|
Post by thegift on Aug 6, 2018 19:44:26 GMT
Judging by our pre season, and pathetic performance yesterday + the deadwood and scholes and cartwright at the helm, id say its closer to 10/1 Happy to give you 12/1 if you want to bet on it. I don't bet myself
|
|
|
Post by StatesideStokie on Aug 6, 2018 19:52:10 GMT
Completely understand the negative reactions to yesterday’s shit-show, but this OP is some next-level knicker wetting.
|
|
|
Post by cobhamstokey on Aug 6, 2018 19:55:36 GMT
I dont think we'll go up but we've got some decent players and will come good I just think it'll be to little to late.
Things wont change for the good until things change at the top and the Pizza boys are gone.
|
|
|
Post by Roger Everyone on Aug 6, 2018 19:57:19 GMT
It hasnt been one game though has it It has been dross and downhiil since Jan '16 yet some are happy with fiddling while Stoke burns and crashes And for that i blame Charisma. If the pizza girls wernt doing their job he should have shown some spunk and walked. Its the same delusional weirdos that said we weren't going down at christmas. They need to wake up and smell the coffee I quite like the title delusional weirdo But in all honesty we will get playing. Give it five games at least. It all takes time to settle down. I for one didnt think we would beat Leeds. And Brentford will not be easy. But i have faith in the new manager and we will be in the top six by the new year.
|
|
|
Post by tony1234 on Aug 6, 2018 19:58:53 GMT
Have seen a bit of Champs football and Leeds were well above average yesterday - whether it was a one off we'll see. But i haven't seen many more complete champs performances than that.
The problem is that our last meaningful win was now Huddersfield in Jan. Its also become clear that a full "overhaul" will take 2-3 windows and not 1.
Understand the anxiety - we could really do with something to rally behind. Even if we'd lost 3-1 yesterday but in a ding dong end to end game where we could rue 2-3 missed chances and still see passages of the game where we'd had the upper hand. We need to wait a bit longer for that.
I think Rowett is a good man at the helm - he did a job at Brum a while ago on inheriting a dysfunctional team and getting them to be play off canddiates, but it wasn't overnight. Sense this won't be either.
In some ways yesterday reminded me of that 3-1 defeat to Bolton many moons ago in the Prem, when we all felt afterwards like our team was simply inadequate to cope and a mile off what was needed. As it happens, it took a couple of games to adjust and the season was a good one.
The time to worry is if - after 6-10 games - with little warning - Rowett resigns. In part to keep his precious reputation. In part, he genuinely feels its an impossible job. (A scenario I contemplated as I came home tonight)
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2018 20:27:28 GMT
Not written anything for 24 hours or so checking the mood!
So, we were poor first game of the season and now we are Sunderland, Charlton et al!
I understand our collective positional failings But as Charlie Brown put it:
"Good grief!"
|
|
|
Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Aug 6, 2018 20:36:31 GMT
Have seen a bit of Champs football and Leeds were well above average yesterday - whether it was a one off we'll see. But i haven't seen many more complete champs performances than that. The problem is that our last meaningful win was now Huddersfield in Jan. Its also become clear that a full "overhaul" will take 2-3 windows and not 1. Understand the anxiety - we could really do with something to rally behind. Even if we'd lost 3-1 yesterday but in a ding dong end to end game where we could rue 2-3 missed chances and still see passages of the game where we'd had the upper hand. We need to wait a bit longer for that. I think Rowett is a good man at the helm - he did a job at Brum a while ago on inheriting a dysfunctional team and getting them to be play off canddiates, but it wasn't overnight. Sense this won't be either. In some ways yesterday reminded me of that 3-1 defeat to Bolton many moons ago in the Prem, when we all felt afterwards like our team was simply inadequate to cope and a mile off what was needed. As it happens, it took a couple of games to adjust and the season was a good one. The time to worry is if - after 6-10 games - with little warning - Rowett resigns. In part to keep his precious reputation. In part, he genuinely feels its an impossible job. (A scenario I contemplated as I came home tonight) I always suspected Rowett would be out of his depth with this job. He's never had money to spend with the objective to win the league. We should have gone for Bielsa
|
|
|
Post by tony1234 on Aug 6, 2018 20:52:58 GMT
Have seen a bit of Champs football and Leeds were well above average yesterday - whether it was a one off we'll see. But i haven't seen many more complete champs performances than that. The problem is that our last meaningful win was now Huddersfield in Jan. Its also become clear that a full "overhaul" will take 2-3 windows and not 1. Understand the anxiety - we could really do with something to rally behind. Even if we'd lost 3-1 yesterday but in a ding dong end to end game where we could rue 2-3 missed chances and still see passages of the game where we'd had the upper hand. We need to wait a bit longer for that. I think Rowett is a good man at the helm - he did a job at Brum a while ago on inheriting a dysfunctional team and getting them to be play off canddiates, but it wasn't overnight. Sense this won't be either. In some ways yesterday reminded me of that 3-1 defeat to Bolton many moons ago in the Prem, when we all felt afterwards like our team was simply inadequate to cope and a mile off what was needed. As it happens, it took a couple of games to adjust and the season was a good one. The time to worry is if - after 6-10 games - with little warning - Rowett resigns. In part to keep his precious reputation. In part, he genuinely feels its an impossible job. (A scenario I contemplated as I came home tonight) I always suspected Rowett would be out of his depth with this job. He's never had money to spend with the objective to win the league. We should have gone for Bielsa You are right: someone with genuine gravitas to shake up the club would have been great. I do admit I find that a little harsh at this stage though to conclude Rowett is out of his depth. It may prove true - but it may be a job that is bigger than 99% could handle, if it requires that he not only overhauls the first team, but changes the culture from top to bottom and implements new processes in all the different technical areas!. Rowett has shown he can build good championship teams on less resources. And Biesla's fiery temper temperament has yet to be put to the test in the unique conditions of the Championship, when he is managing a team with much less ability than he is used to who will not be able to carry out his sophisticated tactics. I suddenly got this sneaking feeling though that, if the shit and fan are on a surefire collision course something like 10 games in (and 8-12 pts on the board), Rowett will just walk citing a difference in direction with the Board - knowing in 3 months he can pick up again at Norwich/Swansea etc. and this was all some unhappy blip. I'd love to know how the job he has reflects the one he was sold!
|
|
|
Post by thegift on Aug 6, 2018 20:55:45 GMT
I always suspected Rowett would be out of his depth with this job. He's never had money to spend with the objective to win the league. We should have gone for Bielsa You are right: someone with genuine gravitas to shake up the club would have been great. I do admit I find that a little harsh at this stage though to conclude Rowett is out of his depth. It may prove true - but it may be a job that bigger than 99% if it requires that he not only overhauls the first team, but changes the culture from top to bottom and implements new processes in all the different technical areas!. Rowett has shown he can build good championship teams on less resources. And Biesla's fiery temper temperament has yet to be put to the test in the unique conditions of the Championship, when he is managing a team with much less ability than he is used to who will not be able to carry out his sophisticated tactics. I suddenly got this sneaking feeling though that, if the shit and fan are on a surefire collision course something like 10 games in (and 8-12 pts on the board), Rowett will just walk citing a difference in direction with the Board - knowing in 3 months he can pick up again at Norwich/Swansea etc. and this was all some unhappy blip. I'd love to know how the job he has reflects the one he was sold! You can easily read between the lines in his recent videos that he's been sold a dud from the pizza boys. He makes that very clear
|
|
|
Post by tony1234 on Aug 6, 2018 21:01:05 GMT
You are right: someone with genuine gravitas to shake up the club would have been great. I do admit I find that a little harsh at this stage though to conclude Rowett is out of his depth. It may prove true - but it may be a job that bigger than 99% if it requires that he not only overhauls the first team, but changes the culture from top to bottom and implements new processes in all the different technical areas!. Rowett has shown he can build good championship teams on less resources. And Biesla's fiery temper temperament has yet to be put to the test in the unique conditions of the Championship, when he is managing a team with much less ability than he is used to who will not be able to carry out his sophisticated tactics. I suddenly got this sneaking feeling though that, if the shit and fan are on a surefire collision course something like 10 games in (and 8-12 pts on the board), Rowett will just walk citing a difference in direction with the Board - knowing in 3 months he can pick up again at Norwich/Swansea etc. and this was all some unhappy blip. I'd love to know how the job he has reflects the one he was sold! You can easily read between the lines in his recent videos that he's been sold a dud from the pizza boys. He makes that very clear Oh dear. That may be the time to worry.
|
|
|
Post by kidcrewbob on Aug 6, 2018 21:05:08 GMT
Main problem here is that we aren't the "new" anything - we're the same old Stoke of last season and the back-end of the season before - it really is worrying after the appalling capitulation last season that even with a new manager and a few new faces it was like nothing had changed at all - and that concerns me greatly and I blame Coates for NOT delivering the implied root & branch reform/ clean sweep he promised only a few short months ago.
There's a stench about the place and a cloud hanging over the club - every team in the Championship will have seen that yesterday and will take heart that we are very very vulnerable and will fancy their chances if they get in our faces......
We have to have a swift & decisive response and put a bouyant Brentford back in their place on Sat in order to steady the ship and instil some belief in players and supporters alike - we are shit scared at the moment & other teams will smell the fear like a pack of rabid dogs...!!!!
|
|
|
Post by thegift on Aug 6, 2018 21:11:45 GMT
Main problem here is that we aren't the "new" anything - we're the same old Stoke of last season and the back-end of the season before - it really is worrying after the appalling capitulation last season that even with a new manager and a few new faces it was like nothing had changed at all - and that concerns me greatly and I blame Coates for NOT delivering the implied root & branch reform/ clean sweep he promised only a few short months ago. There's a stench about the place and a cloud hanging over the club - every team in the Championship will have seen that yesterday and will take heart that we are very very vulnerable and will fancy their chances if they get in our faces...... We have to have a swift & decisive response and put a bouyant Brentford back in their place on Sat in order to steady the ship and instil some belief in players and supporters alike - we are shit scared at the moment & other teams will smell the fear like a pack of rabid dogs...!!!! If we lose to the likes of tinpot brentford with the money we have spent on keeping players on with high wages and the signings we have made its time to shut up shop
|
|
|
Post by tony1234 on Aug 6, 2018 21:21:05 GMT
Main problem here is that we aren't the "new" anything - we're the same old Stoke of last season and the back-end of the season before - it really is worrying after the appalling capitulation last season that even with a new manager and a few new faces it was like nothing had changed at all - and that concerns me greatly and I blame Coates for NOT delivering the implied root & branch reform/ clean sweep he promised only a few short months ago. There's a stench about the place and a cloud hanging over the club - every team in the Championship will have seen that yesterday and will take heart that we are very very vulnerable and will fancy their chances if they get in our faces...... We have to have a swift & decisive response and put a bouyant Brentford back in their place on Sat in order to steady the ship and instil some belief in players and supporters alike - we are shit scared at the moment & other teams will smell the fear like a pack of rabid dogs...!!!! Very graphic! Its a CEO's job to ensure the different areas of the club are doing their part, cohesively, to deliver the strategy - which ends in success on the pitch. And the owners's interest to ensure the CEO and Board are doing their jobs to protect the club's assets. So would see that Scholes AND Coates have become equally comfortable and culpable in a modus operandi of habitual failure - with the inability to rectify a failed business model I've just not seen any evidence Coates knows what it would take to do a root and branch reform of an organisation. If it was a failing business under the scrutiny of auditors or a possibly buyer, say, the outcome would have been structural change, mass job losses, new leadership and a new strategic plan built around the opportunities and weaknesses. Does he have the skills, or does he employ and empower others to do it - its a huge undertaking?! I don't see it with the rank bad judgement of his call in January that "we have enough" - or the "nothing wrong with the process" statement. These statements suggest they don't even know what "reform" means. Not so much broken promises, as a thorough lack of comprehension at what those two had promised. (.... irrespective of what happens with Brentford, I sense Stoke fans got to the other end of the 5 stages of grief a hell of a lot faster than these two have.)
|
|
|
Post by Pricey on Aug 6, 2018 21:28:34 GMT
Main problem here is that we aren't the "new" anything - we're the same old Stoke of last season and the back-end of the season before - it really is worrying after the appalling capitulation last season that even with a new manager and a few new faces it was like nothing had changed at all - and that concerns me greatly and I blame Coates for NOT delivering the implied root & branch reform/ clean sweep he promised only a few short months ago. There's a stench about the place and a cloud hanging over the club - every team in the Championship will have seen that yesterday and will take heart that we are very very vulnerable and will fancy their chances if they get in our faces...... We have to have a swift & decisive response and put a bouyant Brentford back in their place on Sat in order to steady the ship and instil some belief in players and supporters alike - we are shit scared at the moment & other teams will smell the fear like a pack of rabid dogs...!!!! If we lose to the likes of tinpot brentford with the money we have spent on keeping players on with high wages and the signings we have made its time to shut up shop Brentford are one of the best teams in the league. Calling them "tinpot" means nothing if you haven't done your research. They've been building this team, way of playing/recruiting/analysing for 7-8 years and you're calling them tinpot, presumably because they are historically a small club with no recent top-flight experience. You always make a hash of every thread you create or wade into because you clearly take a punt on making statements without knowing the facts.
|
|
|
Post by thegift on Aug 6, 2018 21:43:56 GMT
If we lose to the likes of tinpot brentford with the money we have spent on keeping players on with high wages and the signings we have made its time to shut up shop Brentford are one of the best teams in the league. Calling them "tinpot" means nothing if you haven't done your research. They've been building this team, way of playing/recruiting/analysing for 7-8 years and you're calling them tinpot, presumably because they are historically a small club with no recent top-flight experience. You always make a hash of every thread you create or wade into because you clearly take a punt on making statements without knowing the facts. Trust me mate if i tell you one little secret that would be i never make a hash of anything, especially not on an internet forum.
|
|
|
Post by Pricey on Aug 6, 2018 21:55:48 GMT
Brentford are one of the best teams in the league. Calling them "tinpot" means nothing if you haven't done your research. They've been building this team, way of playing/recruiting/analysing for 7-8 years and you're calling them tinpot, presumably because they are historically a small club with no recent top-flight experience. You always make a hash of every thread you create or wade into because you clearly take a punt on making statements without knowing the facts. Trust me mate if i tell you one little secret that would be i never make a hash of anything, especially not on an internet forum. That's not even English.
|
|
|
Post by thegift on Aug 6, 2018 21:57:52 GMT
Trust me mate if i tell you one little secret that would be i never make a hash of anything, especially not on an internet forum. That's not even English. Again I'm really not that fussed on a forum, its 11pm ive had a few beers and about to go to bed ready for work in the morning.. Lighten up mate
|
|
|
Post by Pricey on Aug 6, 2018 22:02:07 GMT
Again I'm really not that fussed on a forum, its 11pm ive had a few beers and about to go to bed ready for work in the morning.. Lighten up mate Christ.
|
|
|
Post by iglugluk on Aug 6, 2018 22:18:14 GMT
Main problem here is that we aren't the "new" anything - we're the same old Stoke of last season and the back-end of the season before - it really is worrying after the appalling capitulation last season that even with a new manager and a few new faces it was like nothing had changed at all - and that concerns me greatly and I blame Coates for NOT delivering the implied root & branch reform/ clean sweep he promised only a few short months ago. There's a stench about the place and a cloud hanging over the club - every team in the Championship will have seen that yesterday and will take heart that we are very very vulnerable and will fancy their chances if they get in our faces...... We have to have a swift & decisive response and put a bouyant Brentford back in their place on Sat in order to steady the ship and instil some belief in players and supporters alike - we are shit scared at the moment & other teams will smell the fear like a pack of rabid dogs...!!!! Alot of pertinent comments there. Coates are you listening?!?!
|
|
|
Post by johnnysoul60 on Aug 7, 2018 7:08:16 GMT
Too early to say , if we can't shift our dead wood and are stuck in this league with high earners after a couple of seasons there is a risk , our owners are much better though and would hopefully keep us as a solid championship club at least .
|
|
|
Post by biglad180 on Aug 7, 2018 7:15:19 GMT
this talk of the new sunderland is bollox. ok we lost to leeds big deal we will still be there at the end of season. time to calm down and move on I think it is a must to play bojan as a number 10. and use crouch more in this league.
|
|
shimmer
Academy Starlet
Posts: 244
Location: Middle Earth
|
Post by shimmer on Aug 7, 2018 7:18:03 GMT
God lets hope not!
|
|
|
Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Aug 7, 2018 7:21:50 GMT
Main problem here is that we aren't the "new" anything - we're the same old Stoke of last season and the back-end of the season before - it really is worrying after the appalling capitulation last season that even with a new manager and a few new faces it was like nothing had changed at all - and that concerns me greatly and I blame Coates for NOT delivering the implied root & branch reform/ clean sweep he promised only a few short months ago. There's a stench about the place and a cloud hanging over the club - every team in the Championship will have seen that yesterday and will take heart that we are very very vulnerable and will fancy their chances if they get in our faces...... We have to have a swift & decisive response and put a bouyant Brentford back in their place on Sat in order to steady the ship and instil some belief in players and supporters alike - we are shit scared at the moment & other teams will smell the fear like a pack of rabid dogs...!!!! If we lose to the likes of tinpot brentford with the money we have spent on keeping players on with high wages and the signings we have made its time to shut up shop That is the sort of arrogant attitude that will definitely turn us into the new Sunderland. It's not about money, reputation and history - it's about how the teams play on the day. The response to losing to Brentford would be analyse what went wrong, learn and knuckle down to a long hard season - not chuck our toys out of the pram because little old Brentford refused to roll over and have their belly tickled.
|
|
|
Post by haway on Aug 7, 2018 7:39:01 GMT
Main problem here is that we aren't the "new" anything - we're the same old Stoke of last season and the back-end of the season before - it really is worrying after the appalling capitulation last season that even with a new manager and a few new faces it was like nothing had changed at all - and that concerns me greatly and I blame Coates for NOT delivering the implied root & branch reform/ clean sweep he promised only a few short months ago. There's a stench about the place and a cloud hanging over the club - every team in the Championship will have seen that yesterday and will take heart that we are very very vulnerable and will fancy their chances if they get in our faces...... We have to have a swift & decisive response and put a bouyant Brentford back in their place on Sat in order to steady the ship and instil some belief in players and supporters alike - we are shit scared at the moment & other teams will smell the fear like a pack of rabid dogs...!!!! If we lose to the likes of tinpot brentford with the money we have spent on keeping players on with high wages and the signings we have made its time to shut up shop If your players think teams like Brentford are tinpot and nothing more than that, then you are in deep trouble of getting relegated...just saying.
|
|
|
Post by haway on Aug 7, 2018 7:40:04 GMT
Yes you are. Seriously though, no need to panic yet. Continue to be shit until Christmas then you can panic. Funny how yourselves & us seem to go up & down at the same time over the years. Maybe its a red & white stripe thing. Should just change the kit to light blue and try to emulate Man City.
|
|
|
Post by haway on Aug 7, 2018 7:42:20 GMT
Funny how yourselves & us seem to go up & down at the same time over the years. Maybe its a red & white stripe thing. ffs mate .. we've been in the top division for 10 years. Sunderland have been up and down more than Katie Prices' knickers Prior to our recent relegation to the championship, we were in the premiership for a decade as well. Means nowt if the players aren’t motivated for a fight...you’s should be okay though.
|
|
|
Post by thegift on Aug 7, 2018 9:16:51 GMT
If we lose to the likes of tinpot brentford with the money we have spent on keeping players on with high wages and the signings we have made its time to shut up shop If your players think teams like Brentford are tinpot and nothing more than that, then you are in deep trouble of getting relegated...just saying. With the money we have spent, we should not be losing to Brentford. Its like saying man city should lose to wolves. it shouldn't happen.
|
|
|
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Aug 7, 2018 9:46:00 GMT
If your players think teams like Brentford are tinpot and nothing more than that, then you are in deep trouble of getting relegated...just saying. With the money we have spent, we should not be losing to Brentford. Its like saying man city should lose to wolves. it shouldn't happen. The Championship doesn't work like that and never has done.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2018 9:52:53 GMT
There are serious issues and questions about our performance on Sunday that need to be answered this weekend. 'Are we the new Sunderland?' isn't one of them. Have a bit of happiness in your life, take a break from hating everything, you'll feel much better
|
|
|
Post by thegift on Aug 7, 2018 9:57:39 GMT
There are serious issues and questions about our performance on Sunday that need to be answered this weekend. 'Are we the new Sunderland?' isn't one of them. Have a bit of happiness in your life, take a break from hating everything, you'll feel much better Its called living in the real world
|
|