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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2023 18:20:29 GMT
He has got to bin it now
The players don't understand it .
Wilmott kept trying to hit 50 yard balls to Tymon and Hoever and just ignored the midfielders directly in front of him.
I like Wilmott but the system doesn't work for us
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Post by Bojan Mackey on Aug 26, 2023 18:23:39 GMT
I respect that he’s admitted today is on him but if he honestly believed setting up like that against Millwall was the best option then the blokes thick.
If I was Rowett and I saw our formation before kick-off I’d have to excuse myself so I could have a tug because it was an absolute gift for him.
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Back 5
Aug 26, 2023 18:30:22 GMT
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Post by jimmygscfc1234 on Aug 26, 2023 18:30:22 GMT
Sell Tymon is possible and bring in a good left back.
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Post by chopperscfc on Aug 26, 2023 18:32:23 GMT
In all fairness his post match today, he’s the first manager to openly admit he shouldn’t have started with it and then changed it accordingly to 433and he’s learned from it, fair play imo let’s just hope he sticks with it like he says. One thing I’ve noticed with Neil is he seems a bit soft if a team wins a match. He didn’t change it because the same team scraped a win against Watford, I think that’s where the manager rather than the mate brain needs to kick in because that’s not always the best policy. Good teams in this league don’t need to match. They play their way and now we’ve got the squad he needs to play 433 and fear none which he did second half today. Play like that and your not far off the top.
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Back 5
Aug 26, 2023 19:42:51 GMT
Post by dirtygary69 on Aug 26, 2023 19:42:51 GMT
Fucking hate the formation. It takes a very good team to play it well, or a team who are well drilled in it. We aren’t and whenever we play it, you can tell there isn’t any confidence or understanding of it.
Its fine owning up the error, but it really just didn’t need to happen.
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Post by theporcelainpele on Aug 26, 2023 19:53:04 GMT
One thing I’ve noticed with Neil is he seems a bit soft if a team wins a match. He didn’t change it because the same team scraped a win against Watford, I think that’s where the manager rather than the mate brain needs to kick in because that’s not always the best policy. Good teams in this league don’t need to match. They play their way and now we’ve got the squad he needs to play 433 and fear none which he did second half today. Play like that and your not far off the top. Been banging this drum for the past few weeks. I’m sick of watching managers that play a formation to complement what they are supposedly coming up against. Nonsense! A decent team plays its own way throughout and says we are better than you. Simple. Chop and change week in week out and you are only ever ending up mid table, especially when the opposition is a dreadful millwall side.
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Post by karl on Aug 26, 2023 20:10:53 GMT
It was crazy playing a back 5 against Millwall should have been a back 4 from the start.
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Post by numpty40 on Aug 26, 2023 20:19:53 GMT
Must admit I never thought AN would go to a back 5 this season, a bit worrying that he's done it for two games against two poor teams. Even more worrying is the squad he's built seems more suited to a back 5.
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Back 5
Aug 26, 2023 20:35:11 GMT
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Post by willieeetmiout on Aug 26, 2023 20:35:11 GMT
For me hes bought sufficient quality up front to play a 4-2-3-1.
Travers
Hoever (New) McNally (Rose) Wilmot (New) New (Stevens)
Leris (Pearson/Sidibe) Burger (Thompson/Laurent)
Campbell (Chiquino) Mmae (Johnson/Baker) Vidigal (New)
I'd sell Tymon and get rid of Gayle
Wesley (New)
That front 4 are completely interchangeable which is plenty good enough for this League
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Back 5
Aug 26, 2023 20:55:46 GMT
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Post by numpty40 on Aug 26, 2023 20:55:46 GMT
We have a defensive option of Leris, Hoever, McNally, Wilmot, Rose, Stevens and Tymon. That sadly looks like a back 5 to me.
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Post by george2again on Aug 27, 2023 4:18:43 GMT
He’s building a squad to play two systems to suit the opposition in my eyes. Problem is we don’t have the players for a back 5 ( no specialist wing backs and left sided centre half, the players don’t seem to understand the system and clearly the players don’t buy into it. It’s a problem if he persists.
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 6:44:34 GMT
Post by creweoatcake1 on Aug 27, 2023 6:44:34 GMT
One thing I’ve noticed with Neil is he seems a bit soft if a team wins a match. He didn’t change it because the same team scraped a win against Watford, I think that’s where the manager rather than the mate brain needs to kick in because that’s not always the best policy. Good teams in this league don’t need to match. They play their way and now we’ve got the squad he needs to play 433 and fear none which he did second half today. Play like that and your not far off the top. We said exactly that on the way back! We got beaten up at Ipswich and again first half yesterday.. You know exactly what you are up against at places like Millwall! Play to your own strength's and let them worry about us! As the second half proved and they didn't like it .... March in there and play them off the pitch, maybe be arrogant, but so what! I like what I am seeing and with another couple of quality players coming in and a few obvious departures this week. Let's judge at the end of October. KEEP THE FAITH BOYS ... Let's be positive
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Post by theonlooker on Aug 27, 2023 6:52:58 GMT
If he's so desperate for a back three he could make it quite attacking if he wanted to and could make it more solid if he needed to.
McNally Rose Wilmot
Hoever/Leris Pearson Burger New LWB/Stevens
Campbell Wesley/Mmaee/New CF Vidigal
He could play Leris ahead of Hoever to lock it down a bit if needed and Stevens could play as a half left back, half left wing back if he needed to lock down that flank.
It's not what he's specifically recruited for per se, but it is a better halfway house IMO than playing wingers up front in a 532 and the like.
I'd just stick with 433 and be done with it.
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Aug 27, 2023 6:59:12 GMT
A back 5 is only worth wheeling out in games against say Leicester, Southampton, watford, teams that have premier League quality players who will pick us off if we open up.
Millwall away? And a Millwall team bereft of confidence? We handed them the initiative.
Bad bad management
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 7:35:09 GMT
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Post by pavel on Aug 27, 2023 7:35:09 GMT
I don’t think they have specifically bought in players for a back 3, Neil has talked about a mobile and interchangeable front three and he has the players to do that, quite a few options in fact.
I’m convinced that if he plays the right midfield of Pearson, Burger and Johnson/Bae that the midfield will hold its own against most teams, back up is a bit of a problem though.
Unfortunately we don’t have a specialist right full back in Hoever, he’s really got to learn quickly, as he did last year after a shakey start, or we need to bring someone in. Leris did well when he came on and could be the answer. Stevens played well in the second half and proved that he can still get forward with the midfield covering for him. I’m not sure Tymon is cover for Stevens as a full back on his current form and we do need cover.
I hope that some of this will be addressed before the window closes.
It was evident that playing a back 3 just doesn’t work, whether it’s the players or Neil is immaterial, in just turns into a back 5, negates any attacking intent and causes confusion at the back as well as through the rest of them team.
Neil has no excuses now, he’s seen the results and has nowhere to hide if he persists with it. It could be used on certain exceptional occasions but the players must understand it or else we just have a huge disconnect throughout the team.
The second half showed we can more than compete, let’s have more of it.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Aug 27, 2023 7:51:06 GMT
Got away with it v Watford but didn’t yesterday.
It’s a shite, negative, dire system designed to cover inadequacies somewhere in the team.
If he rolls it out again he should be sacked on the spot.
He hasn’t been given carte Blanche to do whatever the hell he wants to take to the pitch with that stupid, shut system.
It was want under Brian little. It was wank under Gudjon. It was wank under O’Neill and it’s wank now.
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 8:00:43 GMT
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Post by upthefud on Aug 27, 2023 8:00:43 GMT
We played an awful 35 minutes in the first half.
Neil stated he didn’t want to chuck all the new players in a 433 at a ground we don’t do well at. He rectified it and we mullered them second half.
I understand we’re unhappy to lose but there’s a massive overreaction going on.
I struggle to blame Neil for the individual performances of Laurent Hoover and Tymon, and respect that he used the break to turn the game on his head.
Yesterday was a much more dramatic performance turnaround than when TP mixed it up at Villa and we nabbed that 2-2 draw. If we rightfully end up 3-1 winners yesterday then we wouldn’t be seeing half the nonsense on here
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Aug 27, 2023 8:01:58 GMT
Got away with it v Watford but didn’t yesterday. It’s a shite, negative, dire system designed to cover inadequacies somewhere in the team. If he rolls it out again he should be sacked on the spot. He hasn’t been given carte Blanche to do whatever the hell he wants to take to the pitch with that stupid, shut system. It was want under Brian little. It was wank under Gudjon. It was wank under O’Neill and it’s wank now. What did we get away with last week?
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Post by davejohnno1 on Aug 27, 2023 8:06:48 GMT
Got away with it v Watford but didn’t yesterday. It’s a shite, negative, dire system designed to cover inadequacies somewhere in the team. If he rolls it out again he should be sacked on the spot. He hasn’t been given carte Blanche to do whatever the hell he wants to take to the pitch with that stupid, shut system. It was want under Brian little. It was wank under Gudjon. It was wank under O’Neill and it’s wank now. What did we get away with last week? Did you think we played well last week? 0-0 would have been the right result. We had one shot at goal. It was a poor game made better by the result.
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 8:08:50 GMT
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Aug 27, 2023 8:08:50 GMT
What did we get away with last week? Did you think we played well last week? 0-0 would have been the right result. We had one shot at goal. It was shite. Yes we were fine in my opinion and he got it spot on against them. We win plenty of games like that in the promotion season
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 8:10:08 GMT
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Post by davejohnno1 on Aug 27, 2023 8:10:08 GMT
Did you think we played well last week? 0-0 would have been the right result. We had one shot at goal. It was shite. Yes we were fine in my opinion and he got it spot on against them. We win plenty of games like that in the promotion season We aren’t going up. Get real. I just want to enjoy watching again. I enjoyed the 2nd half. Watford and the first half yesterday was dull as dishwater
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 8:11:09 GMT
Post by theonlooker on Aug 27, 2023 8:11:09 GMT
Got away with it v Watford but didn’t yesterday. It’s a shite, negative, dire system designed to cover inadequacies somewhere in the team. If he rolls it out again he should be sacked on the spot. He hasn’t been given carte Blanche to do whatever the hell he wants to take to the pitch with that stupid, shut system. It was want under Brian little. It was wank under Gudjon. It was wank under O’Neill and it’s wank now. That first line is so true Dave. Way too many people just looked at the result and not the performance last week. We had two shots on target at home. In open play, with Vidigal pulling naturally wide we only ever had one man in the box (Wesley), two if Johnson could get up to support him, which wasn't very often. Contrast that to the Rotherham game and the second half yesterday, where we were attacking, penned the the opponent in their own half and got loads of bodies in and around the box. If that second half yesterday doesn't tell him something (and I think it will based on his comments after the game) then he wants sectioning.
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 8:13:51 GMT
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Aug 27, 2023 8:13:51 GMT
Yes we were fine in my opinion and he got it spot on against them. We win plenty of games like that in the promotion season We aren’t going up. Get real. I just want to enjoy watching again. I enjoyed the 2nd half. Watford and the first half yesterday was dull as dishwater I never said we were. So you’ve not enjoyed winning football games at home again?I’d say you’re in the minority judging by the crowd reaction at the end of those games.The feel good factor was certainly back for me after the 3 home wins
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 8:13:57 GMT
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Post by TheMmaeestro on Aug 27, 2023 8:13:57 GMT
What infuriates me so much is that he if he wanted to play this formation, why not recruit for it? He’s signed all these attacking minded players and wingers but none of them fit the style.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Aug 27, 2023 9:01:26 GMT
We aren’t going up. Get real. I just want to enjoy watching again. I enjoyed the 2nd half. Watford and the first half yesterday was dull as dishwater I never said we were. So you’ve not enjoyed winning football games at home again?I’d say you’re in the minority judging by the crowd reaction at the end of those games.The feel good factor was certainly back for me after the 3 home wins Of course I’ve enjoyed us winning games. I’ve not particularly enjoyed the pathetic performance at Ipswich followed by that abomination of a 1st half yesterday. Best thing about Watford game was the fact that we didn’t play particularly well, found a bit of magic from Vidigal but they worked their knackers off and fought for everything. A very refreshing change. As a game though, it was a poor spectacle made better by the win. Had we lost it would have been totally different and the manager would have been slaughtered for being as negative as his predecessors
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 9:06:17 GMT
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Aug 27, 2023 9:06:17 GMT
I never said we were. So you’ve not enjoyed winning football games at home again?I’d say you’re in the minority judging by the crowd reaction at the end of those games.The feel good factor was certainly back for me after the 3 home wins Of course I’ve enjoyed us winning games. I’ve not particularly enjoyed the pathetic performance at Ipswich followed by that abomination of a 1st half yesterday. Best thing about Watford game was the fact that we didn’t play particularly well, found a bit of magic from Vidigal but they worked their knackers off and fought for everything. As a game though, it was a poor spectacle made better by the win. Had we lost it would have been totally different and the manager would have been slaughtered for being as negative as his predecessors I would say your description of the Watford win is how most teams win championship games during a 46 game season though. Ipswich was poor for definite and the 1st half yesterday was very poor like you say. Win the 2 games this week and most would say it’s been a decent start before the international break,time will tell on that though
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 9:47:50 GMT
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Post by davejohnno1 on Aug 27, 2023 9:47:50 GMT
Of course I’ve enjoyed us winning games. I’ve not particularly enjoyed the pathetic performance at Ipswich followed by that abomination of a 1st half yesterday. Best thing about Watford game was the fact that we didn’t play particularly well, found a bit of magic from Vidigal but they worked their knackers off and fought for everything. As a game though, it was a poor spectacle made better by the win. Had we lost it would have been totally different and the manager would have been slaughtered for being as negative as his predecessors I would say your description of the Watford win is how most teams win championship games during a 46 game season though. Ipswich was poor for definite and the 1st half yesterday was very poor like you say. Win the 2 games this week and most would say it’s been a decent start before the international break,time will tell on that though It’s been a reasonable start even if we don’t win the next 2. We are clearly going to be better than we were. That’s a good starting point.
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Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Aug 27, 2023 10:12:50 GMT
Good teams in this league don’t need to match. They play their way and now we’ve got the squad he needs to play 433 and fear none which he did second half today. Play like that and your not far off the top. Been banging this drum for the past few weeks. I’m sick of watching managers that play a formation to complement what they are supposedly coming up against. Nonsense! A decent team plays its own way throughout and says we are better than you. Simple. Chop and change week in week out and you are only ever ending up mid table, especially when the opposition is a dreadful millwall side. Exactly, we may lose, obviously we will some, but let's stick to our identity that were supposedly building. I'm sure this talk filters down to the players and gives the shirkers a ready made excuse. We've got one of the highest budgets in the league, recruited some exciting players playing in the top league's in their country, let's start acting like it. Not this plucky little Stoke bollocks!
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 11:38:54 GMT
Post by idle on Aug 27, 2023 11:38:54 GMT
What I don't understand is if he wanted to hoof it like we did in the 1st half yesterday, why did he start with a midfield three? It might have worked if he player a 2 man midfield and a target man and two wingers/inside forwards up front. (Apart from picking Thompson and Hoever and Tymon and Laurent being shite)
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Back 5
Aug 27, 2023 20:30:18 GMT
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Post by riproaringagain on Aug 27, 2023 20:30:18 GMT
Seeing a back 5 at 2pm just gives me ptsd. Pathetic management from any Stoke manager to use it in any game in the last 6 years. In all fairness his post match today, he’s the first manager to openly admit he shouldn’t have started with it and then changed it accordingly to 433and he’s learned from it, fair play imo let’s just hope he sticks with it like he says. His honesty is refreshing, he said the new signings were only in building for a couple of days so didn’t want to risk starting them, then openly said he probably should of, if they bombed out he would of been blasted
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