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Post by Trouserdog on Feb 20, 2021 9:32:38 GMT
I think there’s levels of idiocy. McClean/Vokes/Gregory/Wimmer are the kind of signings where from a review of their Wikipedia pages it was pretty clear we were being very stupid and paying money no one else would. I don’t think anyone could have predicted how disappointing Afobe would be and there weren’t many people crying when we signed him. We didn’t know Rowett was wedded to 4-3-3 or just how ill suited to that Afobe was at the time though. The point is that Rowett and Phillips should’ve done. Understanding how a striker fits into a team is one of the absolute basics of football management. It's the kind of thing I'd expect an Under 7s coach to understand, yet we've had a succession of managers making signings with seemingly no consideration of how this works. A big slow striker who's good in the air? Like Sam Vokes? Literally the only way he's going to score is by getting crosses in to him. In other words 4-4-2 with wingers. Did Nathan Jones play 4-4-2 with wingers? No. Afobe- well, God knows what he's supposed to be, but probably another who needs a strike partner to do literally all the work while he just hovers on the shoulder of the last defender and tries to use his one asset (a bit of pace) to get in behind. If you don't play a strike partnership there's literally no point in him being on the pitch. Even Crouch was a player who didn't really fit into a lone-striker system, but had enough quality about him to at least compensate for doing a job that he naturally wasn't really suited to under TP. It's appalling that we as a club have continually made the same mistake over and over. A mistake that could have been avoided with even the most basic amount of due diligence. |
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Post by robwahlmann on Feb 20, 2021 9:46:21 GMT
I can see Benik is getting about 5 minutes every game now in Turkey! How the mighty have fallen!  Nobody will pay the £3M we need to offload due to FFP as things stand!  |
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Post by lordb on Feb 20, 2021 9:50:19 GMT
I can see Benik is getting about 5 minutes every game now in Turkey! How the mighty have fallen! Nobody will pay the £3M we need to offload due to FFP as things stand! Indeed Another loan next year |
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Post by Gary Hackett on Feb 20, 2021 11:08:01 GMT
He's a bit of a wanker isn't he. I think MON will try and get him on side when he returns, just a gut feeling but we'll see. Mon binned him off as soon as he could have had a look at him pre season What may you think MON will change his mind? Can't see it. It was the player who asked for the move away from England for a while as he wanted a change of scenery after the death of his daughter and the injury, MON said in an interview. |
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Post by nott1 on Feb 20, 2021 11:14:23 GMT
I can see Benik is getting about 5 minutes every game now in Turkey! How the mighty have fallen! Nobody will pay the £3M we need to offload due to FFP as things stand! He's never been up there has he....not good enough! |
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Post by cousindupree on Feb 20, 2021 11:26:11 GMT
We didn’t know Rowett was wedded to 4-3-3 or just how ill suited to that Afobe was at the time though. The point is that Rowett and Phillips should’ve done. Understanding how a striker fits into a team is one of the absolute basics of football management. It's literally the kind of thing I'd expect an Under 7s coach to understand, yet we've had a succession of managers making signings with seemingly no consideration of how this works. A big slow striker who's good in the air? Like Sam Vokes? Literally the only way he's going to score is by getting crosses in to him. In other words 4-4-2 with wingers. Did Nathan Jones play 4-4-2 with wingers? No. Afobe- well, God knows what he's supposed to be, but probably another who needs a strike partner to do literally all the work while he just hovers on the shoulder of the last defender and tries to use his one asset (a bit of pace) to get in behind. If you don't play a strike partnership there's literally no point in him being on the pitch. Even Crouch was a player who didn't really fit into a lone-striker system, but had enough quality about him to at least compensate for doing a job that he naturally wasn't really suited to under TP. It's appalling that we as a club have continually made the same mistake over and over. A mistake that could have been avoided with even the most basic amount of due diligence. It is truly staggering that more due diligence didn't take place. You only have to look in what system Vokes was successful at Burnley and Afobe only success at Wolves to suggest neither player would fit the manager's preferred system. It's been a long source of frustration for me that we have never had at the club an experienced Director of Football who is going to use his expertise to at least question the manager's choice of high priced players. Who at the club was ever able to do that? Carto? Give me a break, Scholes? He's a bean counter and probably knows little more than your well informed fan, Coates Jnr? Christ on a bike! Or good old uncle Peter who seems to always want to please and support his manager. A DOF is not so crucial at the moment with us shopping in the basement bargains, but in the Premier League and our first season in the championship where we were splashing £10m+ on players seemingly on the whim of the manager without any sanity check a DOF would have been that additional input into due diligence. |
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Post by iglugluk on Feb 20, 2021 11:26:14 GMT
Gary Fucking Rowett! Oops wrong thread?! Meant to post this on the worst manager thread.
Oh well it's a comment that is equally relevant here.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Feb 20, 2021 11:34:17 GMT
Gary Fucking Rowett! Oops wrong thread?! Meant to post this on the worst manager thread. Oh well it's a comment that is equally relevant here. Yeah that fucker was only here for a few months and has managed to do more damage to this football club than any manager since I've been supporting Stoke in the 80s. |
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Post by mrcoke on Feb 20, 2021 12:24:41 GMT
It's 5 years since Afobe scored goals with any regularity.
Rowett gave him his chance to reboot his career and it didn't work out.
Jones obviously just didn't fancy him.
MON talked him up last summer, gave him every chance in pre-season and he failed to produce. Maybe MON will repeat the process next summer, but you have to ask how many chances has Afobe had, when others hardly get a chance at all.
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Post by Miles Offside on Feb 20, 2021 12:44:05 GMT
It's 5 years since Afobe scored goals with any regularity. Rowett gave him his chance to reboot his career and it didn't work out. Jones obviously just didn't fancy him. MON talked him up last summer, gave him every chance in pre-season and he failed to produce. Maybe MON will repeat the process next summer, but you have to ask how many chances has Afobe had, when others hardly get a chance at all. Seems typical of a few of our signings over the past few years - has the physical attributes, but not the attitude needed to go with them. |
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Post by FullerMagic on Feb 21, 2021 16:44:23 GMT
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Post by themistocles on Feb 21, 2021 16:56:31 GMT
He thought we we're going to win the league by December with Mclean and Ince... |
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Post by slicko on Feb 21, 2021 17:02:40 GMT
Delusional. Done himself no favours there. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 21, 2021 17:10:25 GMT
Not sure what he’s said wrong tbh.
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Post by Dave the Rave on Feb 21, 2021 17:17:00 GMT
Not sure what he’s said wrong tbh. Me neither. Quite refreshing to hear some honesty. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 21, 2021 17:20:32 GMT
Not sure what he’s said wrong tbh. Me neither. Quite refreshing to hear some honesty. He’s said nothing worse than anything on here or down the ground and indeed he’s been far more polite about it. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 21, 2021 17:28:05 GMT
Yeah don't think there's a lot wrong with that is there?
Don't agree with all of it but he's just talking honestly from his perspective.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2021 17:36:56 GMT
Delusional. Done himself no favours there. Said nothing wrong. Gave reasons for coming, gave reasons for leaving. He can score at this level, though he may never do it with us. He cracked under the pressure of a massively underperforming team who should have destroyed the league that year but couldn’t connect with eachother. He obviously has a poor opinion of the fans also. Will be interesting to see what happens in the summer. Fletcher will be that little bit older and we have no real back up other than Vokes left for the central striker position. We may be forced to use him and try to get him scoring unless we sell others to buy a replacement. |
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Post by tosh on Feb 21, 2021 17:39:03 GMT
Refreshingly honest interview really. Said it didn’t work out but didn’t slag off the club or anyone there.
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Post by mattythestokie on Feb 21, 2021 17:43:18 GMT
Is he suggesting that the fans should of been happy with his performances???
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Post by davejohnno1 on Feb 21, 2021 17:45:25 GMT
More money than wolves! We offered Clucas more money than Burnley.. We gave Ince a pay rise to leave Huddersfield. We were the gift horse and these players weren't going to pass up the ridiculous opportunity we were giving them.
Says it all. He could have stayed at wolves but he moved because it was easy option. When it didn't prove quite so easy, he gave up. Benik is/was happy with 6 goals and couldn't understand the stick he got.
He's not said a lot wrong yet at the same time he's shown his true colours.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 21, 2021 17:47:49 GMT
More money than wolves! We offered Clucas more money than Burnley.. We gave Ince a pay rise to leave Huddersfield. We were the gift horse and these players weren't going to pass up the ridiculous opportunity we were giving them. Says it all. He could have stayed at wolves but he moved because it was easy option. When it didn't prove quite so easy, he gave up. Benik is/was happy with 6 goals and couldn't understand the stick he got. He's not said a lot wrong yet at the same time he's shown his true colours. Not sure it was the easy option? He chose football over sitting on the bench or not playing at all. Isn’t that what a lot of people shout at some of ours for? |
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Post by tosh on Feb 21, 2021 17:51:06 GMT
More money than wolves! We offered Clucas more money than Burnley.. We gave Ince a pay rise to leave Huddersfield. We were the gift horse and these players weren't going to pass up the ridiculous opportunity we were giving them. Says it all. He could have stayed at wolves but he moved because it was easy option. When it didn't prove quite so easy, he gave up. Benik is/was happy with 6 goals and couldn't understand the stick he got. He's not said a lot wrong yet at the same time he's shown his true colours. Loads of players think like that. Don’t think he’s the exception really. Not that he was worth the money. |
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Post by davejohnno1 on Feb 21, 2021 17:54:44 GMT
More money than wolves! We offered Clucas more money than Burnley.. We gave Ince a pay rise to leave Huddersfield. We were the gift horse and these players weren't going to pass up the ridiculous opportunity we were giving them. Says it all. He could have stayed at wolves but he moved because it was easy option. When it didn't prove quite so easy, he gave up. Benik is/was happy with 6 goals and couldn't understand the stick he got. He's not said a lot wrong yet at the same time he's shown his true colours. Not sure it was the easy option? He chose football over sitting on the bench or not playing at all. Isn’t that what a lot of people shout at some of ours for? More money. Doesn't have to fight for place. Doesn't have to move house. Downs tools when he realised it wasnt a walk in the park. Couldn't wait to leave. He's said nothing wrong but the words say a lot about his mentality in my opinion. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 21, 2021 17:59:24 GMT
Not sure it was the easy option? He chose football over sitting on the bench or not playing at all. Isn’t that what a lot of people shout at some of ours for? More money. Doesn't have to fight for place. Doesn't have to move house. Downs tools when he realised it wasnt a walk in the park. Couldn't wait to leave. He's said nothing wrong but the words say a lot about his mentality in my opinion. I don’t think it was the easy option though. Easier to sit on the bench, pick up a bit less wage and play 10 minutes of PL football if you’re lucky. And even easier still to become semi retired like he probably would have done! |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2021 18:04:04 GMT
The only sticking point is if he sat down with Rowett and talked tactics. Surely a player knows the kind of systems they thrive in, and the type they find a bit of a struggle.
If he sat down and signed knowing he was playing in a 433 then he's a bigger tool than he looks.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Feb 21, 2021 18:04:10 GMT
More money. Doesn't have to fight for place. Doesn't have to move house. Downs tools when he realised it wasnt a walk in the park. Couldn't wait to leave. He's said nothing wrong but the words say a lot about his mentality in my opinion. I don’t think it was the easy option though. Easier to sit on the bench, pick up a bit less wage and play 10 minutes of PL football if you’re lucky. And even easier still to become semi retired like he probably would have done! Wonder if he'd have come for less money or the incentive based deal Fletcher and Mikel signed? If he was wanted at wolves, which he says he was, anyone with an ounce of ambition would try to play at the highest level possible. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 21, 2021 18:05:58 GMT
I don’t think it was the easy option though. Easier to sit on the bench, pick up a bit less wage and play 10 minutes of PL football if you’re lucky. And even easier still to become semi retired like he probably would have done! Wonder if he'd have come for less money or the incentive based deal Fletcher and Mikel signed? If he was wanted at wolves, which he says he was, anyone with an ounce of ambition would try to play at the highest level possible. They signed him specifically to sell him didn’t they? |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 21, 2021 18:34:11 GMT
Wonder if he'd have come for less money or the incentive based deal Fletcher and Mikel signed? If he was wanted at wolves, which he says he was, anyone with an ounce of ambition would try to play at the highest level possible. They signed him specifically to sell him didn’t they? Yeah he was supposedly devastated to be told that as well. They told him he could go almost as soon as he signed. |
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Post by Fred Merger on Feb 21, 2021 18:46:26 GMT
To be fair,he has never given the impression that he wanted to be here in the first place. A five year contract and a 12 million deal which he would get a percentage of would seem daft to turn down whatever the outcome.😎
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Nobody will pay the £3M we need to offload due to FFP as things stand! 
