|
Post by neoisd1 on Apr 2, 2018 10:24:45 GMT
Hold on. When were we relegated? I know it's looking bleak but Jesus. It's a problem with most of our support, doom and gloom. It's indicative of the area as a whole to be honest. Having read through some of the threads on here it has reminded why I rarely visit this site any more.
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 2, 2018 10:26:30 GMT
Hold on. When were we relegated? I know it's looking bleak but Jesus. It's a problem with most of our support, doom and gloom. It's indicative of the area as a whole to be honest. Having read through some of the threads on here it has reminded why I rarely visit this site any more. It’s realism based on what we’ve seen all season and what the table says. What cause is there for optimism?
|
|
|
Post by str8outtahampton on Apr 2, 2018 10:26:53 GMT
Probably about 1%. The reasons why we are relegated is as follows: Ridiculous transfer market decisions ie Wimmer Berahino Ridiculous tactics throughout the season. Diouf at RB, Johnson as wing back, Berahino being given a squad number The board hesitating to fire Hughes at a time when decent managers were available Losing the the likes of Arnautovic, Nzonzi, Whelan, Walters and not replacing them adequately The club being ran too much like a business and not enough like a football club Lack of investment in the first team squad And various other reasons. To blame refs is ridiculous It certainly is. In addition to all the above, you would need to factor in whether decisions - over an entire season - had gone against us any more substantially than other clubs. Not impossible but I would say unlikely. People tend to forget the calls that go their way. But much more significant is the fact that even suggesting that decisions have contributed to our position plays into the hands of those responsible for a cock up of biblical proportions - and offers them a hiding place. Just look at goal difference if you need to identify the reason for our decline. The answer to the question "What's the fuss all about?" was surely: "It's about the fact that the team cannot score enough goals and in particular concedes far too many - even with an international goalkeeper".
|
|
|
Post by trickydicky73 on Apr 2, 2018 10:30:13 GMT
A bit. They fucked us against Liverpool, Everton and Arsenal for a start. Charlie Adam fucked us against Everton. You missed out WHU. I think we'd be 3 points better off with good officiating. We'd be 6 points better off if we'd played a serious professional footballer when Adam has been in the team. I was referring to the offside against Everton.
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Apr 2, 2018 10:31:42 GMT
Not at all. I can think of a few examples where desicions went for us. Arguably the goal v Arsenal was marginally offside. Ryan gave away a pen at Brighton that wasnt given. I think the dive by WHU at home and the Mignolet desicions were worst against us. A good enough team and manager gets over those. There are a series of HUGE decisions that have conspired against us in key games and to ignore that is pure folly and they've invariably come after a huge moment at the other end moments before. We should have had 2 pens v bournemouth minutes before they got theirs. Ryan hits the post seconds before lanzini dives. Shaq hits the post moments before pawson invents a penalty for arsenal. Mignolet should have walked when we were actually playing wellin the game. We are a bad combination of crap and desperately unlucky.
|
|
|
Post by andystokey on Apr 2, 2018 10:38:39 GMT
Not at all. I can think of a few examples where desicions went for us. Arguably the goal v Arsenal was marginally offside. Ryan gave away a pen at Brighton that wasnt given. I think the dive by WHU at home and the Mignolet desicions were worst against us. A good enough team and manager gets over those. There are a series of HUGE decisions that have conspired against us in key games and to ignore that is pure folly and they've invariably come after a huge moment at the other end moments before. We should have had 2 pens v bournemouth minutes before they got theirs. Ryan hits the post seconds before lanzini dives. Shaq hits the post moments before pawson invents a penalty for arsenal. Mignolet should have walked when we were actually playing wellin the game. We are a bad combination of crap and desperately unlucky. I'm not ignoring them but the quotes are a bit one sided. Diouf probably should have gone off before his injury the other week for his stupid stamp.
|
|
|
Post by roylandstoke on Apr 2, 2018 10:44:27 GMT
Charlie Adam fucked us against Everton. You missed out WHU. I think we'd be 3 points better off with good officiating. We'd be 6 points better off if we'd played a serious professional footballer when Adam has been in the team. I was referring to the offside against Everton. You're quite right. In effect we were done from both ends.
|
|
|
Post by Gunslinger on Apr 2, 2018 10:58:10 GMT
I don't think the refs are corrupt in the sense of "brown envelope corruption", but the bias many of them have towards the top clubs is frightening.
|
|
|
Post by scarlet on Apr 2, 2018 11:00:45 GMT
The job of the referee is to apply the laws of the game. There will always be genuine mistakes made, what bothers me more is when they refuse to apply the laws. Pawson could not see the incident yesterday so should not have made any decision at all. Against Liverpool Atkinson took it upon himself to ignore the laws of the game by not sending off Mignolet, and you could argue the ref at Palace on Saturday did the same by not sending off Mane for deliberate handball. Without wishing to sound paranoid it seems to usually involve benefitting a bigger club when the refs choose to ignore their responsibility of applying the rules of the game.
|
|
|
Post by metalhead on Apr 2, 2018 11:04:14 GMT
Evasive as fuck, aren't you? Far from it. It's quite obvious what the reply means. So you don't think they've contributed at all....
|
|
|
Post by metalhead on Apr 2, 2018 11:04:54 GMT
Hold on. When were we relegated? I know it's looking bleak but Jesus. It's a problem with most of our support, doom and gloom. It's indicative of the area as a whole to be honest. Having read through some of the threads on here it has reminded why I rarely visit this site any more. It’s realism based on what we’ve seen all season and what the table says. What cause is there for optimism? Like you said, it's about being realistic.
|
|
|
Post by metalhead on Apr 2, 2018 11:06:36 GMT
Why has my thread been merged with this conspiracy bollocks?
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Apr 2, 2018 11:14:29 GMT
Far from it. It's quite obvious what the reply means. So you don't think they've contributed at all.... Not more than they have in any other season. Therefore it's a pointless point.
|
|
|
Post by potterpaul on Apr 2, 2018 11:29:06 GMT
Why has my thread been merged with this conspiracy bollocks? Because when they attach the Anchor both will quietly disappear into the Abyss where they belong
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 2, 2018 11:59:49 GMT
Far from it. It's quite obvious what the reply means. So you don't think they've contributed at all.... What's your opinion, out of interest? We get no more shafted by decisions than other middling Prem teams IMO. It happens to us every season. We haven't been in a relegation battle every season. That would suggest it hasn't been an enormous factor, no?
|
|
|
Post by metalhead on Apr 2, 2018 16:32:01 GMT
So you don't think they've contributed at all.... What's your opinion, out of interest? We get no more shafted by decisions than other middling Prem teams IMO. It happens to us every season. We haven't been in a relegation battle every season. That would suggest it hasn't been an enormous factor, no? I would say it's contributed a bit. Very few decisions have gone our way and when you're down on luck, you need them going your way
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 2, 2018 17:19:34 GMT
What's your opinion, out of interest? We get no more shafted by decisions than other middling Prem teams IMO. It happens to us every season. We haven't been in a relegation battle every season. That would suggest it hasn't been an enormous factor, no? I would say it's contributed a bit. Very few decisions have gone our way and when you're down on luck, you need them going your way Very few? Really? It’s not stuck out to me more than other seasons really. We’ve got away with a few as well.
|
|
|
Post by terryconroyslegs on Apr 2, 2018 17:49:19 GMT
The Refs.are corrupt,they may not be walking out of grounds with big fat brown envelopes,(although some might be). But they are all biased towards the top clubs,which in a way is corruption. Read more: oatcakefanzine.proboards.com/thread/278197/corruption-allegedly#ixzz5BXRYPeZYQuestion is what are we all going to do about it? Reject League football and support non-league is all I can come up with.
|
|
|
Post by GoBoks on Apr 2, 2018 17:59:50 GMT
Hold on. When were we relegated? I know it's looking bleak but Jesus. It's a problem with most of our support, doom and gloom. It's indicative of the area as a whole to be honest. Having read through some of the threads on here it has reminded why I rarely visit this site any more. Don't you know you're on the wrong board? This is the anti-stoke board.
|
|
|
Post by GoBoks on Apr 2, 2018 18:01:44 GMT
Hold on. When were we relegated? I know it's looking bleak but Jesus. It's a problem with most of our support, doom and gloom. It's indicative of the area as a whole to be honest. Having read through some of the threads on here it has reminded why I rarely visit this site any more. It’s realism based on what we’ve seen all season and what the table says. What cause is there for optimism? If everyone had your attitude in our first season back, we would've asked if we could refuse promotion. As long as there is still a mathematical posibility, there is reason to be optimistic.
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 2, 2018 18:03:29 GMT
It’s realism based on what we’ve seen all season and what the table says. What cause is there for optimism? If everyone had your attitude in our first season back, we would've asked if we could refuse promotion. As long as there is still a mathematical posibility, there is reason to be optimistic. The attitude of realism based on what we’ve seen? Give over. Everyone’s behind the team at the match, what you want is happy clapping on here. This isn’t a place for believing in unicorns.
|
|
|
Post by GoBoks on Apr 2, 2018 18:03:49 GMT
So you don't think they've contributed at all.... Not more than they have in any other season. Therefore it's a pointless point. By definition, a point cannot be pointless!
|
|
|
Post by GoBoks on Apr 2, 2018 18:11:21 GMT
If everyone had your attitude in our first season back, we would've asked if we could refuse promotion. As long as there is still a mathematical posibility, there is reason to be optimistic. The attitude of realism based on what we’ve seen? Give over. Everyone’s behind the team at the match, what you want is happy clapping on here. This isn’t a place for believing in unicorns. Says who. You don't think that the continual spout of negativity doesn't slowly affect your attitude? That if you were a little more positive you'd be behind the team a little more? That you'd be a little less quick to get on the team's back when a mistake is made? That a generally more positive attitude would make the team's job just that fraction easier? I am almost sure that you and I have had this discussion before, but here goes... Me: "If this was the attitude during the war, it would have lasted all of a week and we'd be speaking German". You: "If they had the competence/ability/passion of this team the Battle of Britain would have been over in 5 minutes" Me: "Well if people hadn't kept faith and believed in the impossible, the army would have been lost at Dunkirk" It never ever helps avoid defeat if you just give up. But their are countless tales of how just by keeping on to the end, victory is snatched from the jaws of defeat.
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 2, 2018 18:16:51 GMT
The attitude of realism based on what we’ve seen? Give over. Everyone’s behind the team at the match, what you want is happy clapping on here. This isn’t a place for believing in unicorns. Says who. You don't think that the continual spout of negativity doesn't slowly affect your attitude? That if you were a little more positive you'd be behind the team a little more? That you'd be a little less quick to get on the team's back when a mistake is made? That a generally more positive attitude would make the team's job just that fraction easier? I am almost sure that you and I have had this discussion before, but here goes... Me: "If this was the attitude during the war, it would have lasted all of a week and we'd be speaking German". You: "If they had the competence/ability/passion of this team the Battle of Britain would have been over in 5 minutes" Me: "Well if people hadn't kept faith and believed in the impossible, the army would have been lost at Dunkirk" It never ever helps avoid defeat if you just give up. But their are countless tales of how just by keeping on to the end, victory is snatched from the jaws of defeat. I don’t know what you’re wittering about and an fairly sure we’ve never had any form of bizarre, poorly considered WW2 analogous conversation. Again, at the games everyone is behind the team. On here, we can be honest and discuss what’s actually happening? What’s the problem? I’m positive when there’s a reason to be positive. I’m not Benji. Groundless optimism is as tedious and unhelpful as groundless pessimism. Stoke won’t stay up by people speaking through a flower on here and closing their eyes and wishing really, really hard.
|
|
|
Post by GoBoks on Apr 2, 2018 18:31:57 GMT
Says who. You don't think that the continual spout of negativity doesn't slowly affect your attitude? That if you were a little more positive you'd be behind the team a little more? That you'd be a little less quick to get on the team's back when a mistake is made? That a generally more positive attitude would make the team's job just that fraction easier? I am almost sure that you and I have had this discussion before, but here goes... Me: "If this was the attitude during the war, it would have lasted all of a week and we'd be speaking German". You: "If they had the competence/ability/passion of this team the Battle of Britain would have been over in 5 minutes" Me: "Well if people hadn't kept faith and believed in the impossible, the army would have been lost at Dunkirk" It never ever helps avoid defeat if you just give up. But their are countless tales of how just by keeping on to the end, victory is snatched from the jaws of defeat. I don’t know what you’re wittering about and an fairly sure we’ve never had any form of bizarre, poorly considered WW2 analogous conversation. Again, at the games everyone is behind the team. On here, we can be honest and discuss what’s actually happening? What’s the problem? I’m positive when there’s a reason to be positive. I’m not Benji. Groundless optimism is as tedious and unhelpful as groundless pessimism. Stoke won’t stay up by people speaking through a flower on here and closing their eyes and wishing really, really hard. Perhaps you missed my questions or perhaps you don't want to answer because you know it's true. There are plenty of studies that show if you pretend to be angry (or happy) all the time, it becomes reality. People treat you as if you are angry (or happy). It affects others. By spouting a non-stop negative drivel on here, you are absolutely not helping Stoke to avoid relegation and there is a small possibility that you are actually making the job more difficult. but I guess you don't care about that as long as your opinions are voiced.
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Apr 2, 2018 18:37:29 GMT
I don’t know what you’re wittering about and an fairly sure we’ve never had any form of bizarre, poorly considered WW2 analogous conversation. Again, at the games everyone is behind the team. On here, we can be honest and discuss what’s actually happening? What’s the problem? I’m positive when there’s a reason to be positive. I’m not Benji. Groundless optimism is as tedious and unhelpful as groundless pessimism. Stoke won’t stay up by people speaking through a flower on here and closing their eyes and wishing really, really hard. Perhaps you missed my questions or perhaps you don't want to answer because you know it's true. There are plenty of studies that show if you pretend to be angry (or happy) all the time, it becomes reality. People treat you as if you are angry (or happy). It affects others. By spouting a non-stop negative drivel on here, you are absolutely not helping Stoke to avoid relegation and there is a small possibility that you are actually making the job more difficult. but I guess you don't care about that as long as your opinions are voiced. 'Drivel' is what you're asking for, a misrepresentation of reality. I don't do 'pretending', I'm not nine years old. I'm not being negative for the sake of it - when there's cause to be positive I'm positive. When there isn't, I'm not. I call it as I see it. The whole point of the board is for opinions to be voiced, it beggars belief you're telling people to suppress them. Mindless, baseless happy clapping on here isn't going to make a blind bit of difference to the team one way or another.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2018 18:44:56 GMT
Ref have a good guess/mould the table. Refs have said they decide a plan of action before games. Money orientated. When matches are aired around the world. Then the viewers have to be kept tuned in. Imagine the backlash if he doesn’t give that penalty today, the game finishes 0-0 and it turns out to actually be a penalty. 0-0 bore draw in a prime time Asia showing where Arsenal have a massive interest. It’s absolutely suicidal for the brand value of the Premier League. He’s given that decision because its 0-0 and he’s shat himself with fear of missing a penalty against a big team in a game that isn’t following the narrative. 🎯 👍
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2018 18:45:50 GMT
Arsenal had the upper hand in the game, but we certainly were in it before that ridiculous penalty given by Pawson! I also think Bellerin should have had two yellow cards and Xaka at least one, but no, sometimes I feel the refs have two standards one for the top six and another for the rest. Another 🎯👍
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2018 18:50:07 GMT
I have always sat on the fence with Referees because it is really hard to do. I have respected it. The pressure you are under to make split-second decisions and all that comes with getting it wrong (or even right) is a lot. Today has seen something almighty special happen though. What we have seen is a Premier League appointed official drop his arse out in sheer panic at the thought of upsetting the apple cart. No more, no less. It's like the Zebruder film of Kennedy's assignation: Back and to the left Yeah Oswald was a patsy and so was Indi yesterday God it seems like ages since we had a lucky break
|
|
|
Post by GoBoks on Apr 2, 2018 18:54:02 GMT
Perhaps you missed my questions or perhaps you don't want to answer because you know it's true. There are plenty of studies that show if you pretend to be angry (or happy) all the time, it becomes reality. People treat you as if you are angry (or happy). It affects others. By spouting a non-stop negative drivel on here, you are absolutely not helping Stoke to avoid relegation and there is a small possibility that you are actually making the job more difficult. but I guess you don't care about that as long as your opinions are voiced. 'Drivel' is what you're asking for, a misrepresentation of reality. I don't do 'pretending', I'm not nine years old. I'm not being negative for the sake of it - when there's cause to be positive I'm positive. When there isn't, I'm not. I call it as I see it. The whole point of the board is for opinions to be voiced, it beggars belief you're telling people to suppress them. Mindless, baseless happy clapping on here isn't going to make a blind bit of difference to the team one way or another. I disagree. A toxic (pardon the pun) environment bleeds affects the way people feel and act. Being a constant downer on here will not help the team one iota but may affect peoples attitudes and increase the general feeling of hopelessness. However, being positive for the next 6 games, will certainly not hurt the team one iota and may affect peoples attitudes and decrease the general feeling of hopelessness.
|
|