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Post by davejohnno1 on Jul 9, 2017 17:42:16 GMT
Diouf actually played wide that season as much as he played up front, he didn't score a hat trick nor did he take penalties and he missed 5 weeks of the season due to his participation in AFCON. He still outscored Walters. Not that compelling is it? Funny that NOT scoring a hatrick is a point to prove how awesome a forward someone is. The original posters point was about the fact that Diouf would have undoubtedly outscored Walters over the years. On the wafer thin evidence of a season when he scored one goal more than Walters. I don't give a shit whether they were Premier League goals or not. A goal is a goal. And regardless of how many games Diouf missed for the AFCON he played as many if not more games than Walters over the season. But hey, you think the evidence of his superiority over Walters is compelling so... Who said awesome? My view is that both are pretty crap in vital aspects of actually being able to play football but that diouf is less crap than Walters. 1 goal more in the same season, despite not taking penalties and not scoring (or playing) in early season league cup games against lower league opposition is pretty compelling evidence that this is indeed correct.
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Post by thehoof on Jul 9, 2017 17:46:47 GMT
Jon Walters did not score 11 goals in a premier league season.The point the original poster was making is that Diouf is actually only one of 4 players from Stoke to score 10 premier league goals in a season. Wow. 10 goals. That is something. I stand corrected. If it is so easy why did JW not manage it especially as he took penalties-given that the point you were trying to make is that Walters was on a par with Diouf as a striker? Your own argument does not back it up- you wouldn't trust either of them to score 1 in 4 chances, they both work hard and they are both solid professionals, nothing more, nothing less.
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Post by lancashirelad on Jul 11, 2017 19:02:22 GMT
He will be on Radio 5 Live in the next hour, for anyone interested in our ex player.
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Post by lancashirelad on Jul 11, 2017 20:00:30 GMT
Typical Radio 5 Live all top six talk and shit about European players no time for SJW. At least the wife watched Holby in peace.
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Post by Malcolm Clarke on Jul 11, 2017 20:36:09 GMT
The debate about whether SJW or MBD is the better striker based on stats about appearances and goals is not only pointless but also surely flawed on several levels. Both have spent a lot of time playing wide, without complaint, which is the important thing. I remember an experienced manager telling me that one of the reason coaches like SJW is that he has both the intelligence and willingness to do any job his manager wants. Some players have the first but not the second, others have the second but not the first. I suspect that the same can be said of MBD. I thought his performance at right back away at man city was one of the outstanding performances of last season.
But even if someone works out a minutes per goal ratio whilst playing as central striker (with or without penalties), it's still pretty meaningless since it is based on the premiss that goals are the only important measure for someone playing up front. They aren't, particularly in the modern game, where there is much more fluidity in the players behind and wide of the central striker ( or should be ! ) . Going back a few years, there used to be a similar debate about Mama Sidibie where some fans couldn't see beyond a simple goal count to recognise the importance of the contribution he made.
Quite apart from his commitment, workrate etc., SJW is technically a much better player than some on here give him credit for. If he wasn't, he simply could not have played as many PL games as he has.
I'm sorry to see him go, and am not convinced it's a good deal for the club, but I'm always hesitant about thinking I can do other people's jobs better than they can when I'm only in possession of about 20% of the relevant information. I just hope SJW doesn't come back to rub it in, as Thorney did when he returned to score a hat-trick at the Brit.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Jul 14, 2017 18:51:21 GMT
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Post by liathroid on Jul 14, 2017 19:03:39 GMT
Playing Shamrock Rovers a mixture of u17 & 19s as Rovers played in the Europa League last night
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Post by superheroantonius on Jul 14, 2017 19:15:35 GMT
Made some interesting comnents on eir sport ( stoke news now)
He said berahino ' didn't do particularly well ' since arriving in January but was getting picked ahead of him anyway
Superjon said he got the impression ' his face didn't fit'
He implied that four goals in 13 games last season was a better effort than berahino's. Meaning the reason he wasn't getting picked was because ' his face didn't fit '
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Post by superheroantonius on Jul 14, 2017 19:23:54 GMT
Who will score the most goals next season... Walters or berahino?
I am going to guess walters
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Post by thevoid on Jul 14, 2017 20:40:34 GMT
Made some interesting comnents on eir sport ( stoke news now) He said berahino ' didn't do particularly well ' since arriving in January but was getting picked ahead of him anyway Superjon said he got the impression ' his face didn't fit' He implied that four goals in 13 games last season was a better effort than berahino's. Meaning the reason he wasn't getting picked was because ' his face didn't fit ' That's probably what other players thought when TP kept picking him over and over again when he wasn't playing well.
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Post by Kjones9 on Jul 14, 2017 20:46:43 GMT
Who will score the most goals next season... Walters or berahino? I am going to hope walters Fixed that for you and the Norwegian troll.
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Post by Fredrikstad Norway on Jul 14, 2017 20:46:54 GMT
Who will score the most goals next season... Walters or berahino? I am going to guess walters Cannot be rocket science to figure out that. Very low odds on that I guess.
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Post by chamberlain on Jul 14, 2017 20:55:12 GMT
Can we shut up about Walters now, he's a Burnley player
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Post by superheroantonius on Jul 14, 2017 20:57:50 GMT
Who will score the most goals next season... Walters or berahino? I am going to guess walters Cannot be rocket science to figure out that. Very low odds on that I guess. Well we won't know the answer till next may. But if walters has scored more than berahino by then, serious questions need to be asked, as to why we are spending millions to go backwards?
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Post by Pugsley on Jul 14, 2017 21:11:14 GMT
Cannot be rocket science to figure out that. Very low odds on that I guess. Well we won't know the answer till next may. But if walters has scored more than berahino by then, serious questions need to be asked, as to why we are spending millions to go backwards? Mate you might be right. What I find rather piss poor is that you appear to want it to happen and would relish it. Stoke fan? Nah.
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Post by superheroantonius on Jul 14, 2017 21:15:09 GMT
Well we won't know the answer till next may. But if walters has scored more than berahino by then, serious questions need to be asked, as to why we are spending millions to go backwards? Mate you might be right. What I find rather piss poor is that you appear to want it to happen and would relish it. Stoke fan? Nah. [br According to you
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Post by generationex on Jul 14, 2017 21:20:50 GMT
I'll have a quid on SJW scoring more goals than Bera next season. I'm guessing Huth size screw-up approaching.
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Post by liam007 on Jul 14, 2017 21:22:13 GMT
Can we shut up about Walters now, he's a Burnley player Agreed,when they are wearing our badge that is the only time i am interested in any player.Learnt that from my early days when Garth Crooks and Lee Chapman left us, Stoke City moves on.Jon gave us great memories,Stoke City moves on.
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Post by chamberlain on Jul 14, 2017 21:22:48 GMT
I'll have a quid on SJW scoring more goals than Bera next season. I'm guessing Huth size screw-up approaching. Not a chance mate that's why your only willing to bet a quid
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Post by Olgrligm on Jul 14, 2017 21:23:22 GMT
I haven't seen the full interview, but it seems a bit strange of him to say that his face didn't fit. He played for Hughes for what, four years?
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Post by Fredrikstad Norway on Jul 14, 2017 21:33:08 GMT
Cannot be rocket science to figure out that. Very low odds on that I guess. Well we won't know the answer till next may. But if walters has scored more than berahino by then, serious questions need to be asked, as to why we are spending millions to go backwards? Well, I am not optimist regarding Berahino. (as some have noticed) He have scored only 1 goal in his last 40 premier league matches now, and I can`t see any progress in the pre-season matches either. Still, many Stoke fans belive he is the answer to our goal drought. Berahino have scored 23 goals (Mainly in 2014/15) in 118 matches in premier league. 5 of those goals on penalties. That is simply not good enough for a PL-striker.
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Post by thisfootballclub on Jul 14, 2017 21:38:00 GMT
Well we won't know the answer till next may. But if walters has scored more than berahino by then, serious questions need to be asked, as to why we are spending millions to go backwards? Well, I am not optimist regarding Berahino. (as some have noticed) He have scored only 1 goal in his last 40 premier league matches now, and I can`t see any progress in the pre-season matches either. Still, many Stoke fans belive he is the answer to our goal drought. Berahino have scored 23 goals (Mainly in 2014/15) in 118 matches in premier league. 5 of those goals on penalties. That is simply not good enough for a PL-striker. I'm very much willing to give him a chance to prove himself but I agree with your concerns.
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Post by superheroantonius on Jul 14, 2017 21:46:23 GMT
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Post by Fredrikstad Norway on Jul 14, 2017 21:50:58 GMT
Well, I am not optimist regarding Berahino. (as some have noticed) He have scored only 1 goal in his last 40 premier league matches now, and I can`t see any progress in the pre-season matches either. Still, many Stoke fans belive he is the answer to our goal drought. Berahino have scored 23 goals (Mainly in 2014/15) in 118 matches in premier league. 5 of those goals on penalties. That is simply not good enough for a PL-striker. I'm very much willing to give him a chance to prove himself but I agree with your concerns. If that chanse meaning reserv games, I agree with you. We cannot play him in PL before he show his potensial with the reserves. Stoke have a majore striker problem, and even bigger if Arnautovic leaves.
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Post by Gifton on Jul 14, 2017 21:51:01 GMT
The debate about whether SJW or MBD is the better striker based on stats about appearances and goals is not only pointless but also surely flawed on several levels. Both have spent a lot of time playing wide, without complaint, which is the important thing. I remember an experienced manager telling me that one of the reason coaches like SJW is that he has both the intelligence and willingness to do any job his manager wants. Some players have the first but not the second, others have the second but not the first. I suspect that the same can be said of MBD. I thought his performance at right back away at man city was one of the outstanding performances of last season. But even if someone works out a minutes per goal ratio whilst playing as central striker (with or without penalties), it's still pretty meaningless since it is based on the premiss that goals are the only important measure for someone playing up front. They aren't, particularly in the modern game, where there is much more fluidity in the players behind and wide of the central striker ( or should be ! ) . Going back a few years, there used to be a similar debate about Mama Sidibie where some fans couldn't see beyond a simple goal count to recognise the importance of the contribution he made. Quite apart from his commitment, workrate etc., SJW is technically a much better player than some on here give him credit for. If he wasn't, he simply could not have played as many PL games as he has. I'm sorry to see him go, and am not convinced it's a good deal for the club, but I'm always hesitant about thinking I can do other people's jobs better than they can when I'm only in possession of about 20% of the relevant information. I just hope SJW doesn't come back to rub it in, as Thorney did when he returned to score a hat-trick at the Brit. Hear hear Malcolm! Some people seem only able to appreciate a player for technical ability with the ball at their feet. That's only half of the game. Mama is genuinely one of my all time favourite Stoke players. Fuller too, who shone most brightly with Mama by his side. Between them they could turn any long punt into a goalscoring chance. Mama could get a flick on any shit long ball and Ric could make a run to get onto the end of it, then do something special. I'll never forget the Fulham game at home when Mama got injured, a potential win became a draw the second he came off. Whether you agreed with the tactics or not, Mama was essential to the system. When he was injured we continued with plan A but it was futile without Mama.
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Post by Pugsley on Jul 14, 2017 21:53:48 GMT
Fair play to John for playing like he did, given he was carrying a planet sized chip on his shoulder, one which Tiger Woods would be proud of.
My face didn't fit... bollocks.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 14, 2017 22:10:07 GMT
I haven't seen the full interview, but it seems a bit strange of him to say that his face didn't fit. He played for Hughes for what, four years? He played a shit load for Hughes. The bloke is just a twat.
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Post by mrred on Jul 14, 2017 23:16:44 GMT
Fuck off Walters. Hughes gave you far more game time than I ever would have. Just showing more and more that he was only ever about Jon Walters and not Stoke City in his last few years.
Good fucking riddance to the self centred prick.
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Post by terrorofturfmoor on Jul 14, 2017 23:26:27 GMT
He played more than Bojan.... He played more than Diouf.... There was no way he would ever play more than Shaqiri or Arnautovic if all fit.... But he got on more than Sobhi.... At almost 34 Jon, what the fuck do you want????
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Post by chamberlain on Jul 14, 2017 23:31:32 GMT
Bang on fuck off Walters
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