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Post by sportsman on Feb 1, 2015 10:31:19 GMT
SO you think everyone was to blame except N'Zonzi? I've lost you now? No, I don't think Nzonzi was more or less to blame than anyone else. I don't understand, other than the fact you're generally not a fan of his, how you've decided he was the problem yesterday. Or the assertion that he white-flagged it when nobody in a red and white shirt saw more of the ball. If a game is going against you it is usually central midfield. A midfielder that can sense it and act on it. Do something about it. Change the flow, dynamics. Not someone that ghosts around running more distance than any bugger else.
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Post by sportsman on Feb 1, 2015 10:33:53 GMT
There's been more speculation about ryan and it's only the obvious price tag that stops further interest. Just answer me the which other top ten club and player he'd replace. Just that one will do. How do you know it's not the 'obvious price tag' that stops Nzonzi interest? Again, when we were flying high under TP, where was the speculation around Etherington or Fuller? Looking at Spurs' midfield I'd have Nzonzi over at least two of theirs and I don't see a lot in the West Ham or Swansea midfield that's significantly better either. the obvious price tag was reference to ryan.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 1, 2015 10:53:25 GMT
SO you think everyone was to blame except N'Zonzi? I've lost you now? No, I don't think Nzonzi was more or less to blame than anyone else. I don't understand, other than the fact you're generally not a fan of his, how you've decided he was the problem yesterday. Or the assertion that he white-flagged it when nobody in a red and white shirt saw more of the ball. Well you've already had your weekly dig at Wilson and a sly one at Adam yet you make out that the area of the park in which we lost total control of the game featured a class act?! Nope. Definitely lost you!
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 10:56:58 GMT
No, I don't think Nzonzi was more or less to blame than anyone else. I don't understand, other than the fact you're generally not a fan of his, how you've decided he was the problem yesterday. Or the assertion that he white-flagged it when nobody in a red and white shirt saw more of the ball. Well you've already had your weekly dig at Wilson and a sly one at Adam yet you make out that the area of the park in which we lost total control of the game featured a class act?! Nope. Definitely lost you! I think I've made my case pretty clearly and backed it up with some evidence. Sorry, was I supposed to give Adam a rave review for that cameo? Nothing sky about it, he came on and did the square root of fuck all. I don't dislike the bloke like some do but it's been a long time since he's made a positive impact, beyond throttling Sanchez.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 10:57:50 GMT
How do you know it's not the 'obvious price tag' that stops Nzonzi interest? Again, when we were flying high under TP, where was the speculation around Etherington or Fuller? Looking at Spurs' midfield I'd have Nzonzi over at least two of theirs and I don't see a lot in the West Ham or Swansea midfield that's significantly better either. the obvious price tag was reference to ryan. I know it was. My point is that that assertion is based on nowt and you could just as easily say the same for Nzonzi. I've given you three top 10 clubs as well, will that do?
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Post by mrcoke on Feb 1, 2015 11:17:05 GMT
I have never been Walters biggest fan. But what I saw today was quality finishing, and it is his place to lose. Absolutely. He took his time, picked his spot and hit the ball with the right strength and deadly accuracy. Some of the others in the team need to take note and stop blasting the ball over the bar trying to win goal of the month. I'm sure when MH sees some of their shots he wants to get his kit back on!
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Post by sportsman on Feb 1, 2015 11:19:16 GMT
the obvious price tag was reference to ryan. I know it was. My point is that that assertion is based on nowt and you could just as easily say the same for Nzonzi. I've given you three top 10 clubs as well, will that do? No. Ryan's price tag would be big. It would stop a lot of clubs taking it further. Nzonzi's price tag wouldn't. And you say nzonzi would get in spurs' midfield? Say no more.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 11:36:26 GMT
I know it was. My point is that that assertion is based on nowt and you could just as easily say the same for Nzonzi. I've given you three top 10 clubs as well, will that do? No. Ryan's price tag would be big. It would stop a lot of clubs taking it further. Nzonzi's price tag wouldn't. And you say nzonzi would get in spurs' midfield? Say no more. Would you rather have Ryan Mason, Capoue or the coward that is Paulinho over him?
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Post by sportsman on Feb 1, 2015 12:16:35 GMT
No. Ryan's price tag would be big. It would stop a lot of clubs taking it further. Nzonzi's price tag wouldn't. And you say nzonzi would get in spurs' midfield? Say no more. Would you rather have Ryan Mason, Capoue or the coward that is Paulinho over him? Why is that their starting midfield for a usual prem game? If so they aren't doing bad are they? Maybe that spurs manager, what's his name, will come in with a massive bid for him tomorrow to replace one of them.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 12:30:08 GMT
Would you rather have Ryan Mason, Capoue or the coward that is Paulinho over him? Why is that their starting midfield for a usual prem game? If so they aren't doing bad are they? Maybe that spurs manager, what's his name, will come in with a massive bid for him tomorrow to replace one of them. We're not doing bad ourselves, are we? You asked me to name a top 10 club, I named three, and now it's 'well, they're in the top 10, so they must be doing ok'. You can't have it both ways. Mason and Paulinho both started yesterday. I'd take Nzonzi over either of them.
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Post by sportsman on Feb 1, 2015 12:40:35 GMT
Why is that their starting midfield for a usual prem game? If so they aren't doing bad are they? Maybe that spurs manager, what's his name, will come in with a massive bid for him tomorrow to replace one of them. We're not doing bad ourselves, are we? You asked me to name a top 10 club, I named three, and now it's 'well, they're in the top 10, so they must be doing ok'. You can't have it both ways. Mason and Paulinho both started yesterday. I'd take Nzonzi over either of them. like I said then brace yourself for a bid tomorrow. Don't hold your breath though. Just because you named a side in the top ten doesn't make it right. Some even said arsenal would take him! When he does leave let's just see where it is, that's all we can say.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 12:46:06 GMT
We're not doing bad ourselves, are we? You asked me to name a top 10 club, I named three, and now it's 'well, they're in the top 10, so they must be doing ok'. You can't have it both ways. Mason and Paulinho both started yesterday. I'd take Nzonzi over either of them. like I said then brace yourself for a bid tomorrow. Don't hold your breath though. Just because you named a side in the top ten doesn't make it right. Some even said arsenal would take him! When he does leave let's just see where it is, that's all we can say. I still don't see why it's relevant. Fuller went to Blackpool, does that make him shit or tarnish how important he was to us? Nobody came in for Etherington. Why does that have any bearing on anything?
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 1, 2015 12:50:39 GMT
N'Zonzi was fine yesterday, out of the two in midfield in the second half he stood up more than Whelan imo.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Feb 1, 2015 12:55:06 GMT
We're not doing bad ourselves, are we? You asked me to name a top 10 club, I named three, and now it's 'well, they're in the top 10, so they must be doing ok'. You can't have it both ways. Mason and Paulinho both started yesterday. I'd take Nzonzi over either of them. like I said then brace yourself for a bid tomorrow. Don't hold your breath though. Just because you named a side in the top ten doesn't make it right. Some even said arsenal would take him! When he does leave let's just see where it is, that's all we can say. How many came in for Whelan before he signed his new contract?
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Post by sportsman on Feb 1, 2015 13:07:27 GMT
like I said then brace yourself for a bid tomorrow. Don't hold your breath though. Just because you named a side in the top ten doesn't make it right. Some even said arsenal would take him! When he does leave let's just see where it is, that's all we can say. How many came in for Whelan before he signed his new contract? Exactly.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 13:16:00 GMT
There doesn't seem to be a queue for any of our players so they must all be shit.
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Post by werrington on Feb 1, 2015 13:18:39 GMT
There doesn't seem to be a queue for any of our players so they must all be shit. Using their logic Rob... Shawcross and Begovic must be shite then ?
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Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 1, 2015 13:22:39 GMT
QPR must have the best midfield in the country! Our two apparently played well but we're completely overrun for 45 minutes?!
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Post by Roy Cropper on Feb 1, 2015 13:24:30 GMT
Whelan was brilliant, tackle after tackle. But Karl Henry is the better player according to some one here.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Feb 1, 2015 13:25:23 GMT
There doesn't seem to be a queue for any of our players so they must all be shit. Not shit, but not great, either. Whelan, N'Zonzi and Arnie are good for us, but all have limitations. That's what you get when you don't pay fortunes for players(with the odd exception). It doesn't look like Hughes is going to get the money to go for a next level player, so we will have to swing along with what we've got. We are doing pretty well as we are, though, so it's not all that bad. All I was saying is there isn't a clamour for any of our players, so to single out N'Zonzi is strange.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 13:25:51 GMT
I'm still waiting to from you how Nzonzi 'white flagged' a game in which he saw more of the ball than any other player.
Or how Adam's contribution was apparently worthy of the praise you seem to think it was.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 13:26:52 GMT
There doesn't seem to be a queue for any of our players so they must all be shit. Not shit, but not great, either. Whelan, N'Zonzi and Arnie are good for us, but all have limitations. That's what you get when you don't pay fortunes for players(with the odd exception). It doesn't look like Hughes is going to get the money to go for a next level player, so we will have to swing along with what we've got. We are doing pretty well as we are, though, so it's not all that bad. All I was saying is there isn't a clamour for any of our players, so to single out N'Zonzi is strange. Wasn't aimed at you tricky, more at Sportsman's bizarre notion that because the big boys don't want Nzonzi that he mustn't be any good.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2015 13:35:40 GMT
Given how poor the opposition were yesterday , this was still a top flight game
you can only beat what's in front of you
as For Glenn
Superb yesterday - exhibited a modern midfield players full skill set and sprayed some lovely passes about - to boot !
my MOM
Had SJW not chipped in with a superb performance capped with a hat trick also
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Post by sportsman on Feb 1, 2015 13:42:46 GMT
Not shit, but not great, either. Whelan, N'Zonzi and Arnie are good for us, but all have limitations. That's what you get when you don't pay fortunes for players(with the odd exception). It doesn't look like Hughes is going to get the money to go for a next level player, so we will have to swing along with what we've got. We are doing pretty well as we are, though, so it's not all that bad. All I was saying is there isn't a clamour for any of our players, so to single out N'Zonzi is strange. Wasn't aimed at you tricky, more at Sportsman's bizarre notion that because the big boys don't want Nzonzi that he mustn't be any good. Wrong again. I didn't say he wasn't any good did I? I said he's just not what I'd have. I want a proper midfielder not one who's best stat every game is he's ran the most. I liken him to fabian stealth. Runs around a lot, has the odd moment where he produces something but in the main goes under the radar. I'm still waiting to here what his role is and what he does on the pitch to recieve such rave reviews from some fans. Please put me straight.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 13:47:42 GMT
Wasn't aimed at you tricky, more at Sportsman's bizarre notion that because the big boys don't want Nzonzi that he mustn't be any good. Wrong again. I didn't say he wasn't any good did I? I said he's just not what I'd have. I want a proper midfielder not one who's best stat every game is he's ran the most. I liken him to fabian stealth. Runs around a lot, has the odd moment where he produces something but in the main goes under the radar. I'm still waiting to here what his role is and what he does on the pitch to recieve such rave reviews from some fans. Please put me straight. Well who are you comparing him to exactly? Not every midfielder is a creative midfielder and you'd get dicked every week if they were. Nzonzi is far better on the ball than any centre mid we'd had prior to him signing for a good 10-20 years. He's strong, he keeps the ball brilliantly and he carries the ball out of danger and helps us transition to attack. Who is the kind of player you'd like to see instead of him?
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Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 1, 2015 13:47:58 GMT
I'm still waiting to from you how Nzonzi 'white flagged' a game in which he saw more of the ball than any other player. Or how Adam's contribution was apparently worthy of the praise you seem to think it was. How many tackles did he make? How many of his passes were key? I haven't praised Adam yesterday anywhere on this site just disagreed that we went into some sort of steep decline when he came on as you are suggesting. We were already losing the midfield and our attacks were wet fartish way before he came on. He neither improved or deteriorated matters but he's on your 'list' isn't he? Just like Wilson.
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Post by mywaydesolzan on Feb 1, 2015 13:55:48 GMT
Where do you lay the blame for us being completely dominated in the middle of the park, second half then then Rob.........and to make it harder you can't blame Mark Wilson. I blame the team, generally. We slackened off, lost our confidence, and they went for it. We kept giving them the ball back, often via Asmir deciding that Walters was a target man for some reason, which didn't help, with nothing sticking up front. Ireland going off was a dagger to our attacking play as well. Begovic has been using Walters as his out ball for quite a number of games now. Admittedly a couple did seem to unusually ping off John yesterday. Asmir did however slice one into the terracing, just before they got their goal.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Feb 1, 2015 13:56:11 GMT
I'm still waiting to from you how Nzonzi 'white flagged' a game in which he saw more of the ball than any other player. Or how Adam's contribution was apparently worthy of the praise you seem to think it was. How many tackles did he make? How many of his passes were key? I haven't praised Adam yesterday anywhere on this site just disagreed that we went into some sort of steep decline when he came on as you are suggesting. We were already losing the midfield and our attacks were wet fartish way before he came on. He neither improved or deteriorated matters but he's on your 'list' isn't he? Just like Wilson. Ignoring the bare-faced hypocrisy of you accusing anyone else of having a 'list', when someone has a good game I say so, when they don't I say so too. Adam is only on my 'list' if seeing other players as better options than him at present is somehow unreasonable. You won't have it that there's any kind of downside to his game and get all arsey the second anyone suggests there might be. Ireland was still creating chances right up to when he went off - his last action was creating that chance for Crouch. I can't remember us creating anything after that until Walters' goal at the death. Three Stoke players made more tackles than Nzonzi and I don't know what the criteria is for a 'key pass'. He also won the ball numerous times in the air, important on a day when the conditions played a big part. Any chance you could define this 'white-flagged' business?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2015 13:58:43 GMT
Nzonzi is a superb 'Top Half the table' Premier league player often, going under the radar because he plays for us
long may this continue !!!!
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Post by sportsman on Feb 1, 2015 14:01:46 GMT
How many tackles did he make? How many of his passes were key? I haven't praised Adam yesterday anywhere on this site just disagreed that we went into some sort of steep decline when he came on as you are suggesting. We were already losing the midfield and our attacks were wet fartish way before he came on. He neither improved or deteriorated matters but he's on your 'list' isn't he? Just like Wilson. Ignoring the bare-faced hypocrisy of you accusing anyone else of having a 'list', when someone has a good game I say so, when they don't I say so too. Adam is only on my 'list' if seeing other players as better options than him at present is somehow unreasonable. You won't have it that there's any kind of downside to his game and get all arsey the second anyone suggests there might be. Ireland was still creating chances right up to when he went off - his last action was creating that chance for Crouch. I can't remember us creating anything after that until Walters' goal at the death. Three Stoke players made more tackles than Nzonzi and I don't know what the criteria is for a 'key pass'. He also won the ball numerous times in the air, important on a day when the conditions played a big part. Any chance you could define this 'white-flagged' business? who were the three players as a matter of interest? Is that what nzonzi's role is then to break up play? I've been asking on here for two years and no bugger answers. If it is sidwell was the second best player in the premier league last season ahead of the likes of gerrard for interceptions.
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