a red herring.
Not the answer to anything in respect of stopping rubber boats.
Sure, we take fewer people than Germany for example, but anyone see the elections at the weekend, the nazis are back.
Our government need to get a grip on this, they canned Rwanda on the premise of 'smashing the gangs', not much smashing going on so far, more a renaissance of the gangs.
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