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Post by wagsastokie on Dec 25, 2018 0:32:05 GMT
What about taking the industrial revolution to the world with great minds and all the inventions it has put forward? we have contributed a lot of positive things in our history. Talking of the industrial revolution and great minds and inventions who would class as the best British engineer? Thomas Newcomen / James watt for there efforts to improve Thomas Savery’s steam pumping engine
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Post by skemstokie on Dec 25, 2018 8:13:06 GMT
Mine is Isambard Kingdom Brunel who for me was the one who managed to merge earlier inventions into a force which pushed our country into a brave new future (and i believe the son of a immigrant) Merry Xmas all.
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Post by Clayton Wood on Dec 25, 2018 9:06:28 GMT
James Brindley, pioneer of the canal system that helped the Potteries flourish. Merry Christmas all (despite Brexit )
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 25, 2018 10:14:45 GMT
Joyeux Noël Frohe Weinachten Feliz Navidad Buon Natale Feliz Natal Vrolijk kerstfeest Crăciun fericit Wesołych świąt Bożego Narodzenia God Jul Veselé Vánoce
Yes - a special Brexit Happx Xmas to all of you!
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Post by xchpotter on Dec 25, 2018 11:45:47 GMT
How about Sir Tim Berners-Lee, the creator of the World Wide Web. Without him we wouldn’t be having the debate about Brexit in this format.
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Post by thevoid on Dec 25, 2018 11:55:52 GMT
I'm assuming that when you emigrated to the States 30 odd years ago you didn't just fly over there, get a job and remain? I'm sure you had to meet a certain criteria to achieve that goal? I'm also sure that now you have been a resident in the States for 30 odd years you would be horrified if the USA suddenly became a 'United States of the Americas' and there was free movement between the South America and North America. American laws then became made in Montevideo. Could you ever seriously see that scenario?? Well as previously stated I left the UK in 89 for a brighter future - 80's Britain for me wasn't as good for me as those who may hold somewhat nostalgic views. It was incredibly difficult to move to the US- legally. And your closing statement is slightly ironic. I live in the United STATES of America - which is basically like the EU where there is local, state and federal law. Even then the founding fathers realized there was no point each colony (now state) trying to go it alone - Brexit style. You left the UK in 1989. So keep your nose out.
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Post by thevoid on Dec 25, 2018 11:56:48 GMT
What put the Great in Britain was to a great part funded by the slave trade gun-boat plundering of wealth and other such crimes we as a country committed,i fear leaving the EU is more likely to take the United out Kingdom . People towing this line seem to forget that a third of slave owners were black and many countries that were 'exploited' for their minerals and natural-resources, despite having vast amounts of them, are much poorer after we left and currently have massive problems with corruption. Africa, for example, has some of the worst poverty and corruption and also some of the most obscene unequal distributions of income of income of wealth on earth..100 years after the British left. But presumably, that's all our fault. Yes, strange how the black slavers tend to get 'white-washed'.
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Post by thevoid on Dec 25, 2018 12:04:14 GMT
It's possible Scotland may vote for independence following Brexit. But don't bet on it. Nicola Sturgeon ain't very confident hence her two year prevarication on Indyref2 as polls up here stubbornly refuse to support independence. So your prognosis about the dissolution of the U.K. seems more hypothetical than probable. Which, I reckon, is as good a definition for what constitutes Project Fear as there is. Think it is more project fact? How can it be fact when it hasn't happened? 😂 Wales voted Leave too. Northern Ireland should unite with Ireland anyway. Should Scotland actually vote for independence in the future (and as partick says there just isn't the clamour up there for another referendum), if you think they'd just join the EU as simple as that then you're incredibly naive I'm afraid. We're leaving. Deal with it.
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Post by skemstokie on Dec 25, 2018 12:15:50 GMT
Think it is more project fact? How can it be fact when it hasn't happened? 😂 Wales voted Leave too. Northern Ireland should unite with Ireland anyway. Should Scotland actually vote for independence in the future (and as partick says there just isn't the clamour up there for another referendum), if you think they'd just join the EU as simple as that then you're incredibly naive I'm afraid. We're leaving. Deal with it. We are still in,so why would the effects to come after leaving be affecting us now? The EU have intimated they would be fine with a Scottish request to join in theory ? Merry Xmas
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Post by harryburrows on Dec 25, 2018 12:39:57 GMT
How can it be fact when it hasn't happened? 😂 Wales voted Leave too. Northern Ireland should unite with Ireland anyway. Should Scotland actually vote for independence in the future (and as partick says there just isn't the clamour up there for another referendum), if you think they'd just join the EU as simple as that then you're incredibly naive I'm afraid. We're leaving. Deal with it. We are still in,so why would the effects to come after leaving be affecting us now? The EU have intimated they would be fine with a Scottish request to join in theory ? Merry Xmas Would the scots be happy to adopt the euro ? This would be a pre requisite
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Post by hoffgreen on Dec 25, 2018 12:55:45 GMT
Not too long ago some European Nations imposed a 'deal' on another European Nation.....
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Post by skemstokie on Dec 25, 2018 13:11:34 GMT
We are still in,so why would the effects to come after leaving be affecting us now? The EU have intimated they would be fine with a Scottish request to join in theory ? Merry Xmas Would the scots be happy to adopt the euro ? This would be a pre requisite They did not want our £
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Post by harryburrows on Dec 25, 2018 14:10:18 GMT
Would the scots be happy to adopt the euro ? This would be a pre requisite They did not want our £ They do but the government said previously that they won't let them
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Post by thevoid on Dec 25, 2018 16:02:06 GMT
How can it be fact when it hasn't happened? 😂 Wales voted Leave too. Northern Ireland should unite with Ireland anyway. Should Scotland actually vote for independence in the future (and as partick says there just isn't the clamour up there for another referendum), if you think they'd just join the EU as simple as that then you're incredibly naive I'm afraid. We're leaving. Deal with it. We are still in,so why would the effects to come after leaving be affecting us now? The EU have intimated they would be fine with a Scottish request to join in theory ? Merry Xmas Certain countries might hint at that to destabilise the UK but we'll see whether they'd be so willing to do so when push comes to shove. Especially given the seperatist movements in Spain, Italy, Belgium etc- I don't think they'd want to encourage them. Merry Xmas.
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 25, 2018 17:17:56 GMT
So the country should pay £384m a week just on the off chance you fancy working in the EU at some point in the future !?!? Any misery on eu nationals is down to the eu at least twice may offered to agree their rights to stay and the eu was more worried on their money. I see no reason anyone living here and contributing should not be able to stay as long as they want. no idea where that # comes from or care tbh ... you voted out - own it. I honestly have no idea WTF you are on about but happy xmas anyway.
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 26, 2018 7:56:11 GMT
Would the scots be happy to adopt the euro ? This would be a pre requisite They did not want our £ They didn't know what they wanted for a currency at the time of the referendum. It was a huge problem for them. In fairness, the SNP did have a clear policy for a long time; to join the Euro. Unfortunately for them the referendum happened at a very bad time for the Euro (with e Greek financial crisis in full swing) so they dropped that idea. The problem was they had no plan B. Which was painfully (for them) apparent during that referendum.
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Post by wagsastokie on Dec 26, 2018 8:28:52 GMT
They didn't know what they wanted for a currency at the time of the referendum. It was a huge problem for them. In fairness, the SNP did have a clear policy for a long time; to join the Euro. Unfortunately for them the referendum happened at a very bad time for the Euro (with e Greek financial crisis in full swing) so they dropped that idea. The problem was they had no plan B. Which was painfully (for them) apparent during that referendum. If we actually leave in March I can only see that it strengthens the union And starts the terminal decline of the SNP I haven’t spoken to all my relatives but there is no way they would wish a hard boarder between Scotland and England and have to change there currency to shop across the boarder ect Which is why the snp are so rabidly remain they know if we actually leave it offers no sensible ideas for a viable independent Scotland
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Post by lordb on Dec 26, 2018 10:08:00 GMT
They didn't know what they wanted for a currency at the time of the referendum. It was a huge problem for them. In fairness, the SNP did have a clear policy for a long time; to join the Euro. Unfortunately for them the referendum happened at a very bad time for the Euro (with e Greek financial crisis in full swing) so they dropped that idea. The problem was they had no plan B. Which was painfully (for them) apparent during that referendum. If we actually leave in March I can only see that it strengthens the union And starts the terminal decline of the SNP I haven’t spoken to all my relatives but there is no way they would wish a hard boarder between Scotland and England and have to change there currency to shop across the boarder ect Which is why the snp are so rabidly remain they know if we actually leave it offers no sensible ideas for a viable independent Scotland A hard border would be a high probability in this scenario.
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Post by harryburrows on Dec 26, 2018 10:29:37 GMT
If we actually leave in March I can only see that it strengthens the union And starts the terminal decline of the SNP I haven’t spoken to all my relatives but there is no way they would wish a hard boarder between Scotland and England and have to change there currency to shop across the boarder ect Which is why the snp are so rabidly remain they know if we actually leave it offers no sensible ideas for a viable independent Scotland A hard border would be a high probability in this scenario. Rebuild the wall and make the scots pay for it
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Dec 26, 2018 11:32:42 GMT
Unbelievable and disgraceful statement by a member of the UK parliament. This man represents the UK.
" come to heel" = If a person or organization comes to heel, they agree to obey, usually because they have been forcefully persuaded to do so. Oxford English dictionary.
Churchill was far from perfect, but I would have liked to have seen his reaction to Kerr saying this.... particularly during the war.
Previous quotes of Kerr; Speaking at an event organised by the Institute for Government, Lord Kerr said: "In my view, immigration is the thing that keeps this country running. We native Brits are so bloody stupid that we need an injection of intelligent people, young people from outside who come in and wake us up from time to time."
kerr was the man who actually drafted Article 50 ( with Gisela Stuart) whilst the UK representative to the EU.
The House of Lords needs abolishing.
This , to me, simply adds to the number who want Brexit.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2018 11:49:17 GMT
Yet another totally misleading anti-Brexit headline not supported by the actual article. www.aol.co.uk/news/2018/12/25/brexit-woes-to-see-france-a-leapfrog-uk/linkThe article opens with "France will overtake the United Kingdom to become the world's sixth biggest economy next year as the impact of Brexit bites, a reports has said." However the article goes on to say "However, the CEBR's World Economic League Table report says post-Brexit Britain will return to the sixth spot by 2020 – a position it is expected to retain through to 2033. The forecast also suggests that even if Britain's departure from the European Union leads to the secession of Scotland and Northern Ireland, the rest of the UK is forecast to be a larger economy than France by 2026." Project Fear alive and well !
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Dec 26, 2018 13:01:52 GMT
One of my favourite set of facts...
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Post by neworleanstokie on Dec 26, 2018 15:47:15 GMT
Well as previously stated I left the UK in 89 for a brighter future - 80's Britain for me wasn't as good for me as those who may hold somewhat nostalgic views. It was incredibly difficult to move to the US- legally. And your closing statement is slightly ironic. I live in the United STATES of America - which is basically like the EU where there is local, state and federal law. Even then the founding fathers realized there was no point each colony (now state) trying to go it alone - Brexit style. I actually said 'The United States of Americas', the clue being in the plural of America. The USA, Uraguay, Venezuela, Costa Rica, Mexico etc etc all being in a single market and custom union, all geared to ever closer political union with the Americas. Would you be happy with that as a resident of the USA? Mate you’re missing the point... the USA is ALREADY a Union of States.. the equivalent of Brexit here was the Civil War
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Dec 26, 2018 16:40:33 GMT
Well as previously stated I left the UK in 89 for a brighter future - 80's Britain for me wasn't as good for me as those who may hold somewhat nostalgic views. It was incredibly difficult to move to the US- legally. And your closing statement is slightly ironic. I live in the United STATES of America - which is basically like the EU where there is local, state and federal law. Even then the founding fathers realized there was no point each colony (now state) trying to go it alone - Brexit style. I actually said 'The United States of Americas', the clue being in the plural of America. The USA, Uraguay, Venezuela, Costa Rica, Mexico etc etc all being in a single market and custom union, all geared to ever closer political union with the Americas. Would you be happy with that as a resident of the USA? Try again 🤔😏
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Post by prettything on Dec 26, 2018 20:12:11 GMT
One of my favourite set of facts... What about the UK? Sir, Boris Johnson recently asserted that the “EU is a graveyard of low growth”. This claim merits proper examination to determine, precisely, how the UK, US, Germany and France have done since 1973, the year in which the UK joined the EU. Per capita GDP of the UK economy grew by 103%, exceeding the 97% growth of the US. Within the EU, the UK edged out Germany (99%) and clobbered France (74%). The UK’s growth has exceeded the US while tracking it, even since the crisis of 2008. This makes it hard to argue that the EU is dragging the UK down. Alternatively, compare this to the UK’s performance during the “glory days” of the Empire from 1872 to 1914. Back then Britain’s per capita growth was only 0.9% per year, in contrast to its robust 2.1% since joining the EU. An important bonus is that the benefits of growth in Britain have been divided much more fairly than in the US. Statistics compiled by the Institute for New Economic Thinking show that Since 1974, median income in the UK grew by 79%, in contrast to 16% for the US. Thus, Britain has had the best of both worlds while a member of the EU -- not just strong growth, but more equal growth. As the UK economy has grown, it has become more dependent on trade. Since 1973 the ratio of trade to economic output increased from 48% to 67%. At present 45% of the UK’s exports go to other EU member countries. In response to the concern that the EU might impose high tariffs or punitive measures if the UK leaves, some Brexiteers have said that we can “just trade with Australia and Canada”. These two countries, however, only account for a meagre 2.9% of British exports.
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Post by prettything on Dec 26, 2018 20:15:16 GMT
FYI
In a letter to The Times INET Oxford researchers Professor Sir David Hendry, Professor Doyne Farmer, and Dr Max Roser look at how the UK economy has performed since joining the EU.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Dec 26, 2018 22:08:21 GMT
One of my favourite set of facts... What about the UK? Sir, Boris Johnson recently asserted that the “EU is a graveyard of low growth”. This claim merits proper examination to determine, precisely, how the UK, US, Germany and France have done since 1973, the year in which the UK joined the EU. Per capita GDP of the UK economy grew by 103%, exceeding the 97% growth of the US. Within the EU, the UK edged out Germany (99%) and clobbered France (74%). The UK’s growth has exceeded the US while tracking it, even since the crisis of 2008. This makes it hard to argue that the EU is dragging the UK down. Alternatively, compare this to the UK’s performance during the “glory days” of the Empire from 1872 to 1914. Back then Britain’s per capita growth was only 0.9% per year, in contrast to its robust 2.1% since joining the EU. An important bonus is that the benefits of growth in Britain have been divided much more fairly than in the US. Statistics compiled by the Institute for New Economic Thinking show that Since 1974, median income in the UK grew by 79%, in contrast to 16% for the US. Thus, Britain has had the best of both worlds while a member of the EU -- not just strong growth, but more equal growth. As the UK economy has grown, it has become more dependent on trade. Since 1973 the ratio of trade to economic output increased from 48% to 67%. At present 45% of the UK’s exports go to other EU member countries. In response to the concern that the EU might impose high tariffs or punitive measures if the UK leaves, some Brexiteers have said that we can “just trade with Australia and Canada”. These two countries, however, only account for a meagre 2.9% of British exports. The UK was 5th in 1973 and 5th now. A little over a decade ago 55% of UK exports went to the EU now it's 44% and the gap is continuing to widen. Also, an amount of that 44% are goods destined for outside the EU anyway and only trans shipped through places like Rotterdam. It's not a case of replacing EU trade with RoW trade it's about doing both. UK-EU trade
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Post by prettything on Dec 26, 2018 22:24:47 GMT
What about the UK? Sir, Boris Johnson recently asserted that the “EU is a graveyard of low growth”. This claim merits proper examination to determine, precisely, how the UK, US, Germany and France have done since 1973, the year in which the UK joined the EU. Per capita GDP of the UK economy grew by 103%, exceeding the 97% growth of the US. Within the EU, the UK edged out Germany (99%) and clobbered France (74%). The UK’s growth has exceeded the US while tracking it, even since the crisis of 2008. This makes it hard to argue that the EU is dragging the UK down. Alternatively, compare this to the UK’s performance during the “glory days” of the Empire from 1872 to 1914. Back then Britain’s per capita growth was only 0.9% per year, in contrast to its robust 2.1% since joining the EU. An important bonus is that the benefits of growth in Britain have been divided much more fairly than in the US. Statistics compiled by the Institute for New Economic Thinking show that Since 1974, median income in the UK grew by 79%, in contrast to 16% for the US. Thus, Britain has had the best of both worlds while a member of the EU -- not just strong growth, but more equal growth. As the UK economy has grown, it has become more dependent on trade. Since 1973 the ratio of trade to economic output increased from 48% to 67%. At present 45% of the UK’s exports go to other EU member countries. In response to the concern that the EU might impose high tariffs or punitive measures if the UK leaves, some Brexiteers have said that we can “just trade with Australia and Canada”. These two countries, however, only account for a meagre 2.9% of British exports. The UK was 5th in 1973 and 5th now. A little over a decade ago 55% of UK exports went to the EU now it's 44% and the gap is continuing to widen. Also, an amount of that 44% are goods destined for outside the EU anyway and only trans shipped through places like Rotterdam. It's not a case of replacing EU trade with RoW trade it's about doing both. UK-EU tradeEven with the 44% figure, the E.U. is clearly our biggest customer. With a no deal, and trading with tariffs, this figure will seriously depreciate. The effects of this will send ripples, even waves, through our economy and on to the working man. Increasing trade with the rest of the world is welcome and looks great on paper. But when you add the culture differences and the simple distance to ship goods from country to country, it becomes a lot less appealing.
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Post by prettything on Dec 26, 2018 22:32:16 GMT
It’s also worth noting that our major industry has shifted a hell of a lot since 73. (The car industry, even our own pottery industry)
We have gone from manufacturing to being one of the world leaders in the service industry. We don’t really make anything anymore, compared to what we used to.
The E.U. has helped smooth this transition.
I
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Post by Kilo on Dec 26, 2018 23:16:50 GMT
It’s also worth noting that our major industry has shifted a hell of a lot since 73. (The car industry, even our own pottery industry) We have gone from manufacturing to being one of the world leaders in the service industry. We don’t really make anything anymore, compared to what we used to. The E.U. has helped smooth this transition. I Absolute rubbish! "We don’t really make anything anymore" - The UK is the World's 8th largest manufacturer.
Try finding out some facts before you churn out your project fear crap.
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