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Post by Gary Hackett on Sept 12, 2015 23:29:08 GMT
Unbalanced team.
Spine totally gone.
I said months ago letting Huth go would be Hughes worst decision as Stoke manager.
Neither Cameron or Muniesa are solid enough for us.
No decent box to box to box midfielder on the books, Van Ginkel is not the answer right now.
January will need to be a big transfer window..
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Post by chiefdelilah on Sept 12, 2015 23:30:08 GMT
It is one bad game yeah. He was our man of the match against Liverpool and West Brom. Hhe has been our best outfield player this season. Why is he the problem more than anyone else? I don't think he is more than anybody else. I think he's a factor. We keep getting overrun in midfield, with teams creating too many chances against us. Something is wrong, either with the system or the players. We can't control the midfield at the moment(I accept we never do against Arsenal). I realize I am in the minority, but I don't think Whelan is as good as many on here do. Just my opinion. I don't know what you want him to do as a holding midfield player that he isn't doing.
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Post by samba :) on Sept 12, 2015 23:31:28 GMT
If diouf had of scored his complete sitter today everything would be rosey (the one where he was in the box and went offside for no reason
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Post by trickydicky73 on Sept 12, 2015 23:31:47 GMT
I don't think he is more than anybody else. I think he's a factor. We keep getting overrun in midfield, with teams creating too many chances against us. Something is wrong, either with the system or the players. We can't control the midfield at the moment(I accept we never do against Arsenal). I realize I am in the minority, but I don't think Whelan is as good as many on here do. Just my opinion. I don't know what you want him to do as a holding midfield player that he isn't doing. Hold?
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Post by LphPotter on Sept 12, 2015 23:36:16 GMT
Unbalanced team. Spine totally gone. I said months ago letting Huth go would be Hughes worst decision as Stoke manager.Neither Cameron or Muniesa are solid enough for us. No decent box to box to box midfielder on the books, Van Ginkel is not the answer right now. January will need to be a big transfer window.. I don't understand this! Huth barely played a game for us in 2 consecutive 9th placed finishes.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Sept 12, 2015 23:46:46 GMT
I don't know what you want him to do as a holding midfield player that he isn't doing. Hold? He's done that brilliantly in the vast majority of games he's played under Hughes. He sits, he plugs the gaps, he keeps it simple, he protects the back four. That's his job, and I don't see the argument that he hasn't done that very well during the past few seasons and this season thus far.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Sept 12, 2015 23:52:55 GMT
Hold? He's done that brilliantly in the vast majority of games he's played under Hughes. He sits, he plugs the gaps, he keeps it simple, he protects the back four. That's his job, and I don't see the argument that he hasn't done that very well during the past few seasons and this season thus far. I didn't see the match today, due to work commitments, but who protected the back four today? Was it just a case of Arsenal being very good or was Glen isolated, again. You make a fair point on Whelan's play overall, and he never hides, I'll give him that.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Sept 13, 2015 0:02:04 GMT
He's done that brilliantly in the vast majority of games he's played under Hughes. He sits, he plugs the gaps, he keeps it simple, he protects the back four. That's his job, and I don't see the argument that he hasn't done that very well during the past few seasons and this season thus far. I didn't see the match today, due to work commitments, but who protected the back four today? Was it just a case of Arsenal being very good or was Glen isolated, again. You make a fair point on Whelan's play overall, and he never hides, I'll give him that. Glenn was shocking today. But I don't see what dropping him is going to achieve. We don't have anyone in the squad better at his job than him.
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Post by LphPotter on Sept 13, 2015 0:06:45 GMT
Wait, what? Drop Whelan?
Why did i come on here..
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Post by kustokie on Sept 13, 2015 0:22:49 GMT
Unbalanced team. Spine totally gone. I said months ago letting Huth go would be Hughes worst decision as Stoke manager. Neither Cameron or Muniesa are solid enough for us. No decent box to box to box midfielder on the books, Van Ginkel is not the answer right now. January will need to be a big transfer window.. I remember Ferguson saying he never held much faith in the January window because there was rarely anyone worth signing. Think about who we'll be looking off-load: Sidwell, Wollscheidt, Teixiera, Bardsley etc. Walters is worth picking up. The rest will go into oblivion or back where they came from.
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Post by kustokie on Sept 13, 2015 0:23:19 GMT
Unbalanced team. Spine totally gone. I said months ago letting Huth go would be Hughes worst decision as Stoke manager. Neither Cameron or Muniesa are solid enough for us. No decent box to box to box midfielder on the books, Van Ginkel is not the answer right now. January will need to be a big transfer window.. I remember Ferguson saying he never held much faith in the January window because there was rarely anyone worth signing. Think about who we'll be looking off-load: Sidwell, Wollscheidt, Teixiera, Bardsley etc. Walters is worth picking up. The rest will go into oblivion or back where they came from.
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Post by Gods on Sept 13, 2015 0:32:50 GMT
Unbalanced team. Spine totally gone. I said months ago letting Huth go would be Hughes worst decision as Stoke manager. Neither Cameron or Muniesa are solid enough for us. No decent box to box to box midfielder on the books, Van Ginkel is not the answer right now. January will need to be a big transfer window.. I remember Ferguson saying he never held much faith in the January window because there was rarely anyone worth signing. Think about who we'll be looking off-load: Sidwell, Wollscheidt, Teixiera, Bardsley etc. Walters is worth picking up. The rest will go into oblivion or back where they came from. You can say that again
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Post by kustokie on Sept 13, 2015 0:42:00 GMT
I didn't see the match today, due to work commitments, but who protected the back four today? Was it just a case of Arsenal being very good or was Glen isolated, again. You make a fair point on Whelan's play overall, and he never hides, I'll give him that. Glenn was shocking today. But I don't see what dropping him is going to achieve. We don't have anyone in the squad better at his job than him. All the midfielders were shocking today because it was 4 against 5 and they were set up to fail. They were over-run from the kick-off. To be perfectly honest (as Sparky would say), the game was lost before a ball was kicked. Not sure whose bright idea it was to play 4 midfielders (2 new to the set-up) against 5 world class players who were used to playing together and expect anything else. Crazy. The penny finally dropped after 57 minutes when he brought on Ireland for Joselu, which, although made sense was a bit late, and then Bojan after 75 min for Diouf (FFS) instead of Arnie or Shaq. So we started the game with 4 in midfield and 2 up front and ended with 5 in midfield and Arnie up front - pure genius. The final result may well have been the same if we'd played with 2-3 in the middle (Cameron and Whelan, Arnie, Ireland (or Bojan) and Shaq but it wouldn't have been such an embarrasment, the team would have been more settled and Butland definitely would not have been any where near as busy. Possession is not always a good indicator of how well a team has played, especially away, but 70% Arse tells it all.
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Post by stokemanusa on Sept 13, 2015 4:28:44 GMT
Need Cameron in midfield, Wilson at cb until Shawcross comes back. Been saying it since the pre-season defined by each week we get out battled in midfield...
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Post by malteser68 on Sept 13, 2015 5:10:20 GMT
Unbalanced team. Spine totally gone. I said months ago letting Huth go would be Hughes worst decision as Stoke manager. Neither Cameron or Muniesa are solid enough for us. No decent box to box to box midfielder on the books, Van Ginkel is not the answer right now. January will need to be a big transfer window.. Agreed We need to save ourselves in January as we did in season 1 in the prem If we don't sign the proper reinforcements then, we're ducked
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Post by malteser68 on Sept 13, 2015 5:12:57 GMT
Glenn was shocking today. But I don't see what dropping him is going to achieve. We don't have anyone in the squad better at his job than him. All the midfielders were shocking today because it was 4 against 5 and they were set up to fail. They were over-run from the kick-off. To be perfectly honest (as Sparky would say), the game was lost before a ball was kicked. Not sure whose bright idea it was to play 4 midfielders (2 new to the set-up) against 5 world class players who were used to playing together and expect anything else. Crazy. The penny finally dropped after 57 minutes when he brought on Ireland for Joselu, which, although made sense was a bit late, and then Bojan after 75 min for Diouf (FFS) instead of Arnie or Shaq. So we started the game with 4 in midfield and 2 up front and ended with 5 in midfield and Arnie up front - pure genius. The final result may well have been the same if we'd played with 2-3 in the middle (Cameron and Whelan, Arnie, Ireland (or Bojan) and Shaq but it wouldn't have been such an embarrasment, the team would have been more settled and Butland definitely would not have been any where near as busy. Possession is not always a good indicator of how well a team has played, especially away, but 70% Arse tells it all. The possession stat does not worry coz it's quite normal when playing vs gifted teams like arsenal But usually it's mostly sterile possession It's the stat showing the amount of chances they created that's truly shocking
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Post by foxysgloves on Sept 13, 2015 8:12:57 GMT
We're not shit. The manager's not shit. We ARE worryingly light in key areas. We DO seem to currently lack a coherent game plan that suits the players we have. We DO need to sort it fast to avoid a messy relegation battle. I'm still confident we have the right manager and enough quality in the squad to ease ourselves into midtable but it's pointless pretending we're not significantly short of the side we all want us to be. The only area where I'd say we were worryingly light is centre half tbh. My worry is that we've got lots of options in midfield and upfront but Hughes doesn't seem to know which options are best. Just look at the midfielders he's got to choose five from: Affelay Ireland Adam Shaqiri Walters Whelan Van Ginkel Arnie Bojan. Strikers we have Diouf, Crouch Walters (again) and Joselu to pick one from. I know it's a strange thing to say but I think Hughes has too many options in midfield and upfront. I agree to an extent but I think we're overly reliant on Whelan to do the graft and add presence in the middle. He's currently doing his own share of the dirty work and also trying to do the significant share of dirty work Zonz did. From what I've seen Affellay and MVG are either incapable of, or don't want to, do the dirty work. For me we're a dominant CB and an energetic, ball winning box to box midfielder from a very good side. But, worryingly, without those two players we're potential relegation fodder. Much bigger clubs than us with much better players have, in the past, fallen into the old "too good to go down" bracket. I'm confident MH and team won't allow that to happen but we need to start picking up points soon.
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Post by Bombus on Sept 13, 2015 8:16:48 GMT
Not worried at all, we will get going. People need to calm down. +1
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Post by cobhamstokey on Sept 13, 2015 8:19:39 GMT
Need Cameron in midfield, Wilson at cb until Shawcross comes back. Been saying it since the pre-season defined by each week we get out battled in midfield... Agreed. I do have a feeling that there was more to the window than has been disclosed. This whole issue could have been resolved quite cheaply on the grand scale of things by bringing in Collins from West Ham and Jedinak from Palace to make us solid. I have a feeling that Scholes did his accountant bit and said no more spending on short term solutions
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Post by stokemark on Sept 13, 2015 8:29:25 GMT
Need Cameron in midfield, Wilson at cb until Shawcross comes back. Been saying it since the pre-season defined by each week we get out battled in midfield... Agreed. I do have a feeling that there was more to the window than has been disclosed. This whole issue could have been resolved quite cheaply on the grand scale of things by bringing in Collins from West Ham and Jedinak from Palace to make us solid. I have a feeling that Scholes did his accountant bit and said no more spending on short term solutions I think you are right but Hughes is culpable by spending the best part of £10m on a player we didn't need (Joselu) and one even he clearly doesn't rate (Wolscheid)
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Post by chiefdelilah on Sept 13, 2015 8:31:21 GMT
Why didn't we need Joselu again?
If Diouf got injured, would people really have been happy with three 30-somethings as cover?
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 13, 2015 8:32:11 GMT
Think we gave them too much respect and stood off them. We needed to be up close and physical. They had been under the cosh at home and set out to prove they are a good side, which they did. Always factored in losing this one. Butland was tremendous but would like to see him bollicking his defence more. For all those who thought Johnson was finished, he isn't and we missed him. Bojan back on the pitch was good to see even though he didn't do much.
We are two points behind Chelsea, which gives an indication of how meaningless the table is.
The other good thing was that Hughes has publicly said the defence needs addressing. I am sure he will do just that.
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 13, 2015 8:38:05 GMT
Why didn't we need Joselu again? If Diouf got injured, would people really have been happy with three 30-somethings as cover? I remember some writing off Diouf, now it's Joselu's turn. He has had very little game time and will adjust. He's a good player, a great compromise between Diouf's speed and Crouch's target man role. As you say, better than a 30 something replacement.
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Post by Pugsley on Sept 13, 2015 8:51:40 GMT
Why didn't we need Joselu again? If Diouf got injured, would people really have been happy with three 30-somethings as cover? One who has a dodgy knee and looks 'gone' One who doesn't want to be here One who is a bit part player As Sheiky keeps saying, the concern over a billionaires wallet is mind boggling. We're literally dripping in money, more than enough to sign all the players we need. I don't get what the club are trying to do, other than Bet365 trying to claw back all the money they have invested.
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Post by nutterpotter on Sept 13, 2015 9:02:25 GMT
Swansea at home last season? Changed the game completely. Arsenal at home on his debut. Was MOTM.
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Post by jackcity on Sept 13, 2015 9:48:57 GMT
Marc Wilson is by far the better CB available may not be fully fit yet but at least he can organise that back line and before anyone says he switches of and is sure to make an error every game that costs us that's exactly what's happening since he has been out but because it's not Marc it's ok for a few chosen players to make mistakes without getting the abuse Wilson gets, and they must be making the same mistakes we are bottom and still conceding goals The last two seasons have been great finishes for us and he played 33 and 27 games before he was injured I for one think he is the answer to CB
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Post by crapslinger on Sept 13, 2015 9:54:25 GMT
Unbalanced team. Spine totally gone. I said months ago letting Huth go would be Hughes worst decision as Stoke manager.Neither Cameron or Muniesa are solid enough for us. No decent box to box to box midfielder on the books, Van Ginkel is not the answer right now. January will need to be a big transfer window.. I don't understand this! Huth barely played a game for us in 2 consecutive 9th placed finishes. Not difficult really Ryan played in the majority of those games, Ryan is out we needed a fit Robert Huth to step in so Hughes sold him and replaced him with a player he does not trust to start games why on both counts ?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2015 10:49:05 GMT
Is someone seriously suggesting dropping Whelan ? We need another player like Whelan alongside him not the opposite !!!
Here's my team for Leicester
Butland Johnson Wilson Muniesa Pieters Cameron Whelan Walters Bojan Arnie Diouf
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Post by Pugsley on Sept 13, 2015 10:53:27 GMT
Is someone seriously suggesting dropping Whelan ? We need another player like Whelan alongside him not the opposite !!! Here's my team for Leicester Butland Johnson Wilson Muniesa Pieters Cameron Whelan Walters Bojan Arnie Diouf Dropping Whelan would be a catastrophic error. Butland Johnno Wilson Cameron Pieters Muniesa Whelan Shaq Bojan/Ireland Arnie Diouf If that team cannot win a game against Leicester then we are doomed.
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Post by foxysgloves on Sept 13, 2015 10:59:30 GMT
The most important thing when you're struggling for form is to stay calm.
Glen Whelan is currently the only defensive/midfield player who introduces any sense of calm.
Dropping him would be inviting a relegation battle!
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