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Post by followyoudown on Mar 23, 2022 15:22:25 GMT
Ignoring everything else the CDC not sovereign wealth fund is basically FCDO funded from taxes and seems to partner with private companies for infrastructure projects that we spend foreign aid on, if you are investing/upgrading/building port infrastructure in some of the poorest countries in the world there's probably a very limited pool of partners, I'd guess the impact on reducing poverty in these countries probably outweighs the loss of 800 british jobs no matter how shitty they behaved. I agree CDC now rebranded as BII British International Investment is the investment vehicle of FCDO It has a very chequered past and has consistently been accused of amongst other things a) Excessive Pay to its Executives b) Poor selection of Investment favouring profit rather than alleviating poverty c) The majority of investments in tax haven and d) it's published accounts "Opaque" www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2020/feb/15/cdc-commonwealth-development-accused-wastefulness-scerecy-povertyThe essential point I raised was given the evident business practices of DP World was it an appropriate partner for BII The further implication being are DP World likely to continue using these sharp practices using UK Tax Payers Money Incidentally it is interesting that the £50M DP World will receive in Grants from UK Government will more than cover the published £36M it is proposing in Redundancy to the sacked 800 P&O workers Ports aren't my area of expertise but as I mentioned looking at the countries that are being invested in there is probably not a big pool of companies to choose from who would be interested in this or would finance it. The £50m grant is that for developing the freeport on the Thames ? A grant normally has conditions to ensure the other company fulfills their investment or creates the jobs promised so mildly interesting but pretty irrelevant.
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 23, 2022 15:27:04 GMT
Try google again Rishi's father in law is in India, he's indian thats where his companies HQ is, from that I wonder if you can work out why an indian company specialising as I mentioned previously employs indian staff, there is however no link to £1.50 an hour seafarers, the fact you keep going on about california is telling. what a strange reply. Aren't people allowed to move and have houses anywhere else? Aren't low paid indian workers being employed at P&O over those who have just been sacked? And regarding the seafaring employees. You'll see i started my post with "I wonder .... " I didn't state they were, but it would be of course no surprise 'should' it come to light. You're flailing now you have gone from company hq in california to having a house there and you wouldn't be surprised if a multi billion company had decided to become involved in supplying seafaring staff for £1.50 an hour or whatever, dont trip over those clown shoes mate.
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Post by richie22 on Mar 23, 2022 15:35:18 GMT
Arrived in Dover just after 0900 , after dodging operation stack. Finally got in a lane to get on a boat at 3pm. Sailing on the 1420 Irish ferry’s out which is delayed because of weight of traffic by 3 hours…. Take nothing away from the former workers of p&o , but that shipping line has well and truly shafted the port also. Absolute chaos….. very little freight moving, some Irish boats have been leaving with spare capacity as the gridlock is preventing customers getting onto boats… disgusting! They should be stripped of there licence to operate the channel routes and be banished from our seas ……fucking arseholes !
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Post by richie22 on Mar 23, 2022 15:39:12 GMT
what a strange reply. Aren't people allowed to move and have houses anywhere else? Aren't low paid indian workers being employed at P&O over those who have just been sacked? And regarding the seafaring employees. You'll see i started my post with "I wonder .... " I didn't state they were, but it would be of course no surprise 'should' it come to light. You're flailing now you have gone from company hq in california to having a house there and you wouldn't be surprised if a multi billion company had decided to become involved in supplying seafaring staff for £1.50 an hour or whatever, dont trip over those clown shoes mate. Just been sat having a Burger King in the concourse at Dover, the staff that were waiting with travel cases to be collected and bussed out to the p&o ships elsewhere in port definatly didn’t look Indian, I’d say Eastern European for sure . Usual greasy tracksuit wearing men with the darker almost Mediterranean complexion
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 23, 2022 15:53:55 GMT
You're flailing now you have gone from company hq in california to having a house there and you wouldn't be surprised if a multi billion company had decided to become involved in supplying seafaring staff for £1.50 an hour or whatever, dont trip over those clown shoes mate. Just been sat having a Burger King in the concourse at Dover, the staff that were waiting with travel cases to be collected and bussed out to the p&o ships elsewhere in port definatly didn’t look Indian, I’d say Eastern European for sure . Usual greasy tracksuit wearing men with the darker almost Mediterranean complexion Wherever they are from its a shitty trick although seems standard for that industry when you read up on irish ferries in 2005, government can fine them and perhaps make them do the redundancy process properly but if they are deadset on it and will make you redundant anyway I guess if I was an ex employee I'd take the enhanced redundancy now rather than hang on and get contractual minimum not a nice situation for them whatever. Hope the bacon double was nice
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Post by richie22 on Mar 23, 2022 16:06:16 GMT
Just been sat having a Burger King in the concourse at Dover, the staff that were waiting with travel cases to be collected and bussed out to the p&o ships elsewhere in port definatly didn’t look Indian, I’d say Eastern European for sure . Usual greasy tracksuit wearing men with the darker almost Mediterranean complexion Wherever they are from its a shitty trick although seems standard for that industry when you read up on irish ferries in 2005, government can fine them and perhaps make them do the redundancy process properly but if they are deadset on it and will make you redundant anyway I guess if I was an ex employee I'd take the enhanced redundancy now rather than hang on and get contractual minimum not a nice situation for them whatever. Hope the bacon double was nice Double whopper tasted rough as fuck only marginally better than the tripe they serve to drivers as a complimentary onboard
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 23, 2022 16:11:35 GMT
Wherever they are from its a shitty trick although seems standard for that industry when you read up on irish ferries in 2005, government can fine them and perhaps make them do the redundancy process properly but if they are deadset on it and will make you redundant anyway I guess if I was an ex employee I'd take the enhanced redundancy now rather than hang on and get contractual minimum not a nice situation for them whatever. Hope the bacon double was nice Double whopper tasted rough as fuck only marginally better than the tripe they serve to drivers as a complimentary onboard Thats your mistake only the bacon double or the one with onion rings and bbq sauce are worth eating at hungry jacks as they call it in oz god knows why, safe travels.
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Post by wannabee on Mar 23, 2022 16:43:13 GMT
Just been sat having a Burger King in the concourse at Dover, the staff that were waiting with travel cases to be collected and bussed out to the p&o ships elsewhere in port definatly didn’t look Indian, I’d say Eastern European for sure . Usual greasy tracksuit wearing men with the darker almost Mediterranean complexion Wherever they are from its a shitty trick although seems standard for that industry when you read up on irish ferries in 2005, government can fine them and perhaps make them do the redundancy process properly but if they are deadset on it and will make you redundant anyway I guess if I was an ex employee I'd take the enhanced redundancy now rather than hang on and get contractual minimum not a nice situation for them whatever. Hope the bacon double was nice You have just repeated what I said DP/P&O would do earlier in the thread and that the 800 workers would have no option but to take the money It's convenient for DP that the money to cover the Redundancies £36M is being given to them £50M by UK Government in Grants. To answer your question above the Grants are Theoretically for infrastructure at London Gateway and Southampton To further answer your above question DP may well have the expertise to develop ports in Africa but I would bet good money they will engage in sharp practices Therefore I think BII could easily find other better projects to invest in given their charter is to alleviate poverty in Africa not to chase profits with Unethical Companies using UK Taxpayers Money
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Post by heworksardtho on Mar 23, 2022 18:27:52 GMT
Should use the ferry’s to bring the asylum seekers over from France 850 tried to cross yesterday with 400 making it to the U.K. , it’s only a matter of time before there are fatalities again , at least it would be safer this way
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Mar 23, 2022 18:48:27 GMT
Should use the ferry’s to bring the asylum seekers over from France 850 tried to cross yesterday with 400 making it to the U.K. , it’s only a matter of time before there are fatalities again , at least it would be safer this way Whatever happened to Hovercrafts? Do they exist any more? Dust a few of them off.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Mar 23, 2022 18:49:56 GMT
Wherever they are from its a shitty trick although seems standard for that industry when you read up on irish ferries in 2005, government can fine them and perhaps make them do the redundancy process properly but if they are deadset on it and will make you redundant anyway I guess if I was an ex employee I'd take the enhanced redundancy now rather than hang on and get contractual minimum not a nice situation for them whatever. Hope the bacon double was nice Double whopper tasted rough as fuck only marginally better than the tripe they serve to drivers as a complimentary onboard Trouble with the double bacon is they are piddly compared to the others. What’s all that about?😉
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Post by Dutchpeter on Mar 23, 2022 19:06:35 GMT
Should use the ferry’s to bring the asylum seekers over from France 850 tried to cross yesterday with 400 making it to the U.K. , it’s only a matter of time before there are fatalities again , at least it would be safer this way Whatever happened to Hovercrafts? Do they exist any more? Dust a few of them off. Still a passenger only service from Portsmouth (Dog Shit City) to the Isle of Wight. One of the car carrying behemoths still exists in the Hovercraft museum in Lee-on-Solent.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Mar 23, 2022 19:07:20 GMT
Whatever happened to Hovercrafts? Do they exist any more? Dust a few of them off. Still a passenger only service from Portsmouth (Dog Shit City) to the Isle of Wight. One of the car carrying behemoths still exists in the Hovercraft museum in Lee-on-Solent. Always fancied a go of one of those, what was the problem with them?
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Post by Dutchpeter on Mar 23, 2022 19:13:01 GMT
Still a passenger only service from Portsmouth (Dog Shit City) to the Isle of Wight. One of the car carrying behemoths still exists in the Hovercraft museum in Lee-on-Solent. Always fancied a go of one of those, what was the problem with them? Noisy, vibratory, impractical but fast. Apparently drinks were served in bottles with straws as they’d otherwise piss out everywhere. The current small passenger hovercrafts do 15 minute ride outs in the Solent.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Mar 23, 2022 19:15:15 GMT
Always fancied a go of one of those, what was the problem with them? Noisy, vibratory, impractical but fast. Apparently drinks were served in bottles with straws as they’d otherwise piss out everywhere. The current small passenger hovercrafts do 15 minute ride outs in the Solent. Strange, I thought their design would make them smoother if anything. Oh well
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 23, 2022 19:26:42 GMT
Double whopper tasted rough as fuck only marginally better than the tripe they serve to drivers as a complimentary onboard Trouble with the double bacon is they are piddly compared to the others. What’s all that about?😉 There is / was a bacon double xl no idea if still is but after a night out on beer was just the job for train back from charing x or victoria not done that for 2+ years so no idea if they still do them.
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Post by heworksardtho on Mar 23, 2022 19:34:19 GMT
Should use the ferry’s to bring the asylum seekers over from France 850 tried to cross yesterday with 400 making it to the U.K. , it’s only a matter of time before there are fatalities again , at least it would be safer this way Whatever happened to Hovercrafts? Do they exist any more? Dust a few of them off. They had them huge ones didn’t they , imagine that on trentham lake 😂😂
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Mar 23, 2022 19:34:56 GMT
Whatever happened to Hovercrafts? Do they exist any more? Dust a few of them off. They had them huge ones didn’t they , imagine that on trentham lake 😂😂 The thought had crossed my mind 🤣
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 23, 2022 19:37:05 GMT
Wherever they are from its a shitty trick although seems standard for that industry when you read up on irish ferries in 2005, government can fine them and perhaps make them do the redundancy process properly but if they are deadset on it and will make you redundant anyway I guess if I was an ex employee I'd take the enhanced redundancy now rather than hang on and get contractual minimum not a nice situation for them whatever. Hope the bacon double was nice You have just repeated what I said DP/P&O would do earlier in the thread and that the 800 workers would have no option but to take the money It's convenient for DP that the money to cover the Redundancies £36M is being given to them £50M by UK Government in Grants. To answer your question above the Grants are Theoretically for infrastructure at London Gateway and Southampton To further answer your above question DP may well have the expertise to develop ports in Africa but I would bet good money they will engage in sharp practices Therefore I think BII could easily find other better projects to invest in given their charter is to alleviate poverty in Africa not to chase profits with Unethical Companies using UK Taxpayers Money I am repeating what I said on page 4 when people were talking about bringing in legislation to make fire and rehire illegal which effectively means rehire becomes illegal as no law can stop firing all it can do is slow down the process. If the Uk doesnt get involved china will just do it as part of their belt and roadway project, I honestly have no strong feelings either way if BII carries on or wslks away.
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Post by heworksardtho on Mar 23, 2022 19:57:37 GMT
They had them huge ones didn’t they , imagine that on trentham lake 😂😂 The thought had crossed my mind 🤣 😂😂
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Post by toppercorner on Mar 23, 2022 20:34:59 GMT
what a strange reply. Aren't people allowed to move and have houses anywhere else? Aren't low paid indian workers being employed at P&O over those who have just been sacked? And regarding the seafaring employees. You'll see i started my post with "I wonder .... " I didn't state they were, but it would be of course no surprise 'should' it come to light. You're flailing now you have gone from company hq in california to having a house there and you wouldn't be surprised if a multi billion company had decided to become involved in supplying seafaring staff for £1.50 an hour or whatever, dont trip over those clown shoes mate. ok, they do do their business in california, despite the hq being in India. Can't even be arsed to explain how i know, but i know you won't accept it anyway. And i will admit, that does look poor in a response, but it's been a shattering few days.
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 23, 2022 21:03:20 GMT
You're flailing now you have gone from company hq in california to having a house there and you wouldn't be surprised if a multi billion company had decided to become involved in supplying seafaring staff for £1.50 an hour or whatever, dont trip over those clown shoes mate. ok, they do do their business in california, despite the hq being in India. Can't even be arsed to explain how i know, but i know you won't accept it anyway. And i will admit, that does look poor in a response, but it's been a shattering few days. They have offices in 120+ locations, your claim was it was their hq then his home neither are true or were ever particularly relevant to begin with but happy to leave it there rather than go round in circles.
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Post by wannabee on Mar 23, 2022 22:17:54 GMT
You have just repeated what I said DP/P&O would do earlier in the thread and that the 800 workers would have no option but to take the money It's convenient for DP that the money to cover the Redundancies £36M is being given to them £50M by UK Government in Grants. To answer your question above the Grants are Theoretically for infrastructure at London Gateway and Southampton To further answer your above question DP may well have the expertise to develop ports in Africa but I would bet good money they will engage in sharp practices Therefore I think BII could easily find other better projects to invest in given their charter is to alleviate poverty in Africa not to chase profits with Unethical Companies using UK Taxpayers Money I am repeating what I said on page 4 when people were talking about bringing in legislation to make fire and rehire illegal which effectively means rehire becomes illegal as no law can stop firing all it can do is slow down the process. If the Uk doesnt get involved china will just do it as part of their belt and roadway project, I honestly have no strong feelings either way if BII carries on or wslks away. It would be simply to criminalise fire and rehire making corporate executives personally responsible for their actions I'm quite sure that would focus minds You seem quite content to live in a Society that esposes a race to the bottom Perhaps this is why you are so supportive of this Government Perhaps naively I believe the majority of British people have aspirations and values on a higher plane
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Post by sorethumbs on Mar 23, 2022 22:54:43 GMT
Well well well. It appears that the EU made it easier for P&O to sack the staff, rather than Brexit making it easier '-the law changed in 2018 due to the implementation of an EU directive' BBC News - Doubt over PM claim that P&O sackings may be illegal www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60849957A law which ultimately sealed the fate of P&O staff when it came into force in 2018, DP World buy P&O in 2019, almost immediately re-register the vessels in Cyprus. Maybe they planned on shedding the staff for cheaper labour when they took it on?
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 23, 2022 23:21:21 GMT
I am repeating what I said on page 4 when people were talking about bringing in legislation to make fire and rehire illegal which effectively means rehire becomes illegal as no law can stop firing all it can do is slow down the process. If the Uk doesnt get involved china will just do it as part of their belt and roadway project, I honestly have no strong feelings either way if BII carries on or wslks away. It would be simply to criminalise fire and rehire making corporate executives personally responsible for their actions I'm quite sure that would focus minds You seem quite content to live in a Society that esposes a race to the bottom Perhaps this is why you are so supportive of this Government Perhaps naively I believe the majority of British people have aspirations and values on a higher plane How are you going to enforce uk law in dubai then mate ? Are you going to criminalise firing people too because otherwise I see a simple way around your fire and rehire law just dont rehire. You have a company losing £100m a year not sure you can bring in a law to force them to continue operating at that level, this company have been able to do this because this part of the operation is covered by maritime law not uk employmemt law so they can in the future pay £1.50 an hour they can't do that for anyone who works in the uk only those who work at sea. It's not about espousing a race to bottom or wanting aspirations and higher values it's recognising its not the law that could force a change on this its the massive reputational damage p&o are incurring, if customers start cancelling they might reconsider.
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Post by wannabee on Mar 24, 2022 3:53:11 GMT
It would be simply to criminalise fire and rehire making corporate executives personally responsible for their actions I'm quite sure that would focus minds You seem quite content to live in a Society that esposes a race to the bottom Perhaps this is why you are so supportive of this Government Perhaps naively I believe the majority of British people have aspirations and values on a higher plane How are you going to enforce uk law in dubai then mate ? Are you going to criminalise firing people too because otherwise I see a simple way around your fire and rehire law just dont rehire. You have a company losing £100m a year not sure you can bring in a law to force them to continue operating at that level, this company have been able to do this because this part of the operation is covered by maritime law not uk employmemt law so they can in the future pay £1.50 an hour they can't do that for anyone who works in the uk only those who work at sea. It's not about espousing a race to bottom or wanting aspirations and higher values it's recognising its not the law that could force a change on this its the massive reputational damage p&o are incurring, if customers start cancelling they might reconsider. Well mate, P&O is a UK Registered PLC with 6 current active directors resident in UK. No need at all to seek legal recourse in Dubai Your simple solution is flawed because the alternative of a UK PLC if not rehire is liquidation if it doesn't have employees to operate. I doubt if the 800 sailors that were made redundant would shed too many tears. P&O incurred losses of £38M in 2019 and £85M in 2020, no figures have yet been published for 2021 but are expected to approach £100M The decline in trading (Turnover) is mainly attributed to a) Covid and b) The "B" word Brexit in particular the decline in imports/Exports between UK/EU on Hull/Rotterdam route and ROI much less using UK as land bridge. Of course any company experiencing unsustainable losses has a right and indeed a duty to put in place a restructuring that will allow it to trade sustainably into the future. There are legal procedures in place to give protection to the Company and its employees via the Unions for this to take place. P&O have simply decided to ride roughshod over this and seem willing to accept the Financial penalties. I agree enormous reputational damage will be done to P&O Brand ... I wonder if a change of name is imminent Regarding BII's Joint Venture with DP World you are conflating two different things. I posed that it was at least unwise for BII to use UK Taxpayers Money to enter a Joint Venture with the ultimate decision makers in this P&O debacle to avoid a very likely reputational damage to UK down the line. You countered this by saying if not UK then China as an example could take UK's place. I see this as Straw Man Argument and contend, perhaps naively as I acknowledged, that a majority of British people would concur with my opinion Clearly you do not, and which in my opinion iwould be a debasement of British values and indeed a race to the bottom
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 24, 2022 15:55:22 GMT
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Mar 24, 2022 17:29:13 GMT
The daft sod. Doesn't he realise the way you get on here is to deny any rules were broken? Could also have said he thought the zoom meeting was a quiz.
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Post by partickpotter on Mar 24, 2022 18:36:59 GMT
The daft sod. Doesn't he realise the way you get on here is to deny any rules were broken? Could also have said he thought the zoom meeting was a quiz. That’s about as big a “fuck you” as I’ve ever seen from a chief exec. What a twat. I just hope the cunt ends up behind bars for a while.
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Post by superjw on Mar 24, 2022 19:09:10 GMT
"We knew it was illegal, but because we wanted to do it we carried on anyway"
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