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Post by Pugsley on Apr 23, 2024 11:20:29 GMT
I suppose nobody thought Pulis would be the manager either…. Circumstances were somewhat different. Were they? Both inherited struggling sides filled with poor footballers. |
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Post by mamathestriker on Apr 23, 2024 11:21:27 GMT
No the 10 clear was when SS had been here for 5 games and had a really good unbeaten start. Fact is both AN and SS haven't been good enough. The difference being I think SS IS showing some positive signs and feel like he can improve. A full judgement can come when he's brought in his own players. Or you could frame it as we were 20th when AN was sacked. We are currently 17th. Either way we look to be on the up now rather than most certainly on the down when the Dour one got sacked. Progress... It's an improvement but not exactly one to write home about is it? Being 17th isn't something for us to be proud of. I think he's worth keeping but I've been disappointed overall. The summer is huge. He's clearly a decent bloke, very likeable and seems to have struck a good relationship with the fans. That's huge for me too. I've heard the players love training under him too. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Apr 23, 2024 11:29:48 GMT
Or you could frame it as we were 20th when AN was sacked. We are currently 17th. Either way we look to be on the up now rather than most certainly on the down when the Dour one got sacked. Progress... It's an improvement but not exactly one to write home about is it? Being 17th isn't something for us to be proud of. I think he's worth keeping but I've been disappointed overall. The summer is huge. He's clearly a decent bloke, very likeable and seems to have struck a good relationship with the fans. That's huge for me too. I've heard the players love training under him too. Good point. His relatabilty to both the fans and players is a big plus for me. He's raw as a manager which we could argue is not what we need all things considered. It was a big punt by JC. But it appears he's passed test 1 which was keeping us up. So for me he deserves the chance to take on mission 2, which for me should be a solid top half finish showing signs of a proper identity. Which is hopefully this front foot attacking football he keeps referring to. I for one in the spells we've seen that more attacking football have thoroughly enjoyed it. Even the home defeat to Birmingham was a decent watch because we had a go and played some good stuff. Its refreshing after the years of shyte. I've got my fingers crossed for him and hope it works out... |
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Post by riproaringagain on Apr 23, 2024 11:32:01 GMT
Here is the choices, we either go for a Mowbray,Warnock, Houghton type, not those exactly but that type, which you know what your getting or take a chance on a work in progress, we are not going to attract the finished article from here or abroad are we. So question we have to ask is that simple. I think we all know what a meltdown this site would have if one of the old school baggage laden mangers rocked up. Would be amusing though for 30 mins
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Post by foxysgloves on Apr 23, 2024 11:38:39 GMT
I suppose nobody thought Pulis would be the manager either…. Circumstances were somewhat different. As they always are. Some similarities too though. |
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Apr 23, 2024 12:48:18 GMT
There's no evidence he can make the club a top half team. On the other hand he hasn't exactly performed badly enough to be replaced. I guess it depends on what the clubs aspirations are. I completely agree. For ten years we were flying high in the Premier League and for three of those years we were the 9th best club in England! We played an FA Cup final and competed in Europe. Has all that been forgotten? Are there no aspirations to return to the top flight? Surely, the whole point of the Championship is to secure promotion to the Premier League? That's the essence of the very existence of the Championship. Each club starts the season in the hope of being promoted. I'm willing to give Schu another season to prove himself. All we need to do is finish 6th and we have a chance of promotion. Who knows if he can make it happen? Or will my son's kids have had their own kids and I am dead and buried before we get promoted to put the great city of Stoke-on-Trent on the sporting map once more? Of course supporters have aspirations for promotion but harking back to our Premier League days has become one of our problems. Under Pulis everyone wanted us to get promotion but no-one really expected it - the fans just got behind the team regardless, beat a lot of those ex Premiership sides who couldn't understand why they were slumming it with the likes of Stoke in the Championship and took the piss out their fans for thinking they were better than us. Now we've had our day in the limelight promotion has become an expectation and every manager that fails to get us back where "we belong" is derided as a failure. We have become the very fans we used to take the piss out of. |
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Post by vidigoals on Apr 23, 2024 12:53:28 GMT
I'm usually quite quick to make judgement on a manager & decipher whether I want them at the club long-term.
From the early stages with Neil, I just didn't like him, I was thrilled when we fired the lad.
There is something about Shuey that I really like, Saturday's crowd also seemed galvanized & 100% behind him.
I'd back him to the hilt in the summer and let him have a fair crack next season. Anything in the top half is a massive improvement on what we've been served up for almost 6 years.
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Post by miggo on Apr 23, 2024 14:35:19 GMT
I think it's fair to say we are only marginally better points wise under Schuey however performance wise its night and day than under Neil. To be fair there are also some stinkers, Swans away springing to mind where we go from exceptional the previous game to outright awful the next but thats this division from top to bottom.
Small margins have cost us and I'd argue we should be 12 points better off at least had we finished our chances at Watford, Ipswich, Brum, Leeds, WBA , Shef Wed which would have us 11th. We have conceded less than Norwich who currently sit 6th in the table but only Milwall, who sit 1 place above us have scored less and we create plenty of chances. I know goal scorers are difficult to find but had we found one in Jan we would be more than comfortable now.
Big summer of business to be done, Ennis, Wesley, Hoever, Cundle, Campbell, Haks, Iverson, Clark, Johnson, McNally are all set to go and Pearson, Vidigal, Mmae could all leave with the right offers. We need to bring the squad size down but sign quality over quantity in the summer. He has to get it right or we could see groundhog day hitting us around Xmas next season. Someone has to get it right eventually and Schuey, on paper at least has a great opportunity. I like him and hopefully he gets this summer right.
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Post by stokefanone on Apr 23, 2024 14:49:03 GMT
Started pretty well, for some reason it all went to pot at the end of January then a big improvement since Walters’ arrival in March (Norwich and Swansea aside) Slight concern in recruitment (questionmarks on Cundle and Ennis) Just hoping he can see us through it now. Have high hopes for him Don’t think Cundle is that bad, he has a place in a creative midfield, he covers lots of ground allowing others space, and breaks up play. Ennis is and I am sure was bought as a dependable hard working back up forward, to help run games down. |
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Post by dutchstokie on Apr 23, 2024 17:00:26 GMT
Hope to god he comes good but when youre recruiting you look for a solid track record on the CV and achievements.... Ive said it til Im blue in the face, but we need someone at the helm who is used to winning stuff, whether that be titles, or cups consistently and can show that. Not the man for me - sorry. Are you serious? We're in no position to attract a coach that's won anything meaningful certainly not more meaningful than league One which Schu has actually won and you think a serial winner is going to want to come here. What planet are you on? We were in the perfect position to attract that kind of coach when Hughes began to falter over a year before we sacked him. A little word called ambition….. if we had ambitions I would seriously hope that JC and co. we’re going after the likes of World Cup winner, 2 time Champions League winner, numerous Italian cups and world club cup winner Gennaro Gattuso….. There’s one for a start….and with regards to ‘not being in a position to attract a coach not more meaningful than Leavue One’…. There’s the crux of the matter right there….. lack of ambition. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Apr 23, 2024 17:03:23 GMT
Are you serious? We're in no position to attract a coach that's won anything meaningful certainly not more meaningful than league One which Schu has actually won and you think a serial winner is going to want to come here. What planet are you on? We were in the perfect position to attract that kind of coach when Hughes began to falter over a year before we sacked him. A little word called ambition….. if we had ambitions I would seriously hope that JC and co. we’re going after the likes of World Cup winner, 2 time Champions League winner, numerous Italian cups and world club cup winner Gennaro Gattuso….. There’s one for a start….and with regards to ‘not being in a position to attract a coach not more meaningful than Leavue One’…. There’s the crux of the matter right there….. lack of ambition. Put the bong down chief 😆 |
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Apr 23, 2024 17:15:49 GMT
Are you serious? We're in no position to attract a coach that's won anything meaningful certainly not more meaningful than league One which Schu has actually won and you think a serial winner is going to want to come here. What planet are you on? We were in the perfect position to attract that kind of coach when Hughes began to falter over a year before we sacked him. A little word called ambition….. if we had ambitions I would seriously hope that JC and co. we’re going after the likes of World Cup winner, 2 time Champions League winner, numerous Italian cups and world club cup winner Gennaro Gattuso….. There’s one for a start….and with regards to ‘not being in a position to attract a coach not more meaningful than Leavue One’…. There’s the crux of the matter right there….. lack of ambition. There's ambition then there's just being completely unrealistic given where we currently are, that's the sad truth of the matter. Gattuso as a manager/head coach has won 1 Coppa Italia so he doesn't fit your original requirements of "someone at the helm who is used to winning stuff, whether that be titles, or cups consistently and can show that" either. |
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Post by smallthorner on Apr 23, 2024 17:23:47 GMT
He's done what he was hired to do.
Saturday's performance hopefully has rejuvenated everybody.
He has lots to learn but I've come down on the side of giving him the opportunity to build a side and having a pop at top six.
He seems a nice bloke and it will be great if he we sing his name every week.
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Post by dutchstokie on Apr 23, 2024 17:29:53 GMT
A little word called ambition….. if we had ambitions I would seriously hope that JC and co. we’re going after the likes of World Cup winner, 2 time Champions League winner, numerous Italian cups and world club cup winner Gennaro Gattuso….. There’s one for a start….and with regards to ‘not being in a position to attract a coach not more meaningful than Leavue One’…. There’s the crux of the matter right there….. lack of ambition. Put the bong down chief 😆 I had a blast on one Friday night for the first time in over 30 years !!!! Oops…..😂 |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Apr 23, 2024 18:39:46 GMT
Put the bong down chief 😆 I had a blast on one Friday night for the first time in over 30 years !!!! Oops…..😂 Knew it 😆 you're obviously still stoned 😉 Schumacher is going to be a Stoke legend. I can just sense it......now where's that bong gone 😆 |
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Post by firfuxache on Apr 23, 2024 18:48:36 GMT
Here is the choices, we either go for a Mowbray,Warnock, Houghton type, not those exactly but that type, which you know what your getting or take a chance on a work in progress, we are not going to attract the finished article from here or abroad are we. So question we have to ask is that simple. I think we all know what a meltdown this site would have if one of the old school baggage laden mangers rocked up. Would be amusing though for 30 mins Not sure why Hughton was ever lauded as a “big name” manager. His managerial career hardly shouts success. 498 in charge, 196 won, 151 drawn and 151 lost. That’s a win every 2.5 matches or 1.57 points per game. He’s nowt special, especially in this league. |
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Post by thornestein on Apr 23, 2024 18:57:00 GMT
Here is the choices, we either go for a Mowbray,Warnock, Houghton type, not those exactly but that type, which you know what your getting or take a chance on a work in progress, we are not going to attract the finished article from here or abroad are we. So question we have to ask is that simple. I think we all know what a meltdown this site would have if one of the old school baggage laden mangers rocked up. Would be amusing though for 30 mins Not sure why Hughton was ever lauded as a “big name” manager. His managerial career hardly shouts success. 498 in charge, 196 won, 151 drawn and 151 lost. That’s a win every 2.5 matches or 1.57 points per game. He’s nowt special, especially in this league. 1.57 ppg should get you in the playoffs , better then we’ve had in recent years |
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Apr 23, 2024 18:57:30 GMT
There's no evidence he can make the club a top half team. On the other hand he hasn't exactly performed badly enough to be replaced. I guess it depends on what the clubs aspirations are. I completely agree. For ten years we were flying high in the Premier League and for three of those years we were the 9th best club in England! We played an FA Cup final and competed in Europe. Has all that been forgotten? Are there no aspirations to return to the top flight? Surely, the whole point of the Championship is to secure promotion to the Premier League? That's the essence of the very existence of the Championship. Each club starts the season in the hope of being promoted. I'm willing to give Schu another season to prove himself. All we need to do is finish 6th and we have a chance of promotion. Who knows if he can make it happen? Or will my son's kids have had their own kids and I am dead and buried before we get promoted to put the great city of Stoke-on-Trent on the sporting map once more? The aspirations from the club and management at the start of the season were promotion. I think it's probably better now that expectations are lower. It seemed pretty much everyone (including inside the club) thought we'd get promoted the first season down, and that didn't do us any favours. Top half will be a success next season (progress) but of course everyone will be hoping for a tilt at the playoffs at least. |
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Post by Marc01 on Apr 23, 2024 22:02:15 GMT
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Post by Gods on Apr 23, 2024 22:10:57 GMT
He's done what he was hired to do. Saturday's performance hopefully has rejuvenated everybody. He has lots to learn but I've come down on the side of giving him the opportunity to build a side and having a pop at top six. He seems a nice bloke and it will be great if he we sing his name every week. I don't think he was initially hired to keep us up. Although that's what it sadly turned in to. There was talk of an outside run at the play-offs when he first came in. |
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Post by smallthorner on Apr 23, 2024 22:27:04 GMT
He's done what he was hired to do. Saturday's performance hopefully has rejuvenated everybody. He has lots to learn but I've come down on the side of giving him the opportunity to build a side and having a pop at top six. He seems a nice bloke and it will be great if he we sing his name every week. I don't think he was initially hired to keep us up. Although that's what it sadly turned in to. There was talk of an outside run at the play-offs when he first came in. Play-offs ?? Was there? Fook him off then 😄 |
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Post by Gods on Apr 24, 2024 6:38:50 GMT
I don't think he was initially hired to keep us up. Although that's what it sadly turned in to. There was talk of an outside run at the play-offs when he first came in. Play-offs ?? Was there? Fook him off then 😄 Wasn't there one of those 'meet the leaders ' evenings with Coatsey and R.Martin and SS shortly after he joined? He'd put some okay results together in his early games and I'm sure the talk was not of a down to the wire relegation dog fight, instead they were looking up and daring to dream! I'd keep him though, we have to really. |
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Post by gingerninja on Apr 24, 2024 6:43:35 GMT
Of course he will be a manager next season, he has made a pretty good fist of things despite being unrest behind the scenes. He has never lost the dressing room and instilled a pretty decent amount of resilience, certainly latterly.
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Post by baconburger on Apr 24, 2024 7:46:04 GMT
Of course he will be a manager next season, he has made a pretty good fist of things despite being unrest behind the scenes. He has never lost the dressing room and instilled a pretty decent amount of resilience, certainly latterly. I never really thought he had the tools to do much better. I was hoping for some braver more entertaining football and we’ve seen glimpses of that both before and after he had to put his beliefs to one side and play more attritional percentage football to grind out some points (whether he realised that himself or was told to do it I couldn’t say). Some of these players have grown and improved under him that’s the mark of a good coach. Over to recruitment now to find him a CF worth the title in the Summer amongst other things. He’s had his first taste of adversity as a head coach/manager but isn’t that where they learn and develop significantly, more so than when everything is going their way. |
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Apr 24, 2024 7:48:52 GMT
Play-offs ?? Was there? Fook him off then 😄 Wasn't there one of those 'meet the leaders ' evenings with Coatsey and R.Martin and SS shortly after he joined? He'd put some okay results together in his early games and I'm sure the talk was not of a down to the wire relegation dog fight, instead they were looking up and daring to dream! I'd keep him though, we have to really. If Ricky Martin was there I'm surprised they were only talking about the play-offs and not being the first club side to be allowed to enter the Euros (and win it). |
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Post by prestwichpotter on Apr 24, 2024 7:52:37 GMT
100% keep him.
With the right personnel in place you could see how setting up like we did against Plymouth will be a successful blue print for next season.
I saw absolutely nothing from Neil in terms of patterns of play or structure in all the time he was here......
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Post by a on Apr 24, 2024 7:53:08 GMT
Or you could frame it as we were 20th when AN was sacked. We are currently 17th. Either way we look to be on the up now rather than most certainly on the down when the Dour one got sacked. Progress... It's an improvement but not exactly one to write home about is it? Being 17th isn't something for us to be proud of. I think he's worth keeping but I've been disappointed overall. The summer is huge. He's clearly a decent bloke, very likeable and seems to have struck a good relationship with the fans. That's huge for me too. I've heard the players love training under him too. That’s pretty much my take on it to. I’d love next season for us to kick on. |
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Post by femark on Apr 24, 2024 7:53:25 GMT
We need some continuity with management and players to be successful so Schumacher should stay. I'd try to sign some of the decent loan players on permanent deals - Iversen, McNally & Cundle.
We then need to rely on the recruitment department to build a balanced squad. We've had a disjointed squad for far too long which always seems to fuck us over throughout the season. Lots of managers talk about two players for every position but we seem to have five players for one position and one player for another (see left back).
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Apr 24, 2024 8:31:41 GMT
He's done what he was hired to do. Saturday's performance hopefully has rejuvenated everybody. He has lots to learn but I've come down on the side of giving him the opportunity to build a side and having a pop at top six. He seems a nice bloke and it will be great if he we sing his name every week. I don't think he was initially hired to keep us up. Although that's what it sadly turned in to. There was talk of an outside run at the play-offs when he first came in. You might be right in that the people hiring him thought we were just underperforming and a new manager would just get the team performing at the higher level they were capable of. If they thought that they were wrong - both Neil and Schumacher are getting what they can out of this squad and that squad is a bottom half Championship side that is perectly capable of getting relegated - and still could. When we sacked Neil I thought we would be in for a relegation battle and that Schumacher was a high risk appointment for that role. He's actually doing ok and for me, if not others, he will have done his job if we avoid relegation. I suspect those wanting rid of Schumacher also thought we are capable of a top half finish and that a good/better manager would have got us there so in those terms he's failed. I think a good/better manager would have seen us safe earlier but I just don't think this squad is top half material. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Apr 24, 2024 8:54:42 GMT
I don't think he was initially hired to keep us up. Although that's what it sadly turned in to. There was talk of an outside run at the play-offs when he first came in. You might be right in that the people hiring him thought we were just underperforming and a new manager would just get the team performing at the higher level they were capable of. If they thought that they were wrong - both Neil and Schumacher are getting what they can out of this squad and that squad is a bottom half Championship side that is perectly capable of getting relegated - and still could. When we sacked Neil I thought we would be in for a relegation battle and that Schumacher was a high risk appointment for that role. He's actually doing ok and for me, if not others, he will have done his job if we avoid relegation. I suspect those wanting rid of Schumacher also thought we are capable of a top half finish and that a good/better manager would have got us there so in those terms he's failed. I think a good/better manager would have seen us safe earlier but I just don't think this squad is top half material. This squad is what happens when a manager brings his mate in to sign 20 players in a scattergun approach. Said manager then fails to piece it all together and creates a team with no consistent strategy to games that ends up with no confidence. That manager is then sacked. New manager has to come in and try and deal with not only trying to get a tune out of the mess he's inherited but also manage the fallouts, the bad behaviour and the poor morale. As is looking likely, if Schumacher steers us to a 17th place finish, he's done a very decent job. He probably wasn't the right manager for the very difficult situation we were in in all fairness. But this time its starting to look like JC has had a wild punt of his come off for once. I see bright things ahead personally. I reckon we got a good one 🙏 |
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