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Post by andromeda on Sept 18, 2024 9:30:57 GMT
I don’t have an issue with the structure - it works well at lots of other clubs albeit mainly in Europe. My issue here is the inference that there are people at the Club in the top positions who only want yes men. All the best businesses have disagreements and the ability to challenge opinions is a key aspect of success. Now the inference may be wrong but if it isn’t then we are setting people up to fail. That strikes of an owner shirking responsibility to key people and showing why he isn’t running the family business. Think most of us agree Jon Coates isn't suited to run the club Fair play he's handed control over to Simon King,Jon Walters however Walters has shown his colours as a 'my way or the highway ' boss If that continues then that's a huge problem People have said on here that both Walters and King are cut from the same cloth and only want yes men which doesn’t bode well on or off the pitch. |
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Post by pushon on Sept 18, 2024 9:33:19 GMT
I agree with most of what you say but can't agree that Walters should be remote from 'On Field' matters. The 'On Field' results are ultimately his responsibility. He can’t employ a HC then interfere in match days. He shouldn’t be anywhere near the team or the dressing room on match days. If as rumoured him and Schu had a bust up after the Oxford game he’s involving himself somewhere he shouldn’t be. If he has issues with the actions of the HC he should be bringing them up in a debrief/review away from everyone else ie players and preferably not in the immediate aftermath at all. The following week in either a one on one or a meeting of the technical board are the appropriate times and venues. He’s got to make his mind up whether he wants to be a director or a manager. You don't really seem to understand the point I was making. JW is the Director and as his Job Title suggests he instructs the Head Coach and yes communication is a 2-way street. I don't expect him to be immersed in the day to day activities, unless his job description calls for this.I think it's unlikely though, otherwise he'd probably be known as the manager. However you are spouting how things should be done to some type of rigid structural plan. In a small business, lots of decision-making is made 'on the hoof' and scheduled meetings are quite often for Rubber-Stamping purposes. As you see I'm using old school terminology as I've been retired for a while, but I doubt that procedures have changed a great deal. Oh, as far as being a Director and therefore not managing, I would guess that you've never performed the required duties. |
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Post by J-Roar on Sept 18, 2024 9:34:10 GMT
He is desperately short In midfield is his big big issue , I think je may need four in there up to Xmas we just can’t control a game or have the physicality as it is Pearson,Seko,Lawal, Thompson,Burger,Sidibe,Moron,Junho and er Gooch 🥴 Ok not Gooch That's 8 midfielders for 3 places Bit harsh. He's only been here a few games. |
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 18, 2024 9:35:00 GMT
Thinking about the problems we have with FFP
Alex Neil probably had a 3 year contract as would Schuey as will Pelach. No doubt Neil and Schuey have had lump sum payoffs. But it still makes for a very expensive management bill in financial terms which could have been put to better use.
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Post by Bojan Mackey on Sept 18, 2024 9:35:56 GMT
www.stokesentinel.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/stoke-city-narcis-pelach-live-9556516 Narcis Pelach's coaching teamIt might be a case of watch this space on Pelach's backroom set-up. But keeper coach Paul Clements is expected to make the move from Norwich too as well as analyst Harrison Glew, who also worked with Pelach at Huddersfield Town. Dean Whitehead, the former Stoke midfielder whose coaching career has taken him from Port Vale to Besiktas as well as spells at Cardiff and Watford, could join from Barnsley. His son is in the Stoke academy. Clements and Glew were in the executive box with Pelach last night. Whose kids haven’t we got in our academy at the moment. We’re football manager regen FC. |
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Sept 18, 2024 9:39:52 GMT
Football has moved on from ruling with a rod? So you're happy we have a DOF sacking a HC for winning 7 of his last 10. Or 15 points in his last 8. I'm not. Smells like a DOF who can't work with his HC and has thrown his toys out of the pram and gone all Alan Sugar. Massive red flag for me on little Johnny Walters now.. Or a HC that has won just 2 of his 5 league games this season, losing the other 3, and scoring just 3 goals along the way. A HC who has no style of play, no clue what to do with substitutions, and who gets completely out-coached during games every other week. I'd imagine the DoF would have set goals for our HC to achieve, I'll take a stab that they'd involve giving plenty of minutes to our academy boys (He just about gets a pass on this), he'd have a style of play that he wants to see (Massive failure on this), and he'd have more than likely set a points total/league position to be in at 'x' stage (We can only guess at what they'd be but I'd imagine he again failed this one). |
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Post by J-Roar on Sept 18, 2024 9:39:56 GMT
I thought the players had Wednesday off but with a Friday game that may change. If they have a new manager, fuck days off. |
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Post by senojbor on Sept 18, 2024 9:40:42 GMT
I also hope it hasn’t damaged his love of the club, but I fear it’s possibly irreparable due to how personal it must feel. I think Fish said when he was appointed he wouldn’t be saying much because he couldn’t, but you could tell he felt proud. He must have known how the job was sold to Schumacher and what was expected - I’m guessing this wasn’t it! Hope you can rekindle your Stoke City energy, Fish and I hope you don’t feel somehow weirdly responsible for what’s gone on. I'll always love Stoke and nothing will ever change that mate. I couldn't have been prouder at the time but I feel that the introduction of SJW may have significantly changed the dynamics. I'm guessing that the sacking was done without being able to give a substantial reason and a replacement was lined up a few weeks ago. I believe that directors and managers need to work together,and not to try and be sly by taking players to one side and having a quiet word. I believe that this is counterproductive and will only go one way, if this did happen. In my view, the club have acted disgracefully and we have a director who is trying to make a name for himself, as he didn't appoint Steven. I wish the new manager all the best but he needs to tread very carefully if he dare disagree with the playing staff, or potential new signings. Steven can hold his head up high and removed players who had absolutely no interest in Stoke or their fan base. He's brought in a young, hungry team who he believed would do well in time. Unfortunately for Steven, he didn't get it. I hope I'm wrong but I can't see this working out well with SJW at our club. I go the games and I've not met anyone who has agreed that sacking SS and bringing an unknown manager together is a good thing. I think we all wish him well and I'm sure he'll not be out of work long |
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Post by baconburger on Sept 18, 2024 9:45:25 GMT
He can’t employ a HC then interfere in match days. He shouldn’t be anywhere near the team or the dressing room on match days. If as rumoured him and Schu had a bust up after the Oxford game he’s involving himself somewhere he shouldn’t be. If he has issues with the actions of the HC he should be bringing them up in a debrief/review away from everyone else ie players and preferably not in the immediate aftermath at all. The following week in either a one on one or a meeting of the technical board are the appropriate times and venues. He’s got to make his mind up whether he wants to be a director or a manager. I agree re the DoF not interfering directly in the dressing room. However as I understand the rumours Walters had a bust up with Schumacher 3 weeks ago and it was the players who had a bust up with Schumacher at the Oxford match. I don't know if that is what happened - where did you get Walters having a bust up in the dressing room from? Something posted on here FB or X. It was pretty detailed and involved a heated argument in the dressing room and some sort of away directors suite and then Schu not returning on the team bus. I’m well aware it could just be the product of a vivid imagination. I find it difficult to process that someone would just make it all up but then people do such weird shit all the time. |
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Post by desman2 on Sept 18, 2024 9:48:07 GMT
I agree re the DoF not interfering directly in the dressing room. However as I understand the rumours Walters had a bust up with Schumacher 3 weeks ago and it was the players who had a bust up with Schumacher at the Oxford match. I don't know if that is what happened - where did you get Walters having a bust up in the dressing room from? Something posted on here FB or X. It was pretty detailed and involved a heated argument in the dressing room and some sort of away directors suite and then Schu not returning on the team bus. I’m well aware it could just be the product of a vivid imagination. I find it difficult to process that someone would just make it all up but then people do such weird shit all the time. Yes read that last night. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 18, 2024 9:48:56 GMT
Football has moved on from ruling with a rod? So you're happy we have a DOF sacking a HC for winning 7 of his last 10. Or 15 points in his last 8. I'm not. Smells like a DOF who can't work with his HC and has thrown his toys out of the pram and gone all Alan Sugar. Massive red flag for me on little Johnny Walters now.. Or a HC that has won just 2 of his 5 league games this season, losing the other 3, and scoring just 3 goals along the way. A HC who has no style of play, no clue what to do with substitutions, and who gets completely out-coached during games every other week. I'd imagine the DoF would have set goals for our HC to achieve, I'll take a stab that they'd involve giving plenty of minutes to our academy boys (He just about gets a pass on this), he'd have a style of play that he wants to see (Massive failure on this), and he'd have more than likely set a points total/league position to be in at 'x' stage (We can only guess at what they'd be but I'd imagine he again failed this one). Or a manager who has come into a basket case club and steadied the ship. Played some of the best front foot football we've seen in years. Blooding young talent. Has good support from most of its fan base. Is only 5 games into the season. 15 points in 8 games (auto promotion form that) Of course there's been some shit performances. How wouldn't there be when your clearing up a mess and simultaneously trying to build a young side. So what happens when Pelach loses 3 or 4 in 6 or 7? You've set a standard now John. Surely he needs sacking doesn't he John. Shit optics, badly managed by little Johnny Walters. And so the general consensus will continue that stoke are all the gear and no fucking idea. Billy smarts circus.... |
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Post by coldtuesdaynight on Sept 18, 2024 9:49:49 GMT
I don’t have an issue with the structure - it works well at lots of other clubs albeit mainly in Europe. My issue here is the inference that there are people at the Club in the top positions who only want yes men. All the best businesses have disagreements and the ability to challenge opinions is a key aspect of success. Now the inference may be wrong but if it isn’t then we are setting people up to fail. That strikes of an owner shirking responsibility to key people and showing why he isn’t running the family business. Think most of us agree Jon Coates isn't suited to run the club Fair play he's handed control over to Simon King,Jon Walters however Walters has shown his colours as a 'my way or the highway ' boss If that continues then that's a huge problem How do we know that? At the end of the day the results haven’t been there, bar one spell towards the end of last season. People are projecting reasons outside the result onto this decision, but if we were all sat confident of a top half finish after the first 5 games Schumacher would still be here. Signs were there this season that worried me before the Oxford game: Schumacher talking about a tough start despite it being actually quite nice fixture-wise, getting thrashed at Watford, playing a formation the fans hate and we don’t have the players for a week later etc. Sure I’d have let the couple of wins before the break convince me to not sack him if it was my choice, but it’s hardly a massive surprise he’s gone surely? If we’d lost against Hull then it’d fast be getting to the point where we would be shocked if he was there the next game. |
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Post by RWChris on Sept 18, 2024 9:50:13 GMT
Since Dean Whitehead is apparently coming back into the fold it is only right to put this back into circulation. This remains one of my favourite videos on the internet… |
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Sept 18, 2024 9:57:59 GMT
Or a manager who has come into a basket case club and steadied the ship. Played some of the best front foot football we've seen in years. Blooding young talent. Has good support from most of its fan base. Is only 5 games into the season. 15 points in 8 games (auto promotion form that) Of course there's been some shit performances. How wouldn't there be when your clearing up a mess and simultaneously trying to build a young side. So what happens when Pelach loses 3 or 4 in 6 or 7? You've set a standard now John. Surely he needs sacking doesn't he John. Shit optics, badly managed by little Johnny Walters. And so the general consensus will continue that stoke are all the gear and no fucking idea. Billy smarts circus.... You keep using the 3 games at the end of last season to help with your narrative. Look at all of his reign instead, for the majority of it he was poor, those 3 games at the end, in my opinion, would have saved him being sacked over the summer. He's then been given 5 games this season to see if those 3 games at the end of last season really were a turning point or not, but he's instead gone back to what he did for the majority of his time here. The football's been shit, his subs are clueless, how many games you can remember him changing with his tactics/subs? He's rightly been sacked. The new guy will most probably have till the end of the season (a roughly similar amount of time to what SS had) and if he only manages to produce 3 good games during that time then I imagine he'll get the boot aswell. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 18, 2024 10:04:56 GMT
Or a manager who has come into a basket case club and steadied the ship. Played some of the best front foot football we've seen in years. Blooding young talent. Has good support from most of its fan base. Is only 5 games into the season. 15 points in 8 games (auto promotion form that) Of course there's been some shit performances. How wouldn't there be when your clearing up a mess and simultaneously trying to build a young side. So what happens when Pelach loses 3 or 4 in 6 or 7? You've set a standard now John. Surely he needs sacking doesn't he John. Shit optics, badly managed by little Johnny Walters. And so the general consensus will continue that stoke are all the gear and no fucking idea. Billy smarts circus.... You keep using the 3 games at the end of last season to help with your narrative. Look at all of his reign instead, for the majority of it he was poor, those 3 games at the end, in my opinion, would have saved him being sacked over the summer. He's then been given 5 games this season to see if those 3 games at the end of last season really were a turning point or not, but he's instead gone back to what he did for the majority of his time here. The football's been shit, his subs are clueless, how many games you can remember him changing with his tactics/subs? He's rightly been sacked. The new guy will most probably have till the end of the season (a roughly similar amount of time to what SS had) and if he only manages to produce 3 good games during that time then I imagine he'll get the boot aswell. I use those last games of last season to give some perspective because 5 games is not enough to judge someone. And he won 2 of those last 5 with clean sheets. What was Walters expecting, 5 wins on the spin. 4 wins? 3 wins and a couple of draws. We are 5 games in 5. We'll not agree obviously and its just my opinion but I think Walters is a wrong un. Massive ego. Been given a massive job way too early. And appears to consider himself some kind of clever hard nut. Comes across as someone who thinks he has way more credit in the bank with fans cos he werked hard here as a player. He worked hard most of the time but let's face it he was average. He ain't got the credit he thinks he has and he'd do well to realise that.. |
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Post by Caerwrangonpotter on Sept 18, 2024 10:05:33 GMT
If Dean Whitehead returns, so does the "Dean Whitehead Bingo"......it will be 24 mins into the first game & he will get booked just for being Dean Whitehead  Get the new management team now |
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Post by nottsover60 on Sept 18, 2024 10:10:36 GMT
I much prefer this scenario than Allardyce or similar. Football moves on and Allardyce would just have held us back for two years. Not sure what to think of Pelach but the more I hear the more I like him. Knows what he wants and is passionate about getting players to play his way. Seems he was very popular with the players at Norwich too. Football and society in general have moved away from ruling with a rod towards a more positive, supportive, enthusiastic motivational approach. That doesn't mean players get away with not doing the right thing though. Fingers crossed for once Stoke might find an upcoming first class manager like Potter or Frank neither of whom had any experience of managing in England before becoming successful managers. Football has moved on from ruling with a rod? So you're happy we have a DOF sacking a HC for winning 7 of his last 10. Or 15 points in his last 8. I'm not. Smells like a DOF who can't work with his HC and has thrown his toys out of the pram and gone all Alan Sugar. Massive red flag for me on little Johnny Walters now.. I'm talking about Pelach as opposed to Allardyce. I have not mentioned Schumacher as rightly or wrongly he has gone. I was supporting keeping him for the rest of the season if you look back at my posts. As for Walters I have always had reservations about his involvement with team matters and self congratulatory videos. Not sure he rules through fear though and neither of us know the full story. I also had my reservations over our run at the end of last season when apart from Plymouth none of the other teams had anything to play for. I hoped we would start this season in the same way but even our wins have not had the fast flowing football and quick one touch passes we saw then. |
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Post by nottsover60 on Sept 18, 2024 10:13:58 GMT
I agree re the DoF not interfering directly in the dressing room. However as I understand the rumours Walters had a bust up with Schumacher 3 weeks ago and it was the players who had a bust up with Schumacher at the Oxford match. I don't know if that is what happened - where did you get Walters having a bust up in the dressing room from? Something posted on here FB or X. It was pretty detailed and involved a heated argument in the dressing room and some sort of away directors suite and then Schu not returning on the team bus. I’m well aware it could just be the product of a vivid imagination. I find it difficult to process that someone would just make it all up but then people do such weird shit all the time. Could be that Schumacher didn't return on the team bus as he went on to the family home in Plymouth. People then start summising that there has been a bust up and rumour becomes fact. |
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Post by tommycarlsberg on Sept 18, 2024 10:14:05 GMT
The problem you're always going to have with Walters is he'll think he knows better than the head coaches because of his playing career.
He'd have thought he had a bigger football brain than SS because he was a Premier League player and Narco ain't even played for anyone who's got a Wikipedia page.
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Post by nottsover60 on Sept 18, 2024 10:16:06 GMT
You keep using the 3 games at the end of last season to help with your narrative. Look at all of his reign instead, for the majority of it he was poor, those 3 games at the end, in my opinion, would have saved him being sacked over the summer. He's then been given 5 games this season to see if those 3 games at the end of last season really were a turning point or not, but he's instead gone back to what he did for the majority of his time here. The football's been shit, his subs are clueless, how many games you can remember him changing with his tactics/subs? He's rightly been sacked. The new guy will most probably have till the end of the season (a roughly similar amount of time to what SS had) and if he only manages to produce 3 good games during that time then I imagine he'll get the boot aswell. I use those last games of last season to give some perspective because 5 games is not enough to judge someone. And he won 2 of those last 5 with clean sheets. What was Walters expecting, 5 wins on the spin. 4 wins? 3 wins and a couple of draws. We are 5 games in 5. We'll not agree obviously and its just my opinion but I think Walters is a wrong un. Massive ego. Been given a massive job way too early. And appears to consider himself some kind of clever hard nut. Comes across as someone who thinks he has way more credit in the bank with fans cos he werked hard here as a player. He worked hard most of the time but let's face it he was average. He ain't got the credit he thinks he has and he'd do well to realise that.. He was also one of the players who downed tools in Pulis's last season after Christmas which almost resulted in our relegation. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 18, 2024 10:20:47 GMT
Football has moved on from ruling with a rod? So you're happy we have a DOF sacking a HC for winning 7 of his last 10. Or 15 points in his last 8. I'm not. Smells like a DOF who can't work with his HC and has thrown his toys out of the pram and gone all Alan Sugar. Massive red flag for me on little Johnny Walters now.. I'm talking about Pelach as opposed to Allardyce. I have not mentioned Schumacher as rightly or wrongly he has gone. I was supporting keeping him for the rest of the season if you look back at my posts. As for Walters I have always had reservations about his involvement with team matters and self congratulatory videos. Not sure he rules through fear though and neither of us know the full story. I also had my reservations over our run at the end of last season when apart from Plymouth none of the other teams had anything to play for. I hoped we would start this season in the same way but even our wins have not had the fast flowing football and quick one touch passes we saw then. Fair enough. But with reference to the start of this season, he's still bedding in a new raft of players on top of having overseen the massive overhaul from last season. He's also had injuries to contend with. But all that aside we are 5 games into a season. We're sat bang in mid table. Its not when you sack someone, even if Schumacher has called him a twat. And now we have a new guy who has to start all over again. Who will decide x y and z are not players I want here. Players get unsettled again. Results start getting bad, fans unhappy. What do you do now Walters. Another pay off. Compo for stealing another manager from yet another club. Its a shit show.. |
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 18, 2024 10:21:21 GMT
New guy has 6 games to impress, not his fault but he is starting from a bad position because of what has gone on and how many are feeling. I really hope he is up to it as I want Stoke to be successful but failure puts his and Walters job on the line very quickly.
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Post by lordb on Sept 18, 2024 10:23:43 GMT
Think most of us agree Jon Coates isn't suited to run the club Fair play he's handed control over to Simon King,Jon Walters however Walters has shown his colours as a 'my way or the highway ' boss If that continues then that's a huge problem How do we know that? At the end of the day the results haven’t been there, bar one spell towards the end of last season. People are projecting reasons outside the result onto this decision, but if we were all sat confident of a top half finish after the first 5 games Schumacher would still be here. Signs were there this season that worried me before the Oxford game: Schumacher talking about a tough start despite it being actually quite nice fixture-wise, getting thrashed at Watford, playing a formation the fans hate and we don’t have the players for a week later etc. Sure I’d have let the couple of wins before the break convince me to not sack him if it was my choice, but it’s hardly a massive surprise he’s gone surely? If we’d lost against Hull then it’d fast be getting to the point where we would be shocked if he was there the next game. We know that because no sensible club sacks their head coach in September |
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Post by SCFC92 on Sept 18, 2024 10:25:00 GMT
How do we know that? At the end of the day the results haven’t been there, bar one spell towards the end of last season. People are projecting reasons outside the result onto this decision, but if we were all sat confident of a top half finish after the first 5 games Schumacher would still be here. Signs were there this season that worried me before the Oxford game: Schumacher talking about a tough start despite it being actually quite nice fixture-wise, getting thrashed at Watford, playing a formation the fans hate and we don’t have the players for a week later etc. Sure I’d have let the couple of wins before the break convince me to not sack him if it was my choice, but it’s hardly a massive surprise he’s gone surely? If we’d lost against Hull then it’d fast be getting to the point where we would be shocked if he was there the next game. We know that because no sensible club sacks their head coach in September Forest did and got promoted. |
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Post by monsoonmoon on Sept 18, 2024 10:27:30 GMT
Or a HC that has won just 2 of his 5 league games this season, losing the other 3, and scoring just 3 goals along the way. A HC who has no style of play, no clue what to do with substitutions, and who gets completely out-coached during games every other week. I'd imagine the DoF would have set goals for our HC to achieve, I'll take a stab that they'd involve giving plenty of minutes to our academy boys (He just about gets a pass on this), he'd have a style of play that he wants to see (Massive failure on this), and he'd have more than likely set a points total/league position to be in at 'x' stage (We can only guess at what they'd be but I'd imagine he again failed this one). Or a manager who has come into a basket case club and steadied the ship. Played some of the best front foot football we've seen in years. Blooding young talent. Has good support from most of its fan base. Is only 5 games into the season. 15 points in 8 games (auto promotion form that) Of course there's been some shit performances. How wouldn't there be when your clearing up a mess and simultaneously trying to build a young side. So what happens when Pelach loses 3 or 4 in 6 or 7? You've set a standard now John. Surely he needs sacking doesn't he John. Shit optics, badly managed by little Johnny Walters. And so the general consensus will continue that stoke are all the gear and no fucking idea. Billy smarts circus.... This is sort of the point that underpins everything, isn’t it? We’ve all got our biases, whether conscious or unconscious - what we like, what we want to see - and as things play out we probably interpret things to either fit or go against what we think is the right way of doing things. There’ll be people who didn’t rate Schumacher, and those who did and thought he had it in him to succeed. I’m in the latter and seems like you are too. SJW and some others on the message board were in the former. We probably see and highlight different things in games which either encourage or alarm depending on the stance we’ve taken. On reflection, while at the time I was buzzing about the results and performances at the very end of last season someone else, such as someone who has had the thought for months that Schumacher’s the wrong man and now has the authority to swing a big axe, might see it as a worry that we didn’t pick that level up this season and why it took the jeopardy we were in last season to get that out of the side. Neither are views are innately wrong, just that we probably offer greater value to the view which conforms to our perspective. Ultimately, if Walters has wanted to make the change since he was appointed either in the Interim or Permanent role, it probably comes to the point where it’s best for everyone to call it time and let everyone go in a different direction. It’s a ballsy move, but even if you have the best people appointed, if they aren’t on the same page and are always at each other’s throats it’s not going to work. And I don’t really buy the yes man argument. Ultimately, if I don’t work to the strategy my boss lays out he’s going to be pissed off and want to know why. Equally, Schumacher was within his right to be pissed off if one of the players was doing stuff that went against what he was asking him to do - he’d drop them, send them to Blackburn, or whatever and that’s perfectly fine. |
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seths
Lads'n'Dads
Posts: 68
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Post by seths on Sept 18, 2024 10:30:05 GMT
Was really hoping for a proper manager but hey ho! At this level, no one really employs a manager in the traditional sense, they are all head coaches, with a different person or team in charge of recruitment, and someone else again running the rest of the club. |
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Post by rowleyscfc on Sept 18, 2024 10:31:04 GMT
Think most of us agree Jon Coates isn't suited to run the club Fair play he's handed control over to Simon King,Jon Walters however Walters has shown his colours as a 'my way or the highway ' boss If that continues then that's a huge problem People have said on here that both Walters and King are cut from the same cloth and only want yes men which doesn’t bode well on or off the pitch. Who out of these 'people on here' know either Simon King and/or Walters outside of the figment of their imagination. It's just assumptions |
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Post by somersetpotter on Sept 18, 2024 10:31:26 GMT
Think most of us agree Jon Coates isn't suited to run the club Fair play he's handed control over to Simon King,Jon Walters however Walters has shown his colours as a 'my way or the highway ' boss If that continues then that's a huge problem People have said on here that both Walters and King are cut from the same cloth and only want yes men which doesn’t bode well on or off the pitch. Don't get this fixation on "yes men". We're all playing American Housewives at this point, but i'd imagine Walters has strong opinions. If you're going to challenge someone with a different viewpoint that's all good but you've got to show you were right in the results. I was massively excited for Schuey in the beginning, he came across like a great guy had obvious success at Plymouth on a limited budget playing good football, but in the end I haven't been impressed with how he's got us playing. I didn't watch Boro in the cup (my luck of watching everything and missing the only game we seem to do well), but I can't remember a game where I really thought we had a working system that suited our players strengths and made us look a threat. Walters has put his balls on the chopping block and I didn't see it coming, but to put things down to him just wanting yes men is mad. He wants results and to see us playing good attacking football. |
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Post by march4 on Sept 18, 2024 10:33:16 GMT
Thinking about the problems we have with FFP Alex Neil probably had a 3 year contract as would Schuey as will Pelach. No doubt Neil and Schuey have had lump sum payoffs. But it still makes for a very expensive management bill in financial terms which could have been put to better use. It depends if there were agreed contract breaks put in place at fixed points during the three years. |
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Sept 18, 2024 10:38:54 GMT
Or a manager who has come into a basket case club and steadied the ship. Played some of the best front foot football we've seen in years. Blooding young talent. Has good support from most of its fan base. Is only 5 games into the season. 15 points in 8 games (auto promotion form that) Of course there's been some shit performances. How wouldn't there be when your clearing up a mess and simultaneously trying to build a young side. So what happens when Pelach loses 3 or 4 in 6 or 7? You've set a standard now John. Surely he needs sacking doesn't he John. Shit optics, badly managed by little Johnny Walters. And so the general consensus will continue that stoke are all the gear and no fucking idea. Billy smarts circus.... This is sort of the point that underpins everything, isn’t it? We’ve all got our biases, whether conscious or unconscious - what we like, what we want to see - and as things play out we probably interpret things to either fit or go against what we think is the right way of doing things. There’ll be people who didn’t rate Schumacher, and those who did and thought he had it in him to succeed. I’m in the latter and seems like you are too. SJW and some others on the message board were in the former. We probably see and highlight different things in games which either encourage or alarm depending on the stance we’ve taken. On reflection, while at the time I was buzzing about the results and performances at the very end of last season someone else, such as someone who has had the thought for months that Schumacher’s the wrong man and now has the authority to swing a big axe, might see it as a worry that we didn’t pick that level up this season and why it took the jeopardy we were in last season to get that out of the side. Neither are views are innately wrong, just that we probably offer greater value to the view which conforms to our perspective. Ultimately, if Walters has wanted to make the change since he was appointed either in the Interim or Permanent role, it probably comes to the point where it’s best for everyone to call it time and let everyone go in a different direction. It’s a ballsy move, but even if you have the best people appointed, if they aren’t on the same page and are always at each other’s throats it’s not going to work. And I don’t really buy the yes man argument. Ultimately, if I don’t work to the strategy my boss lays out he’s going to be pissed off and want to know why. Equally, Schumacher was within his right to be pissed off if one of the players was doing stuff that went against what he was asking him to do - he’d drop them, send them to Blackburn, or whatever and that’s perfectly fine. Fair points. I was fairly neutral to Walters coming back. Concerned about his experience but bought a bit of the idea that he was a good pro for us (mostly) and could bring some of the work ethic back. But I think this shows him up to be either a bully or someone who knee jerks and seemingly likes quick fire firings. I got a really bad feeling about Walters. Looking back over interviews it never dawned on me how full of himself he is. Thinks he's a Stoke legend. Not for me he isn't and I think there's plenty who think the same. Pelach fails then so should Walters. Pelach finally cracks the stoke poison chalice and brings success then I'll shut me gob. Unnecessary sacking. The measure had not been met for such an unceremonial dismissal and damage to a young coaches reputation. Fucking Stoke City 🤦♂️ |
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