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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 10, 2020 8:43:31 GMT
In what way were they not fighting for the cause - Etebo's always given everything when he's played? He was apparently furious at not being given the chance to play? What are you talking about? He won't be getting any more money at Getafe than he will here, so how is he a mercenary? Do you think any of our players would turn down a Europa League club in a top league if they came in for them this window? Even Saint Joe? “In what way were they not fighting for the cause” (Wimmer, Imbula, Ndiaye, etc.?) - you must be blind. As for Etebo and Ndiaye, they asked for a move! But, of course they really wanted to stay and fight for the cause, didn’t they. I prefer to recognise what MON saw in him. And, so far as Wimmer and Imbula: where do we start on them!!! I wasn't talking about Wimmer and Imbula, but Ndiaye's performances this season were as battling and strong as anyone's. Their performances on the pitch showed plenty of commitment and if you don't think pretty much anyone in the squad would prefer to 'stay and fight' if the chance to leave for brighter things presented itself, I've got some magic beans I'd like to sell you. I presume you'll be giving the same stick to Joe Allen if he ends up at West Ham? You haven't explained how they're mercenaries. |
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Jan 10, 2020 16:04:29 GMT
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Jan 10, 2020 16:15:42 GMT
🤔
The players who’ve gone out on loan made it pretty clear to me that they didn’t see their future at Stoke City," said O'Neill.
“They were pretty direct about that, which they are entitled to do, but equally they are contracted players.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 10, 2020 16:30:32 GMT
🤔 The players who’ve gone out on loan made it pretty clear to me that they didn’t see their future at Stoke City," said O'Neill. “They were pretty direct about that, which they are entitled to do, but equally they are contracted players. I'm putting my fingers in my ears and not listening. They were fully committed to the cause, on the pitch and behind the scenes. They've both been treated appallingly. O'Neil out. Hes got rid of our two best players because prefers cousins. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 10, 2020 16:37:32 GMT
Is it mental to suggest that had they played in those games they were available for before the window then we might actually, you know, have got a fee for them?
They were always likely to be off in January, the issue was getting the most out of them while they were here and getting them in the shop window to maximise our chances of cashing in.
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Post by berahinosgoals on Jan 10, 2020 16:38:02 GMT
So you sell them to give you funds to replace them? Isn't that kind of how it works? Like someone else said the other day, as if etebo couldnt attract cash interest when he has been raved about at international level and by other managers.
Stoke seem content just to get a wage off the book to give room in the wage bill to add. Do they not realise we are going to get jack shit for all these players or are we content to salvage in the free transfer market every season?
They cant fucking moan come summer that we have no funds, we have what must be £50m on loan
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2020 16:41:45 GMT
So why did he undermine himself by not being straight?
It isn't as if he was protecting a large fee by spinning yarns about NDiaye at Cardiff and Etebo and his training habits.
One we only got a 150k loan fee for and the other one god knows. Coming out and saying they didn't want to play for us was hardly going to put off a couple of clubs for loans was it?
All he's done is make himself look stupid and untrustworthy.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jan 10, 2020 16:47:53 GMT
🤔 The players who’ve gone out on loan made it pretty clear to me that they didn’t see their future at Stoke City," said O'Neill. “They were pretty direct about that, which they are entitled to do, but equally they are contracted players. Well that puts the final nail in the coffin of the why oh why doesn't he play N'Diaye and Etebo threads: - O'Neil is trying to build a team spirit that will improve our points tally see us through the season
- Some players have told O'Neil they don't see their future at the club
- Rather than affect team spirit, lose a sizable chunk of the established midfield in January and start again in the team building exercise O'Neil sees as essential to our survival (which is already paying dividends) he drops those players wh don't want to be here
Only a month ago this perfectly reasonable strategy was being portrayed on here as evidence that O'Neil was barmy and out of his depth. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2020 16:49:01 GMT
So why did he undermine himself by not being straight? It isn't as if he was protecting a large fee by spinning yarns about NDiaye at Cardiff and Etebo and his training habits. One we only got a 150k loan fee for and the other one god knows. Coming out and saying they didn't want to play for us was hardly going to put off a couple of clubs for loans was it? All he's done is make himself look stupid and untrustworthy. You don't often hear managers turn around and say that players want to leave a month or two before a window. It doesn't help morale of the team and if he needed to then use them, ie if we had a lot of injuries, they would likely be treated by the fans with hostility. It also puts other clubs in a good bargaining position to buy on the cheap (well they don't want to be there). I feel that N'Diaye will be back in summer as always, but hope Etebo has a really good loan spell and commands a good fee. |
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Jan 10, 2020 16:50:50 GMT
🤔 The players who’ve gone out on loan made it pretty clear to me that they didn’t see their future at Stoke City," said O'Neill. “They were pretty direct about that, which they are entitled to do, but equally they are contracted players. Well that puts the final nail in the coffin of the why oh why doesn't he play N'Diaye and Etebo threads: - O'Neil is trying to build a team spirit that will improve our points tally see us through the season
- Some players have told O'Neil they don't see their future at the club
- Rather than affect team spirit, lose a sizable chunk of the established midfield in January and start again in the team building exercise O'Neil sees as essential to our survival (which is already paying dividends) he drops those players wh don't want to be here
Only a month ago this perfectly reasonable strategy was being portrayed on here as evidence that O'Neil was barmy and out of his depth. I agree with that but I suppose a lot of fans will only agree if we manage to stay up |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2020 16:51:13 GMT
Is it mental to suggest that had they played in those games they were available for before the window then we might actually, you know, have got a fee for them? They were always likely to be off in January, the issue was getting the most out of them while they were here and getting them in the shop window to maximise our chances of cashing in. In today's game, its not like they have to play to be recognised. There is little point in playing guys who don't want to be at the team, that sets such a poor example for those who actually are committed to playing for Stoke and if you get rid of them, then you still have to rebuild with the weaker players anyways. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 10, 2020 16:57:42 GMT
Is it mental to suggest that had they played in those games they were available for before the window then we might actually, you know, have got a fee for them? They were always likely to be off in January, the issue was getting the most out of them while they were here and getting them in the shop window to maximise our chances of cashing in. In today's game, its not like they have to play to be recognised. There is little point in playing guys who don't want to be at the team, that sets such a poor example for those who actually are committed to playing for Stoke and if you get rid of them, then you still have to rebuild with the weaker players anyways. Again though, their performances were committed? They weren't phoning it in? And there's a difference between being recognised and maximising a player's value. Who do you think's worth more, a player bang in form and playing every week or a player ostracised for mysterious reasons? |
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 10, 2020 17:10:28 GMT
Is it mental to suggest that had they played in those games they were available for before the window then we might actually, you know, have got a fee for them? They were always likely to be off in January, the issue was getting the most out of them while they were here and getting them in the shop window to maximise our chances of cashing in. Clearly and forcefully they suggested they didn't want to stay so you can hardly blame a new manager, desperately needing wins to get us off the bottom of the table, for not risking playing 2 players who couldn't really give a shit whether they won or lost and who would play only for themselves. We didn't, and still don't, have the wiggle room to be a shop window for players who want out. If they weren't prepared to commit to what the manager wanted them to do, the manager was right to leave them out and to move them on at first opportunity available to him. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2020 17:12:28 GMT
So why did he undermine himself by not being straight? It isn't as if he was protecting a large fee by spinning yarns about NDiaye at Cardiff and Etebo and his training habits. One we only got a 150k loan fee for and the other one god knows. Coming out and saying they didn't want to play for us was hardly going to put off a couple of clubs for loans was it? All he's done is make himself look stupid and untrustworthy. I don’t think he’s undermined himself, nor made himself look stupid or untrustworthy. That’s just massively over egging it..... |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2020 17:13:40 GMT
🤔 The players who’ve gone out on loan made it pretty clear to me that they didn’t see their future at Stoke City," said O'Neill. “They were pretty direct about that, which they are entitled to do, but equally they are contracted players. Well that puts the final nail in the coffin of the why oh why doesn't he play N'Diaye and Etebo threads: - O'Neil is trying to build a team spirit that will improve our points tally see us through the season
- Some players have told O'Neil they don't see their future at the club
- Rather than affect team spirit, lose a sizable chunk of the established midfield in January and start again in the team building exercise O'Neil sees as essential to our survival (which is already paying dividends) he drops those players wh don't want to be here
Only a month ago this perfectly reasonable strategy was being portrayed on here as evidence that O'Neil was barmy and out of his depth. Sounds like a reasonable summary to me..... |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 10, 2020 17:19:37 GMT
Is it mental to suggest that had they played in those games they were available for before the window then we might actually, you know, have got a fee for them? They were always likely to be off in January, the issue was getting the most out of them while they were here and getting them in the shop window to maximise our chances of cashing in. Clearly and forcefully they suggested they didn't want to stay so you can hardly blame a new manager, desperately needing wins to get us off the bottom of the table, for not risking playing 2 players who couldn't really give a shit whether they won or lost and who would play only for themselves. We didn't, and still don't, have the wiggle room to be a shop window for players who want out. If they weren't prepared to commit to what the manager wanted them to do, the manager was right to leave them out and to move them on at first opportunity available to him. That first sentence is a huge leap and denigration of them though isn't it? If they didn't give a shit why was Etebo so angry about not playing? I don't understand the 'we don't have the wiggle room' sentence. If they're in the shop window then supposedly they're playing for a move which means they're giving everything to secure that? It's short termist but that's where we are. Are we saying that everyone not loaned out wants to stay? I look forward to Mr Allen and Mr Butland pumping their fists, kissing the badges and waving away any Premier League bids should serious offers materialise if that's the case? Just because you want to leave doesn't mean you won't try while you're here. It's academic now because they've gone. |
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 10, 2020 17:29:44 GMT
Clearly and forcefully they suggested they didn't want to stay so you can hardly blame a new manager, desperately needing wins to get us off the bottom of the table, for not risking playing 2 players who couldn't really give a shit whether they won or lost and who would play only for themselves. We didn't, and still don't, have the wiggle room to be a shop window for players who want out. If they weren't prepared to commit to what the manager wanted them to do, the manager was right to leave them out and to move them on at first opportunity available to him. That first sentence is a huge leap and denigration of them though isn't it? If they didn't give a shit why was Etebo so angry about not playing? I don't understand the 'we don't have the wiggle room' sentence. If they're in the shop window then supposedly they're playing for a move which means they're giving everything to secure that? It's short termist but that's where we are. Are we saying that everyone not loaned out wants to stay? I look forward to Mr Allen and Mr Butland pumping their fists, kissing the badges and waving away any Premier League bids should serious offers materialise if that's the case? Just because you want to leave doesn't mean you won't try while you're here. It's academic now because they've gone. I've watched a team recently fighting not to lose. The team I was watching, with the 2 dear departed friends playing, played like they accepted defeat. It is academic though as you say. Let's hope more follow them out of the door. If it enrages you and Bayern I'm all for it  |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 10, 2020 18:17:33 GMT
That first sentence is a huge leap and denigration of them though isn't it? If they didn't give a shit why was Etebo so angry about not playing? I don't understand the 'we don't have the wiggle room' sentence. If they're in the shop window then supposedly they're playing for a move which means they're giving everything to secure that? It's short termist but that's where we are. Are we saying that everyone not loaned out wants to stay? I look forward to Mr Allen and Mr Butland pumping their fists, kissing the badges and waving away any Premier League bids should serious offers materialise if that's the case? Just because you want to leave doesn't mean you won't try while you're here. It's academic now because they've gone. I've watched a team recently fighting not to lose. The team I was watching, with the 2 dear departed friends playing, played like they accepted defeat. It is academic though as you say. Let's hope more follow them out of the door. If it enrages you and Bayern I'm all for it I’m not enraged at them leaving, I just think the Orwellian Groupthink that we all have to hate them now is a bit weird. |
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Post by Caerwrangonpotter on Jan 10, 2020 18:24:03 GMT
More pissed off in all honesty that the current South West Supporters player of the season is now on loan to Getafe!  Livid....absolute livid  |
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Post by Pugsley on Jan 10, 2020 18:31:12 GMT
Is it mental to suggest that had they played in those games they were available for before the window then we might actually, you know, have got a fee for them? They were always likely to be off in January, the issue was getting the most out of them while they were here and getting them in the shop window to maximise our chances of cashing in. You'll make up any old shit to convince yourself these pair should be part of Stoke City. We couldn't even sell N'Diaye when he was playing regularly for us in the PL. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 10, 2020 18:38:11 GMT
Is it mental to suggest that had they played in those games they were available for before the window then we might actually, you know, have got a fee for them? They were always likely to be off in January, the issue was getting the most out of them while they were here and getting them in the shop window to maximise our chances of cashing in. You'll make up any old shit to convince yourself these pair should be part of Stoke City. We couldn't even sell N'Diaye when he was playing regularly for us in the PL. That’s been my argument from the beginning, and you’re brilliant at saying something’s ‘made up shit’ and altogether worse at articulating why. Ndiaye wasn’t for sale when we were in the PL was he? He only signed that January. The only player we could sell after relegation was Shaqiri wasn’t it? |
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Post by theoptimist on Jan 10, 2020 18:41:09 GMT
Good to see how well run clubs get their players in to make impact immediately, glad Stoke could help them ....... meanwhile we have to wait to fight over the scraps at 10:59 on Jan 31.
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Post by Pugsley on Jan 10, 2020 18:42:05 GMT
You'll make up any old shit to convince yourself these pair should be part of Stoke City. We couldn't even sell N'Diaye when he was playing regularly for us in the PL. That’s been my argument from the beginning, and you’re brilliant at saying something’s ‘made up shit’ and altogether worse at articulating why. Ndiaye wasn’t for sale when we were in the PL was he? He only signed that January. The only player we could sell after relegation was Shaqiri wasn’t it? You saying would not have sold him after we were relegated? Every player is for sale. He made it clear he wanted away. The best we can do with these pair is loan them out. Says it all. I'd love to know when they actually told O'Neil when they wanted to go. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 10, 2020 18:49:34 GMT
That’s been my argument from the beginning, and you’re brilliant at saying something’s ‘made up shit’ and altogether worse at articulating why. Ndiaye wasn’t for sale when we were in the PL was he? He only signed that January. The only player we could sell after relegation was Shaqiri wasn’t it? You saying would not have sold him after we were relegated? Every player is for sale. He made it clear he wanted away. The best we can do with these pair is loan them out. Says it all. I'd love to know when they actually told O'Neil when they wanted to go. No, I’m saying we couldn’t sell anyone after relegation bar Shaqiri, even your mate Butland. |
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Post by Pugsley on Jan 10, 2020 18:52:03 GMT
You saying would not have sold him after we were relegated? Every player is for sale. He made it clear he wanted away. The best we can do with these pair is loan them out. Says it all. I'd love to know when they actually told O'Neil when they wanted to go. No, I’m saying we couldn’t sell anyone after relegation bar Shaqiri, even your mate Butland. Fair enough. Just glad that the manager has confirmed what most people suspected. |
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 10, 2020 18:53:11 GMT
I've watched a team recently fighting not to lose. The team I was watching, with the 2 dear departed friends playing, played like they accepted defeat. It is academic though as you say. Let's hope more follow them out of the door. If it enrages you and Bayern I'm all for it I’m not enraged at them leaving, I just think the Orwellian Groupthink that we all have to hate them now is a bit weird. I dont hate either of them. I'm disappointed in etebo more than anything. Badou, it was absolutely not a surprise. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Jan 10, 2020 18:53:44 GMT
No, I’m saying we couldn’t sell anyone after relegation bar Shaqiri, even your mate Butland. Fair enough. Just glad that the manager has confirmed what most people suspected. I don’t think anyone disputed they could be off did they? You’ll struggle to find a player in the squad who doesn’t fancy a move. |
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Post by Pugsley on Jan 10, 2020 18:55:33 GMT
Fair enough. Just glad that the manager has confirmed what most people suspected. I don’t think anyone disputed they could be off did they? You’ll struggle to find a player in the squad who doesn’t fancy a move. That's not what I meant and you know it. |
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Post by ParaPsych on Jan 10, 2020 18:55:38 GMT
Is it ok to not really think the players are cunts, but also think the manager has got this one spot on?
An existing manager may well carry on playing them for continuity, but a new manager needs to look to build a team he thinks he can continue with and work out what is best going forward. Why would you even bother wasting time for a few games?
Sure you might continue to play someone who is absolutely brilliant, but neither of them are quite that, even if I did really rate them both.
Sure it's possible other players may go too, but he obviously felt it was nailed on for these two.
I suspect the two deals were long in the pipeline anyway, these things don't just happen in the space of a couple of weeks.
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Post by zerps on Jan 10, 2020 19:00:49 GMT
He’ll want to come back when we get promoted in May,
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