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Post by boskampsflaps on Feb 19, 2019 22:43:33 GMT
He transformed a Luton team that were struggling so what’s your point? He’ll do the same here We’re in one of the hardest leagues having previously played at the top level. With so so much expectation and resource by comparison. Luton were in the lowest league, and non league prior, with little expectation. It’s a massive difference, that’s my point! It’s like managing a market stall then running the UK operation for Sainsbury’s Only if Sainsbury's was identical but with higher value stock yeh.
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shooters
Youth Player
POTTER POWER
Posts: 475
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Post by shooters on Feb 20, 2019 10:05:28 GMT
Yes!. He really believes in his methods and needs to see if the players can fit into it, are physically and mentally up for that .. they are all getting a chance and if they don't they are not part of matchday squad. Training is where this is being sorted out. spoke to a few who know him well going back 10 yrs and all are very positive on him and his team, and we have a manager who is 100% committed. Now just need the players to be 100% with him, believe in themselves and the fans right behind them so we build momentum.
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Post by wakefieldstokie on Feb 20, 2019 16:01:10 GMT
We’re in one of the hardest leagues having previously played at the top level. With so so much expectation and resource by comparison. Luton were in the lowest league, and non league prior, with little expectation. It’s a massive difference, that’s my point! It’s like managing a market stall then running the UK operation for Sainsbury’s There’s a difference yes but the principles of creating a competitive team remain the same The Luton team that he built will be in the same division as us next season Who did you want? Allardyce? Moyes? O’Neil? Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz glad we have gone down a different route but it will take time You don’t get the point. Why mention other managers? I was pleased with his appointment just doubting his abilities, I’m allowed to, doesn’t mean I want him to fail.
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Post by stokefan1972 on Feb 20, 2019 17:32:10 GMT
He needs two wins fast not two losses or two draws next two home games
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Post by maple on Feb 20, 2019 18:25:13 GMT
He transformed a Luton team that were struggling so what’s your point? He’ll do the same here We’re in one of the hardest leagues having previously played at the top level. With so so much expectation and resource by comparison. Luton were in the lowest league, and non league prior, with little expectation. It’s a massive difference, that’s my point! It’s like managing a market stall then running the UK operation for Sainsbury’s
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Post by bertiebigguns on Feb 20, 2019 19:08:48 GMT
We’re in one of the hardest leagues having previously played at the top level. With so so much expectation and resource by comparison. Luton were in the lowest league, and non league prior, with little expectation. It’s a massive difference, that’s my point! It’s like managing a market stall then running the UK operation for Sainsbury’s There’s a difference yes but the principles of creating a competitive team remain the same The Luton team that he built will be in the same division as us next season Who did you want? Allardyce? Moyes? O’Neil? Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz glad we have gone down a different route but it will take time Seems a very long winded process to me, get rid of your entire player bank to suit a new manager or get a new manager to suit your player bank? Somebody with the right profile can get a tune out of these fuckers, I hate to say it but NJ isn’t that man.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2019 19:10:36 GMT
There’s a difference yes but the principles of creating a competitive team remain the same The Luton team that he built will be in the same division as us next season Who did you want? Allardyce? Moyes? O’Neil? Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz glad we have gone down a different route but it will take time Seems a very long winded process to me, get rid of your entire player bank to suit a new manager or get a new manager to suit your player bank? Somebody with the right profile can play a tune on these fuckers, I hate to say it but NJ isn’t that man. Name the right man then.
Rowett playing a functional brand of football couldn't get a tune out of them and Nathan Jones, who favours attacking football can't get a tune out of them either.
Good luck.
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Post by bertiebigguns on Feb 20, 2019 19:24:30 GMT
Seems a very long winded process to me, get rid of your entire player bank to suit a new manager or get a new manager to suit your player bank? Somebody with the right profile can play a tune on these fuckers, I hate to say it but NJ isn’t that man. Name the right man then. Rowett playing a functional brand of football couldn't get a tune out of them and Nathan Jones, who favours attacking football can't get a tune out of them either. Good luck.
As much as we can’t see it at the moment we are dealing with highly paid, professional and international football stars who in the majority have played at the highest level in domestic football here and abroad and some have represented their country. The person that leads this group of players HAS to be somebody they can look up to, somebody who has done it, somebody to aspire to, somebody who has the experience and the knowledge to be able to tell them what to do, ultimately somebody that they respect. In many professions if you get a young up and coming spunker walking into any established setup with big ideas and no experience to back it up, they’ll get a short thrift, NJ will never get the respect he needs to move things forward.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2019 19:27:41 GMT
Name the right man then. Rowett playing a functional brand of football couldn't get a tune out of them and Nathan Jones, who favours attacking football can't get a tune out of them either. Good luck.
As much as we can’t see it at the moment we are dealing with highly paid, professional and international football stars who in the majority have played at the highest level in domestic football here and abroad and have represented their country. The person that leads this group of players HAS to be somebody they can look up to, somebody who has done it, somebody to aspire to, somebody who has the experience and the knowledge to be able to tell them what to do, ultimately somebody that they respect. In many professions if you get a young up and coming spunker walking into any established setup with big ideas and no experience to back it up, they’ll get a short thrift, NJ will never get the respect he needs to move things forward. Who?
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Post by bertiebigguns on Feb 20, 2019 19:40:32 GMT
Somebody who suits that profile, a manager who has operated at the highest level and is capable of solidifying our assets.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2019 19:44:38 GMT
Somebody who suits that profile, a manager who has operated at the highest level and is capable of solidifying our assets. Such as?
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Post by rawli on Feb 20, 2019 20:11:11 GMT
Name the right man then. Rowett playing a functional brand of football couldn't get a tune out of them and Nathan Jones, who favours attacking football can't get a tune out of them either. Good luck.
As much as we can’t see it at the moment we are dealing with highly paid, professional and international football stars who in the majority have played at the highest level in domestic football here and abroad and some have represented their country. The person that leads this group of players HAS to be somebody they can look up to, somebody who has done it, somebody to aspire to, somebody who has the experience and the knowledge to be able to tell them what to do, ultimately somebody that they respect. In many professions if you get a young up and coming spunker walking into any established setup with big ideas and no experience to back it up, they’ll get a short thrift, NJ will never get the respect he needs to move things forward. Think you are over rating the squad. The fact no other clubs have come in for any of them bar Shaqiri, Crouch and Bojan shows says they aren't as good as they or the recruitment team believe.
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Post by owdestokie2 on Feb 20, 2019 20:22:19 GMT
I think in reply to the title of the post........We have to.
This coming summer and next January’s transfer windows will be massive for us, IMHO there significance cannot underestimated.
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Post by bertiebigguns on Feb 20, 2019 20:40:01 GMT
Somebody who suits that profile, a manager who has operated at the highest level and is capable of solidifying our assets. Such as? I can’t answer that, I wish I could. For the record it’s not about capability with Jones, it’s not his ability as a manager I am questioning but his suitability to manage this level or type of player. What is concerning his profile is very similar to the previous incumbent.
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Post by southcoaststokie on Feb 20, 2019 20:44:26 GMT
Everyone has got tò get behind Jones, we cannot sack another manager, I don't get it that you have to get someone in who has played at the highest level so as to get the backing of the players, plenty of World class players have failed as managers, and top class players who have proved themselves as top managers are not going to come to Stoke, I was pleased we got Jones after he put out his vision for the club, at least he has an idea of how he wants to play the game and it has proven very successful at Luton, as with anything new, he has to get the right people in to do the job he wants properly, at the moment he is just making do with what he has, they maybe very expensive footballers, but that doesn't mean they fit the right profile for NJ, I think there is signs of improvement, give him time and I believe that he could get us back up but will we all give him our patience and time to fulfil his project
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Post by bertiebigguns on Feb 20, 2019 21:11:23 GMT
Everyone has got tò get behind Jones, we cannot sack another manager, I don't get it that you have to get someone in who has played at the highest level so as to get the backing of the players, plenty of World class players have failed as managers, and top class players who have proved themselves as top managers are not going to come to Stoke, I was pleased we got Jones after he put out his vision for the club, at least he has an idea of how he wants to play the game and it has proven very successful at Luton, as with anything new, he has to get the right people in to do the job he wants properly, at the moment he is just making do with what he has, they maybe very expensive footballers, but that doesn't mean they fit the right profile for NJ, I think there is signs of improvement, give him time and I believe that he could get us back up but will we all give him our patience and time to fulfil his project Mate I said operated at the highest level not necessarily played. On paper we have got a premiership team playing in the championship and being managed by a league 1 manager, it is a total misfit.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2019 21:51:16 GMT
I can’t answer that, I wish I could. For the record it’s not about capability with Jones, it’s not his ability as a manager I am questioning but his suitability to manage this level or type of player. What is concerning his profile is very similar to the previous incumbent. I think there's a very simple reason why you can't, and that is there are very few options at that type of level for our club at this moment in time. He is a risk but one I think is well worth taking. It's far too early to write him off when I genuinely believe a bigger name manager would be in a similar situation with such a misfit squad. I'll give you a name that fits your criteria of managing at the top level. Alan Pardew. Would you have him over Jones? If so why and if not why?
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Post by Absolution on Feb 20, 2019 22:02:25 GMT
Everyone has got tò get behind Jones, we cannot sack another manager, I don't get it that you have to get someone in who has played at the highest level so as to get the backing of the players, plenty of World class players have failed as managers, and top class players who have proved themselves as top managers are not going to come to Stoke, I was pleased we got Jones after he put out his vision for the club, at least he has an idea of how he wants to play the game and it has proven very successful at Luton, as with anything new, he has to get the right people in to do the job he wants properly, at the moment he is just making do with what he has, they maybe very expensive footballers, but that doesn't mean they fit the right profile for NJ, I think there is signs of improvement, give him time and I believe that he could get us back up but will we all give him our patience and time to fulfil his project Mate I said operated at the highest level not necessarily played. On paper we have got a premiership team playing in the championship and being managed by a league 1 manager, it is a total misfit. We don't have a Premiership team on paper or on grass, and if we'd left Jones where he was, the chances are he'd be a Championship manager next season anyway. In no way is it a misfit. A risk, yes. At this point in time, anyone would be. But I'd rather risk nabbing a manager potentially on the way up rather than a Moyes type on the way down.
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Post by marcofstoke on Feb 20, 2019 22:04:29 GMT
There’s a difference yes but the principles of creating a competitive team remain the same The Luton team that he built will be in the same division as us next season Who did you want? Allardyce? Moyes? O’Neil? Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz glad we have gone down a different route but it will take time You don’t get the point. Why mention other managers? I was pleased with his appointment just doubting his abilities, I’m allowed to, doesn’t mean I want him to fail. Let’s just see then, if you were happy with his appointment then you’ve got to give him time, he hasn’t got a magic wand, even Fergie needed time at United all those years ago
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Post by marcofstoke on Feb 20, 2019 22:08:10 GMT
Everyone has got tò get behind Jones, we cannot sack another manager, I don't get it that you have to get someone in who has played at the highest level so as to get the backing of the players, plenty of World class players have failed as managers, and top class players who have proved themselves as top managers are not going to come to Stoke, I was pleased we got Jones after he put out his vision for the club, at least he has an idea of how he wants to play the game and it has proven very successful at Luton, as with anything new, he has to get the right people in to do the job he wants properly, at the moment he is just making do with what he has, they maybe very expensive footballers, but that doesn't mean they fit the right profile for NJ, I think there is signs of improvement, give him time and I believe that he could get us back up but will we all give him our patience and time to fulfil his project Mate I said operated at the highest level not necessarily played. On paper we have got a premiership team playing in the championship and being managed by a league 1 manager, it is a total misfit. When Pulis took on the Stoke job the first time around we were a Championship side and most of his experience was in League One! Hope it turns out the same as that did
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Post by marcofstoke on Feb 20, 2019 22:12:11 GMT
There’s a difference yes but the principles of creating a competitive team remain the same The Luton team that he built will be in the same division as us next season Who did you want? Allardyce? Moyes? O’Neil? Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz glad we have gone down a different route but it will take time Seems a very long winded process to me, get rid of your entire player bank to suit a new manager or get a new manager to suit your player bank? Somebody with the right profile can get a tune out of these fuckers, I hate to say it but NJ isn’t that man. Come back this time next year, how you can say that after a few games is beyond me There’s a reason players and fans were devastated when he left his previous club
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Post by stokeson on Feb 20, 2019 22:24:10 GMT
Seems a very long winded process to me, get rid of your entire player bank to suit a new manager or get a new manager to suit your player bank? Somebody with the right profile can get a tune out of these fuckers, I hate to say it but NJ isn’t that man. Come back this time next year, how you can say that after a few games is beyond me There’s a reason players and fans were devastated when he left his previous club Yes they were a Div 1 club doing the best they have in years.He is a proven Div 1 manager anything else is just wishfull thinking .I want him to do well but this team is better than what he has given us . Give us some Goals and Points Nathan then ill be will you.
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Post by marcofstoke on Feb 20, 2019 22:50:50 GMT
Come back this time next year, how you can say that after a few games is beyond me There’s a reason players and fans were devastated when he left his previous club Yes they were a Div 1 club doing the best they have in years.He is a proven Div 1 manager anything else is just wishfull thinking .I want him to do well but this team is better than what he has given us . Give us some Goals and Points Nathan then ill be will you. he made them a division one club, they were near the bottom of division two when he took over and next season they will probably be in the Championship with us.
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Post by stokeson on Feb 20, 2019 23:12:36 GMT
Yes they were a Div 1 club doing the best they have in years.He is a proven Div 1 manager anything else is just wishfull thinking .I want him to do well but this team is better than what he has given us . Give us some Goals and Points Nathan then ill be will you. he made them a division one club, they were near the bottom of division two when he took over and next season they will probably be in the Championship with us. If things carry on he'll make us a Div 1 club that's my point.............
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Post by bertiebigguns on Feb 21, 2019 0:36:36 GMT
Mate I said operated at the highest level not necessarily played. On paper we have got a premiership team playing in the championship and being managed by a league 1 manager, it is a total misfit. We don't have a Premiership team on paper or on grass, and if we'd left Jones where he was, the chances are he'd be a Championship manager next season anyway. In no way is it a misfit. A risk, yes. At this point in time, anyone would be. But I'd rather risk nabbing a manager potentially on the way up rather than a Moyes type on the way down. The investment that has been poured into this squad of players quite easily justifies a Premier League setup, we have got 2 players loaned out to foreign clubs, both cost more than Cardiff City’s recent record signing Unless I am mistaken every position on that pitch can be filled by a player with premier league experience in the last 12 months, some twice over. Without the right manager it means nothing.
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Post by Absolution on Feb 21, 2019 0:51:35 GMT
We don't have a Premiership team on paper or on grass, and if we'd left Jones where he was, the chances are he'd be a Championship manager next season anyway. In no way is it a misfit. A risk, yes. At this point in time, anyone would be. But I'd rather risk nabbing a manager potentially on the way up rather than a Moyes type on the way down. The investment that has been poured into this squad of players quite easily justifies a Premier League setup, we have got 2 players loaned out to foreign clubs, both cost more than Cardiff City’s recent record signing. Unless I am mistaken every position on that pitch can be filled by a player with premier league experience, some twice over. Without the right manager it means nothing. If I spend a million quid on a pile of junk, it doesn’t make it a Ferrari. It makes it a pile of junk that I’ve badly overspent on. We were relegated because the players weren’t good enough and we were badly managed. We’re where we are now because the players aren’t good enough and they’ve been badly managed. Luton have presumably spent more wisely and been well managed. At this point, the fact it’s been done in the two divisions below us is neither here nor there. Whether Jones is the right manager or not is nowhere near to being decided.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Feb 21, 2019 1:04:45 GMT
We don't have a Premiership team on paper or on grass, and if we'd left Jones where he was, the chances are he'd be a Championship manager next season anyway. In no way is it a misfit. A risk, yes. At this point in time, anyone would be. But I'd rather risk nabbing a manager potentially on the way up rather than a Moyes type on the way down. The investment that has been poured into this squad of players quite easily justifies a Premier League setup, we have got 2 players loaned out to foreign clubs, both cost more than Cardiff City’s recent record signing. Unless I am mistaken every position on that pitch can be filled by a player with premier league experience, some twice over. Without the right manager it means nothing. I'm with you on this one. The whole point of getting rid of Lambert should have been to replace him with someone much better, a Premier league manager to manage our Premier league players. As it happened we've gone from a Premier league manager (Hughes) to a bloke with a proven track record of getting a team promoted from this division (Lambert) to a mid table championship manager (Rowett) to a league 1 manager (Jones). It's no coincidence things are getting worse really is it.
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Post by bertiebigguns on Feb 21, 2019 1:13:40 GMT
I can’t answer that, I wish I could. For the record it’s not about capability with Jones, it’s not his ability as a manager I am questioning but his suitability to manage this level or type of player. What is concerning his profile is very similar to the previous incumbent. I think there's a very simple reason why you can't, and that is there are very few options at that type of level for our club at this moment in time. He is a risk but one I think is well worth taking. It's far too early to write him off when I genuinely believe a bigger name manager would be in a similar situation with such a misfit squad. I'll give you a name that fits your criteria of managing at the top level. Alan Pardew. Would you have him over Jones? If so why and if not why? Agree, at this moment in time we are extremely limited with our options, when Rowett went the favourable option was to appoint the best from the worst instead of the worst from the best, a big gamble. The average Joe that kicked off the season was removed to make way, he failed miserably, he had familiarity of the league but couldn’t work the players. In comes NJ, doesn’t know the league and can’t work the players, trying to play a system unsuited to his team and is not productive in the league, he is struggling to adapt a new approach with what he’s got, granted it’s early days but the red flags are starting to flutter. Step forward Alan Pardew (your example not my choice), managed top flight footballers with mixed success, experience in the lower leagues and dabbled at European level. Familiar on the Premier League circuit and unquestionably holds the type of respect that our players can adhere to. Yes I would employ Alan Pardew over Nathan Jones.
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Post by bertiebigguns on Feb 21, 2019 1:17:17 GMT
The investment that has been poured into this squad of players quite easily justifies a Premier League setup, we have got 2 players loaned out to foreign clubs, both cost more than Cardiff City’s recent record signing. Unless I am mistaken every position on that pitch can be filled by a player with premier league experience, some twice over. Without the right manager it means nothing. If I spend a million quid on a pile of junk, it doesn’t make it a Ferrari. It makes it a pile of junk that I’ve badly overspent on. We were relegated because the players weren’t good enough and we were badly managed. We’re where we are now because the players aren’t good enough and they’ve been badly managed. Luton have presumably spent more wisely and been well managed. At this point, the fact it’s been done in the two divisions below us is neither here nor there. Whether Jones is the right manager or not is nowhere near to being decided. If you did spend a million quid on a Ferrari you wouldn’t take it to Ford to get it serviced.
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Post by Absolution on Feb 21, 2019 1:22:37 GMT
If I spend a million quid on a pile of junk, it doesn’t make it a Ferrari. It makes it a pile of junk that I’ve badly overspent on. We were relegated because the players weren’t good enough and we were badly managed. We’re where we are now because the players aren’t good enough and they’ve been badly managed. Luton have presumably spent more wisely and been well managed. At this point, the fact it’s been done in the two divisions below us is neither here nor there. Whether Jones is the right manager or not is nowhere near to being decided. If you did spend a million quid on a Ferrari you wouldn’t take it to Ford to get it serviced. A Ferrari garage wouldn’t even consider looking at the pile of junk I’ve purchased.
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