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Post by reddipotter on Apr 1, 2021 13:13:14 GMT
Realistically football , and our club has a number of issues ..and it’s why they need to get things right Another season of stop , start unclear messaging could see many walk away from the game ( loyal and casual ) some of them potentially for good They have the problem that crowds tend to turn up enmass inside 15 minutes before kick off , their records will give them precise timings at each turnstile , and each supporter at every game ..you can even check your own details They have the problem that fans leave enmass at the end They have the problem that grounds are neither wholly in or out of doors , especially dependant on where you sit in the ground , and have concourses and tight enclosed toilets They have the problem that as many seats as possible are crammed into the smallest possible space They have the problem that concourses often meet only minimal legal safety sizes and often attract uncrolled behaviour They have the problem of inadequate toilet facilities , especially for female supporters , especially at peak times They have the problem that toilet space is often abused for illegal activity ..smoking and drug taking Thry have the problem of catering capacity being too small for demand at peak times All the above and more are of concern to many supporters , but they put up with them in ‘ normal ‘ times .. they may well be less inclined to accept those conditions and the yobbish behaviour of a small minority in the future that further presssures those issues if you think many having seen the behaviour of those in the parks in the last few days , can’t imagine similar chaotic scenes at football on its return , unless reassured and situations now managed when clubs have historically turned a blind eye and waited for the next disaster to happen then I’d think again Football needs to return in 21/22 , but it also needs to show it hasn’t spent the last 18 months with its head up its arse , and instead has been plannng for fans return for that period , not simply at the last minute or waiting to see what minimum conditions government imposes on it ..imposed measures will be because historically they’ve sat idle This is a pretty good summary. Of course, none of it is a problem in COVID terms if everyone entering the ground can show that they have been vaccinated.
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Apr 1, 2021 13:22:57 GMT
The live music industry's reopening plans are entirely based on the complete removal of social distancing restrictions (as reopening with with reduced capacities etc in place is simply not financially viable and will be devastating for many venues). If social distancing restrictions are not mandated by the government for this industry post June 21st then it'd make no sense to impose them on the live sports sector. Indeed, as others have suggested, should individual clubs seek to implement their own restrictions after June 21st 'to make people feel safer' then they'd have to contend with a sizeable portion of their customer base simply staying away as they don't want to be subject to needless restrictions that are not in place in all other aspects of society. Slipknot will just corner the market, their fans have been wearing masks voluntarily for years. 3 year world tour incoming....... Never been that sure about yer football fan's anti mask stance either tbh. Walk past a police van with a camera and a fair few seem to have one to hand.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Apr 1, 2021 13:37:58 GMT
Slipknot will just corner the market, their fans have been wearing masks voluntarily for years. 3 year world tour incoming....... Never been that sure about yer football fan's anti mask stance either tbh. Walk past a police van with a camera and a fair few seem to have one to hand. Millwall's F-Troop were way ahead of their time, I thought they were trying avoid being spotted by the police but turns out they were merely pre-empting a global pandemic.......
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Post by Scouse on Apr 1, 2021 13:38:14 GMT
The not feeling safe aspect is why Liverpool have offered a season ticket holiday to their 2019/20 ST holders without forever losing their seat ..and why I had the question raiised at the recent board event ..the surprised response concerned me a little , given that the event was held after Liverpool’s announcement and would therefore be known by the industry ..suggesting no further work or thought on fans return had taken place since the red/white solution fell ..if nothing else the last 12 months should have shown all businesses that covid requires constant reviewing and flexibility ( including by customers)
Its not an ideal solution, as it may still mean people desperate , but scared to get back are left behind , but it provides a safety net and doesn’t cast them aside totally ..more importantly it acknowledges in real terms there could be some supporters with very genuine concerns , concerns strong enough to mean they’d stop going ..it gives those people some breathing space
People should remember many people won’t have been in groups , crowds for over a year ..the nearest experience I can relate that too is going some Liverpool’s games as they played catch-up after Hillsborough .. stood on the Kop , the nervousness of people approaching their space and the efforts that people made not to encroach was I think similar to how some will react to mass crowds ..it made for uncomfortable viewing
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Post by danceswithclams on Apr 1, 2021 13:54:49 GMT
They could put all the cellar dwellers in one stand, all socially distanced and masked up like gimps (staggered entry too with the first admittance scheduled for 8am). The club could also get the sponsors of the chosen stand to agree to a name change for the duration of the initiative. The Absolute Fanny Stand Sponsored by Tile Mountain might not fit on the name plate though. 😂 Good idea. Perhaps we could put all those oxygen thieves with wheelchairs and crutches with them as well. Fuckers are always getting in my way when I'm making a dash after a game. On a similar note, why should kids pay less than I do for tickets? They're watching the same game and taking up the same amount of space so why is it cheaper for them? Cough up, you fucking workshy short-arse pricks.
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Post by LGH87 on Apr 1, 2021 13:57:38 GMT
Good idea. Perhaps we could put all those oxygen thieves with wheelchairs and crutches with them as well. Fuckers are always getting in my way when I'm making a dash after a game. On a similar note, why should kids pay less than I do for tickets? They're watching the same game and taking up the same amount of space so why is it cheaper for them? Cough up, you fucking workshy short-arse pricks. And why should the OAP's pay less, them old buggers have worked for 40 years more than me, should have plenty more disposable cash the tight owd bastards.
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Apr 1, 2021 14:00:24 GMT
Good idea. Perhaps we could put all those oxygen thieves with wheelchairs and crutches with them as well. Fuckers are always getting in my way when I'm making a dash after a game. On a similar note, why should kids pay less than I do for tickets? They're watching the same game and taking up the same amount of space so why is it cheaper for them? Cough up, you fucking workshy short-arse pricks. You PAY for your ticket??!! Well that's your fault then. Personally I only ever go corporate. The food's far better, you can watch the racing if the game's shit and it's much less likely that someone will piss on you Gucci's. Can't recommend it highly enough😉
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Post by LGH87 on Apr 1, 2021 14:38:23 GMT
For all those nervous folk.
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Post by alsagerstokie on Apr 2, 2021 7:20:27 GMT
Do you know somthing. Stoke City is my team. The joy i get from 3 points is fantastic. I went my first match around 1993. Ive had a season ticket for so long.
I love Golf and im trying to improve all the time. I also am trying to change my career. To work with wildlife. One thing i want to put myself into is some volunteer work. Ideally with the RSPB. I also spend alot of time doing my wildlife photography.
Ive done some thinking which i was doing even before lockdown. Ive had to make the decision for myself. I wont be having another season ticket. This has nothing to do with where we are.
If i want to put my time into other things. Things im desperate to get better at the golf the Photography. Work with helping Animals ling term. Somthing else has to give. Working full time to earn a wage somthing had to give at weekends. Ill miss the mstchday buzz. Talking to people etc. Ill still try get to the odd game. Its a shame but its somthing i had to do really.
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Post by andystokey on Apr 2, 2021 7:56:33 GMT
The not feeling safe aspect is why Liverpool have offered a season ticket holiday to their 2019/20 ST holders without forever losing their seat ..and why I had the question raiised at the recent board event ..the surprised response concerned me a little , given that the event was held after Liverpool’s announcement and would therefore be known by the industry ..suggesting no further work or thought on fans return had taken place since the red/white solution fell ..if nothing else the last 12 months should have shown all businesses that covid requires constant reviewing and flexibility ( including by customers) Its not an ideal solution, as it may still mean people desperate , but scared to get back are left behind , but it provides a safety net and doesn’t cast them aside totally ..more importantly it acknowledges in real terms there could be some supporters with very genuine concerns , concerns strong enough to mean they’d stop going ..it gives those people some breathing space People should remember many people won’t have been in groups , crowds for over a year ..the nearest experience I can relate that too is going some Liverpool’s games as they played catch-up after Hillsborough .. stood on the Kop , the nervousness of people approaching their space and the efforts that people made not to encroach was I think similar to how some will react to mass crowds ..it made for uncomfortable viewing Apart from the not feeling safe, I'd take up the holiday on the basis I don't want a vaccine passport to enter the ground. I doubt if the lower league teams can afford to set aside an empty seat for a year mind you.
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Lard
Academy Starlet
Posts: 151
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Post by Lard on Apr 2, 2021 8:13:22 GMT
The not feeling safe aspect is why Liverpool have offered a season ticket holiday to their 2019/20 ST holders without forever losing their seat ..and why I had the question raiised at the recent board event ..the surprised response concerned me a little , given that the event was held after Liverpool’s announcement and would therefore be known by the industry ..suggesting no further work or thought on fans return had taken place since the red/white solution fell ..if nothing else the last 12 months should have shown all businesses that covid requires constant reviewing and flexibility ( including by customers) Its not an ideal solution, as it may still mean people desperate , but scared to get back are left behind , but it provides a safety net and doesn’t cast them aside totally ..more importantly it acknowledges in real terms there could be some supporters with very genuine concerns , concerns strong enough to mean they’d stop going ..it gives those people some breathing space People should remember many people won’t have been in groups , crowds for over a year ..the nearest experience I can relate that too is going some Liverpool’s games as they played catch-up after Hillsborough .. stood on the Kop , the nervousness of people approaching their space and the efforts that people made not to encroach was I think similar to how some will react to mass crowds ..it made for uncomfortable viewing Apart from the not feeling safe, I'd take up the holiday on the basis I don't want a vaccine passport to enter the ground. I doubt if the lower league teams can afford to set aside an empty seat for a year mind you. They could still sell the seat for that one season, and then give the original season ticket holder first refusal in the following season. New customers buy their seat on that understanding. I feel that the season ticket holiday with your seat reserved is the way to go. That way people won't feel pressured into coming into an environment they are uncomfortable with, to keep a seat they have had for years
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Post by BristolMick on Apr 2, 2021 8:28:37 GMT
Apart from the not feeling safe, I'd take up the holiday on the basis I don't want a vaccine passport to enter the ground. I doubt if the lower league teams can afford to set aside an empty seat for a year mind you. They could still sell the seat for that one season, and then give the original season ticket holder first refusal in the following season. New customers buy their seat on that understanding. I feel that the season ticket holiday with your seat reserved is the way to go. That way people won't feel pressured into coming into an environment they are uncomfortable with, to keep a seat they have had for years Yes, if the club are going to mandate that I have to turn up at a certain time way before kick off and then keep a mask on during the whole of the time I am sat in my seat I would definitely say that’s an ‘environment I feel uncomfortable in’ to use your words and would like to take advantage of the holiday until such time as these restrictions were sacked off! Either way I am not attending if those are the rules and would be unhappy to either pay for my seat if I never used it, or lost it if I didn’t. BM
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Post by westlandstokie on Apr 2, 2021 8:40:09 GMT
Realistically football , and our club has a number of issues ..and it’s why they need to get things right Another season of stop , start unclear messaging could see many walk away from the game ( loyal and casual ) some of them potentially for good They have the problem that crowds tend to turn up enmass inside 15 minutes before kick off , their records will give them precise timings at each turnstile , and each supporter at every game ..you can even check your own details They have the problem that fans leave enmass at the end They have the problem that grounds are neither wholly in or out of doors , especially dependant on where you sit in the ground , and have concourses and tight enclosed toilets They have the problem that as many seats as possible are crammed into the smallest possible space They have the problem that concourses often meet only minimal legal safety sizes and often attract uncrolled behaviour They have the problem of inadequate toilet facilities , especially for female supporters , especially at peak times They have the problem that toilet space is often abused for illegal activity ..smoking and drug taking Thry have the problem of catering capacity being too small for demand at peak times All the above and more are of concern to many supporters , but they put up with them in ‘ normal ‘ times .. they may well be less inclined to accept those conditions and the yobbish behaviour of a small minority in the future that further presssures those issues if you think many having seen the behaviour of those in the parks in the last few days , can’t imagine similar chaotic scenes at football on its return , unless reassured and situations now managed when clubs have historically turned a blind eye and waited for the next disaster to happen then I’d think again Football needs to return in 21/22 , but it also needs to show it hasn’t spent the last 18 months with its head up its arse , and instead has been plannng for fans return for that period , not simply at the last minute or waiting to see what minimum conditions government imposes on it ..imposed measures will be because historically they’ve sat idle This is a pretty good summary. Of course, none of it is a problem in COVID terms if everyone entering the ground can show that they have been vaccinated. How is it not a problem if everyone is vaccinated ? You can still catch and transmit even when vaccinated...the vaccine is brilliant but it ain’t the holy grail. We have to accept that there will be risks going forward but remember that only a very tiny % of people are seriously ill from it. We have to move forward and return to some sort of normality.
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Post by Miles Offside on Apr 2, 2021 12:03:12 GMT
The government's lifting of restrictions is conditional, and with a third wave of covid currently sweeping Europe we can't be certain what the situation will be in August.
If all restrictions are lifted, there will be some who will still not be comfortable returning. Likewise, if the social distancing rule remains (most likely a government/FA decision), the numbers attending are likely to be limited and some just won't want the hassle even if they could go.
So one way of accommodating these different positions - it may be for one season only - would be for clubs to include free streams in the purchase of a season ticket.
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Post by Squeekster on Apr 2, 2021 19:32:28 GMT
The government's lifting of restrictions is conditional, and with a third wave of covid currently sweeping Europe we can't be certain what the situation will be in August. If all restrictions are lifted, there will be some who will still not be comfortable returning. Likewise, if the social distancing rule remains (most likely a government/FA decision), the numbers attending are likely to be limited and some just won't want the hassle even if they could go. So one way of accommodating these different positions - it may be for one season only - would be for clubs to include free streams in the purchase of a season ticket. That it a simple solution do not let anyone in or out of the country Australia and New Zealand have been back to normal for a while simply because they shut up shop!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2021 10:32:02 GMT
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Post by stokeoptimist on Apr 4, 2021 10:38:21 GMT
They can stick their passports up their arsenal. What next weighing in before your allowed in Maccies?
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Post by TinkerT on Apr 4, 2021 10:46:45 GMT
They can stick their passports up their arsenal. What next weighing in before your allowed in Maccies? People will need to accept these will become part of modern day life, the same way flu jab is and vaccine for holidays when going certain places. No one will force people have the vaccine but don't moan about it when you're not allowed to go certain places because you could pass it on to someone else.
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Post by Scrotnig on Apr 4, 2021 11:17:38 GMT
They can stick their passports up their arsenal. What next weighing in before your allowed in Maccies? People will need to accept these will become part of modern day life, the same way flu jab is. No I won’t, and I’ve never had to show proof of a flu vaccine to get into a football match.
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Post by TinkerT on Apr 4, 2021 11:32:01 GMT
People will need to accept these will become part of modern day life, the same way flu jab is. No I won’t, and I’ve never had to show proof of a flu vaccine to get into a football match. Stay at home then pal. I meant about people having the flu vaccine every year and this will be no different
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Post by Scrotnig on Apr 4, 2021 11:36:46 GMT
No I won’t, and I’ve never had to show proof of a flu vaccine to get into a football match. Stay at home then pal. I meant about people having the flu vaccine every year and this will be no different I'm fine with having vaccines, I'm not fine with having to prove that fact in order to live a normal life, nor with informing the government of my every move by "checking in". And no I won't stay at home, I just won't spend my money with any organisation where this becomes necessary. You may be happy surrendering your freedoms, but you have no right to force it on others.
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Post by stokiedan17 on Apr 4, 2021 11:57:08 GMT
Stay at home then pal. I meant about people having the flu vaccine every year and this will be no different I'm fine with having vaccines, I'm not fine with having to prove that fact in order to live a normal life, nor with informing the government of my every move by "checking in". And no I won't stay at home, I just won't spend my money with any organisation where this becomes necessary. You may be happy surrendering your freedoms, but you have no right to force it on others. How is it surrendering your freedoms to have a piece of paper to say I’m not in danger of transmitting a potentially fatal disease ?
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Post by Scrotnig on Apr 4, 2021 14:07:15 GMT
I'm fine with having vaccines, I'm not fine with having to prove that fact in order to live a normal life, nor with informing the government of my every move by "checking in". And no I won't stay at home, I just won't spend my money with any organisation where this becomes necessary. You may be happy surrendering your freedoms, but you have no right to force it on others. How is it surrendering your freedoms to have a piece of paper to say I’m not in danger of transmitting a potentially fatal disease ? “Papers, please”. Not the sort of society I want to live in.
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Post by stokiedan17 on Apr 4, 2021 14:21:23 GMT
How is it surrendering your freedoms to have a piece of paper to say I’m not in danger of transmitting a potentially fatal disease ? “Papers, please”. Not the sort of society I want to live in. How is that any different to being asked for id for purchasing alcohol or an 18 at the cinema ?
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Post by Scouse on Apr 4, 2021 14:30:19 GMT
Freedom , what freedom..From birth certificate , death certificate, marriage certificate , driving license , car tax , car insurance , bus / train pass , passport , clocking on at work , clocking off at work ,paying taxes , school register , true supporter card , bubble matches , kick off dates and times changed .. and a million other things , people jump through hoops from the day they're born and carry on jumping through them until the day they die
The club already know my name , age , address , what games I attend , any I don’t , what time I enter the ground , those and all the above are everyday examples of certification bringing with them Benifits and not ‘conforming’ merely short changes yourself , so if vaccination certification is needed to access football and allows more people to access football than would do otherwise then tbh hey ho
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Post by Scrotnig on Apr 4, 2021 14:30:21 GMT
“Papers, please”. Not the sort of society I want to live in. How is that any different to being asked for id for purchasing alcohol or an 18 at the cinema ? That’s fine if you’re 18. I’m not. If I was repeatedly asked for ID in a pub I wouldn’t go in.
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Post by TinkerT on Apr 4, 2021 14:31:12 GMT
Stay at home then pal. I meant about people having the flu vaccine every year and this will be no different I'm fine with having vaccines, I'm not fine with having to prove that fact in order to live a normal life, nor with informing the government of my every move by "checking in". And no I won't stay at home, I just won't spend my money with any organisation where this becomes necessary. You may be happy surrendering your freedoms, but you have no right to force it on others. Not forcing anything pal just saying its the new normal so don't moan when you have to sit at home because the club won't put other supporters at risk.
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Post by Scrotnig on Apr 4, 2021 14:31:23 GMT
Freedom , what freedom..From birth certificate , death certificate, marriage certificate , driving license , car tax , car insurance , bus / train pass , passport , clocking on at work , clocking off at work ,paying taxes , school register , true supporter card , bubble matches , kick off dates and times changed .. and a million other things , people jump through hoops from the day they're born and carry on jumping through them until the day they die The club already know my name , age , address , what games I attend , any I don’t , what time I enter the ground , those and all the above are everyday examples of certification bringing with them Benifits and not c’ conforming’ short changing merely yourself , so if vaccination certification is needed to access football and allows more people to access football than would do otherwise then tbh hey ho Well I used to go to football and won’t if they bring this in so that’s fewer people not more.
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Post by Scouse on Apr 4, 2021 14:42:56 GMT
Freedom , what freedom..From birth certificate , death certificate, marriage certificate , driving license , car tax , car insurance , bus / train pass , passport , clocking on at work , clocking off at work ,paying taxes , school register , true supporter card , bubble matches , kick off dates and times changed .. and a million other things , people jump through hoops from the day they're born and carry on jumping through them until the day they die The club already know my name , age , address , what games I attend , any I don’t , what time I enter the ground , those and all the above are everyday examples of certification bringing with them Benifits and not c’ conforming’ short changing merely yourself , so if vaccination certification is needed to access football and allows more people to access football than would do otherwise then tbh hey ho Well I used to go to football and won’t if they bring this in so that’s fewer people not more. Nobody wants lock downs going on and on , nobody wants regulation that isn’t needed ..but cutting your nose off to spite your face means youre left outside whilst everyone else is inside watching the game . or we could go down your route , no vaccination certification and 75% of those that want to go can’t because of enforced reduced capacity For the record , I don’t particular want or advocating certification , but if it’s a necessary evil then so be it .. And obviously any certification comes with it difficulties of those not able to be vaccinated
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Post by bingbang on Apr 4, 2021 14:43:21 GMT
Freedom , what freedom..From birth certificate , death certificate, marriage certificate , driving license , car tax , car insurance , bus / train pass , passport , clocking on at work , clocking off at work ,paying taxes , school register , true supporter card , bubble matches , kick off dates and times changed .. and a million other things , people jump through hoops from the day they're born and carry on jumping through them until the day they die The club already know my name , age , address , what games I attend , any I don’t , what time I enter the ground , those and all the above are everyday examples of certification bringing with them Benifits and not c’ conforming’ short changing merely yourself , so if vaccination certification is needed to access football and allows more people to access football than would do otherwise then tbh hey ho Well I used to go to football and won’t if they bring this in so that’s fewer people not more. Don’t understand your logic to be honest. Should we not have driving licences and just let anybody drive, no passports in fact no rules let’s just let the world be Ferrell. It’s called living and trying to keep people safe if you don’t fancy that enjoy your limited life.
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