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Post by sonichuth on Aug 20, 2016 17:29:02 GMT
Imbula contributes far more than Whelan, who simply does not put a kick in when that is apparently what he's supposed to be there for. Allen's performance should make Whelan, not the out-of-position Imbula, worry for his starting XI berth. When a player who looks a physical beast gets knocked off the ball by that man mountain Raheem Sterling you are entitled to ask questions. He has absolutely no idea what is going on around him, is very one footed,can't tackle and is an average passer of the ball and loses possession in dangerous areas. Other than that he's fine. I have serious reservations about him and his attitude. I don't know how you can make any judgements about his attitude to be honest. I don't see anything to suggest he isn't working hard. The losing possession thing is frustrating but, again, he is playing out of position, and still looking to do something with the ball.
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Post by Staying up for Grandadstokey on Aug 20, 2016 17:29:19 GMT
He needs a midfield destroyer beside him, to turnover the ball and feed him to move it forward. Something which should've been our main position to address this transfer window . Wanyamma/kante style .... Can't disagree. Whelan offered nothing today and made Imbula and Joe's lives more difficult for it Whelan did OK, if Imbula put in just half of Whelan's effort then he would be a good player.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2016 17:33:53 GMT
When a player who looks a physical beast gets knocked off the ball by that man mountain Raheem Sterling you are entitled to ask questions. He has absolutely no idea what is going on around him, is very one footed,can't tackle and is an average passer of the ball and loses possession in dangerous areas. Other than that he's fine. I have serious reservations about him and his attitude. I don't know how you can make any judgements about his attitude to be honest. I don't see anything to suggest he isn't working hard. The losing possession thing is frustrating but, again, he is playing out of position, and still looking to do something with the ball. Read sids post earlier in the thread. He got it bang on. Jogging back after losing possession does not constitute working hard. Can he actually sprint? For me he has a lot to do. Just because he can go past players does not make him a class midfield player. He needs to up his game massively IMO.
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Aug 20, 2016 17:35:30 GMT
When a player who looks a physical beast gets knocked off the ball by that man mountain Raheem Sterling you are entitled to ask questions. He has absolutely no idea what is going on around him, is very one footed,can't tackle and is an average passer of the ball and loses possession in dangerous areas. Other than that he's fine. I have serious reservations about him and his attitude. I don't know how you can make any judgements about his attitude to be honest. I don't see anything to suggest he isn't working hard. The losing possession thing is frustrating but, again, he is playing out of position, and still looking to do something with the ball. I think it's about him not trying to win it back when he loses it and how he lets players run off him. It's fine having loads of ability but the really good players do the other stuff too. The really frustrating part is that he could be absolutely bloody brilliant if he put his mind to it. To highlight this point he's what, 6 foot and then some? I can't recall him winning a header (I'm sure he has before any pedant tells me he won one against Spurs last season or summat) Now, he's not in the team to win headers I know but that shouldn't stop him doing it when there's a 50/50 in midfield and that's my issue. Like I've said, when he's good he's great but when he's bad he may as well not be on the pitch due to the lack of match nous he appears to have. Hopefully we can get his head in the right place and make him realise there are two sides to the game because what a player he'd be if he got the basics right.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Aug 20, 2016 17:40:08 GMT
Desperately disappointing today. He should have put us ahead but his attempted shot, if you can call it that, with his right foot was laughable.
Clearly he's not prepared to graft for the right to play and he won't realise his potential in this country until he realises what it takes to play in this country.
Why Adam wasn't bought on to replace him, only Hughes knows.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2016 17:40:10 GMT
I don't know how you can make any judgements about his attitude to be honest. I don't see anything to suggest he isn't working hard. The losing possession thing is frustrating but, again, he is playing out of position, and still looking to do something with the ball. I think it's about him not trying to win it back when he loses it and how he lets players run off him. It's fine having loads of ability but the really good players do the other stuff too. The really frustrating part is that he could be absolutely bloody brilliant if he put his mind to it. To highlight this point he's what, 6 foot and then some? I can't recall him winning a header (I'm sure he has before any pedant tells me he won one against Spurs last season or summat) Now, he's not in the team to win headers I know but that shouldn't stop him doing it when there's a 50/50 in midfield and that's my issue. Like I've said, when he's good he's great but when he's bad he may as well not be on the pitch due to the lack of match nous he appears to have. Hopefully we can get his head in the right place and make him realise there are two sides to the game because what a player he'd be if he got the basics right. I completely agree with this Jamo. However we are not talking about a 19 year old here. I hope he can sort it out because we'd have a fantastic midfield but IMO the signs are not good. I don't think anyone can be critisced for expecting more from an 18 million pound player.
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Post by hooftastic on Aug 20, 2016 17:40:36 GMT
Wasn't great but nowhere near our worst player today (Ryan, Diouf or Whelan for me). After he went off we hardly touched the ball for the next 10 minutes.
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Aug 20, 2016 17:42:16 GMT
I think it's about him not trying to win it back when he loses it and how he lets players run off him. It's fine having loads of ability but the really good players do the other stuff too. The really frustrating part is that he could be absolutely bloody brilliant if he put his mind to it. To highlight this point he's what, 6 foot and then some? I can't recall him winning a header (I'm sure he has before any pedant tells me he won one against Spurs last season or summat) Now, he's not in the team to win headers I know but that shouldn't stop him doing it when there's a 50/50 in midfield and that's my issue. Like I've said, when he's good he's great but when he's bad he may as well not be on the pitch due to the lack of match nous he appears to have. Hopefully we can get his head in the right place and make him realise there are two sides to the game because what a player he'd be if he got the basics right. I completely agree with this Jamo. However we are not talking about a 19 year old here. I hope he can sort it out because we'd have a fantastic midfield but IMO the signs are not good. I don't think anyone can be critisced for expecting more from an 18 million pound player. I know what you mean, he's no kid so you'd think it comes down to attitude. As Dave has said above in this league you HAVE to earn the right to play and not just expect it to happen.
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Post by hooftastic on Aug 20, 2016 17:43:32 GMT
I completely agree with this Jamo. However we are not talking about a 19 year old here. I hope he can sort it out because we'd have a fantastic midfield but IMO the signs are not good. I don't think anyone can be critisced for expecting more from an 18 million pound player. I know what you mean, he's no kid so you'd think it comes down to attitude. As Dave has said above in this league you HAVE to earn the right to play and not just expect it to happen. When did we finally start to see Fuller shake off that sort of attitude though? When he was 31 ish?
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Aug 20, 2016 17:47:40 GMT
I know what you mean, he's no kid so you'd think it comes down to attitude. As Dave has said above in this league you HAVE to earn the right to play and not just expect it to happen. When did we finally start to see Fuller shake off that sort of attitude though? When he was 31 ish? Nah he was only 20 when he was at Hearts and Preston.
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Post by itsmorethanagame on Aug 20, 2016 18:12:52 GMT
Imbula personifies Hughes' Stoke. So much potential but ultimately frustrating. Great at times but far too inconsistent. Looks good going forward but not enough end product and lacks defensive awareness.
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Post by sonichuth on Aug 20, 2016 18:32:50 GMT
I don't know how you can make any judgements about his attitude to be honest. I don't see anything to suggest he isn't working hard. The losing possession thing is frustrating but, again, he is playing out of position, and still looking to do something with the ball. I think it's about him not trying to win it back when he loses it and how he lets players run off him. It's fine having loads of ability but the really good players do the other stuff too. The really frustrating part is that he could be absolutely bloody brilliant if he put his mind to it. To highlight this point he's what, 6 foot and then some? I can't recall him winning a header (I'm sure he has before any pedant tells me he won one against Spurs last season or summat) Now, he's not in the team to win headers I know but that shouldn't stop him doing it when there's a 50/50 in midfield and that's my issue. Like I've said, when he's good he's great but when he's bad he may as well not be on the pitch due to the lack of match nous he appears to have. Hopefully we can get his head in the right place and make him realise there are two sides to the game because what a player he'd be if he got the basics right. Okay. First of all, he was PLAYING AS AN ATTACKING MIDFIELDER. How often, really, have you seen Bojan trying to win it back when playing in that role? Height does not equate to power/dominance on the ball. See Crouch. I agree that sometimes he is frustrating and my biggest criticism of him is him trying to take players on rather than play a pass, but given our team, something a bit different is often called for. At least he has the confidence to try and beat players. We need more of that. Also, as another poster said, he may not be '19 years old', but he's only 23 and without a full season in England. Give the lad a break. Maybe focus on the hapless displays from Shawcross and Whelan? No?
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Post by Pugsley on Aug 20, 2016 18:35:30 GMT
The problem with our midfield is Whelan who is utter dog shit.
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Aug 20, 2016 18:41:20 GMT
I think it's about him not trying to win it back when he loses it and how he lets players run off him. It's fine having loads of ability but the really good players do the other stuff too. The really frustrating part is that he could be absolutely bloody brilliant if he put his mind to it. To highlight this point he's what, 6 foot and then some? I can't recall him winning a header (I'm sure he has before any pedant tells me he won one against Spurs last season or summat) Now, he's not in the team to win headers I know but that shouldn't stop him doing it when there's a 50/50 in midfield and that's my issue. Like I've said, when he's good he's great but when he's bad he may as well not be on the pitch due to the lack of match nous he appears to have. Hopefully we can get his head in the right place and make him realise there are two sides to the game because what a player he'd be if he got the basics right. Okay. First of all, he was PLAYING AS AN ATTACKING MIDFIELDER. How often, really, have you seen Bojan trying to win it back when playing in that role? Height does not equate to power/dominance on the ball. See Crouch. I agree that sometimes he is frustrating and my biggest criticism of him is him trying to take players on rather than play a pass, but given our team, something a bit different is often called for. At least he has the confidence to try and beat players. We need more of that. Also, as another poster said, he may not be '19 years old', but he's only 23 and without a full season in England. Give the lad a break. Maybe focus on the hapless displays from Shawcross and Whelan? No? Thing is he doesn't try and win it back when he is playing further back and he needs to. Bojan put more tackles in than he did today and the likes of Arnie work infinitely harder. Talent on the ball doesn't give you a free pass to shirking out of work off the ball (or at least it shouldn't).
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Post by sonichuth on Aug 20, 2016 18:45:10 GMT
Okay. First of all, he was PLAYING AS AN ATTACKING MIDFIELDER. How often, really, have you seen Bojan trying to win it back when playing in that role? Height does not equate to power/dominance on the ball. See Crouch. I agree that sometimes he is frustrating and my biggest criticism of him is him trying to take players on rather than play a pass, but given our team, something a bit different is often called for. At least he has the confidence to try and beat players. We need more of that. Also, as another poster said, he may not be '19 years old', but he's only 23 and without a full season in England. Give the lad a break. Maybe focus on the hapless displays from Shawcross and Whelan? No? Thing is he doesn't try and win it back when he is playing further back and he needs to. Bojan put more tackles in than he did today and the likes of Arnie work infinitely harder. Talent on the ball doesn't give you a free pass to shirking out of work off the ball (or at least it shouldn't). When he's playing in his actual position I don't think he shirks from off the ball work at all. Bojan never tackles when playing as AMC. He had to do more today due to Man City's use of wide players and full backs. Again, I really don't think he's lazy or a shirker. He was used wrongly today.
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Aug 20, 2016 18:46:32 GMT
Thing is he doesn't try and win it back when he is playing further back and he needs to. Bojan put more tackles in than he did today and the likes of Arnie work infinitely harder. Talent on the ball doesn't give you a free pass to shirking out of work off the ball (or at least it shouldn't). When he's playing in his actual position I don't think he shirks from off the ball work at all. Bojan never tackles when playing as AMC. He had to do more today due to Man City's use of wide players and full backs. Again, I really don't think he's lazy or a shirker. He was used wrongly today. We'll agree to disagree then as I think it's the major flaw in his game.
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Post by alster on Aug 20, 2016 18:59:42 GMT
I'm struggling to get my head around his performances. I thought he was smashing last week, then today I thought he was still in bed. There seems to be nothing in between he's either great or absolutely shit. The management must be as confused in some ways it would be easier if he was just a plain old dropped bollock but you just don't know which Imbula is going to turn up.
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Post by no1972 on Aug 20, 2016 19:02:27 GMT
I'm struggling to get my head around his performances. I thought he was smashing last week, then today I thought he was still in bed. There seems to be nothing in between he's either great or absolutely shit. The management must be as confused in some ways it would be easier if he was just a plain old dropped bollock but you just don't know which Imbula is going to turn up. He was good last week against championship players ,like against Bournmouth last season.
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Post by wuzza on Aug 20, 2016 19:06:30 GMT
I'm struggling to get my head around his performances. I thought he was smashing last week, then today I thought he was still in bed. There seems to be nothing in between he's either great or absolutely shit. The management must be as confused in some ways it would be easier if he was just a plain old dropped bollock but you just don't know which Imbula is going to turn up. He was good last week against championship players ,like against Bournmouth last season. I think there is an element of truth in this. The old 'flat track bully' syndrome. Likes it when he is able to dictate the pace of things, struggles badly when the opposition bring it on to him.
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Post by alster on Aug 20, 2016 19:08:11 GMT
No sorry I'm not having that, the opposition are irrelevant last week he was switched on this week he was plain dozy he'd have looked dozy if we were playing the vale. What the fook is up with him?
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 20, 2016 19:10:11 GMT
The problem with our midfield is Whelan who is utter dog shit. The problem with our midfield is that the manager does not know the best positions to play them in, Whelan has been a fantastic servant to our club however he is getting on now, let's hope Imbula gives us comparative value for money !, we seem to be at a turning point as we were at the end of last season Hughes needs to sort the right path and quickly. Allen looks to be one of his best signings along with Arnie, the rest are not pulling up any trees what concerns me is that he still has to turn to the old guard to put some fire and motivation into the team, Charlie Adam was the right man for this game !
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Post by march4 on Aug 20, 2016 19:14:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2016 19:15:04 GMT
I'm struggling to get my head around his performances. I thought he was smashing last week, then today I thought he was still in bed. There seems to be nothing in between he's either great or absolutely shit. The management must be as confused in some ways it would be easier if he was just a plain old dropped bollock but you just don't know which Imbula is going to turn up. He was good last week against championship players ,like against Bournmouth last season. He didn't particularly impress me last week. He may have been one of our better performers,but collectively as a team last week we were fucking shit.
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Post by Miles Offside on Aug 20, 2016 19:17:33 GMT
He's not brilliant though is he? What has he actually done to deserve that label? I thought he was absolutely awful today. IMO he's a real worry. Shows the occasional flash of something special, but certainly hasn't done enough since he's been here to qualify for the "brilliant player" tag. He needs to work harder (he's not the only one).
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Post by manmarking on Aug 20, 2016 19:20:32 GMT
Desperately disappointing today. He should have put us ahead but his attempted shot, if you can call it that, with his right foot was laughable. Clearly he's not prepared to graft for the right to play and he won't realise his potential in this country until he realises what it takes to play in this country. Why Adam wasn't bought on to replace him, only Hughes knows. Harsh to blame him for the shot mate. He's left-footed. Would you judge Charlie so harshly if he'd cocked up a right footed shot?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2016 19:21:05 GMT
I'm not surprised March. It is laughable. If I was in the tunnel before a game and Imbula was standing opposite me with gloves on in August I'd laugh my bollocks off and immediately think "right lads we've got a right pussy playing against us today,let's get into these fuckers". I wonder what Sparky thinks of his glove wearing? Probably the same as me but he can't admit it in public.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2016 19:22:12 GMT
Desperately disappointing today. He should have put us ahead but his attempted shot, if you can call it that, with his right foot was laughable. Clearly he's not prepared to graft for the right to play and he won't realise his potential in this country until he realises what it takes to play in this country. Why Adam wasn't bought on to replace him, only Hughes knows. Harsh to blame him for the shot mate. He's left-footed. Would you judge Charlie so harshly if he'd cocked up a right footed shot? Not that harsh when you consider he cost £18 million really
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Post by manmarking on Aug 20, 2016 19:27:12 GMT
Harsh to blame him for the shot mate. He's left-footed. Would you judge Charlie so harshly if he'd cocked up a right footed shot? Not that harsh when you consider he cost £18 million really Like it or not, £18m is chicken feed these days sid. And there are plenty of very good players who can't use one of their feet. For what it's worth I agree with George Best - they should be able to use both - but the reality is that lots can't. Bummer but that's life. You'd have got the same outcome if Whelan, Arnie or Bojan or had attempted a left foot shot
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2016 19:27:25 GMT
He's not brilliant though is he? What has he actually done to deserve that label? I thought he was absolutely awful today. IMO he's a real worry. Shows the occasional flash of something special, but certainly hasn't done enough since he's been here to qualify for the "brilliant player" tag. He needs to work harder (he's not the only one). he shows flashes of brilliance with dribbling and powerful ball sheilding.......if he could release the ball quicker he would be a ledge
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2016 19:30:57 GMT
Shows the occasional flash of something special, but certainly hasn't done enough since he's been here to qualify for the "brilliant player" tag. He needs to work harder (he's not the only one). he shows flashes of brilliance with dribbling and powerful ball sheilding.......if he could release the ball quicker he would be a ledge Footballers at any level can show flashes of brilliance it those that do it consistently that get labelled as brilliant.
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