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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 20, 2019 15:44:10 GMT
I never said it was immaculate, I just thought it was fairly largely accepted? If you want to put forward your understanding then by all means do. I don’t know why you’re getting so huffy about it? I think Neville comes in for unfair stick for his managerial career. Valencia were a basket case club who ate managers alive at that time and it was no job for a rookie who wasn’t fluent in the language. He should never have gone there. Apologies if you think I'm being "huffy", just rebuffing a negative with a negative and we could both go on forever. I do realise that tapping up goes and has gone on for eons, but not so widely at the loWer echelons. Whether or not Joe Allen has been the subject or the instigator of this type of action is purely a matter of conjecture, unless you are ITK of course. Are you named Dave by any chance🤔 I never once suggested Joe had instigated anything. Just that if the club had had any serious offers since relegation, one way or another we’d have heard about it.
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Post by pushon on Dec 20, 2019 15:52:37 GMT
Apologies if you think I'm being "huffy", just rebuffing a negative with a negative and we could both go on forever. I do realise that tapping up goes and has gone on for eons, but not so widely at the loWer echelons. Whether or not Joe Allen has been the subject or the instigator of this type of action is purely a matter of conjecture, unless you are ITK of course. Are you named Dave by any chance🤔 I never once suggested Joe had instigated anything. Just that if the club had had any serious offers since relegation, one way or another we’d have heard about it. Ok that's your take on the situation and you have a 50:50 chance of being right. My own view is that, if Stoke or Allen himself had shown the slightest inclination of him moving on, there would have been a rush to acquire his services.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 20, 2019 15:54:12 GMT
I never once suggested Joe had instigated anything. Just that if the club had had any serious offers since relegation, one way or another we’d have heard about it. Ok that's your take on the situation and you have a 50:50 chance of being right. My own view is that, if Stoke or Allen himself had shown the slightest inclination of him moving on, there would have been a rush to acquire his services. Why would they wait for an inclination though? Would they not just test our/his mettle with a bid?
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Post by pushon on Dec 20, 2019 16:03:07 GMT
Ok that's your take on the situation and you have a 50:50 chance of being right. My own view is that, if Stoke or Allen himself had shown the slightest inclination of him moving on, there would have been a rush to acquire his services. Why would they wait for an inclination though? Would they not just test our/his mettle with a bid? No why would they make a bid if there is no inclination by player or club to upset the staus quo?
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Post by wuzza on Dec 20, 2019 16:08:27 GMT
I think Joe might just be one of those players with a slightly more rounded view of life and isn’t going to charge off anywhere at the drop of a pound note (although we probably pay him as much as any but the top clubs would). Things might change now of course if he thinks we are indeed heading to the 3rd Div and like I say watch the queue form if we give it the slightest hint we are willing to sell. It’s not really about the ‘pound note’, most footballers want to play at as high a level they can for as long as they can. He took a view that we were his best bet of returning to the top flight, signed up and has felt morally obliged to see things through until the club tell him they want him gone? It’s not impossible and I think he is definitely one of the ‘good guys’.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 20, 2019 16:16:39 GMT
Why would they wait for an inclination though? Would they not just test our/his mettle with a bid? No why would they make a bid if there is no inclination by player or club to upset the staus quo? Because situations change once interest solidifies? Because they really want to change the player’s mind? Do you think football clubs don’t do any transfer business unless they know a player’s not happy where he is? In the cutthroat world of football?
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Post by pushon on Dec 20, 2019 16:19:13 GMT
It’s not really about the ‘pound note’, most footballers want to play at as high a level they can for as long as they can. He took a view that we were his best bet of returning to the top flight, signed up and has felt morally obliged to see things through until the club tell him they want him gone? It’s not impossible and I think he is definitely one of the ‘good guys’. I'm convinced wuzza and also surprised, though only mildly, at all the animosity thrown at Joe. I think only Badou and we haven't really seen enough of him, comes close to Joe in the context of footballing ability and nous.
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Post by pushon on Dec 20, 2019 16:23:25 GMT
No why would they make a bid if there is no inclination by player or club to upset the staus quo? Because situations change once interest solidifies? Because they really want to change the player’s mind? Do you think football clubs don’t do any transfer business unless they know a player’s not happy where he is? In the cutthroat world of football? I think it's you who is naive, all the spadework is done by agents.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 20, 2019 16:26:52 GMT
Because situations change once interest solidifies? Because they really want to change the player’s mind? Do you think football clubs don’t do any transfer business unless they know a player’s not happy where he is? In the cutthroat world of football? I think it's you who is naive, all the spadework is done by agents. Sorry, how does that change anything? Are you saying no player happy where he is could possibly want to play at a higher level and no club would try to sign them for that reason? And I’M the one being naive?
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Post by pushon on Dec 20, 2019 16:34:57 GMT
I think it's you who is naive, all the spadework is done by agents. Sorry, how does that change anything? Are you saying no player happy where he is could possibly want to play at a higher level and no club would try to sign them for that reason? And I’M the one being naive? You're the one who reminded that this is a Joe Allen thread, now you're pontificating about "no player", by which I guess you mean any player? What will it be next one man and his dog?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 20, 2019 16:36:29 GMT
Sorry, how does that change anything? Are you saying no player happy where he is could possibly want to play at a higher level and no club would try to sign them for that reason? And I’M the one being naive? You're the one who reminded that this is a Joe Allen thread, now you're pontificating about "no player", by which I guess you mean any player? What will it be next one man and his dog? Any chance of you answering the question? If a club wants a player, be it Joe Allen or anyone, they aren’t going to politely and patiently wait for him to develop a wanderlust of his own accord.
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Post by pushon on Dec 20, 2019 16:37:59 GMT
You're the one who reminded that this is a Joe Allen thread, now you're pontificating about "no player", by which I guess you mean any player? What will it be next one man and his dog? Any chance of you answering the question? Ditto
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 20, 2019 16:43:04 GMT
Any chance of you answering the question? Ditto Which one, the childish one about one man and his dog? Happy to discuss football mate, otherwise I’m not really interested.
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Post by pushon on Dec 20, 2019 16:50:58 GMT
You're the one who reminded that this is a Joe Allen thread, now you're pontificating about "no player", by which I guess you mean any player? What will it be next one man and his dog? Any chance of you answering the question? If a club wants a player, be it Joe Allen or anyone, they aren’t going to politely and patiently wait for him to develop a wanderlust of his own accord. What do they do then Kidnap him or perhaps his family and hold him to ransom.Or maybe batter him about the head with sacks full of £1000 notes. Yup, I know that it's ridiculous but no more so than your flight of self-indulgent fantasies.
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Post by thehoof on Dec 20, 2019 16:55:13 GMT
Clucas is a far worse player than Allen- the two Superstar’s Etebo and N’Diaye contribute zero assists and a goal once a blue moon, but Allen is the cause of our midfield problems? There’s more to being a midfielder than assists and goals though isn’t there? Yes, none of our midfielders including N’Diaye and Etebo have managed to add anything to the team that has made us look like a side that can dominate a game. I feel that Allen cops a lot of stick for running about, as opposed to Clucas who just waves his arms, and Etebo and N’Diaye who look impressive but actually add nothing- we don’t have noticeably better results when Etebo and N’Diaye play do we?
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 20, 2019 16:55:22 GMT
Any chance of you answering the question? If a club wants a player, be it Joe Allen or anyone, they aren’t going to politely and patiently wait for him to develop a wanderlust of his own accord. What do they do then Kidnap him or perhaps his family and hold him to ransom.Or maybe batter him about the head with sacks full of £1000 notes. Yup, I know that it's ridiculous but no more so than your flight of self-indulgent fantasies. No, again, they make enquiries, they test the mettle with bids etc. I really don’t think anything I’ve suggested is anything out of the ordinary or strange or ridiculous. I’ve obviously upset you though, and this has gone on long enough so I’ll leave you to it.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Dec 20, 2019 16:58:57 GMT
There’s more to being a midfielder than assists and goals though isn’t there? Yes, none of our midfielders including N’Diaye and Etebo have managed to add anything to the team that has made us look like a side that can dominate a game. I feel that Allen cops a lot of stick for running about, as opposed to Clucas who just waves his arms, and Etebo and N’Diaye who look impressive but actually add nothing- we don’t have noticeably better results when Etebo and N’Diaye play do we? I don’t agree that they haven’t added anything. Ndiaye has looked comfortably the best option in the holding role while Etebo has the physicality and ability to drive the team forward. It’s true results haven’t improved with them in the side but they can’t do it themselves and they offer more than any of our other midfielders. It’s the ‘running around’ that’s been the issue with Joe - charging round and leaving gaps that see us get punished. His best games have come when we’ve had a DM to offset that and plug those gaps, but I don’t think we can play him and, say, Powell or a second striker in the same team.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Dec 20, 2019 17:01:40 GMT
Looks like I’ll be in a minority but I’ll be disappointed if Allen goes.
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Post by pushon on Dec 20, 2019 17:02:53 GMT
What do they do then Kidnap him or perhaps his family and hold him to ransom.Or maybe batter him about the head with sacks full of £1000 notes. Yup, I know that it's ridiculous but no more so than your flight of self-indulgent fantasies. No, again, they make enquiries, they test the mettle with bids etc. I really don’t think anything I’ve suggested is anything out of the ordinary or strange or ridiculous. I’ve obviously upset you though, and this has gone on long enough so I’ll leave you to it. I partially agree about the process, but take it from me that the spade-work is done by an agent, prior to offers being made to a buying club. Yes I'm out too and no offence meant.Well done on keeping effing and jeffing out of it too.
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