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Post by sheikhmomo on Apr 6, 2014 8:46:15 GMT
I've had time to think about it and have concluded that whatever people think about Wilko, Geoff Cameron is still fucking wank.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 8:48:49 GMT
Post by MarkWolstanton on Apr 6, 2014 8:48:49 GMT
Much as we all love Wilko for his 110% commitment to the cause over the years and his status as "one of us" I can't help but feel he is a very lucky boy to have had the opportunity to play Premier League football at all. When you wipe away the misty eyes you can clearly see he is a long way off being of that standard.
I have to say how surprised I was to see the club offering him an extension to his contract.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 8:49:33 GMT
Post by robwahlmann on Apr 6, 2014 8:49:33 GMT
I can see why Hughes put him on because Cameron wasn't having his best game, but Wilko will always be too hot headed I'm afraid! Even though he was struggling Cameron was still having a better half than Pieters, PO and Arnie and they weren't subbed. There's no question it was a daft sub by MH thinking Wilko would shore up a defense away versus Chelsea in which not one winger for Stoke was helping on the edges. Took Jose' what a min to sub on Eden to take on Wilko and the "inevitable" peno to enshrine that we would get no points... Pieters was woeful and so where our wingers who turned off after meeting a tough defense. Wilko is getting alot of stick for a bad decision by MH as I see it. Cameron stepping in as RB is still better than Wilko who is out of depth. According to some papers this morning it seems like Cameron picked up an injury and that Wilko could deputise against Newcastle too! I hope to God that they don't put Ben Arfa up against him! Wilko has often been much better at home than away though!
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 8:51:00 GMT
Post by scfcno1fan on Apr 6, 2014 8:51:00 GMT
Much as we all love Wilko for his 110% commitment to the cause over the years and his status as "one of us" I can't help but feel he is a very lucky boy to have had the opportunity to play Premier League football at all. When you wipe away the misty eyes you can clearly see he is a long way off being of that standard. I have to say how surprised I was to see the club offering him an extension to his contract. He is a long way off Prem standard. To have had the career he has had is nothing short of astounding. But fair play to the lad, he has made a career.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Apr 6, 2014 8:52:57 GMT
Bloke hasn't played since the old King died and is written off after being roasted at Chelsea.
Standard Stoke fan wankery.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 8:54:11 GMT
via mobile
borat likes this
Post by malteser68 on Apr 6, 2014 8:54:11 GMT
Still our best right back. It's not like Cameron made a needless, clumsy challenge that could easily have been given as a penalty in the first half... how blind can one be to say such a thing !!! Cameron is miles ahead of wilko and wilko will never ever make it at this level coz he's just not good enough
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 8:55:11 GMT
via mobile
Post by thedeadlyshart on Apr 6, 2014 8:55:11 GMT
I wondered if Cameron might have been injured, but MH's post game conference seemed to suggest that it was a tactical decision.
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Post by mrpickles on Apr 6, 2014 9:06:07 GMT
You can't take offence, because I said 'no offence' I wasn't trying to come across as superior, and I don't dismiss people's claims because of where they're from, I'm just stating an observation. Americans seem (imo) to place too much emphasis on statistics, just like we English often place hard work over ability. There are stats that matter for sure, but I've had charts and numbers with decimal places chucked at me to 'back up' why Cameron didn't play poorly in the first half yesterday, when he quite clearly did. Fair enough. None taken then. But I know quite a few Americans, and my observation is that stats are about as popular as "soccer". For example, over here most people believe that citizens with guns will actually prevent crimes, despite plenty of statistics that show a strong correlation between gun violence and gun ownership. That stat is used by both sides of the gun control debate as confirmation as to why their side is the correct one. But, the stat itself is not a lie, more gun owners means it is more likely that a person will be killed by a gun. People arguing on internet message boards are not an entirely different subset though, because many of us post opinions and then try to 1.)use stats to justify the opinion, or 2.)say stats that don't matter to justify the opinion. I guess what I'm trying to say is, don't hate the stats, hate the way people try to use them to confirm bias. And I'm pretty sure that's what you are getting at when you say "too much emphasis..."? Good post. It certainly was, what I was trying to get at. I'm all for stats if they are used right, and are not considered the be all and end all. Most successful interceptions, blocks, tackles etc are definitely relevant for a defender, but there is no way that stats can show how good or bad a player's positional sense is.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:09:38 GMT
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Post by sportsman on Apr 6, 2014 9:09:38 GMT
If Cameron is out of the Newcastle game due to an injury I would start the game with crouch or sorensen at right back before putting wilko in there again.
It's not the actual challenge he made that pissed me off yesterday it's the thought that went through his head to decide to make it. At just 1-0 he should have just showed him down the line and blocked the attempted cut back / cross.
The force he tried to do it though was typical of him. Look at me fellow stokie mates, hard as nails me, see you all out tomorrow night lads.
Start with 10 men or stick any other player named in our squad at right back. Wonder what Coates thinks of the challenge, him not hughes being the one to offer the 1 year deal.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:12:12 GMT
Post by MarkWolstanton on Apr 6, 2014 9:12:12 GMT
Bloke hasn't played since the old King died and is written off after being roasted at Chelsea. Standard Stoke fan wankery. Well not really is it? Wilko has clearly, in my opinion not been up to it at this level from the off. It was his good fortune that the preferred alternatives of the previous manager was to play centre halves at right back such as Huth and more tragically Woodgate and Shawcross. That gave Wilko some credibility as a Premier League full back!!! To suggest people have an opinion of Wilko's ability at this level based on yesterday is a bit of a ruse on your part. It is based on a string of roastings, sending offs and conceded penalties to give a fairer summary.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Apr 6, 2014 9:14:01 GMT
Bloke hasn't played since the old King died and is written off after being roasted at Chelsea. Standard Stoke fan wankery. . It is based on a string of roastings, sending offs and conceded penalties to give a fairer summary. You'd have a point if that wasn't all made up.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:17:04 GMT
Post by Clayton Wood on Apr 6, 2014 9:17:04 GMT
Don't Skrill have a Premier league he could play in?
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:20:26 GMT
Post by sheikhmomo on Apr 6, 2014 9:20:26 GMT
Don't Skrill have a Premier league he could play in? The USA have lots of vastly overrated players that are shit. Maybe he'd fit in there?
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Post by stokeramblers on Apr 6, 2014 9:20:41 GMT
. It is based on a string of roastings, sending offs and conceded penalties to give a fairer summary. You'd have a point if that wasn't all made up. Two sending offs, one was utterly laughable and from the ever reliable Mike Dean in a game we won away at Portsmouth. The other Wilko was bang to rights with even though Ronaldo should've already been off the pitch himself. The penalties, I'm struggling to remember, the most infamous ones of recent times to me being Pennant, Collins, Sonko. The roastings, whenever we played Spurs really. So a 'string' of all those things....just quite a short string
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2014 9:21:14 GMT
Bloke hasn't played since the old King died and is written off after being roasted at Chelsea. Standard Stoke fan wankery. It is based on a string of roastings, sending offs and conceded penalties to give a fairer summary. So you're redefining "a string of..." to mean 2 sendings off in 10 years playing for Stoke City? That's one hell of a string that. How many penalties has he conceeded in that time? I don't actually know, that's why i'm asking but I guess that'd be a "string" as well. As for roastings, he's not really had a "string" of them either. So all in all, great point, beautifully made.
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Post by stokeramblers on Apr 6, 2014 9:23:50 GMT
It is based on a string of roastings, sending offs and conceded penalties to give a fairer summary. So you're redefining "a string of..." to mean 2 sendings off in 10 years playing for Stoke City? That's one hell of a string that. How many penalties has he conceeded in that time? I don't actually know, that's why i'm asking but I guess that'd be a "string" as well. As for roastings, he's not really had a "string" of them either. So all in all, great point, beautifully made. Like I said, it's a short string
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:26:29 GMT
Post by Clayton Wood on Apr 6, 2014 9:26:29 GMT
Don't Skrill have a Premier league he could play in? The USA have lots of vastly overrated players that are shit. Maybe he'd fit in there? Good idea. Maybe Inchy will take him.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:32:34 GMT
Post by MarkWolstanton on Apr 6, 2014 9:32:34 GMT
So you're redefining "a string of..." to mean 2 sendings off in 10 years playing for Stoke City? That's one hell of a string that. How many penalties has he conceeded in that time? I don't actually know, that's why i'm asking but I guess that'd be a "string" as well. As for roastings, he's not really had a "string" of them either. So all in all, great point, beautifully made. Like I said, it's a short string Fair point. I should have stuck with a string of roastings and a host of needless free kicks when the lad has been shown to be out of his depth. I don't really know what we are arguing about here. Wilko is clearly not of the standard required and I admire his qualities and his contribution to the cause as much as the next man. I think those defending him know it full well. Can anyone suggest a full back in the Prem who they would not take as a replacement?
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Post by sportsman on Apr 6, 2014 9:33:11 GMT
Why are some of you trying to defend a player that's an absolute useless right back. Read my post above I've said it all there. Can't pass, can't link up going forward, rash in the tackle, cringe and cross fingers whenever he's on the ball or someone is running at him anywhere near our box. But he's a local stokie eh?
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:36:08 GMT
Post by crapslinger on Apr 6, 2014 9:36:08 GMT
Don't Skrill have a Premier league he could play in? The USA have lots of vastly overrated players that are shit. Maybe he'd fit in there? Pulis bought four of them to Stoke.
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Post by thedeadlyshart on Apr 6, 2014 9:37:40 GMT
Don't Skrill have a Premier league he could play in? The USA have lots of vastly overrated players that are shit. Maybe he'd fit in there? So England isn't the place for vastly overrated players anymore? Wilshere, Smalling, and Cleverly sure didn't get the memo.
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Post by stokeramblers on Apr 6, 2014 9:38:52 GMT
Like I said, it's a short string Fair point. I should have stuck with a string of roastings and a host of needless free kicks when the lad has been shown to be out of his depth. I don't really know what we are arguing about here. Wilko is clearly not of the standard required and I admire his qualities and his contribution to the cause as much as the next man. I think those defending him know it full well. Can anyone suggest a full back in the Prem who they would not take as a replacement? You're not wrong, just sad to see another player who was part of our Champioship side and early Premiership days being slaughtered and slung out of the club by his ear if it was left to the fans. Some of the comments yesterday were well beyond the pale.. I suppose it's always the way, the talk started like this about Delap not so long ago, now the fervent hating and so on has died down it's all 'Oh what a legend, loved Rory I did etc. etc.' It's time to go, but maybe with a bit of respect..
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Post by sheikhmomo on Apr 6, 2014 9:42:17 GMT
Like I said, it's a short string Can anyone suggest a full back in the Prem who they would not take as a replacement? Geoff Cameron?
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:44:20 GMT
Post by Staffsoatcake on Apr 6, 2014 9:44:20 GMT
I like Wilko,but in no way on Gods Earth is he Premiership class.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:45:05 GMT
Post by crapslinger on Apr 6, 2014 9:45:05 GMT
Like I said, it's a short string Fair point. I should have stuck with a string of roastings and a host of needless free kicks when the lad has been shown to be out of his depth. I don't really know what we are arguing about here. Wilko is clearly not of the standard required and I admire his qualities and his contribution to the cause as much as the next man. I think those defending him know it full well. Can anyone suggest a full back in the Prem who they would not take as a replacement? Ryan Shotton
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:52:06 GMT
Post by MarkWolstanton on Apr 6, 2014 9:52:06 GMT
Fair point. I should have stuck with a string of roastings and a host of needless free kicks when the lad has been shown to be out of his depth. I don't really know what we are arguing about here. Wilko is clearly not of the standard required and I admire his qualities and his contribution to the cause as much as the next man. I think those defending him know it full well. Can anyone suggest a full back in the Prem who they would not take as a replacement? You're not wrong, just sad to see another player who was part of our Champioship side and early Premiership days being slaughtered and slung out of the club by his ear if it was left to the fans. Some of the comments yesterday were well beyond the pale.. I suppose it's always the way, the talk started like this about Delap not so long ago, now the fervent hating and so on has died down it's all 'Oh what a legend, loved Rory I did etc. etc.' It's time to go, but maybe with a bit of respect.. Very well said, sir. I am sure that in a more temperate environment than the message board, that is a view we would all subscribe to.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:55:34 GMT
Post by Sergeant Muttley on Apr 6, 2014 9:55:34 GMT
Much as we all love Wilko for his 110% commitment to the cause over the years and his status as "one of us" I can't help but feel he is a very lucky boy to have had the opportunity to play Premier League football at all. When you wipe away the misty eyes you can clearly see he is a long way off being of that standard. I have to say how surprised I was to see the club offering him an extension to his contract. Shock horror i actually agree word for word with that
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 9:56:23 GMT
Post by MarkWolstanton on Apr 6, 2014 9:56:23 GMT
Can anyone suggest a full back in the Prem who they would not take as a replacement? Geoff Cameron? Not a full back as per with the later post naming Shotton (the winger as described by one famous observer. Cameron has been inconsistent this year but in all honesty but I am happier seeing him there if that is the choice. The fact that two Stoke players who are not full backs are offered up sort of makes my point. Going back to Cameron I think he is the sort of player every squad needs; able to cover adequately a number of positions. A sort of latter day Eric "Ecka" Skeels if you will.
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 10:01:03 GMT
Post by sheikhmomo on Apr 6, 2014 10:01:03 GMT
Not a full back as per with the later post naming Shotton (the winger as described by one famous observer. Cameron has been inconsistent this year but in all honesty but I am happier seeing him there if that is the choice. The fact that two Stoke players who are not full backs are offered up sort of makes my point. Going back to Cameron I think he is the sort of player every squad needs; able to cover adequately a number of positions. A sort of latter day Eric "Ecka" Skeels if you will. Wilko was shit yesterday as was every single member of our team but I have seen nothing, absolutely nothing to suggest that Geoff Cameron is a better right back than him. If I was judging an athletics competition or recruiting a Marine then its Geoff all the way. Introduce a football then things get a bit more cloudy!
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Wilko
Apr 6, 2014 10:03:49 GMT
Post by MarkWolstanton on Apr 6, 2014 10:03:49 GMT
Not a full back as per with the later post naming Shotton (the winger as described by one famous observer. Cameron has been inconsistent this year but in all honesty but I am happier seeing him there if that is the choice. The fact that two Stoke players who are not full backs are offered up sort of makes my point. Going back to Cameron I think he is the sort of player every squad needs; able to cover adequately a number of positions. A sort of latter day Eric "Ecka" Skeels if you will. Wilko was shit yesterday as was every single member of our team but I have seen nothing, absolutely nothing to suggest that Geoff Cameron is a better right back than him. If I was judging an athletics competition or recruiting a Marine then its Geoff all the way. Introduce a football then things get a bit more cloudy! Yes but we don't all factor in your hatred of all things American.
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