|
|
Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jul 22, 2023 7:23:13 GMT
So are you saying people the straight white working class aren't academic enough to get into university and should be routed into non academic training based on their class, ethnicity and sexuality? Actually I think more does need to go onto vocational training and that getting rid of the polys was a massive mistake. The real challenge is addressing the class bias in the education system and in particular the advantages baked into the public school system which ensures over representation of the wealthy and privileged in academia and all positions of power and influence from then on in. The other big issue is to get rid of the low esteem associated with technical and vocational education which is a particularly British issue and a problem shared by all classes. I'm of the view that your class background determines your early educational experience which in turn (statistically at least) determines where you end up in life. If this was a level playing field the numbers going to university would reflect the proportion of people from different class backgrounds - as would the number in technical and vocational education. This won't happen until the advantages of class are removed from the education system. What you seem to proposing is a return to the secondary modern/grammar school system which did more than anything to stratify society along class lines and baked in wealth and privilege at the top of the tree and ensured the working classes knew their place and had little option but to stay there. The bit I feel uncomfortable about in all this is that alhough I'm from a working class background by any objective definition I would now be considered middle class (my dad was a miner, I grew up on a council estate in Stoke-on-Trent, went through the comprehensive school system but went to university, ended up in a good job and bought my own house) so me pontificating about the working class is just perpetuating the problem. The working class don't really have an authentic and proportionate voice in politics and never have - both Labour and the Tories are essentially parties run by and for the benefit of the upper and middle class. There needs to be an authentic working class movement and an authentic working class voice. I'm not it and neither I suspect are you. No and I'm mystified as to how you concluded that. OK - so what are you saying? |
|
|
|
Post by scfcbiancorossi on Jul 22, 2023 8:00:44 GMT
No and I'm mystified as to how you concluded that. OK - so what are you saying? Where on earth did you get race from? That as per the original post, we need more opportunity for those who don't want to go to university and that the standard of education and subsequent quality coming out of University is often abysmal. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2023 10:51:15 GMT
Change is needed in our education system to provide more options for those that aren't academic but more opportunities for those who do not want to stay in education has to be the priority. Education is fine up to a point but there is as much talent coming straight from school than there are from universities, yet grads always get prioritised, even in roles where having said degree is utterly irrelevant - which in itself is a national scandal. Having run a number of grad schemes at my firm this year, I am utterly staggered at the entitlement coming from University grads over those who haven't gone through the University system. The difference in character is often significant. So are you saying people the straight white working class aren't academic enough to get into university and should be routed into non academic training based on their class, ethnicity and sexuality? Actually I think more does need to go onto vocational training and that getting rid of the polys was a massive mistake. The real challenge is addressing the class bias in the education system and in particular the advantages baked into the public school system which ensures over representation of the wealthy and privileged in academia and all positions of power and influence from then on in. The other big issue is to get rid of the low esteem associated with technical and vocational education which is a particularly British issue and a problem shared by all classes. I'm of the view that your class background determines your early educational experience which in turn (statistically at least) determines where you end up in life. If this was a level playing field the numbers going to university would reflect the proportion of people from different class backgrounds - as would the number in technical and vocational education. This won't happen until the advantages of class are removed from the education system. What you seem to proposing is a return to the secondary modern/grammar school system which did more than anything to stratify society along class lines and baked in wealth and privilege at the top of the tree and ensured the working classes knew their place and had little option but to stay there. The bit I feel uncomfortable about in all this is that alhough I'm from a working class background by any objective definition I would now be considered middle class (my dad was a miner, I grew up on a council estate in Stoke-on-Trent, went through the comprehensive school system but went to university, ended up in a good job and bought my own house) so me pontificating about the working class is just perpetuating the problem. The working class don't really have an authentic and proportionate voice in politics and never have - both Labour and the Tories are essentially parties run by and for the benefit of the upper and middle class. There needs to be an authentic working class movement and an authentic working class voice. I'm not it and neither I suspect are you. The advantages of “class” will likely never be removed from education (or other aspects of society). They can be lessened but removing them isn’t going to happen in my lifetime (I’m 31). In the US, we have just removed affirmative action for education. I think that it isn’t fit for purpose anymore, anyways. What we should do (now that we have the technology) is positively weight applications for people with high area disadvantage indexes. In that way, there is something targeted towards “class”. I don’t see any politician coming up with common sense ideas like that anytime soon though. |
|
|
|
Post by Gawa on Jul 26, 2023 13:56:37 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by knype on Jul 26, 2023 13:59:54 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by Gawa on Jul 26, 2023 14:08:13 GMT
Nigel wants to cancel people. Correct thread. |
|
|
|
Post by knype on Jul 26, 2023 15:38:42 GMT
Nigel wants to cancel people. Correct thread. So do most of the left leaning posters on here... |
|
|
|
Post by Gawa on Jul 26, 2023 20:07:02 GMT
Nigel wants to cancel people. Correct thread. So do most of the left leaning posters on here... I know. See the left and right have much more in common than you think 😄 |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2023 20:52:31 GMT
all beginning to make sense ...
same as brexit, just a money making opportunity for the spivs, whilst the public are lied to by the media and govt, and eventually cajoled into a culture war, making us all metaphorically and literally poorer.
|
|
|
|
Post by RipRoaringPotter on Jul 26, 2023 21:02:45 GMT
all beginning to make sense ... same as brexit, just a money making opportunity for the spivs, whilst the public are lied to by the media and govt, and eventually cajoled into a culture war, making us all metaphorically and literally poorer. Been wondering how this story has been allowed prominence when it is basically a man having his bank account downgraded. Natwest's talk of him being a grifter is looking fairly accurate now. I'd also like to know who made money off him quasi-conceding the Brexit referendum at around midnight to one o'clock while the votes were being counted and the evidence was beginning to show a strong Vote Leave vote. Quite sure that made the pound rise, and the odds of a Leave victory shoot up - both things you could easily make a lot of money on if you knew that comment was coming. |
|
|
|
Post by Gawa on Nov 8, 2023 19:52:32 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by elystokie on Nov 8, 2023 20:17:35 GMT
But, but isn't the BBC full of and run by wokey left libtards like we keep getting told on here? |
|
|
|
Post by knype on Nov 9, 2023 6:48:25 GMT
No, she's just shite at her job! |
|
|
|
Post by Chewbacca the Wookie on Nov 9, 2023 6:57:02 GMT
But, but isn't the BBC full of and run by wokey left libtards like we keep getting told on here? To be fair though haven’t they just set some new social media guidelines which she wasn’t prepared to keep to. There’s nothing to suggest they wouldn’t do the same if it was someone with right wing views. I’m sure the Beeb aren’t the first or last organisation to have rules around the use of social media. |
|
|
|
Post by elystokie on Nov 9, 2023 7:14:53 GMT
But, but isn't the BBC full of and run by wokey left libtards like we keep getting told on here? To be fair though haven’t they just set some new social media guidelines which she wasn’t prepared to keep to. There’s nothing to suggest they wouldn’t do the same if it was someone with right wing views. I’m sure the Beeb aren’t the first or last organisation to have rules around the use of social media. If they do the same with someone with right wing views I'd expect an outrage from some on here, wouldn't you? The very ones constantly calling the BBC a wokey lefty bunch of libtards I'd have thought. |
|
|
|
Post by Chewbacca the Wookie on Nov 9, 2023 7:46:09 GMT
To be fair though haven’t they just set some new social media guidelines which she wasn’t prepared to keep to. There’s nothing to suggest they wouldn’t do the same if it was someone with right wing views. I’m sure the Beeb aren’t the first or last organisation to have rules around the use of social media. If they do the same with someone with right wing views I'd expect an outrage from some on here, wouldn't you? The very ones constantly calling the BBC a wokey lefty bunch of libtards I'd have thought. To be honest I don’t really care about either Vorderman or anyone on the Beeb. So I’m pretty blasé around this situation. Ultimately she’s not following the new rules. At least they’re clear now and no one can argue what ever their political stance should they be let go if they choose not to follow them. |
|
|
|
Post by elystokie on Nov 9, 2023 7:53:21 GMT
If they do the same with someone with right wing views I'd expect an outrage from some on here, wouldn't you? The very ones constantly calling the BBC a wokey lefty bunch of libtards I'd have thought. To be honest I don’t really care about either Vorderman or anyone on the Beeb. So I’m pretty blasé around this situation. Ultimately she’s not following the new rules. At least they’re clear now and no one can argue what ever their political stance should they be let go if they choose not to follow them. I don't really care about Vorderman or anyone on the Beeb either, I was merely pointing out that it isn't the wokey lefty libtard organisation it's constantly painted as by some, the bloke in charge is a Tory that was appointed by another Tory, the claim is ludicrous. |
|
|
|
Post by Gawa on Nov 9, 2023 10:20:38 GMT
But, but isn't the BBC full of and run by wokey left libtards like we keep getting told on here? To be fair though haven’t they just set some new social media guidelines which she wasn’t prepared to keep to. There’s nothing to suggest they wouldn’t do the same if it was someone with right wing views. I’m sure the Beeb aren’t the first or last organisation to have rules around the use of social media. Thats the problem there though. They've only changed the rules. The rules were fine when it was criticising opposition parties. Now the tories have became a laughing stock they're silencing their staff because the tories can't handle the criticisim. Andrew Neil, Alan Sugar, Jeremy Clarkson and many others had alot to say on politics. It only became an issue when the conservatives were criticised. Now maybe it's an unbiased decision. But I struggle to believe that while the BBC continues to have former Conservative candidates with the highest job. |
|
|
|
Post by elystokie on Nov 9, 2023 10:29:55 GMT
To be fair though haven’t they just set some new social media guidelines which she wasn’t prepared to keep to. There’s nothing to suggest they wouldn’t do the same if it was someone with right wing views. I’m sure the Beeb aren’t the first or last organisation to have rules around the use of social media. Thats the problem there though. They've only changed the rules. The rules were fine when it was criticising opposition parties. Now the tories have became a laughing stock they're silencing their staff because the tories can't handle the criticisim. Andrew Neil, Alan Sugar, Jeremy Clarkson and many others had alot to say on politics. It only became an issue when the conservatives were criticised. Now maybe it's an unbiased decision. But I struggle to believe that while the BBC continues to have former Conservative candidates with the highest job. Seems it's all come about thanks to the furore caused by Gary Linkdangler's tweet about Suella Braverman using language akin to that of 1930's Germany. She's evidently seen this as a green light to spread her poison even further. Wokey left libtards my arse. |
|
|
|
Post by knype on Nov 9, 2023 10:32:41 GMT
About time! Lineker next please...
|
|
|
|
Post by Gawa on Dec 12, 2023 9:30:50 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by knype on Dec 12, 2023 9:35:26 GMT
Snowflakes...  |
|
|
|
Post by scfcbiancorossi on Dec 12, 2023 10:17:17 GMT
Linekar being a mouthpiece of the Liberal left probably tells you all you need to know about the modern day profile of the Liberal left. If this was a right wing British TV presenter on the BBC (impossible theory I know, because they wouldn't recruit a right of centre presenter) and they were constantly tweeting about the need to send all the immigrants to Rwanda, questioning the gender debate and cheering on Brexit, they'd be sacked within minutes. |
|
|
|
Post by elystokie on Dec 12, 2023 10:35:26 GMT
Quite ironic, 30p Lee and the risible Gullis trying to cancel people. |
|
|
|
Post by Gawa on Dec 12, 2023 10:39:34 GMT
Linekar being a mouthpiece of the Liberal left probably tells you all you need to know about the modern day profile of the Liberal left. If this was a right wing British TV presenter on the BBC (impossible theory I know, because they wouldn't recruit a right of centre presenter) and they were constantly tweeting about the need to send all the immigrants to Rwanda, questioning the gender debate and cheering on Brexit, they'd be sacked within minutes. What punishment did this receive?  Which is worse? The problem is too many snowflakes always playing the victim. You find me a tweet worse than that from Sugar. |
|
|
|
Post by scfcbiancorossi on Dec 12, 2023 10:44:23 GMT
Linekar being a mouthpiece of the Liberal left probably tells you all you need to know about the modern day profile of the Liberal left. If this was a right wing British TV presenter on the BBC (impossible theory I know, because they wouldn't recruit a right of centre presenter) and they were constantly tweeting about the need to send all the immigrants to Rwanda, questioning the gender debate and cheering on Brexit, they'd be sacked within minutes. What punishment did this receive? Which is worse? The problem is too many snowflakes always playing the victim. You find me a tweet worse than that from Sugar. That's not the same. Sugar was essentially an actor on a show aired by the BBC. Linekar is a presenter who is allegedly confined to strict impartiality rules, which he evidently ignores. |
|
|
|
Post by wannabee on Dec 12, 2023 10:52:48 GMT
Linekar being a mouthpiece of the Liberal left probably tells you all you need to know about the modern day profile of the Liberal left. If this was a right wing British TV presenter on the BBC (impossible theory I know, because they wouldn't recruit a right of centre presenter) and they were constantly tweeting about the need to send all the immigrants to Rwanda, questioning the gender debate and cheering on Brexit, they'd be sacked within minutes. I didn't have you down as a snowflake someone who encouraged sensorship Bianco I had you down as a free thinker who encouraged alternative ideas.... no matter how bizarre Gary Limedrinker is saying exactly the same as what the Right and Left of the Tory Party are saying, just not in the way the Right Side would like it said. There's just no pleasing some people |
|
|
|
Post by Gawa on Dec 12, 2023 10:53:49 GMT
What punishment did this receive? Which is worse? The problem is too many snowflakes always playing the victim. You find me a tweet worse than that from Sugar. That's not the same. Sugar was essentially an actor on a show aired by the BBC. Linekar is a presenter who is allegedly confined to strict impartiality rules, which he evidently ignores. So one rule for the right one rule for the left? What tv shows does he act in? Is Linekar not "essentially an actor" too then? Or what's the difference? One presents a reality show about business (while being enterprise secretary to the conservative government) and one talks about 22 men chasing a football. What about Andrew Neil and his tweets? Why did Linekar not get in trouble for this political tweet? Double standards? |
|
|
|
Post by knype on Dec 12, 2023 11:05:03 GMT
That's not the same. Sugar was essentially an actor on a show aired by the BBC. Linekar is a presenter who is allegedly confined to strict impartiality rules, which he evidently ignores. So one rule for the right one rule for the left? What tv shows does he act in? Is Linekar not "essentially an actor" too then? Or what's the difference? One presents a reality show about business (while being enterprise secretary to the conservative government) and one talks about 22 men chasing a football. What about Andrew Neil and his tweets? Why did Linekar not get in trouble for this political tweet? Double standards? Was Alan Sugar employed by the BBC ? I think thats what Bianco meant? |
|
|
|
Post by Seymour Beaver on Dec 12, 2023 11:14:28 GMT
So one rule for the right one rule for the left? What tv shows does he act in? Is Linekar not "essentially an actor" too then? Or what's the difference? One presents a reality show about business (while being enterprise secretary to the conservative government) and one talks about 22 men chasing a football. What about Andrew Neil and his tweets? Why did Linekar not get in trouble for this political tweet? Double standards? Was Alan Sugar employed by the BBC ? I think thats what Bianco meant? It's irrelevant. Unless you are employed by BBC as a journalist or a presenter of news programmes (Lineker isn't) then a BBC employee is "allowed to express their political opinions so long as they do not engage in formal campaigning". The problem for Gullis and Anderson is they simply don't like being criticised and try to bully anyone who does. Reminiscent of the days of Oswald Moseley who believed his own views should be aired under the banmer of 'free speech' but had thugs at the back of his rallies to kick the shit out of anyone who voiced their dissent. |
|
