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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 6, 2021 9:55:32 GMT
Are you Boris in disguise?! 😉 No. The current offering from our government doesn't even scratch the surface...... This Conservative government is going to be in power a long long time. You better get used to it. Zero credible opposition.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 6, 2021 9:57:10 GMT
No. The current offering from our government doesn't even scratch the surface...... This Conservative government is going to be in power a long long time. You better get used to it. Zero credible opposition. That has no relevance to anything being discussed here but ok.......
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 6, 2021 9:59:07 GMT
This Conservative government is going to be in power a long long time. You better get used to it. Zero credible opposition. That has no relevance to anything being discussed here but ok....... You were saying the government is wrong, I was kindly reminding you that they will be here a very long time suggesting the people largely agree with their green proposal ☺️
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 6, 2021 10:02:54 GMT
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 6, 2021 10:04:09 GMT
That has no relevance to anything being discussed here but ok....... You were saying the government is wrong, I was kindly reminding you that they will be here a very long time suggesting the people largely agree with their green proposal ☺️ You think people voted Tory for their green credentials, seriously?
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 6, 2021 10:05:18 GMT
You were saying the government is wrong, I was kindly reminding you that they will be here a very long time suggesting the people largely agree with their green proposal ☺️ You think people voted Tory for their green credentials, seriously? Their green credentials and their compassion!
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Post by franklin on Mar 6, 2021 10:05:53 GMT
I really don't care mate it shows me that despite all this we care shit it boils down to whats in it for me.
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Mar 6, 2021 10:07:38 GMT
Lots of people have worked through this to keep the country going and plenty in reduced wages/income given the current situation its a fair offer which plenty of the others won't even get. Agree. I cannot agree with the OP. Millions of people are facing job losses in the next 6 months. Many hundreds of thousands have already lost their jobs. Livelihoods and lives have been shattered with small business owners struggling to put food on a plate for their families due to these horrifying draconian lockdowns. NHS workers should get a pay rise, but to demand that they get it right now while the country enters its biggest economical crash on record (and threaten strike which completely contradicts the reasoning staff work for the NHS) is beyond disgusting. NHS staff and teachers currently have the most secure line of work in the country and need a bit of a reality check as to what's going on around them. It is their choice to work for the public sector which guarantees more job security but pays lower salaries in the same way its one's choice to work in the private sector, earn well, but risk being out of work whenever we get an economic downturn. I fully appreciate many NHS workers vehemently oppose this vile suggestion of strikes and also recognise that pay rises in the current climate are not appropriate. As with all these things, it's a small, angry minority backed up by the militant left. I now don't know if I agree with myself or not. I am considering my position, dependent on the wisdom of the Oatcake. It is ridiculous to ask for 12% even as an opening bargaining position.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 6, 2021 10:08:38 GMT
You were saying the government is wrong, I was kindly reminding you that they will be here a very long time suggesting the people largely agree with their green proposal ☺️ You think people voted Tory for their green credentials, seriously? Not what I said is it? People voted Tory for a number of reasons, one being the severe lack of any kind of credible opposition. That looks set to remain for years. Boris has been incredibly left of centre on a number of things thus far and many staunch Conservatives aren't big fans. But there's no one close to him at the moment as the polling suggests.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 6, 2021 10:09:19 GMT
Agree. I cannot agree with the OP. Millions of people are facing job losses in the next 6 months. Many hundreds of thousands have already lost their jobs. Livelihoods and lives have been shattered with small business owners struggling to put food on a plate for their families due to these horrifying draconian lockdowns. NHS workers should get a pay rise, but to demand that they get it right now while the country enters its biggest economical crash on record (and threaten strike which completely contradicts the reasoning staff work for the NHS) is beyond disgusting. NHS staff and teachers currently have the most secure line of work in the country and need a bit of a reality check as to what's going on around them. It is their choice to work for the public sector which guarantees more job security but pays lower salaries in the same way its one's choice to work in the private sector, earn well, but risk being out of work whenever we get an economic downturn. I fully appreciate many NHS workers vehemently oppose this vile suggestion of strikes and also recognise that pay rises in the current climate are not appropriate. As with all these things, it's a small, angry minority backed up by the militant left. I now don't know if I agree with myself or not. I am considering my position, dependent on the wisdom of the Oatcake. It is ridiculous to ask for 12% even as an opening bargaining position. Come to our side of the fence brother! 🤗
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 6, 2021 10:10:01 GMT
I really don't care mate it shows me that despite all this we care shit it boils down to whats in it for me. I agree and if you're friends with a Government Minister there's been a hell of a lot in it for you!
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 6, 2021 10:12:51 GMT
You think people voted Tory for their green credentials, seriously? Not what I said is it? People voted Tory for a number of reasons, one being the severe lack of any kind of credible opposition. That looks set to remain for years. Boris has been incredibly left of centre on a number of things thus far and many staunch Conservatives aren't big fans. But there's no one close to him at the moment as the polling suggests. You said they agreed with their green proposal, I'm saying it wasn't even a consideration. Again the rest is just irrelevant to what we were discussing......
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Post by franklin on Mar 6, 2021 10:14:41 GMT
I really don't care mate it shows me that despite all this we care shit it boils down to whats in it for me. I agree and if you're friends with a Government Minister there's been a hell of a lot in it for you! But again that's not the subject its about the payrise offered to the NHS who despite the country being skint and months telling everyone how much they care are now telling everyone we are going on stike if you don't give us more. They are not unique in working throughout this Pandemic.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 6, 2021 10:29:21 GMT
I agree and if you're friends with a Government Minister there's been a hell of a lot in it for you! But again that's not the subject its about the payrise offered to the NHS who despite the country being skint and months telling everyone how much they care are now telling everyone we are going on stike if you don't give us more. They are not unique in working throughout this Pandemic. I think they have been unique, many left their families for months and worked themselves into the ground. The pictures of their contorted faces after 14 hour shifts wearing heavy duty masks was heart breaking but predictably soon forgotten. If we're mocking them for trying to realise their worth, at least lets admit what an utter sham that nonsense was in the summer with that fop haired moron cynically clapping them and now hanging them out to dry. We all know who this Government see as key workers in this country, these twats, those who saw covid as an opportunity not to care for their fellow man but to make ‘super normal returns’ on the back of misery and death. www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/05/rees-mogg-firm-accused-of-cashing-in-on-coronavirus-crisisWe are an awful country when you step back and look at it.
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Post by franklin on Mar 6, 2021 10:39:24 GMT
But again that's not the subject its about the payrise offered to the NHS who despite the country being skint and months telling everyone how much they care are now telling everyone we are going on stike if you don't give us more. They are not unique in working throughout this Pandemic. I think they have been unique, many left their families for months and worked themselves into the ground. The pictures of their contorted faces after 14 hour shifts wearing heavy duty masks was heart breaking but predictably soon forgotten. If we're mocking them for trying to realise their worth, at least lets admit what an utter sham that nonsense was in the summer with that fop haired moron cynically clapping them and now hanging them out to dry. We all know who this Government see as key workers in this country, these twats, those who saw covid as an opportunity not to care for their fellow man but to make ‘super normal returns’ on the back of misery and death. www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/05/rees-mogg-firm-accused-of-cashing-in-on-coronavirus-crisisWe are an awful country when you step back and look at it. All very emotional did you clap for my lady when she went to work everyday in a supermarket.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 6, 2021 10:41:17 GMT
I think they have been unique, many left their families for months and worked themselves into the ground. The pictures of their contorted faces after 14 hour shifts wearing heavy duty masks was heart breaking but predictably soon forgotten. If we're mocking them for trying to realise their worth, at least lets admit what an utter sham that nonsense was in the summer with that fop haired moron cynically clapping them and now hanging them out to dry. We all know who this Government see as key workers in this country, these twats, those who saw covid as an opportunity not to care for their fellow man but to make ‘super normal returns’ on the back of misery and death. www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/05/rees-mogg-firm-accused-of-cashing-in-on-coronavirus-crisisWe are an awful country when you step back and look at it. All very emotional did you clap for my lady when she went to work everyday in a supermarket. No. I'd back her for a decent pay rise though.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Mar 6, 2021 10:46:07 GMT
Not saying that getting a one percent pay rise is right it isn’t. But I’m not sure striking Is the answer. I think the nurses would lose support if they did. If you had a member of your family lose their life in hospital because there’s no one available to save their life because they’re striking you wouldn’t be happy would you. I guess for those looking to call the strike the person that passes away could be classed as colatarel damage for the greater good. I know a lot of nurses and thankfully like the Police they don’t do there job for the money they do it because they love it and they want to help and support people in need so I’m not so sure a strike would get that much support from them. Like a lot of key workers on the frontline they do it because their special people who look on financial reward as secondary.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Mar 6, 2021 10:47:13 GMT
The vast majority of dissent is coming from the NHS staff at the top of the pay structure.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 6, 2021 10:47:17 GMT
I think they have been unique, many left their families for months and worked themselves into the ground. The pictures of their contorted faces after 14 hour shifts wearing heavy duty masks was heart breaking but predictably soon forgotten. If we're mocking them for trying to realise their worth, at least lets admit what an utter sham that nonsense was in the summer with that fop haired moron cynically clapping them and now hanging them out to dry. We all know who this Government see as key workers in this country, these twats, those who saw covid as an opportunity not to care for their fellow man but to make ‘super normal returns’ on the back of misery and death. www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/05/rees-mogg-firm-accused-of-cashing-in-on-coronavirus-crisisWe are an awful country when you step back and look at it. All very emotional did you clap for my lady when she went to work everyday in a supermarket. The supermarkets have done very well out this pandemic. Maybe they should be committing to paying everyone the real living wage as a thank you instead of massive dividends for share holders?
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Mar 6, 2021 10:54:40 GMT
Lot's of people have worked through this it's true but NHS staff have put their health and their lives on the line So have shop workers,bus drivers,taxi drivers,teachers and many more and for less money. Indeed, and if they wanted to, they could join a Union, and if not happy with their pay and conditions, threaten to take industrial action if their employers aren't prepared to improve their conditions or come to an acceptable agreement with them. Not that I think nurses will strike, or at most in a very limited way that doesn't affect patients, but if they did, you'd see the government perform the fastest U-turn they've ever done, which is saying something They might try to come out with the kind of language expressed on here about blackmail and unaffordable etc, but the bottom line would be that if people did start dying, the general public (other than a few on here!) would recognise and support the effort that they put in during the pandemic and rapidly turn on the government, rather than the nurses.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Mar 6, 2021 10:57:36 GMT
The vast majority of dissent is coming from the NHS staff at the top of the pay structure. No surprise there it’s like a lot of things at the moment it’s those least affected that kick up the biggest stink.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Mar 6, 2021 11:00:55 GMT
Just a thought - but couldn't we use some of that £350m a week to fund the NHS instead? Wonder how much a 1% payrise actually equates to annually? £18bn should go a long way towards funding that?
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Post by franklin on Mar 6, 2021 11:11:31 GMT
All very emotional did you clap for my lady when she went to work everyday in a supermarket. The supermarkets have done very well out this pandemic. Maybe they should be committing to paying everyone the real living wage as a thank you instead of massive dividends for share holders? Correct but if the vast majority of the shops were closed and the company had borrowed to stay afloat and were paying staff to stay at home I wouldn't moan too much at a small payrise.
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Post by Dave the Rave on Mar 6, 2021 11:18:15 GMT
The vast majority of dissent is coming from the NHS staff at the top of the pay structure. No surprise there it’s like a lot of things at the moment it’s those least affected that kick up the biggest stink. The staff at the very top of the pay structure aren't even paid according to Agenda for Change payscales. They are paid on VSM (Very Senior Manager) payscales and their pay is decided by remuneration committees. As someone working in the NHS it is not my experience that senior managers are the ones complaining. Those that are, are doing so on behalf of their workforce. By and large, NHS managers actually care about the colleagues under their stewardship and will stand up for them. Quite why being more well off means you can't stand up for the less well off is something that baffles me greatly.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Mar 6, 2021 11:22:39 GMT
No surprise there it’s like a lot of things at the moment it’s those least affected that kick up the biggest stink. The staff at the very top of the pay structure aren't even paid according to Agenda for Change payscales. They are paid on VSM (Very Senior Manager) payscales and their pay is decided by remuneration committees. As someone working in the NHS it is not my experience that senior managers are the ones complaining. Those that are, are doing so on behalf of their workforce. By and large, NHS managers actually care about the colleagues under their stewardship and will stand up for them. Quite why being more well off means you can't stand up for the less well off is something that baffles me greatly. Nothing wrong with sticking up for those at the low end as long as it’s done for the right reason and it’s what the workers want.
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Post by crapslinger on Mar 6, 2021 11:47:01 GMT
Maybe we could stop paying to keep illegal immigrants in 4* hotels on full board plus £40 a week "pocket money", deport all foreign nationals in our prisons and put the money saved into the pot for NHS pay rises charity begins at home time we started to realise that fact.
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Post by tommycarlsberg on Mar 6, 2021 13:20:39 GMT
Lots of people have worked through this to keep the country going and plenty in reduced wages/income given the current situation its a fair offer which plenty of the others won't even get. Agree. I cannot agree with the OP. Millions of people are facing job losses in the next 6 months. Many hundreds of thousands have already lost their jobs. Livelihoods and lives have been shattered with small business owners struggling to put food on a plate for their families due to these horrifying draconian lockdowns. NHS workers should get a pay rise, but to demand that they get it right now while the country enters its biggest economical crash on record (and threaten strike which completely contradicts the reasoning staff work for the NHS) is beyond disgusting. NHS staff and teachers currently have the most secure line of work in the country and need a bit of a reality check as to what's going on around them. It is their choice to work for the public sector which guarantees more job security but pays lower salaries in the same way its one's choice to work in the private sector, earn well, but risk being out of work whenever we get an economic downturn. I fully appreciate many NHS workers vehemently oppose this vile suggestion of strikes and also recognise that pay rises in the current climate are not appropriate. As with all these things, it's a small, angry minority backed up by the militant left. Demanding it right now? I’m pretty sure it’s a reaction to the pathetic 1% offered in the budget. Some people would just argue with their shadow.
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Post by tommycarlsberg on Mar 6, 2021 13:22:49 GMT
I really don't care mate it shows me that despite all this we care shit it boils down to whats in it for me. What a ridiculous thing to say. A complete generalisation.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 6, 2021 13:57:22 GMT
The deification of the NHS is utterly bizarre and started with the government in March last year. Now its come back to haunt them.
No other country in the world has this complete obsession with deifying their health service. It's ridiculous and frankly, becoming pretty creepy. You've got children being indoctrinated into thinking that the NHS is this sacred God like, untouchable savior.
In reality, its an underperforming health service that's creaking at the seams that urgently needs a whole lot of restructuring. Anyone who questions it seems to be in the same category as a member of Isis. In fact, the militant left would probably argue you're worse than Isis.
The armed forces must be sat there thinking "what the fuck did we do wrong, we never got this kind of praise".
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Post by Cns on Mar 6, 2021 14:35:49 GMT
The deification of the NHS is utterly bizarre and started with the government in March last year. Now its come back to haunt them. No other country in the world has this complete obsession with deifying their health service. It's ridiculous and frankly, becoming pretty creepy. You've got children being indoctrinated into thinking that the NHS is this sacred God like, untouchable savior. In reality, its an underperforming health service that's creaking at the seams that urgently needs a whole lot of restructuring. Anyone who questions it seems to be in the same category as a member of Isis. In fact, the militant left would probably argue you're worse than Isis. The armed forces must be sat there thinking "what the fuck did we do wrong, we never got this kind of praise". The armed forces need do some dance routines on tiktok.
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