|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2020 8:17:38 GMT
I think he tried hard enough and ran around a bit and basically looked okay, I just can't recall any single thing he did of note in a season and a half. Ideally at this level you'd like some kind of cutting edge for 6 million quid and a kings ransom wage. The much derided Joe Allen has a few goals to his name and quite some assists at least. Manages to make a real nuisance of himself. Number of Joe Allen assists this season: zero Etebo is at least as big a nuisance factor and more robust to boot. We miss that presence to drive us forward, especially if we want to be a counter attacking side. Question marks over his end product absolutely, but given the defensive issues and weakness in the middle, having that outlet would be an asset. We miss his ability to drive us forward yet we’ve scored more goals, conceded less goals and gained far more points since he’s been out of the team? And I like Etebo by the way, there’s definitely a player in there but end product is pretty important in the grand scheme of things...... |
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 9, 2020 8:20:26 GMT
Number of Joe Allen assists this season: zero Etebo is at least as big a nuisance factor and more robust to boot. We miss that presence to drive us forward, especially if we want to be a counter attacking side. Question marks over his end product absolutely, but given the defensive issues and weakness in the middle, having that outlet would be an asset. We miss his ability to drive us forward yet we’ve scored more goals, conceded less goals and gained far more points since he’s been out of the team? And I like Etebo by the way, there’s definitely a player in there but end product is pretty important in the grand scheme of things...... I think we've missed it overall but it's a fair point, absolutely, and he's gone now anyway, so fairly pointless I accept. What I don't really understand is the willingness of some fans to stick the boot into him based on not much. I don't recall him being considered a lazy mercenary dastardly type until suddenly the narrative deemed it convenient for him to be so. If we allow him, Badou and Allen to leave in the same window I'd be very worried indeed about our chances of survival. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2020 8:22:46 GMT
Leaving the ground and not staying to watch your team mates play also suggests someone that isn’t a team player. All rather flimsy “evidence” if I do say so from either side of the debate..... It's not professional, I completely agree, though one might argue his frustrations were understandable if not expressed appropriately. It's behaviour that doesn't suggest laziness or an unwillingness to play, is my point. What's the evidence to suggest he's a lazy arse mercenary not prepared to pull his weight? In your opinion, does that tally with the player you've seen on the pitch? I just have ten minutes to kill waiting for a train and an playing devils advocate to be fair 😄 I don’t think he’s a lazy arsed mercenary, but if (and I say if) he was going into training and not giving that extra 10% that matters as a professional sportsman. And if the manager feels that he’s not worthy of a place in the team based on that I have no issue with it. I like Etebo, but we’re not talking about a player who’s been so impressive for the team that he’s guaranteed a start no matter what (like Fuller in his prime would have been for example). |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2020 8:25:40 GMT
Yet Cousins has put in a few decent performances and helped moved us out of the relegation zone, something Etebo didn’t manage this season. Funny old world...... I'd argue Etebo has as many good performances to his name this season as Cousins. Difficult comparison as they play different roles, but in terms of actual good performances, like. Agree completely, but it’s all about the team not the individual. And points wise we’re far better off under the current system..... |
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 9, 2020 8:26:33 GMT
It's not professional, I completely agree, though one might argue his frustrations were understandable if not expressed appropriately. It's behaviour that doesn't suggest laziness or an unwillingness to play, is my point. What's the evidence to suggest he's a lazy arse mercenary not prepared to pull his weight? In your opinion, does that tally with the player you've seen on the pitch? I just have ten minutes to kill waiting for a train and an playing devils advocate to be fair 😄 I don’t think he’s a lazy arsed mercenary, but if (and I say if) he was going into training and not giving that extra 10% that matters as a professional sportsman. And if the manager feels that he’s not worthy of a place in the team based in that I have no issue with it. I like Etebo, but we’re not talking about a player who’s been so impressive for the team that he’s guaranteed a start no matter what (like Fuller in his prime would have been for example). Not guaranteed a start, I agree, but given your mate Ryan Woods was recalled (and you wonder about his attitude given he made one of Jones' last 10 matchday squads and seems to be persona non grata again now), you do wonder a bit whether there might be a bit more to it than attitude... |
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 9, 2020 8:27:23 GMT
I'd argue Etebo has as many good performances to his name this season as Cousins. Difficult comparison as they play different roles, but in terms of actual good performances, like. Agree completely, but it’s all about the team not the individual. And points wise we’re far better off under the current system..... Now results have picked up and things are looking up I have absolutely no issue with the manager not picking them and accept he's done the right thing. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2020 8:27:37 GMT
I just have ten minutes to kill waiting for a train and an playing devils advocate to be fair 😄 I don’t think he’s a lazy arsed mercenary, but if (and I say if) he was going into training and not giving that extra 10% that matters as a professional sportsman. And if the manager feels that he’s not worthy of a place in the team based in that I have no issue with it. I like Etebo, but we’re not talking about a player who’s been so impressive for the team that he’s guaranteed a start no matter what (like Fuller in his prime would have been for example). Not guaranteed a start, I agree, but given your mate Ryan Woods was recalled (and you wonder about his attitude given he made one of Jones' last 10 matchday squads and seems to be persona non grata again now), you do wonder a bit whether there might be a bit more to it than attitude... My mate Ryan Woods? I think Woods is a complete non entity of a footballer, I’d get rid tomorrow....... |
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 9, 2020 8:28:08 GMT
Not guaranteed a start, I agree, but given your mate Ryan Woods was recalled (and you wonder about his attitude given he made one of Jones' last 10 matchday squads and seems to be persona non grata again now), you do wonder a bit whether there might be a bit more to it than attitude... My mate Ryan Woods? I think Woods is a complete non entity of a footballer, I’d get rid tomorrow....... I know mate, I was being facetious.  |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2020 8:29:47 GMT
My mate Ryan Woods? I think Woods is a complete non entity of a footballer, I’d get rid tomorrow....... I know mate, I was being facetious. Fair enough mate. Actually I retract what I said, why wait until tomorrow? |
|
|
|
Post by Godo on Jan 9, 2020 9:16:53 GMT
Fucking club is run by a bunch of incompetent amateurs! If we have to offload then we must have been able to get a buyer for Etebo after some of the press and comments from other managers. Instead we deprive ourselves of one of our best players for no real financial gain other than probably 50% of his wages. Imbula, Wimmer, N'Diaye and Etebo all on loan, all doing nothing to enhance their saleability and you can bet we are paying a good 50% (or around £80k per week!) of their wages. Scholes doesn't need a pay rise he needs sacking and as for Coates jnr from all accounts he should just be sat in the corner with a dunces hat on and ignored. Fucking idiots......
|
|
|
|
Post by Gods on Jan 9, 2020 10:15:32 GMT
I think he tried hard enough and ran around a bit and basically looked okay, I just can't recall any single thing he did of note in a season and a half. Ideally at this level you'd like some kind of cutting edge for 6 million quid and a kings ransom wage. The much derided Joe Allen has a few goals to his name and quite some assists at least. Manages to make a real nuisance of himself. Etebo is at least as big a nuisance factor and more robust to boot. We miss that presence to drive us forward, especially if we want to be a counter attacking side. Question marks over his end product absolutely, but given the defensive issues and weakness in the middle, having that outlet would be an asset. Top of my head wasn't his goal bound shot v Sheff Wed turned in on the line by James Mclean? Anyway whether it was or not Allen has 3 goals to his name this season which is 1 more than Etebo has in his Stoke City career. |
|
|
|
Post by berahinosgoals on Jan 9, 2020 10:16:07 GMT
Fucking club is run by a bunch of incompetent amateurs! If we have to offload then we must have been able to get a buyer for Etebo after some of the press and comments from other managers. Instead we deprive ourselves of one of our best players for no real financial gain other than probably 50% of his wages. Imbula, Wimmer, N'Diaye and Etebo all on loan, all doing nothing to enhance their saleability and you can bet we are paying a good 50% (or around £80k per week!) of their wages. Scholes doesn't need a pay rise he needs sacking and as for Coates jnr from all accounts he should just be sat in the corner with a dunces hat on and ignored. Fucking idiots...... Afobe is on loan too |
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 9, 2020 10:18:45 GMT
Number of Joe Allen assists this season: zeroEtebo is at least as big a nuisance factor and more robust to boot. We miss that presence to drive us forward, especially if we want to be a counter attacking side. Question marks over his end product absolutely, but given the defensive issues and weakness in the middle, having that outlet would be an asset. Top of my head wasn't his goal bound shot v Sheff Wed turned in on the line by James Mclean? Anyway whether it was or not Allen has 3 goals to his name this season which is 1 more than Etebo has in his Stoke City career. That appears not to count according to the stats bods. I think judging midfielders on goals is a bit weird anyway, unless their role is to be a creative/attacking midfielder. Both could do with chipping in with more (Allen has missed some absolute sitters), but there's far more to the role than that. Nzonzi wasn't exactly prolific and he's the best midfielder I've seen play for Stoke in 30 years. |
|
|
|
Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Jan 9, 2020 10:33:20 GMT
David Silva scored half as many goals last season as Luka Milovojevic. I know who I’d rather have in my first team.
Etebo is a ball progressor who moves the ball via dribbling, we haven’t got a single midfielder playing more than 12 games with more than 2 passes into the final third or 1 pass into the box per 90 minutes this season. We don’t move the ball to dangerous areas via passing or dribbling. That latter is Etebo’s main role. Sawyers hasn’t registered many assists this year but that’s because he playing the pass leading to the assist more often than not. You can’t just judge a player on end point stats to make a holistic judgement of how good he is.
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2020 11:05:53 GMT
David Silva scored half as many goals last season as Luka Milovojevic. I know who I’d rather have in my first team. Etebo is a ball progressor who moves the ball via dribbling, we haven’t got a single midfielder playing more than 12 games with more than 2 passes into the final third or 1 pass into the box per 90 minutes this season. We don’t move the ball to dangerous areas via passing or dribbling. That latter is Etebo’s main role. Sawyers hasn’t registered many assists this year but that’s because he playing the pass leading to the assist more often than not. You can’t just judge a player on end point stats to make a holistic judgement of how good he is. You can’t I agree. But you can judge the output of the team as a whole, and that appears to be heading in the right direction. It’s not about the individual....... |
|
|
|
Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Jan 9, 2020 11:22:00 GMT
David Silva scored half as many goals last season as Luka Milovojevic. I know who I’d rather have in my first team. Etebo is a ball progressor who moves the ball via dribbling, we haven’t got a single midfielder playing more than 12 games with more than 2 passes into the final third or 1 pass into the box per 90 minutes this season. We don’t move the ball to dangerous areas via passing or dribbling. That latter is Etebo’s main role. Sawyers hasn’t registered many assists this year but that’s because he playing the pass leading to the assist more often than not. You can’t just judge a player on end point stats to make a holistic judgement of how good he is. You can’t I agree. But you can judge the output of the team as a whole, and that appears to be heading in the right direction. It’s not about the individual....... We have certainly improved and we've dominated the sides around us. But, and it's a big but in my opinion our record against the non-bottom 5 remains exactly the same as Jones' PPG. Bottom 5: P4 W4 D0 L0 GF 14 GA 5 Non Bottom 5: P7 W1 D1 L5 GF6 GA 10 We've got a tough run coming up now, and we simply have to be getting a better return than that up until we start playing the sides around us again in March. Personally I think we will, but I still think most are judging O'Neill and the team in general on a small sample size, heavily weighted with some godawful teams in it. That said, against the sides around he literally couldn't have done anymore, and full credit to him for that. Etebo is one of our younger players and one who could have been a real force in the division. Alas, it's not worked out that way. But I think we could potentially miss the impact he could have against better sides in the long run. |
|
|
|
Post by crapslinger on Jan 9, 2020 12:00:40 GMT
Fucking club is run by a bunch of incompetent amateurs! If we have to offload then we must have been able to get a buyer for Etebo after some of the press and comments from other managers. Instead we deprive ourselves of one of our best players for no real financial gain other than probably 50% of his wages. Imbula, Wimmer, N'Diaye and Etebo all on loan, all doing nothing to enhance their saleability and you can bet we are paying a good 50% (or around £80k per week!) of their wages. Scholes doesn't need a pay rise he needs sacking and as for Coates jnr from all accounts he should just be sat in the corner with a dunces hat on and ignored. Fucking idiots...... Afobe is on loan too A total fcuk up by all involved in transfers in and out ! we have approx. £71million of players out on loan now, nothing wrong with the process my arse, those still here involved in this debacle should be sacked with immediate effect, the whole club needs a root and branch strip down and rebuild top to bottom. |
|
|
|
Post by chuckrocky on Jan 9, 2020 12:39:02 GMT
To be fair anyone would be furious if you’d lost your place to Jordan Cousins. Yet Cousins has put in a few decent performances and helped moved us out of the relegation zone, something Etebo didn’t manage this season. Funny old world...... Not really a fair comparison though. Cousins has had a chance to play in a more solid system. He still managed to cost us the game at Middlesbrough mind and we still leak goals for fun despite him being the defensive midfielder. |
|
|
|
Post by dirtygary69 on Jan 9, 2020 12:45:35 GMT
Surely it's impossible to "prove" that we have improved without Etebo being in the team? He hasn't featured under O'Neill so it's difficult to know how we'd have done if he'd played. You can't take his stats from the games played under Jones and compare them to midfielders who have played under O'Neill. We couldn't have done much better as O'Neill has done well but I think it's wrong to suggest we've been better without him. We've just been a whole lot better since O'Neill came in, bar the odd shitter.
|
|
|
|
Post by liathroid on Jan 9, 2020 16:25:19 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by berahinosgoals on Jan 9, 2020 17:23:17 GMT
A total fcuk up by all involved in transfers in and out ! we have approx. £71million of players out on loan now, nothing wrong with the process my arse, those still here involved in this debacle should be sacked with immediate effect, the whole club needs a root and branch strip down and rebuild top to bottom. It's crazy because we are willing to let all these contracts run low and lose the money spent for zero return. Meanwhile we cant even replace them with the right quality. Any other club the board would be hounded for this its criminal, look how Newcastle treat mike Ashley and they are either a prem club or going straight back up. Imagine the uproar on tyneside if Ashley was doing what we are with loaning players out and getting nothing in return Are the Coates trying to assest strip and sell the club for peanuts and write off the debt, if they are fair play. They cant complain about the size of debt though when they have been running the club amateurishly. Personally i think they are happy to leave us a bog standard championship club now they have failed with all that money and only when all the decent earners are gone might we re attempt to get somewhere. All this money they have wasted is likely to make them not so keen to spend it again, especially the big numbers prem football demands. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2020 17:26:38 GMT
Sounds like Etebo expected us to be in the Premier League when he signed and then expected us to go straight back up.
When that didn't happen he wanted out
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2020 17:35:12 GMT
Sounds like Etebo expected us to be in the Premier League when he signed and then expected us to go straight back up. When that didn't happen he wanted out Fairplay you wouldn't know from his performances, same with N'Diaye to be fair. |
|
|
|
Post by thehoof on Jan 9, 2020 17:45:47 GMT
David Silva scored half as many goals last season as Luka Milovojevic. I know who I’d rather have in my first team. Etebo is a ball progressor who moves the ball via dribbling, we haven’t got a single midfielder playing more than 12 games with more than 2 passes into the final third or 1 pass into the box per 90 minutes this season. We don’t move the ball to dangerous areas via passing or dribbling. That latter is Etebo’s main role. Sawyers hasn’t registered many assists this year but that’s because he playing the pass leading to the assist more often than not. You can’t just judge a player on end point stats to make a holistic judgement of how good he is. The fact is that good a player as Etebo MAY be, his presence in the team both last year and this did nothing to make us look like a force in the Championship- I think that in his time here he has played in 6 league victories? He does not grab a game by the scruff of the neck, and despite his ability to dribble his final ball is usually ineffective. If we get our money back then I’m not overly bothered at losing him- I do actually prefer Allen. |
|
|
|
Post by ParaPsych on Jan 9, 2020 17:52:18 GMT
So he asked to leave and we granted him his wish but in the mean time O'Neill decided to concentrate on his other options. Don't think the manager can be questioned over that approach personally. |
|
|
|
Post by Pugsley on Jan 9, 2020 18:12:50 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by s7oke on Jan 9, 2020 18:20:20 GMT
You just know he’s going to be good though 😱 |
|
|
|
Post by Pugsley on Jan 9, 2020 18:22:07 GMT
You just know he’s going to be good though 😱 Who cares. |
|
|
|
Post by s7oke on Jan 9, 2020 18:49:43 GMT
You just know he’s going to be good though 😱 Who cares. Me because there won’t be a sell on clause Because we don’t do sell on clauses |
|
|
|
Post by Fred Ferret on Jan 10, 2020 8:31:06 GMT
How are they mercenary? If you need it spelling out: Sign for PL wages, when we struggle, either want out or don't train/fight for the cause when we are fighting for existence. Don't go near what? Those type of players! Don't give a toss about nationality - it's character that matters. In what way were they not fighting for the cause - Etebo's always given everything when he's played? He was apparently furious at not being given the chance to play? What are you talking about? He won't be getting any more money at Getafe than he will here, so how is he a mercenary? Do you think any of our players would turn down a Europa League club in a top league if they came in for them this window? Even Saint Joe? “In what way were they not fighting for the cause” (Wimmer, Imbula, Ndiaye, etc.?) - you must be blind. As for Etebo and Ndiaye, they asked for a move! But, of course they really wanted to stay and fight for the cause, didn’t they. I prefer to recognise what MON saw in him. And, so far as Wimmer and Imbula: where do we start on them!!! |
|
.
.
.
.
