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Post by mailman44 on Jun 15, 2014 12:01:07 GMT
Has Newcastle won a World Cup? If you are happy with the result from what was a very winnable game then fair play. When I see Woy taken behind the woodshed tactically again by the Italians it gives me a case of the a$$. Where was the famous English Bulldog mentality last night? Out with a whimper and it even pisses me off as a Yank! Of Hodgson had a clue you lot would be nailed on for the round of 16 at least. Bobby Robson wept ... We won a world cup nearly 50 years ago, it hardly makes up 'deserving' of a place now does it. As for Hodgson, he's far from my first choice but he's the manager, we have to get on with it. As for it being a winnable game i agree, on another night we would have won that game, we were unlucky. As for being out thought tactically i dont think either of the managers did anything tactically wonderful. What did the italian manager do....tell his full backs to bomb on and pirlo will find you. Hardly a mastermind tactic is it. We havent had the bulldog mentality for years, but at least those guys showed some passion last night, we aint out, and it wasnt a wimper. Precious entitled fuckers do my nut right in! I am not entitled. Your tax dollars went in to funding the FA not mine. I am just pissed off as an Anglophile. Where was Woy's plan b? The Italians got it right from the off and didn't need one.
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Post by pedro23 on Jun 15, 2014 12:05:51 GMT
Best line in this thread "Rooney is a poor mans John Walters" Jesus Mary and Joseph!
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Post by kristoff on Jun 15, 2014 12:06:44 GMT
We won a world cup nearly 50 years ago, it hardly makes up 'deserving' of a place now does it. As for Hodgson, he's far from my first choice but he's the manager, we have to get on with it. As for it being a winnable game i agree, on another night we would have won that game, we were unlucky. As for being out thought tactically i dont think either of the managers did anything tactically wonderful. What did the italian manager do....tell his full backs to bomb on and pirlo will find you. Hardly a mastermind tactic is it. We havent had the bulldog mentality for years, but at least those guys showed some passion last night, we aint out, and it wasnt a wimper. Precious entitled fuckers do my nut right in! I am not entitled. Your tax dollars went in to funding the FA not mine. I am just pissed off as an Anglophile. Where was Woy's plan b? The Italians got it right from the off and didn't need one. My tax dollars? You say your not entitled but bitch and moan when we lose a game on any other day we probably wouldve won. As for a plan B, he didnt use it. The Italians played the same way they always play. Its what the best teams generally do. At the end of the day Stoke finished 9th last year, so that would mean we are 9th best team in the country. We won the league cup 42 years ago, does this mean we can all have a pissy bitch fest when we lose to a better team in next years cup in a game we couldve won? No
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Post by mailman44 on Jun 15, 2014 12:14:02 GMT
I am not entitled. Your tax dollars went in to funding the FA not mine. I am just pissed off as an Anglophile. Where was Woy's plan b? The Italians got it right from the off and didn't need one. My tax dollars? You say your not entitled but bitch and moan when we lose a game on any other day we probably wouldve won. As for a plan B, he didnt use it. The Italians played the same way they always play. Its what the best teams generally do. At the end of the day Stoke finished 9th last year, so that would mean we are 9th best team in the country. We won the league cup 42 years ago, does this mean we can all have a pissy bitch fest when we lose to a better team in next years cup in a game we couldve won? No I am sorry I didn't realize you had Woy's name tattoo'd on your seat warmer. Leave my beloved Stoke out of this, apples and oranges here, m8. Italians did NOT play the way they usually do it don't let he truth get in the way of your "acceptance of mediocrity" love in. Vent your frustration on me, my team plays Monday. They are shit but they give a f@ck at least.
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Post by kristoff on Jun 15, 2014 12:20:42 GMT
Im no fan of roy at all but blah blah blah blah (whats the point in arguing, you aint reading what im writing obviously).
Also, your beloved Stoke? did i go to the wrong place, i thought we were all stoke fans here????
As for 'your' team. Id like to see them win, but its a bit ironic your celebrating their shitness yet im bending the truth.
Italians do play that way most often. back 4 into pirlo find balotelli except pirlo notcied how wank our left was so targeted it.
As for frustration, not frustrated with the England team in the slightest
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Post by lancashirelad on Jun 15, 2014 12:32:16 GMT
Both are reactionary centre backs. Neither leads or dictates play at the back. This type of centre back is due to the modern day top level footy of playing the floating three behind the one up top. I would prefer a leader at the back ie Terry type with a reactionary cb alongside him. Plus make sure the full backs try/stop a cross.
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Post by maninasuitcase on Jun 15, 2014 12:39:59 GMT
I didn't think Jags was too bad as it goes. Compared to Baines, Cahill and Johnson he was positively outstanding.. Only Jags and Sterling, possibly Sturridge and maybe Barkley when he came on can take any credit from last night. H At last someone who saw it like me.
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Post by geoff321 on Jun 15, 2014 12:45:08 GMT
The focus on here regarding Cahill is another way of raising the Shawcross issue, by many Stoke fans, for me the guy played pretty well, what problems arose were in front of him.
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Post by bathstoke on Jun 15, 2014 12:45:28 GMT
Where was the famous English Bulldog mentality last night? [/quote]
Margaret chewed the ball off our bulldog years ago & didn't even give it anaesthetic. Ouch!!!
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jun 15, 2014 12:45:53 GMT
No mate. It was too late for my boy to stay up so we watched it together this morning.
Did you know the result Dave before you watched it?
No mate. Set the TV to Sky Atlantic before going to bed so that we couldn't even peek at the score before finding it on the SKY planner.
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Jun 15, 2014 12:50:01 GMT
The focus on here regarding Cahill is another way of raising the Shawcross issue, by many Stoke fans, for me the guy played pretty well, what problems arose were in front of him. Well if letting the ball go through your legs for the first and totally losing your man in a phone box for the second is playing well, we'll agree to disagree.
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Post by kristoff on Jun 15, 2014 12:54:41 GMT
The focus on here regarding Cahill is another way of raising the Shawcross issue, by many Stoke fans, for me the guy played pretty well, what problems arose were in front of him. Well if letting the ball go through your legs for the first and totally losing your man in a phone box for the second is playing well, we'll agree to disagree. While i accept he couldve done more with both, lets be honest if we'd won 2-0 the daggers wouldve still been out for our back 4 (not toally undeserved i admit)
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Post by geoff321 on Jun 15, 2014 12:58:21 GMT
Come on Jamo, less bias please. Are you suggesting Cahill should stand on a football pitch with his legs closed, I assume he wouldn't see the shot until very late, as for the second goal an Italian was allowed to cut inside, again down our left side, and play a great ball in.
The England back four were exposed by Italian players picking the ball up in midfield and running directly at our defence especially Baines, teams should defend as teams, not individuals.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jun 15, 2014 12:59:28 GMT
For me I thought our defence was very poor last night with only Jagielka coming out of it with any credit. The biggest issue was our midfields failure to protect the back four, the Italians (Pirlo in particular) spotted this early on and made us pay, we looked exhausted after 60 odd minutes. Gerrard was dreadful, Henderson marginally better I thought. Rooney playing out of position was a mistake and it showed in his body language, he either plays up front or in the hole but not out wide. I thought Sterling was excellent, as was Barkley when he came on also. For a coach who has supposedly great tactical nous, I thought Hodgson got it very wrong last night, failing to address the shortcomings in defensive midfield, therefore the blame must lie at Hodgson's feet.
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Jun 15, 2014 12:59:39 GMT
Come on Jamo, less bias please. Are you suggesting Cahill should stand on a football pitch with his legs closed, I assume he wouldn't see the shot until very late, as for the second goal an Italian was allowed to cut inside, again down our left side, and play a great ball in. The England back four were exposed by Italian players picking the ball up in midfield and running directly at our defence especially Baines, teams should defend as teams, not individuals. He is a crap defender for me, Geoff and as for the Ryan thing if he was at Stoke I would pick Ryan every time.
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Post by kristoff on Jun 15, 2014 13:01:25 GMT
The thing that got me thinking was where were our 2 defensive midfielders when all these runs were being made. People say Johnson shouldve had the back post, well he was tracking another run which wasnt picked up by our wonderful liverpool gems
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Post by mailman44 on Jun 15, 2014 13:04:52 GMT
Look I want England to do well, it is good for the World Cup and football in general if they do. But if England can't at least get out of this group than heads should roll. I guarantee the English FA through the taxpayers and punters benevolence have dropped 8 to 10 times more into their FA than Uruguay and Costa Rica combined and probably more than Italy. This BS about How difficult it is to win in South America went out the window with 5 star training resorts and private planes and buses. I'd take England's chances playing Uruguay in a five star stadia over facing Grimsby Town on a cold Tuesday night in January at Blundell Park. The England Has every reason to believe it will get through and anything else is unacceptable.
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Post by kristoff on Jun 15, 2014 13:36:27 GMT
Look I want England to do well, it is good for the World Cup and football in general if they do. But if England can't at least get out of this group than heads should roll. I guarantee the English FA through the taxpayers and punters benevolence have dropped 8 to 10 times more into their FA than Uruguay and Costa Rica combined and probably more than Italy. This BS about How difficult it is to win in South America went out the window with 5 star training resorts and private planes and buses. I'd take England's chances playing Uruguay in a five star stadia over facing Grimsby Town on a cold Tuesday night in January at Blundell Park. The England Has every reason to believe it will get through and anything else is unacceptable. Right ok, i think we are coming to the same point from different directions here a bit. I fully agree if we dont get out of this group then heads should roll, but im not just talking in management, im talking from the top right down to grass roots ect. I dont believe we cannot find at least 1 or 2 players with the talent and vision of players the French, Germans and Spanish seem to find on a regular basis. In all other forms of life we manage it, so i dont see why football is any different. (and if wales can find Bale, Giggs then why cant we). Having said that i will not blame a player for not being the best player. What pisses me off is people hyping them up then slaughtering them when they are playing the same as they've always done (albeit yesterday they actually showed good effort i thought). Hodgson was never the man for me, but at this time he is the manager so i will support him. The FA will never appoint the type of manager we need because as history shows if you dont nod like a churchill toy you wont get the job so sadly Hodgson is what we were left with (which is pathetic in itself). Maybe i jumped on you a bit quick because of all the crap posted since the game (and before lets be honest) and misread what you put if so i apolagise.
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Post by minnierover on Jun 15, 2014 13:47:32 GMT
I didn't watch the game last night, choosing instead to record it and watch it with my boy this morning. Cahill and Jagielka were fucking marvellous weren't they? Jagielka turned his back on the first and Cahill looked so assured, strong and domineering at that back post again...NOT. England played OK I thought, certainly for an hour so, but defensively we were all over the place. Woy and his defensive picks, including Baines, will bite England on the arse for as long as they are involved in the competition. FFS Let it drop, so Ryan ain't there, big deal. England played well last night and didn't deserve to lose. We will get 6 points in the next 2 games.
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Post by mrcoke on Jun 15, 2014 13:52:12 GMT
CBs purely picked for their ability on the ball, which is mediocre but better than most. As defenders though I thought they were poor and would much prefer Ryan and the much improved Wilson in my team.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2014 13:55:44 GMT
It was the best England World Cup performance since what, 2002? Maybe even 1998.
A long way from perfect, best team won, but plenty of positives.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2014 14:05:24 GMT
It was the best England World Cup performance since what, 2002? Maybe even 1998. A long way from perfect, best team won, but plenty of positives. Agreed. I think we'll qualify.
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Jun 15, 2014 14:06:40 GMT
It was the best England World Cup performance since what, 2002? Maybe even 1998. A long way from perfect, best team won, but plenty of positives. Agreed. I think we'll qualify. Well I hope they watch the video of the Uruguay game as that should lift their spirits.
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Post by BuzzB on Jun 15, 2014 14:06:52 GMT
He just HAS to find the balls to drop Rooney firstly, Sturridge is the man in form and deservedly leading the line, and ,I said after the Ecuador game there is no need for Gerrard AND Henderson. There were definately positives, we had the chances to win that game, Hart didn't have alot to do. It just makes Thursdays game massive, lose and it all over to coin a phrase. This might raise a few eyebrows too but I just don't get the hype over Barkley either.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jun 15, 2014 14:10:56 GMT
It was the best England World Cup performance since what, 2002? Maybe even 1998. A long way from perfect, best team won, but plenty of positives.
I know where you're coming from Rob but I wouldn't give any one of
Cahill Baines Rooney Gerrard Henderson
anymore than a 5 out of 10 and when half your outfield players have played poorly it is quite concerning.
The biggest worry for me however, is Hodgson claiming that Rooney had a good game on the left - which is quite clearly either a lie or he just doesn't have a clue.
Will Hodgson learn from his mistakes last night?
Probably not I'd wager.
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Post by chopandmash on Jun 15, 2014 14:14:14 GMT
For me its simply a case of them doing the simple things so much better than us,600 passes,93%completion may explai why we looked dead on our feet at the end,and the likes of pirlo walked of looking like they had just had a kick about with their kids.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2014 14:15:18 GMT
It was the best England World Cup performance since what, 2002? Maybe even 1998. A long way from perfect, best team won, but plenty of positives.
I know where you're coming from Rob but I wouldn't give any one of
Cahill Baines Rooney Gerrard Henderson
anymore than a 5 out of 10 and when half your outfield players have played poorly it is quite concerning.
The biggest worry for me however, is Hodgson claiming that Rooney had a good game on the left - which is quite clearly either a lie or he just doesn't have a clue.
Will Hodgson learn from his mistakes last night?
Probably not I'd wager.
I wouldn't disagree with any of that Paul. But there was an energy about our performance that we haven't seen for years, even if it was largely in spite of the manager. There are loads of issues around the defence and it's becoming clear that the midfield two aren't fit for purpose. We could go out on Thursday, we could make the quarters. But I was encouraged by our attacking and there are encouraging signs compared to 2/4/6 years ago.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Jun 15, 2014 14:23:51 GMT
I bet Pirlo completed as many passes as Gerrard and Henderson did combined ...
Apparantly De Rossi and Pirlo combined only played 37 less passes than our whole team put together in the first half. Just to add Italy broke the record for passing accuracy at a world cup 602 passes with an accuracy of 93.2% England's pass completion of 91% was the highest they have recorded in a World Cup game since 1966. Just wanted to chuck this in there, I was a little surprised tbh.
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Post by robwahlmann on Jun 15, 2014 14:26:34 GMT
It's important not to put things out of the proportians lads and lasses! Apart from Italy's second goal I think Cahill did OK, but from my point of view Baines was a bit disappointing. Especially his defending was questionable for both their goals really! Have seen it before though that Baines can struggle because of his lack of pace so no surprise there. Thought England played better than expected and certainly deserved a point! The central midfield looked a bit anonymous though and didn't create much, but up front both Sturridge and especially Sterling played well I thought! A draw against Uruguay and a win against Costa Rica would possibly be enough to get to the next round so still hope there!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2014 14:27:52 GMT
Has Baines ever had a good game for England?
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