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Post by felonious on Mar 9, 2019 7:47:19 GMT
The Home office statistics , if this was an issue predominantly within the white community would there be an issue with targeted stop and search, would there be riots burning building, setting fire to cars, attacking the Police etc. ? if it walks like a duck quacks like a duck it is in all probability a duck, easiest way to stop this is to target the most likely proven risk area ! simple really duck, common sense if you like it isn't rocket science. If the police stopped and searched white people, predominantly, absolutely, there would be outrage. I remember walking home from my mates house in Basford, after having a massive session on champ manager, at three in the morning, 19 years old. I got stopped and searched, and then after, the copper said “keep your nose clean, son”. I wanted to tell him to go fuck him self. Imagine if that happened to you constantly, just walking home from your mates house? Stop and search does more harm than good. You've got a problem then. I got stopped by the police walking home at 4 in the morning from Newcastle. The police were just doing their job. Far from being shitty about it I asked and got a lift home.
Perhaps people should understand that stop and search will benefit local communities whatever their flavour enabling them not to be stabbed and to go about their business without fear of being stabbed. Stopping the police from being able to do this by playing the race card just makes people accessories. Stop and search is not the magic wand but it is a useful tool.
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Post by salopstick on Mar 9, 2019 8:08:29 GMT
Now I don’t believe in parental or any other abuse but when I was growing up if I did somthing really wrong I had a smack off my parents In school teachers had respect, even though illegal some teachers would get physical especially PE teachers with a dap but tbh you were slightly frighten of being shouted at etc You had respect for your elders,you called some friends of your parents especially older ones uncle or aunt and if needed they would command respect or shout at you You had respect or fear for the police because one of them bastards would drag you home by the ear You can talk about cutbacks all you want but this country has flipped where everything is on the side of the child regardless of how bad they are. Schools cannot do anything to the 6 year old little shit that tells teachers to fuck off. With out direction that 6 year old shot becomes a 11 year old shot disrupting lessons and other kids at school. The only powers the school has is to exclude them. Next thing they are a 16 year old little shit potentially on the scrap heap for life unless they get an epiphany. And the cycle starts again Kids get no discipline at home and parents are more likely to complain to the school than address their kids behaviour. I’m not advocating kicking fuck out of kids but bringing them up in a world with no responsibilities or discipline makes some of these little entitled snowflakes think they are untouchable and can do what they like Pandora’s box no going back I came from a scummy sinkhole estate when I joined the army the discipline wasn’t hard it was just a continuation of my life. Being from a shit hole sink estate doesn’t mean you have to resort to crime, drugs and knifes. It’s very easy to blame everything else and yes there are external factors but some people just choose to be cunts, choose the easy way because it’s too hard and not quick enough for them to walk the other way, put in some graft and succeed Is there a lack of options, in today’s world yes but those lack of options are not the root cause Absolutely 100% spot on Salop ! I've been saying it for years, there's no discipline of any sort anymore at school or home, and as a result these kids have little or no respect for people or property. These young thugs are not frightened of any retribution the way we were when we were growing up. How the hell did we manage to survive after the odd clip round the ear from mum or dad, or the cane or ruler at school ? Discipline taught us respect for each other, people in general, property and possessions. Yes, there were still the "bad 'un's" who still regularly got into trouble, and a few were expelled, but nothing on the apparent scale of expulsions today. These kids think they're untouchable and then get dragged into gangs of similar minded yobs, and the cycle continues with drugs, violence and more stabbings, and sadly deaths. We need to re-institute the core values of discipline and respect, and if these bastards are offended, well never mind eh, at least the new mindset may just save a few lives down the line. It probably has had an effect in the increasing mental health problems of the youth of today too
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Post by crapslinger on Mar 9, 2019 8:44:00 GMT
The Home office statistics , if this was an issue predominantly within the white community would there be an issue with targeted stop and search, would there be riots burning building, setting fire to cars, attacking the Police etc. ? if it walks like a duck quacks like a duck it is in all probability a duck, easiest way to stop this is to target the most likely proven risk area ! simple really duck, common sense if you like it isn't rocket science. If the police stopped and searched white people, predominantly, absolutely, there would be outrage. I remember walking home from my mates house in Basford, after having a massive session on champ manager, at three in the morning, 19 years old. I got stopped and searched, and then after, the copper said “keep your nose clean, son”. I wanted to tell him to go fuck him self. Imagine if that happened to you constantly, just walking home from your mates house? Stop and search does more harm than good. Not if you consider the statistics it doesn't, the fall in stop and search in London has resulted in a rise in knife crime, but don't let that get in the way hey !
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Mar 9, 2019 8:54:51 GMT
The real issue with knife crime is drugs, gangs & territory. Anyone whose worked with 'disaffected' youth knows this. Children who grow up with no rules or boundaries, who do what they like, when they like, with whom they like. They don't like school so they don't go..or they go and piss about and ruin things for all the other children and get kicked out. No moral background. No sense of personal responsibility. Don't give a fuck about anyone else. And all we can do is understand. 😠 Now I don’t believe in parental or any other abuse but when I was growing up if I did somthing really wrong I had a smack off my parents In school teachers had respect, even though illegal some teachers would get physical especially PE teachers with a dap but tbh you were slightly frighten of being shouted at etc You had respect for your elders,you called some friends of your parents especially older ones uncle or aunt and if needed they would command respect or shout at you You had respect or fear for the police because one of them bastards would drag you home by the ear You can talk about cutbacks all you want but this country has flipped where everything is on the side of the child regardless of how bad they are. Schools cannot do anything to the 6 year old little shit that tells teachers to fuck off. With out direction that 6 year old shot becomes a 11 year old shot disrupting lessons and other kids at school. The only powers the school has is to exclude them. Next thing they are a 16 year old little shit potentially on the scrap heap for life unless they get an epiphany. And the cycle starts again Kids get no discipline at home and parents are more likely to complain to the school than address their kids behaviour. I’m not advocating kicking fuck out of kids but bringing them up in a world with no responsibilities or discipline makes some of these little entitled snowflakes think they are untouchable and can do what they like Pandora’s box no going back I came from a scummy sinkhole estate when I joined the army the discipline wasn’t hard it was just a continuation of my life. Being from a shit hole sink estate doesn’t mean you have to resort to crime, drugs and knifes. It’s very easy to blame everything else and yes there are external factors but some people just choose to be cunts, choose the easy way because it’s too hard and not quick enough for them to walk the other way, put in some graft and succeed Is there a lack of options, in today’s world yes but those lack of options are not the root cause Absolutely bang on. Couldn't agree more. Some people have the moral backbone and character to make something of their lives and some people find any excuse not to. All part of the dependency culture which strips people of any personal responsibility and obligation.
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Post by henry on Mar 9, 2019 9:24:55 GMT
The Home office statistics , if this was an issue predominantly within the white community would there be an issue with targeted stop and search, would there be riots burning building, setting fire to cars, attacking the Police etc. ? if it walks like a duck quacks like a duck it is in all probability a duck, easiest way to stop this is to target the most likely proven risk area ! simple really duck, common sense if you like it isn't rocket science. If the police stopped and searched white people, predominantly, absolutely, there would be outrage. I remember walking home from my mates house in Basford, after having a massive session on champ manager, at three in the morning, 19 years old. I got stopped and searched, and then after, the copper said “keep your nose clean, son”. I wanted to tell him to go fuck him self. Imagine if that happened to you constantly, just walking home from your mates house? Stop and search does more harm than good. I asked my 16 year old lad how he would feel about being stopped and searched when out with his mates, and he said it wouldn't bother him at all. His actual words "i would feel safer"
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Mar 9, 2019 9:42:34 GMT
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 9, 2019 11:15:37 GMT
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Mar 9, 2019 11:34:21 GMT
Where I would agree with you Sheikh is that we live in an unfair and unjust society. I don't think that is reason though that one young person should stab another.....and more often than not the victim is also poor. I don't think that there is a single simple answer. An abundance of jobs and some hope for the future would help, as would responsible parenting , but , for me, I think that the fear of stabbing is such that we also need a Policing response.
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Post by salopstick on Mar 9, 2019 11:51:08 GMT
And whilst they put party political bullshit at the heart of the matter you miss most of the other causes
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Post by trickydicky73 on Mar 9, 2019 12:27:58 GMT
I see that the man charged with the murder of Jodie Chesney has a good English name.
What the fuck are we letting in?
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Post by mattyd on Mar 9, 2019 14:15:39 GMT
I see that the man charged with the murder of Jodie Chesney has a good English name. What the fuck are we letting in? But if anyone raises this then people like Momo jump up and down playing the race card and blaming the government. I cant for one minute imagine Manuel Petrovic woke up thoroughly pissed off with the government, Brexit, austerity etc etc and thought " Fuck it...I'm gonna kill an innocent teenage girl.." Did he bollocks, he is a feral piece of shit that would have done the same regardless of the state of the country...
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Post by partickpotter on Mar 9, 2019 14:28:23 GMT
And whilst they put party political bullshit at the heart of the matter you miss most of the other causes Momo misses a lot of stuff because he views the world through red lenses.
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Post by mattyd on Mar 9, 2019 14:44:06 GMT
And whilst they put party political bullshit at the heart of the matter you miss most of the other causes Momo misses a lot of stuff because he views the world through red lenses. & he's a bit of a loony left.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Mar 9, 2019 14:49:31 GMT
This video is nearly 10 years old..as true now as it was then.
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Post by xchpotter on Mar 9, 2019 14:55:25 GMT
I see that the man charged with the murder of Jodie Chesney has a good English name. What the fuck are we letting in? But if anyone raises this then people like Momo jump up and down playing the race card and blaming the government. I cant for one minute imagine Manuel Petrovic woke up thoroughly pissed off with the government, Brexit, austerity etc etc and thought " Fuck it...I'm gonna kill an innocent teenage girl.." Did he bollocks, he is a feral piece of shit that would have done the same regardless of the state of the country... You could say that, but at the same time we haven’t a bloody clue who is the country because of the relaxation of borders. Whether he would’ve been a nut job as a second, third or fourth generation Brit..who knows, but we have enough nutters already so why the hell make it easy for others with shady criminal backgrounds to come in? Culturally in some other countries it’s quite normal to carry knives from an early age. Our own knife carriers do it mainly as part of gang culture mentality rather than it being a generational culture. I’m not saying for one minute we don’t have more than enough of our own shit, but for heavens sake why compound matters and make it worse by allowing in the dregs of other nations.
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Post by middleoftheboothen on Mar 9, 2019 15:57:09 GMT
Momo misses a lot of stuff because he views the world through red lenses. & he's a bit of a loony left. He will be calling us all racists if we carry on with all this truth we are speaking.
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Post by trentvale68 on Mar 9, 2019 16:02:57 GMT
Strong sentences would help. 10 years for carrying, 25 years for using and whole life sentences for killing. And in the case of the 10 and 25,you actually serve the full term, no open prison etc.
Harsh sentences but don't play with knives little boys or you will get hurt!!
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Post by followyoudown on Mar 9, 2019 18:53:35 GMT
And whilst they put party political bullshit at the heart of the matter you miss most of the other causes You can bet despite the 50% cut in funding the bonuses for the top management teams will be unaffected.... I could also suggest some savings on the usual non job play coordinators etc etc stop paying union staff for doing union work plenty of savings there if they really wanted too.
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Post by felonious on Mar 9, 2019 18:56:31 GMT
And whilst they put party political bullshit at the heart of the matter you miss most of the other causes Momo misses a lot of stuff because he views the world through red lenses. Judging by some of his posts it's certainly not red and white lenses
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Post by prettything on Mar 10, 2019 11:43:34 GMT
If the police stopped and searched white people, predominantly, absolutely, there would be outrage. I remember walking home from my mates house in Basford, after having a massive session on champ manager, at three in the morning, 19 years old. I got stopped and searched, and then after, the copper said “keep your nose clean, son”. I wanted to tell him to go fuck him self. Imagine if that happened to you constantly, just walking home from your mates house? Stop and search does more harm than good. You've got a problem then. I got stopped by the police walking home at 4 in the morning from Newcastle. The police were just doing their job. Far from being shitty about it I asked and got a lift home.
Perhaps people should understand that stop and search will benefit local communities whatever their flavour enabling them not to be stabbed and to go about their business without fear of being stabbed. Stopping the police from being able to do this by playing the race card just makes people accessories. Stop and search is not the magic wand but it is a useful tool.
I don’t have a problem at all. They were aggressive and treated me like a I was guilty, which got my 19 year old back up. If that happened to me more than once, I would have started to resent the police. I’m glad you got a lift home, I don’t think you would have in any of the big cities. Newcastle is very different to London. People on here are saying stop and search is the answer, is ridiculous. It’s largely to do with the cuts, the police agree on this, the councils agree on this, the only people who don’t, are the tories,and a few middle aged white blokes on this forum.
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Post by felonious on Mar 10, 2019 13:52:07 GMT
You've got a problem then. I got stopped by the police walking home at 4 in the morning from Newcastle. The police were just doing their job. Far from being shitty about it I asked and got a lift home.
Perhaps people should understand that stop and search will benefit local communities whatever their flavour enabling them not to be stabbed and to go about their business without fear of being stabbed. Stopping the police from being able to do this by playing the race card just makes people accessories. Stop and search is not the magic wand but it is a useful tool.
I don’t have a problem at all. They were aggressive and treated me like a I was guilty, which got my 19 year old back up. If that happened to me more than once, I would have started to resent the police. I’m glad you got a lift home, I don’t think you would have in any of the big cities. Newcastle is very different to London. People on here are saying stop and search is the answer, is ridiculous. It’s largely to do with the cuts, the police agree on this, the councils agree on this, the only people who don’t, are the tories,and a few middle aged white blokes on this forum. The police have to deal with a lot of difficult, entitled 19 year olds and similar with an attitude problem and you expect them to be sweet as pie. Stop and search is a useful tool that has been taken away from the police by the racist sayers which now has the effect of rebounding back on the very communities that complain the most.
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Post by prettything on Mar 10, 2019 14:11:18 GMT
I don’t have a problem at all. They were aggressive and treated me like a I was guilty, which got my 19 year old back up. If that happened to me more than once, I would have started to resent the police. I’m glad you got a lift home, I don’t think you would have in any of the big cities. Newcastle is very different to London. People on here are saying stop and search is the answer, is ridiculous. It’s largely to do with the cuts, the police agree on this, the councils agree on this, the only people who don’t, are the tories,and a few middle aged white blokes on this forum. The police have to deal with a lot of difficult, entitled 19 year olds and similar with an attitude problem and you expect them to be sweet as pie. Stop and search is a useful tool that has been taken away from the police by the racist sayers which now has the effect of rebounding back on the very communities that complain the most. You are presuming all 19 years old are entitled. I certainly wasn’t . It did make me resent them for a while, mind. Stop and search is useful when used correctly. It isn’t when any random black youth is a target for it.
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Post by felonious on Mar 10, 2019 14:31:21 GMT
The police have to deal with a lot of difficult, entitled 19 year olds and similar with an attitude problem and you expect them to be sweet as pie. Stop and search is a useful tool that has been taken away from the police by the racist sayers which now has the effect of rebounding back on the very communities that complain the most. You are presuming all 19 years old are entitled. I certainly wasn’t . It did make me resent them for a while, mind. Stop and search is useful when used correctly. It isn’t when any random black youth is a target for it. I aren't presuming anything I was using your example as a 19 year old. I defend the youth of the nation on here more than anyone. My kids are just older than 19 and I can honestly say they would be respectful to the police. The same can be said for their friends.
If the BAME community are responsible disproportionately for knife crime how do you propose to instigate useful stop and search? Do you find the proportionate number of white people just to make the figures look OK?...... or do you follow the arrest data?
I was a random target, walking FFS, what's the problem?
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Post by prettything on Mar 10, 2019 15:27:31 GMT
You are presuming all 19 years old are entitled. I certainly wasn’t . It did make me resent them for a while, mind. Stop and search is useful when used correctly. It isn’t when any random black youth is a target for it. I aren't presuming anything I was using your example as a 19 year old. I defend the youth of the nation on here more than anyone. My kids are just older than 19 and I can honestly say they would be respectful to the police. The same can be said for their friends.
If the BAME community are responsible disproportionately for knife crime how do you propose to instigate useful stop and search? Do you find the proportionate number of white people just to make the figures look OK?...... or do you follow the arrest data?
I was a random target, walking FFS, what's the problem?
Stop and search should be on an evidence based criteria approach and not “randomly” based on colour. I’m glad you defend the youth of the nation , just don’t use the word “entitled” when talking about nineteen year olds, and there will be no confusion.
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Post by crapslinger on Mar 10, 2019 16:24:38 GMT
I aren't presuming anything I was using your example as a 19 year old. I defend the youth of the nation on here more than anyone. My kids are just older than 19 and I can honestly say they would be respectful to the police. The same can be said for their friends.
If the BAME community are responsible disproportionately for knife crime how do you propose to instigate useful stop and search? Do you find the proportionate number of white people just to make the figures look OK?...... or do you follow the arrest data?
I was a random target, walking FFS, what's the problem?
Stop and search should be on an evidence based criteria approach and not “randomly” based on colour. I’m glad you defend the youth of the nation , just don’t use the word “entitled” when talking about nineteen year olds, and there will be no confusion. All the Home Office evidence confirms that the majority of knife crime in our capital is perpetrated by the BME community, is that not clear enough for you.
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Post by prettything on Mar 10, 2019 17:25:56 GMT
Stop and search should be on an evidence based criteria approach and not “randomly” based on colour. I’m glad you defend the youth of the nation , just don’t use the word “entitled” when talking about nineteen year olds, and there will be no confusion. All the Home Office evidence confirms that the majority of knife crime in our capital is perpetrated by the BME community, is that not clear enough for you. Very clear. It doesn’t mean every black youth walking down the street should be searched because they’re black . Do you imagine how persecuted it might make an individual feel and what consequences this approach would cause on the community? Look at the damage this approach has done to the black communities in the US. Stop and search isn’t as effective as other methods, but it’s an obvious means to an end for those who think all of it can be solved with a quick fix.
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Post by crapslinger on Mar 10, 2019 17:39:43 GMT
All the Home Office evidence confirms that the majority of knife crime in our capital is perpetrated by the BME community, is that not clear enough for you. Very clear. It doesn’t mean every black youth walking down the street should be searched because they’re black . Do you imagine how persecuted it might make an individual feel and what consequences this approach would cause on the community? Look at the damage this approach has done to the black communities in the US. Stop and search isn’t as effective as other methods, but it’s an obvious means to an end for those who think all of it can be solved with a quick fix. Surely they realise why they would be targeted, it is a result of the actions of individuals from their own communities, it is not difficult to understand is it if you are innocent you have nothing to worry about if not if you can't do the time don't do the crime. It may encourage the innocent amongst those communities to do more themselves to root out the bad apples, the biggest issue is the people who are committing these crimes they need identifying as quickly as possible if you haven't noticed it is now an epidemic, short term fix or not something has to done and as soon as possible.
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Post by prettything on Mar 10, 2019 17:50:40 GMT
Very clear. It doesn’t mean every black youth walking down the street should be searched because they’re black . Do you imagine how persecuted it might make an individual feel and what consequences this approach would cause on the community? Look at the damage this approach has done to the black communities in the US. Stop and search isn’t as effective as other methods, but it’s an obvious means to an end for those who think all of it can be solved with a quick fix. Surely they realise why they would be targeted, it is a result of the actions of individuals from their own communities, it is not difficult to understand is it if you are innocent you have nothing to worry about if not if you can't do the time don't do the crime. It may encourage the innocent amongst those communities to do more themselves to root out the bad apples, the biggest issue is the people who are committing these crimes they need identifying as quickly as possible if you haven't noticed it is now an epidemic, short term fix or not something has to done and as soon as possible. I agree, it is an epidemic. The “you don’t have anything to worry about if your innocent “ adage is very dangerous, though. You can apply that to everything. Phone tapping, internet snooping powers etc. Innocent people have regularly been searched, sometimes in double figures in the last five years. It makes their own neighbourhoods into a concentration camp if too much power is given away, whilst achieving very little. If Muslims were stopped and searched because most domestic terrorists are brown, it would divide communities and sometimes turn them into exactly what we are trying to avoid. I’m not saying stop and search isn’t a useful tool, but it should be used sparingly and backed by the police officers potential evidence for a search to be justified.
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Post by felonious on Mar 10, 2019 17:56:36 GMT
I aren't presuming anything I was using your example as a 19 year old. I defend the youth of the nation on here more than anyone. My kids are just older than 19 and I can honestly say they would be respectful to the police. The same can be said for their friends.
If the BAME community are responsible disproportionately for knife crime how do you propose to instigate useful stop and search? Do you find the proportionate number of white people just to make the figures look OK?...... or do you follow the arrest data?
I was a random target, walking FFS, what's the problem?
Stop and search should be on an evidence based criteria approach and not “randomly” based on colour. I’m glad you defend the youth of the nation , just don’t use the word “entitled” when talking about nineteen year olds, and there will be no confusion. ....and what if colour is a criteria in that as I understand it the BAME community in England is over represented proportionately in the figures.
I'm sorry that you still have a problem with being stopped by the police. Perhaps it's time to let it go it may be clouding your judgement on all police stop and search cases.
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Post by prettything on Mar 10, 2019 18:00:27 GMT
Stop and search should be on an evidence based criteria approach and not “randomly” based on colour. I’m glad you defend the youth of the nation , just don’t use the word “entitled” when talking about nineteen year olds, and there will be no confusion. ....and what if colour is a criteria in that as I understand it the BAME community in England is over represented proportionately in the figures.
I'm sorry that you still have a problem with being stopped by the police. Perhaps it's time to let it go it may be clouding your judgement on all police stop and search cases.
Very presumptive, and wrong. I’m not angry anymore. Most of family my were police. I felt persecuted at the time, I’m 41 now. I don’t know how I would feel if it continued to happen to me, however.
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