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Post by milky on Nov 29, 2015 12:50:36 GMT
I've a lot of time for Jon but for the last few games we have seen the TP 700 games in a row version.
I can well understand Sparky not changing a winning team but after yesterday I'd be amazed if he doesn't now give Mame the shirt for the next game.
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Post by rawli on Nov 29, 2015 13:03:32 GMT
Agree, it's dissappointing but hardly the end of the world. Tuesdays far more important. Sent from my HTC One_M8 using proboards Yes. I hope we haven't become the sort of mardarses who shrivel up and blart at a defeat. What do you mean 'become' ?
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Post by wuzza on Nov 29, 2015 13:03:34 GMT
Are people suggesting the attacking play going on around Walters is satisfactory? Sorry I just don't see that and even in a game where we did create a good number of chances last week it was other people guilty of some fairly shocking misses. Our lack of goals is a bigger issue than just Jon Walters.
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Post by Paddypotter on Nov 29, 2015 13:33:54 GMT
When we were down to 10 men, Walters was caught offside twice. He should be more aware of his position when the team under pressure needs an outlet. having said that his lack of ball control, pace and football brain, meant if the ball reached him without an opposition player near him to fall over, he would have to actually beat a defender, which is a rare thing if he's facing the wrong way.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Nov 29, 2015 14:00:24 GMT
When we were down to 10 men, Walters was caught offside twice. He should be more aware of his position when the team under pressure needs an outlet. having said that his lack of ball control, pace and football brain, meant if the ball reached him without an opposition player near him to fall over, he would have to actually beat a defender, which is a rare thing if he's facing the wrong way. His ability to be consistently offside is annoyingly tiresome.
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Post by spoton on Nov 29, 2015 14:12:29 GMT
I'm no great lover of Walters but let's get the facts right his effort was on target it was well saved so he did not miss,if people keep saying he missed then Adam missed his header,Arnie missed his shot ,bogan missed his shot,when Hazard penalty was well saved by Butland it was on target ,what we need more is to get more attempts on target
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Post by kustokie on Nov 29, 2015 14:15:49 GMT
I take that to mean you believe Sparky had a better plan than Fat Sam and the players just didn't execute? Bit of both. The players weren't at it, although I think we would have nicked it with the full eleven on the pitch. We were slower to the ball too many times, which accounted for all the yellow cards from the usual suspects, Charlie, Erik and Ryan. Ryan being sent off (unfairly) and having to re-shape our attacking midfield to reinforce the defence just threw the tactics out of the window. I can't subscribe to your notion that BFS set up his team to get our players sent off. I was possibly a bit rude to you, but I'd just got back from the 300mile round trip to SoL, driving throuh crap weather with my oil warning light flashing at me. I needed cheering up, and wasnt too tolerant of any negative vibes. Soz, mate. No, problem mate. I was bit disappointed too. We seem to be so close to being a top team and then Fat Sam, who's good at what he does, set up to frustrate us and we had no answer. Oh well, already looking forward to Tuesday. I wish I was there! If they win I'm booking a flight for February!
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Post by foxysgloves on Nov 29, 2015 15:52:27 GMT
Keep piling on the hate. It usually results in Walters making you and the other haters look a bit silly. I'm commenting on one game where he was absolutely fucking useless. If you cant handle that and feel the need to blindly defend him no matter what then fill your boots. Is he your son? Walters will never prove me wrong. Never has, never will. He has his strengths, is great to have around the club and in the squad and he will no doubt dine out on another good game for several months in the near future. I'm not blindly defending him at all. He was poor and is starting to look overused and in need of a break. You, on the other hand, appear blind to all the good things he has brought to our club and interested only in focusing on the negatives. And no, I'm not his father.....on that note....did he run over your dog? No, don't tell me, he somehow missed him when it seemed impossible not to run him over. Typical SJW eh?
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Post by foxysgloves on Nov 29, 2015 15:54:12 GMT
Not even Walty's most ardent admirers could say he played well at Sunderland. He was like a paving slab. Foxygloves can! Errrrr...but I didn't.
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Post by foxysgloves on Nov 29, 2015 15:56:01 GMT
Are people suggesting the attacking play going on around Walters is satisfactory? Sorry I just don't see that and even in a game where we did create a good number of chances last week it was other people guilty of some fairly shocking misses. Our lack of goals is a bigger issue than just Jon Walters. Absolutely. But a large section of our support love a scapegoat and Jon fits the bill nicely. Any possible connection with a certain former manager is of course incidental and completely inconsequential. Allegedly.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Nov 29, 2015 15:59:06 GMT
I'm commenting on one game where he was absolutely fucking useless. If you cant handle that and feel the need to blindly defend him no matter what then fill your boots. Is he your son? Walters will never prove me wrong. Never has, never will. He has his strengths, is great to have around the club and in the squad and he will no doubt dine out on another good game for several months in the near future. I'm not blindly defending him at all. He was poor and is starting to look overused and in need of a break. You, on the other hand, appear blind to all the good things he has brought to our club and interested only in focusing on the negatives. And no, I'm not his father.....on that note....did he run over your dog? No, don't tell me, he somehow missed him when it seemed impossible not to run him over. Typical SJW eh? I've commented ample times when he's done well as you well know. I don't have a dog but if I did I'd name him johnny Walters and give him a balloon to play with!
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Post by foxysgloves on Nov 29, 2015 15:59:33 GMT
I've a lot of time for Jon but for the last few games we have seen the TP 700 games in a row version. I can well understand Sparky not changing a winning team but after yesterday I'd be amazed if he doesn't now give Mame the shirt for the next game. I think he'd be right to. I just hope Mame is right for it. After what he's been through you'd think he might be struggling to get mentally focused. I've a feeling it's why we haven't seen too much of him. When Charlie was going through something similar I think his form dipped noticeably. Totally understandable and just a case of give them the support and time they need.
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Post by foxysgloves on Nov 29, 2015 16:01:12 GMT
I'm not blindly defending him at all. He was poor and is starting to look overused and in need of a break. You, on the other hand, appear blind to all the good things he has brought to our club and interested only in focusing on the negatives. And no, I'm not his father.....on that note....did he run over your dog? No, don't tell me, he somehow missed him when it seemed impossible not to run him over. Typical SJW eh? I've commented ample times when he's done well as you well know. I don't have a dog but if I did I'd name him johnny Walters and give him a balloon to play with! Let's be honest Dave, any praise is begrudgingly given while you leap on his failings gleefully.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Nov 29, 2015 16:04:38 GMT
I've commented ample times when he's done well as you well know. I don't have a dog but if I did I'd name him johnny Walters and give him a balloon to play with! Let's be honest Dave, any praise is begrudgingly given while you leap on his failings gleefully. Whilst you criticise him begrudgingly. I waxed lyrical about Walters last season when we needed our leaders to step up to the plate and he did just that. I'm more than happy to give credit where its due. The simple facts are that his last decent game in a stoke shirt came months ago v Leicester. Since then he's got steadily worse, culminating in his utterly abysmal performance yesterday.
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Post by samba :) on Nov 29, 2015 16:06:15 GMT
Vale lost
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Post by mondeoman on Nov 29, 2015 16:19:18 GMT
All of them, 1, and that's only for turning up.
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Post by foxysgloves on Nov 29, 2015 16:20:44 GMT
Let's be honest Dave, any praise is begrudgingly given while you leap on his failings gleefully. Whilst you criticise him begrudgingly. I waxed lyrical about Walters last season when we needed our leaders to step up to the plate and he did just that. I'm more than happy to give credit where its due. The simple facts are that his last decent game in a stoke shirt came months ago v Leicester. Since then he's got steadily worse, culminating in his utterly abysmal performance yesterday. I hate criticising our players. It reminds me of the dark days when there was virtually nothing to praise and an endless amount to criticise. These days it's harder and harder for me to find things or players in our team I don't see any positives in. When I have criticised (eg Wooly) I've usually been proved wrong. We lost. We played poorly. Our squad is thin in places. Take it on the chin. Move on and focus on Tuesday. We gain nothing out of scapegoating players.....that said it usually fires Walters up so it might not be an entirely bad thing.
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Post by samba :) on Nov 29, 2015 16:25:46 GMT
Why isn't Wolly rated lower than Shawcross? I thought that's how the oatcake works. it was Wolly leaving shawx alone for the red
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Post by kustokie on Nov 29, 2015 16:41:20 GMT
If Sunderland sit back and try to hit us on the counter, we'll struggle to a low score draw or a 1-0 win. If they press up the field, we'll batter them by 3 or 4. I'm an effing genius. LOL.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 16:49:44 GMT
When Stoke City lose so predictably and needlessly as they did yesterday, my own personal way to overcome the now crushing disappointnent is thus:
to totally boycott the sport for at least 24 hours
i.e Other scores = not interested league table = not interested 5.30 pm kick off = not interested Motd = not interested Sunday games = not interested League table sunday night = not interested
any other football anywhere = not fucking interested
(not even how Wrexham -my non league team - did)
as my brother said earlier today (robo 51 - its his birthday today too) - he didnt really mind us losing yesterday as long as we win on Tuesday
For me, I remain far more annoyed than that, having watched it unfold so painfully and predictably yesterday
lack of penetration - side to side passing - unwillingness to do the hard work - complacancy even, needless bookings and the inevitable sending off - inability to deal with such a very, very ordinary - substitute player who near terrorized them by just 'having a go' - dumb ill timed substitutions and an almost collective willngeness to roll over and throw three valuable - easy even, points away against what is in truth a pretty rubbish football team
I remain very annoyed and, gutted
BETTER GET YOUR COLLECTIVE FUCKING ACT TOGETHER TUESDAY - thats All I can say !
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Post by Kjones9 on Nov 29, 2015 16:51:28 GMT
Or what?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 16:51:59 GMT
I will send a plague of locusts
and at the very least - they will lose a very good chance to get to a cup final
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 17:08:46 GMT
To me whilst Stoke were pretty Rubbish However, Sundelrand gave a perfect masterclass at just how desparate you can be to stay in the premier league
and absolutely anything ---goes
fair means or foul
classic 'Allardyce win at all costs' stuff
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Post by milky on Nov 29, 2015 17:24:46 GMT
I've a lot of time for Jon but for the last few games we have seen the TP 700 games in a row version. I can well understand Sparky not changing a winning team but after yesterday I'd be amazed if he doesn't now give Mame the shirt for the next game. I think he'd be right to. I just hope Mame is right for it. After what he's been through you'd think he might be struggling to get mentally focused. I've a feeling it's why we haven't seen too much of him. When Charlie was going through something similar I think his form dipped noticeably. Totally understandable and just a case of give them the support and time they need. Absolutely. None of us know how Mame is but the management are seeing him day to day and they will know if he is ready. He didn't look right to me yesterday but due to the circumstances it wasn't really fair to judge him. I expect he will play Tuesday mind...
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Post by foxysgloves on Nov 29, 2015 17:38:51 GMT
I think he'd be right to. I just hope Mame is right for it. After what he's been through you'd think he might be struggling to get mentally focused. I've a feeling it's why we haven't seen too much of him. When Charlie was going through something similar I think his form dipped noticeably. Totally understandable and just a case of give them the support and time they need. Absolutely. None of us know how Mame is but the management are seeing him day to day and they will know if he is ready. He didn't look right to me yesterday but due to the circumstances it wasn't really fair to judge him. I expect he will play Tuesday mind... If he's right he should play Tuesday. Jon clearly needs a rest and we need to be as strong as we can be. Once Mame has the shirt it's his to lose....if someone (Anybody!!) can bag goals consistently from that position then we should see the top 8 team we all crave.
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Post by rawli on Nov 29, 2015 17:42:48 GMT
To me whilst Stoke were pretty Rubbish However, Sundelrand gave a perfect masterclass at just how desparate you can be to stay in the premier league and absolutely anything ---goes fair means or foul classic 'Allardyce win at all costs' stuff That's the trouble. Given the cost of relegation and the financial incentives managers are on to keep teams up, anything does go.
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Post by milky on Nov 29, 2015 17:45:17 GMT
Absolutely. None of us know how Mame is but the management are seeing him day to day and they will know if he is ready. He didn't look right to me yesterday but due to the circumstances it wasn't really fair to judge him. I expect he will play Tuesday mind... If he's right he should play Tuesday. Jon clearly needs a rest and we need to be as strong as we can be. Once Mame has the shirt it's his to lose....if someone (Anybody!!) can bag goals consistently from that position then we should see the top 8 team we all crave. To be fair its usually how it is with Sparky.He generally doesn't tinker and seems to adopt a your shirt to lose policy. And rightly so. Jons time will come again and hopefully we will get the rejuvenated and effective JW who is a total pain in the arse for defenders when that time comes.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 17:54:54 GMT
Absolutely. None of us know how Mame is but the management are seeing him day to day and they will know if he is ready. He didn't look right to me yesterday but due to the circumstances it wasn't really fair to judge him. I expect he will play Tuesday mind... If he's right he should play Tuesday. Jon clearly needs a rest and we need to be as strong as we can be. Once Mame has the shirt it's his to lose....if someone (Anybody!!) can bag goals consistently from that position then we should see the top 8 team we all crave. I think mame still is our first choice striker, but after recent events i think hughes is giving him a little more time to grieve without making him feel pushed out. Maybe a little enthusiasm has gone from his game in training which is to be expected under the circumstances, but once he is ready he will surely be back up top.
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Post by capto on Nov 29, 2015 18:08:40 GMT
To me whilst Stoke were pretty Rubbish However, Sundelrand gave a perfect masterclass at just how desparate you can be to stay in the premier league and absolutely anything ---goes fair means or foul classic 'Allardyce win at all costs' stuff That's the trouble. Given the cost of relegation and the financial incentives managers are on to keep teams up, anything does go. surely not just the managers tho? the owners too, who probably 'lean' on the manager to get a result at any cost?
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Post by pottersrule on Nov 29, 2015 18:29:04 GMT
One of our coaches broke down on the way home yesterday, not sure where just heard when we got back to Stoke. Hope everybody was ok.Weather was horrendous coming over the M62, the wind blew one of our wipers off and the driver had to stop to sort it out.End of a perfect day really add to that the bloke sitting next to me keep farting and they smelt!!! It was bad enough driving home yesterday, i think i would have walked,rather than suffer a journey on one of those funeral buses.
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