|
Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2023 17:28:07 GMT
The original Scottish ref took place when the idea of uk leaving the eu was still fantasyland. And the EU stopped being the EEC a long time ago. So you can’t compare leaving a political union (where free trade is a major benefit) with joining any other trading blocs that don’t entail political union. There’s nothing batshit about that and I don’t think your point works. It only works if you view the EU as primarily a trading bloc, and the political union stuff irrelevant. Nobody in their right minds would’ve voted to leave if The EEC hadn’t become The EU. Perhaps you are young or have a short or selective memory One of the scare and effective tactics used by Better Together's Chairman Blair MacDougall was that if Scotland voted for Independence it would have to apply to become an EU Member, yet less than two years later it was taken out against the wishes of the Scottish People Not to repeat myself see my reply to Salop that there is little difference between EU and CPTPP The Union of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a Political Union of consent If any of the Member Countries withdraws its consent (Like UK leaving EU) then the Union is no more. For it to be anything different would be to turn a Democracy into a Dictatorship My point is, close to half of Scotland wanted independence when people were still laughing at kippers. And (IMO) they would still be fighting for it even if the brexit vote had gone the other way. So I think it’s perfectly valid to be confused why people advocating for power de-centralisation are simultaneously advocating for power centralisation. I’m relatively young but my memory is fine cheers.
|
|
|
Post by wannabee on Mar 27, 2023 18:10:08 GMT
Perhaps you are young or have a short or selective memory One of the scare and effective tactics used by Better Together's Chairman Blair MacDougall was that if Scotland voted for Independence it would have to apply to become an EU Member, yet less than two years later it was taken out against the wishes of the Scottish People Not to repeat myself see my reply to Salop that there is little difference between EU and CPTPP The Union of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a Political Union of consent If any of the Member Countries withdraws its consent (Like UK leaving EU) then the Union is no more. For it to be anything different would be to turn a Democracy into a Dictatorship My point is, close to half of Scotland wanted independence when people were still laughing at kippers. And (IMO) they would still be fighting for it even if the brexit vote had gone the other way. So I think it’s perfectly valid to be confused why people advocating for power de-centralisation are simultaneously advocating for power centralisation. I’m relatively young but my memory is fine cheers. Of course they would, but Brexit adds a new dimension and realisation to a Political Union of Countries by consent or more specifically which matters are devolved and which remain exclusively the domain of Westminster I'm astonished you can't see the parallels As an independent nation Scotland would have its own seat at EU table A clear Scottish Majority 62%/38% Voted to remain in EU A Scottish Majority of 55%/45% voted to remain in the Union BEFORE Brexit If the latter Voting Preference changed as sure as night follows day the former would follow
|
|
|
Post by salopstick on Mar 27, 2023 18:46:55 GMT
The EU is much more than a trading block That's a generous, but accurate observation You may be interested in this Article which reflects on whether EU can save CPTPP and obviously some advantages for EU to do so thediplomat.com/2022/06/can-the-eu-save-the-cptpp/This Article critiques UK joining CPTPP Concerns However, CPTPP has expressed the UK should fully accept and commit to complying to the existing rules of the agreement. Therefore, since the government cannot negotiate terms, the question is what will the UK have to sacrifice in order to qualify? For example, there have been concerns raised that joining CPTPP will lead to the lowering of food standards. Central to this is that if we continue alignment with the EU on Sanitary and Phytosanitary measures, there would be a discrepancy in SPS measures between the UK and CPTPP members. UK farms have emphasised the impact that signing trade deals with countries who are big exporters of agriculture would have on UK industry. Another significant concern surrounds Intellectual Property (IP), and the need to protect our standards. IP contributes significantly to UK innovation and productivity. Currently, the UK is a member of the European Patent Convention (EPC), which supports particularly creative industries, but also research, tech, and innovation businesses. There are inconsistencies between CPTPP rules on IP and the EPC, which, if the UK had to cede membership to the EPC, would impact growth of British businesses. The post-Brexit perspective Since we left the EU, the government has been focusing on their trade reorientation strategy. As a competitive trading nation, it is vital the UK signs trade deals to restore our international reputation since Brexit. Agreements we have signed already have been concluded in quick succession, and do not necessarily have a significant impact on our economy. Our deal with New Zealand for example is estimated to have negligible impact on UK GDP. So while flying the flag for ‘Global Britain’ is good for our post-Brexit standing, complete reorientation is not going to solve the very real problem that businesses currently face, namely that they have many more trade related challenges than they did six years ago. From our surveys, directors have told us that the EU-UK relationship is a priority issue the government needs to address in order to support business. UK companies still rely on the long established links they have with EU markets, which are directly on our doorstep and with whom they have closer historical ties. The Indo-Pacific strategy will open up important opportunities for UK businesses, but the government must not forfeit the significance of our relationship with the EU in order to do so. www.iod.com/news/global-business/flying-the-flag-for-global-britain-how-valuable-is-cptpp-for-the-uk-really/If you think there is a major difference in "pooling Sovereignty" in one Trading Bloc versus another you are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land I’m not interested We are out. I’d rather the country as a whole concentrated on making brexit work instead of moaning about it
|
|
|
Post by salopstick on Mar 27, 2023 18:47:45 GMT
I think the snp and Scottish independence has taken a backwards step with the continuity candidate. If the snp wanted a change the other two should have made an arrangement for one of them to step back and allow a 1 on 1 contest. They have split the non-continuity vote I don’t think it would of changed the result maybe it would of been closer still The snp is fairly split down the middle over social issues And are in a lot of trouble They’ve caused the trouble themselves by allowing the green tail to wag the dogs arse And the wokists
|
|
|
Post by felonious on Mar 27, 2023 18:55:08 GMT
The original Scottish ref took place when the idea of uk leaving the eu was still fantasyland. And the EU stopped being the EEC a long time ago. So you can’t compare leaving a political union (where free trade is a major benefit) with joining any other trading blocs that don’t entail political union. There’s nothing batshit about that and I don’t think your point works. It only works if you view the EU as primarily a trading bloc, and the political union stuff irrelevant. Nobody in their right minds would’ve voted to leave if The EEC hadn’t become The EU. Perhaps you are young or have a short or selective memory Wow, condescending pompous arsehole alert
|
|
|
Post by wannabee on Mar 27, 2023 19:16:02 GMT
Perhaps you are young or have a short or selective memory Wow, condescending pompous arsehole alert Ignorant Clown intersecting him/herself into conversation they don't understand
|
|
|
Post by felonious on Mar 28, 2023 7:16:38 GMT
Wow, condescending pompous arsehole alert Ignorant Clown intersecting him/herself into conversation they don't understand Have you got any friends on here who can take you to one side for a quiet discussion on your superiority complex. You never know you could become a useful poster where your well thought out interesting posts may be actually read rather than people just seeing the undermining, belittling language that tends to surface now and then. Perhaps a partner at home could glance over your shoulder, wince and say perhaps you ought to take that line out dear. If not perhaps a bit of research on basic good manners might do the trick.
|
|
|
Post by wannabee on Mar 28, 2023 8:04:52 GMT
Ignorant Clown intersecting him/herself into conversation they don't understand Have you got any friends on here who can take you to one side for a quiet discussion on your superiority complex. You never know you could become a useful poster where your well thought out interesting posts may be actually read rather than people just seeing the undermining, belittling language that tends to surface now and then. Perhaps a partner at home could glance over your shoulder, wince and say perhaps you ought to take that line out dear. If not perhaps a bit of research on basic good manners might do the trick. Take yourself off to your thread if it makes you feel better you pratt
|
|
|
Post by felonious on Mar 28, 2023 14:20:41 GMT
Have you got any friends on here who can take you to one side for a quiet discussion on your superiority complex. You never know you could become a useful poster where your well thought out interesting posts may be actually read rather than people just seeing the undermining, belittling language that tends to surface now and then. Perhaps a partner at home could glance over your shoulder, wince and say perhaps you ought to take that line out dear. If not perhaps a bit of research on basic good manners might do the trick. Take yourself off to your thread if it makes you feel better you pratt Well Wannabee, Who do you think you are It's prat by the way the extra t makes it into a surname unless of course you're giving me a compliment.
|
|
|
Post by noustie on Apr 5, 2023 8:48:08 GMT
Things could get interesting quickly here
|
|
|
Post by noustie on Apr 5, 2023 8:51:16 GMT
|
|
|
Post by scfcbiancorossi on Apr 5, 2023 8:53:40 GMT
Things you love to see.
|
|
|
Post by Rednwhitenblue on Apr 5, 2023 8:58:58 GMT
Funny how you didn't post that on the Trump thread
|
|
|
Post by gawa on Apr 5, 2023 8:59:40 GMT
Things could get interesting quickly here They must have some pretty good evidence on him I'd say for him to be arrested and all. Wasn't he in a bit of a controversy a few weeks ago in relation to falsifying the number of members or something too? Wonder if this could be part of the reason why Surgeon suddenly stepped down. Was the writing already on the wall.
|
|
|
Post by gawa on Apr 5, 2023 9:03:25 GMT
Funny how you didn't post that on the Trump thread While bianca may not hold all politicians to high standards, it doesn't mean the rest of us shouldn't. We shouldn't allow this to descend into whataboutery.
|
|
|
Post by thevoid on Apr 5, 2023 9:04:37 GMT
Things could get interesting quickly here They must have some pretty good evidence on him I'd say for him to be arrested and all. Wasn't he in a bit of a controversy a few weeks ago in relation to falsifying the number of members or something too? Wonder if this could be part of the reason why Surgeon suddenly stepped down. Was the writing already on the wall. Occam's razor would suggest so
|
|
|
Post by noustie on Apr 5, 2023 9:08:58 GMT
Things could get interesting quickly here They must have some pretty good evidence on him I'd say for him to be arrested and all. Wasn't he in a bit of a controversy a few weeks ago in relation to falsifying the number of members or something too? Wonder if this could be part of the reason why Surgeon suddenly stepped down. Was the writing already on the wall. Wings Over Scotland have been banging on about this for years. Be interesting to see the fallout as the Salmond fiasco is bound to resurface. In addition the marriage is allegedly one of convenience and there will be some salacious headlines to follow potentially Long story short - SNP are fucked. For a man of my persuasion it has unfortunately been a long time in the making and ironically will take a generation to recover from unfortunately
|
|
|
Post by raythesailor on Apr 5, 2023 9:09:51 GMT
The proverbial you no what is starting to hit the fan.
No coincidence that these events follow sudden decisions to resign. Could cause serious damage to the SNP.
|
|
|
Post by thevoid on Apr 5, 2023 9:10:15 GMT
They must have some pretty good evidence on him I'd say for him to be arrested and all. Wasn't he in a bit of a controversy a few weeks ago in relation to falsifying the number of members or something too? Wonder if this could be part of the reason why Surgeon suddenly stepped down. Was the writing already on the wall. Wings Over Scotland have been banging on about this for years. Be interesting to see the fallout as the Salmond fiasco is bound to resurface. In addition the marriage is allegedly one of convenience and there will be some salacious headlines to follow potentially Long story short - SNP are fucked. For a man of my persuasion it has unfortunately been a long time in the making and ironically will take a generation to recover from unfortunately Do you think Salmond's flag shaggers will grow in popularity as a result?
|
|
|
Post by noustie on Apr 5, 2023 9:11:16 GMT
They must have some pretty good evidence on him I'd say for him to be arrested and all. Wasn't he in a bit of a controversy a few weeks ago in relation to falsifying the number of members or something too? Wonder if this could be part of the reason why Surgeon suddenly stepped down. Was the writing already on the wall. Occam's razor would suggest so Part of it but I've got Jimmy Cricket in my head '....and there's more'
|
|
|
Post by eddyclamp on Apr 5, 2023 9:11:22 GMT
it`s fandabbydozy.
|
|
|
Post by noustie on Apr 5, 2023 9:16:26 GMT
The proverbial you no what is starting to hit the fan. No coincidence that these events follow sudden decisions to resign. Could cause serious damage to the SNP. In my opinion there'll either be an exodus to Alba or Forbes will try to resurrect them as a more central slightly right party staying well away from the mental Greens if they ever even see power again
|
|
|
Post by starkiller on Apr 5, 2023 9:21:02 GMT
They must have some pretty good evidence on him I'd say for him to be arrested and all. Wasn't he in a bit of a controversy a few weeks ago in relation to falsifying the number of members or something too? Wonder if this could be part of the reason why Surgeon suddenly stepped down. Was the writing already on the wall. Wings Over Scotland have been banging on about this for years. Be interesting to see the fallout as the Salmond fiasco is bound to resurface. In addition the marriage is allegedly one of convenience and there will be some salacious headlines to follow potentially Long story short - SNP are fucked. For a man of my persuasion it has unfortunately been a long time in the making and ironically will take a generation to recover from unfortunately SNP have been trading on a Mel Gibson fantasy film for 30 years.
|
|
|
Post by lordb on Apr 5, 2023 9:24:49 GMT
The proverbial you no what is starting to hit the fan. No coincidence that these events follow sudden decisions to resign. Could cause serious damage to the SNP. Indeed In which case if SNP votors look elsewhere who will they vote for? Good news for Labour, they may pick up a seat or 3
|
|
|
Post by noustie on Apr 5, 2023 9:26:10 GMT
Wings Over Scotland have been banging on about this for years. Be interesting to see the fallout as the Salmond fiasco is bound to resurface. In addition the marriage is allegedly one of convenience and there will be some salacious headlines to follow potentially Long story short - SNP are fucked. For a man of my persuasion it has unfortunately been a long time in the making and ironically will take a generation to recover from unfortunately SNP have been trading on a Mel Gibson fantasy film for 30 years. For me mate they started well and replaced a Labour party that genuinely took Scotland for granted. Salmond knew they needed a competent government to increase independence support. Since 2014 its increasingly careerists who've taken their seat on the gravy train for granted so roles reversed from when they took over from Labour. It's such a shambles Tories are on for winning numerous southern/ North Eastern seats
|
|
|
Post by raythesailor on Apr 5, 2023 9:27:34 GMT
The proverbial you no what is starting to hit the fan. No coincidence that these events follow sudden decisions to resign. Could cause serious damage to the SNP. Indeed In which case if SNP votors look elsewhere who will they vote for? Good news for Labour, they may pick up a seat or 3 I suspect Sir Kier is rubbing his hands with glee and booking flights north as we type🤪
|
|
|
Post by iancransonsknees on Apr 5, 2023 9:29:29 GMT
Soon to be the ex - Mr Sturgeon.
|
|
|
Post by hamsta2 on Apr 5, 2023 9:45:48 GMT
Mrs Hamsta very subdued today. Not helped by me saying ‘RIP SNP’💀
|
|
|
Post by gawa on Apr 5, 2023 9:46:21 GMT
SNP have been trading on a Mel Gibson fantasy film for 30 years. For me mate they started well and replaced a Labour party that genuinely took Scotland for granted. Salmond knew they needed a competent government to increase independence support. Since 2014 its increasingly careerists who've taken their seat on the gravy train for granted so roles reversed from when they took over from Labour. It's such a shambles Tories are on for winning numerous southern/ North Eastern seats What do you think of their new leader? Seems a nice lad but I know very little about him.
|
|
|
Post by phileetin on Apr 5, 2023 9:46:45 GMT
so many police there , looks like there might be a body in the garden .
|
|