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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 15:43:28 GMT
Good old fashions 1970s cricket spinners operating from both ends. I would not like to to try and bat this one out. Those were the days ! All that's missing is Derek Underwood on a rain affected pitch .....unplayable
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Post by lancashirelad on Jul 9, 2017 15:51:10 GMT
Good old fashions 1970s cricket spinners operating from both ends. I would not like to to try and bat this one out. Those were the days ! All that's missing is Derek Underwood on a rain affected pitch .....unplayable Bring back Hughes and Jack Simmons the Gillette cup days. Underwood was on TV in the crowd yesterday deadly on the last day of a test.
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Jul 9, 2017 16:22:21 GMT
This thread is a pisser from start-to-finish with people putting their foot in it I think my favourite is... Although Rashid took over thirty wickets during the winter , they apparently think he bowls too many bad balls and concedes too many runs and is better suited to one day cricket at the moment ......seems like a contradictional way of thinking to me , he has the ability to be a match winner with the ball, something you wouldn't say of Moeen or Dawson
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Post by followyoudown on Jul 9, 2017 16:48:56 GMT
The thinking supposedly is for Mo to concentrate on attacking bowling and use Dawson for containment. The fact his county team mate preferred Dawson over Rashid probably means his test career is pretty much over, I'm sure they'll give Crane a test debut sooner rather than later. Yep Swann is a really big miss lets hope they learn from that with the quicks they need to get the Currans, Overtons involved while Anderson and Broad are still around. On current form Samit Patel might be an interesting pick ? He's always been a decent player and at the moment he appears to be in the form of his life ....decent second string option in the spin department too. If Samit doesn't get a chance again this year, he never will his face just doesn't seem to fit must have a connection to Somerset somewhere Much better batsman than Dawson and as (not) good at this level with the ball. When we have Mo-r-ali do we need a second spinner
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 17:01:12 GMT
This thread is a pisser from start-to-finish with people putting their foot in it I think my favourite is... Although Rashid took over thirty wickets during the winter , they apparently think he bowls too many bad balls and concedes too many runs and is better suited to one day cricket at the moment ......seems like a contradictional way of thinking to me , he has the ability to be a match winner with the ball, something you wouldn't say of Moeen or Dawson But it's a thread about people's opinions on the game isn't it ? Do you have any ? ....a marvellous performance by Moeen Ali in this match , something that he has not been previously. is a match winner with the ball ...I take my hat off to him he bowled excellently and I hope he continues in a similar vein in the future ....one swallow never makes a summer however ..
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 17:04:40 GMT
On current form Samit Patel might be an interesting pick ? He's always been a decent player and at the moment he appears to be in the form of his life ....decent second string option in the spin department too. If Samit doesn't get a chance again this year, he never will his face just doesn't seem to fit must have a connection to Somerset somewhere Much better batsman than Dawson and as (not) good at this level with the ball. When we have Mo-r-ali do we need a second spinner Agree that he deserves a chance but doubt whether he will get one ....No we probably don't need two spinners as it's unlikely to turn as much on the other pitches they will play on this summer ( unless that's what they are looking to do ....but I think unlikely ) .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 17:08:49 GMT
Those were the days ! All that's missing is Derek Underwood on a rain affected pitch .....unplayable Bring back Hughes and Jack Simmons the Gillette cup days. Underwood was on TV in the crowd yesterday deadly on the last day of a test. Deadly on any day if the rain got onto the pitch ....." Flat Jack " was a decent bowler , was pro at Blackpool for a season when he retired from the first class game .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 17:32:09 GMT
I think Moeen's bowling coach (whose name eludes me at the moment) deserves a lot of the credit as he has obviously done a lot of work with Moeen and improved his technique and variations immensely.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 18:06:38 GMT
I think Moeen's bowling coach (whose name eludes me at the moment) deserves a lot of the credit as he has obviously done a lot of work with Moeen and improved his technique and variations immensely. Saqlain Mushtaq ( who was a world class off spinner ) it's definitely the best he has bowled for England , but I still maintain that he's never looked looked liked being a match winner with the ball before now ...I hope he continues to improve on this performance .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 18:21:59 GMT
I think Moeen's bowling coach (whose name eludes me at the moment) deserves a lot of the credit as he has obviously done a lot of work with Moeen and improved his technique and variations immensely. Saqlain Mushtaq ( who was a world class off spinner ) it's definitely the best he has bowled for England , but I still maintain that he's never looked looked liked being a match winner with the ball before now ...I hope he continues to improve on this performance . That's him, I just couldn't remember his name ! I suppose the very dry conditions really helped as well.
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Post by followyoudown on Jul 9, 2017 18:25:39 GMT
If Samit doesn't get a chance again this year, he never will his face just doesn't seem to fit must have a connection to Somerset somewhere Much better batsman than Dawson and as (not) good at this level with the ball. When we have Mo-r-ali do we need a second spinner Agree that he deserves a chance but doubt whether he will get one ....No we probably don't need two spinners as it's unlikely to turn as much on the other pitches they will play on this summer ( unless that's what they are looking to do ....but I think unlikely ) . Lords is generally a "corporate" pitch to get 5 days play in, the unusually hot weather will probably have affected it, wouldn't expect Dawson to get a game at Trent Bridge or Mo to get much of a bowl. Expect they'll pick another seamer.
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Post by followyoudown on Jul 9, 2017 18:29:58 GMT
I think Moeen's bowling coach (whose name eludes me at the moment) deserves a lot of the credit as he has obviously done a lot of work with Moeen and improved his technique and variations immensely. Saqlain Mushtaq ( who was a world class off spinner ) it's definitely the best he has bowled for England , but I still maintain that he's never looked looked liked being a match winner with the ball before now ...I hope he continues to improve on this performance . He's picked up useful wickets and does have the knack of getting the key players out but like you say he's not looked like putting in a display like today although to be fair he's having to learn his game at test level which takes some doing.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 19:17:40 GMT
Saqlain Mushtaq ( who was a world class off spinner ) it's definitely the best he has bowled for England , but I still maintain that he's never looked looked liked being a match winner with the ball before now ...I hope he continues to improve on this performance . He's picked up useful wickets and does have the knack of getting the key players out but like you say he's not looked like putting in a display like today although to be fair he's having to learn his game at test level which takes some doing. That's exactly right ....It wasn't aimed as a criticism of the guy , he was thrown in at the deep end initially as a part time spinner in the championship and asked to bowl as the front line spinner in the Test side , when he wasn't up to the job .....not his fault and he has steadily improved , he's a decent cricketer no doubt about it. We are still looking for that top class spinner though as it seems as we said before that they are looking beyond Rashid .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 19:19:58 GMT
Agree that he deserves a chance but doubt whether he will get one ....No we probably don't need two spinners as it's unlikely to turn as much on the other pitches they will play on this summer ( unless that's what they are looking to do ....but I think unlikely ) . Lords is generally a "corporate" pitch to get 5 days play in, the unusually hot weather will probably have affected it, wouldn't expect Dawson to get a game at Trent Bridge or Mo to get much of a bowl. Expect they'll pick another seamer. Probably so .....it would be ideal to slip Samit in on his own ground , it would strengthen the batting too....won't happen though .
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Post by jimigoodwinsbeard on Jul 9, 2017 19:35:37 GMT
Good old fashions 1970s cricket spinners operating from both ends. I would not like to to try and bat this one out. Those were the days ! All that's missing is Derek Underwood on a rain affected pitch .....unplayable I was a bit young for Derek, what made him special (esp on a rain affected)? From what I can recollect back in the day he seemed a 'quick' off spinner....may be completely wrong (just remember a fairly brisk run-up)....
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 19:57:34 GMT
Those were the days ! All that's missing is Derek Underwood on a rain affected pitch .....unplayable I was a bit young for Derek, what made him special (esp on a rain affected)? From what I can recollect back in the day he seemed a 'quick' off spinner....may be completely wrong (just remember a fairly brisk run-up).... Left arm almost medium pace bowler who bowled more " cutters " than genuine spin On a rain affected pitch he used to seam them both ways , vicious lift off a good length with men all around the bat ....he deserved the name " Deadly " ....He was never quite the same on drier wickets abroad though Or when they started covering the whole of the pitch over here .
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 10, 2017 6:20:41 GMT
He's picked up useful wickets and does have the knack of getting the key players out but like you say he's not looked like putting in a display like today although to be fair he's having to learn his game at test level which takes some doing. That's exactly right ....It wasn't aimed as a criticism of the guy , he was thrown in at the deep end initially as a part time spinner in the championship and asked to bowl as the front line spinner in the Test side , when he wasn't up to the job .....not his fault and he has steadily improved , he's a decent cricketer no doubt about it. We are still looking for that top class spinner though as it seems as we said before that they are looking beyond Rashid . Fantastic effort from Ali yesterday - he bowled us to victory. But worth bearing in mind the 10 wickets he took in this test is the same number of wickets he took in the entire recent 5 test series in India. Maybe he has turned the corner and is now good enough to be a front line spinner. It's a big maybe though. That horror show in India is still fresh in the mind.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2017 8:39:09 GMT
That's exactly right ....It wasn't aimed as a criticism of the guy , he was thrown in at the deep end initially as a part time spinner in the championship and asked to bowl as the front line spinner in the Test side , when he wasn't up to the job .....not his fault and he has steadily improved , he's a decent cricketer no doubt about it. We are still looking for that top class spinner though as it seems as we said before that they are looking beyond Rashid . Fantastic effort from Ali yesterday - he bowled us to victory. But worth bearing in mind the 10 wickets he took in this test is the same number of wickets he took in the entire recent 5 test series in India. Maybe he has turned the corner and is now good enough to be a front line spinner. It's a big maybe though. That horror show in India is still fresh in the mind. My thoughts exactly .
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 14, 2017 10:56:41 GMT
2nd test underway - England are bowling and bowling well. SA 20-1 after 11 overs. Enjoy
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Post by penkvillepotter on Jul 14, 2017 17:13:33 GMT
Pleased to say I'm going tomorrow. Been looking forward to it for ages. Always prefer it when England will be batting.
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 14, 2017 18:41:10 GMT
Pleased to say I'm going tomorrow. Been looking forward to it for ages. Always prefer it when England will be batting. Good for you. Hope your day is great. You've a bit of South Africa batting to go yet, then, let's hope, a lengthy endurance test as our top 3 build (slowly) a platform for the glamour boys of our middle order. Today was good for England up until the new ball when it got a bit flat and SA batted very well.
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Post by chuckrocky on Jul 15, 2017 14:46:58 GMT
Six wickets down and still 150 behind. A long way back from here.
South Africa have bowled well but our batting line up really is fragile. Every match it seems like it's down to a couple of the batsmen to score the majority of the runs.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Jul 15, 2017 15:47:42 GMT
When will the selectors realise Ballance isn't up to the job?
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Post by chuckrocky on Jul 15, 2017 18:09:07 GMT
Well this test is effectively over after day two, have our batsmen forgotten how to play test match cricket?
Cook Stoneman Westley Root Malan Bairstow Stokes Ali Woakes Broad Anderson
I'd be going with something like for the remaining matches, we definitely need an extra batsman in there.
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Post by penkvillepotter on Jul 16, 2017 8:05:48 GMT
Didn't bring England much luck yesterday. But when you are 3-2 it's a long way back from there. Would loved to have seen Root get a ton but it was a bloody good day out, much ale and other unidentified drinks taken and a couple in the Glebe to finish off.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Jul 16, 2017 11:44:18 GMT
With 2 and 3 getting out regularly before there is even a mark on the new ball,Root is practically opening the batting.
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 16, 2017 12:13:02 GMT
Didn't bring England much luck yesterday. But when you are 3-2 it's a long way back from there. Would loved to have seen Root get a ton but it was a bloody good day out, much ale and other unidentified drinks taken and a couple in the Glebe to finish off. Glad you had a good day. You got to see some classic Jimmy Anderson bowling, a classic "70" from Roooooot and a classic batting collapse from England. Sadly I think you also saw the day England lost the test. Conceding 130 on first innings batting second is not good. You imagine we'll need to bat 3+ sessions to save the game. Which is Cook territory. Sadly, for these particular circumstances, no one else seems to want to, or be able to, occupy the crease. Let's hope for something better but defeat sometime around tea looks distinctly likely. It would not be very surprising, sad to say.
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 17, 2017 6:42:39 GMT
Blimey - I got my days mixed up.
Yesterday was day 3 not day 4 so England have 6 sessions to bat. (these Friday starts can be confusing!).
I wonder if it will make much difference to my tea time prediction. Let's hope so. A time for our batsmen to shine.
BTW - can someone explain why Philander is so dangerous. He is putting the ball down at sub 80 mph and looks unplayable. I guess it's his ability to put the ball in the right place consistently.
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Post by GeneralFaye on Jul 17, 2017 8:06:20 GMT
Who is to blame for our batting "mentality" ? the captain? or the coaches? because it's not good enough. It's almost like we're premeditating shots rather than reacting to the conditions/delivery. It's all well and good being positive but we're getting skittled out for low scores time after time now and something needs to change or someone needs to be made accountable. I have no doubt in my mind we'll be all out by tea today (hope to be proven wrong of course)
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Post by GeneralFaye on Jul 17, 2017 8:11:38 GMT
In addition for the next test, we desperately need an extra batsmen in the line up to replace Dawson. It's almost certain that Ballance won't be dropped so to make it work I think he needs dropping down the order to 5 and being replaced at 3 by someone who is more of quick scorer to add some impetus at the top of the order. I also think the injury to Chris Woakes has been a big blow, was starting to establish himself as a regular and possibly the long term replacement for Jimmy.
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