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Post by questionable on Sept 16, 2024 14:16:04 GMT
He's either nuts or very smart, I hope he's the latter. He's a Stokie and despite being in shock at the sacking of Schumacher we should back him as we know he would only do what he thinks is best for Stoke Honestly we need to get away from this mentality of he’s a Stokie, it’s something we all do but it’s got us absolutely nowhere for years along with local owners malarkey. It’s JW not SJW
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Post by spitthedog on Sept 16, 2024 14:38:28 GMT
I thought he came to here to improve the standards. If so, why is this seen as such a bad move? John Coates, and I quote.... "He has impressed everybody since taking charge on an interim basis, playing a huge part in galvanising the club and our fans" Walters himself said in his opening spiel about everyone having every else's backs. He forgot to mention watching for the knives obviously. Of course he's going to say that, what would you expect? Things change very quickly in football. So should we have employed him forever whatever happens on the field (or off it)?
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 16, 2024 14:38:37 GMT
He may have played for Stoke bur he has zero experience in managing a football team When compared to Schueys record of management there is no way he should have been allowed to over rule him.
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 16, 2024 14:43:16 GMT
I said at the time that it was a stupid decision to give him such a key job and nothing has changed my mind. Totally agree, never managed and probably never will. Just a parasite living from the talent of others. We seek to have the roles the wrong way round with the inexperienced ( in management) of JW overuling Schuey who has a decent record at least at Plymouth
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Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Sept 16, 2024 14:44:09 GMT
You wanted Jon boy to appoint a football man to run things, here you are.....
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Post by pushon on Sept 16, 2024 15:38:11 GMT
I said at the time that it was a stupid decision to give him such a key job and nothing has changed my mind. Totally agree, never managed and probably never will. Just a parasite living from the talent of others. We seek to have the roles the wrong way round with the inexperienced ( in management) of JW overuling Schuey who has a decent record at least at Plymouth There's not much point in appointing a Sporting Director if he isn’t allowed to manage the Footballing path, which he thinks, we should follow.
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Sept 16, 2024 15:44:40 GMT
Still, good news about the masters degree.
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Post by spitthedog on Sept 16, 2024 15:47:00 GMT
Totally agree, never managed and probably never will. Just a parasite living from the talent of others. We seek to have the roles the wrong way round with the inexperienced ( in management) of JW overuling Schuey who has a decent record at least at Plymouth There's not much point in appointing a Sporting Director if he isn’t allowed to manage the Footballing path, which he thinks, we should follow. Exactly this. Where did the 'he's got too big for his boots' crap come from suddenly? Stinks of small town mentality to me. We have been seriously underperforming. Needs someone to get a grip. He nearly got us relegated last season FFS! He's just doing his job, otherwise there is no point in having someone if they are just there to go along with everything.
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Post by pavel on Sept 16, 2024 15:57:11 GMT
There's not much point in appointing a Sporting Director if he isn’t allowed to manage the Footballing path, which he thinks, we should follow. Exactly this. Where did the 'he's got too big for his boots' crap come from suddenly? Stinks of small town mentality to me. We have been seriously underperforming. Needs someone to get a grip. He nearly got us relegated last season FFS! He's just doing his job, otherwise there is no point in having someone if they are just there to go along with everything. He is inexperienced as a DOF and for my mind been given to much power by Coates, so I think questions will be raised, including the timing of the decision. As for seriously underperforming, 7 wins out of the last 10 does not indicate that assertion. We’ve have some bad performances but losing at Watford who blow hot and cold, WBA who are top and even Oxford who are unbeaten at home is not a disastrous start. I’d say it was par for course for a team in the making and certainly not a reason to sack a manager 5 games into the season. There’s decisive management and thoughtful management, Walters seem to have failed on both counts in MY opinion.
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Post by stokesaint1 on Sept 16, 2024 16:01:38 GMT
I think the bottom line now is that Walters lives or dies dependant on the success or failure of the next appointment. There is no in between in my view. I guess success will be judged purely on finishing position at the end of season. Anything less than top half finish has to be judged a failure. Unless of course we are in the bottom 6 at Christmas and then I can see it being all change again. Who would have thought that when John Coates was young and asked for a cowboy outfit for Christmas, that daddy would get him Stoke City.
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 16, 2024 16:07:56 GMT
There's not much point in appointing a Sporting Director if he isn’t allowed to manage the Footballing path, which he thinks, we should follow. Exactly this. Where did the 'he's got too big for his boots' crap come from suddenly? Stinks of small town mentality to me. We have been seriously underperforming. Needs someone to get a grip. He nearly got us relegated last season FFS! He's just doing his job, otherwise there is no point in having someone if they are just there to go along with everything. And Walters qualifications are? At least Shuey got a side promoted We ended up with the tail wagging the dog with Walters said to be interfering
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Post by cheekymatt71 on Sept 16, 2024 16:08:44 GMT
He might as well just make himself manager at this point.
He is making it all about the John Walters at the moment.
War cry for support last season Firing Dublin and others at the club Now Firing Shumacher
Maybe he seems himself as the new tough guy TP style manager.
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Post by spitthedog on Sept 16, 2024 16:09:27 GMT
Exactly this. Where did the 'he's got too big for his boots' crap come from suddenly? Stinks of small town mentality to me. We have been seriously underperforming. Needs someone to get a grip. He nearly got us relegated last season FFS! He's just doing his job, otherwise there is no point in having someone if they are just there to go along with everything. He is inexperienced as a DOF and for my mind been given to much power by Coates, so I think questions will be raised, including the timing of the decision. As for seriously underperforming, 7 wins out of the last 10 does not indicate that assertion. We’ve have some bad performances but losing at Watford who blow hot and cold, WBA who are top and even Oxford who are unbeaten at home is not a disastrous start. I’d say it was par for course for a team in the making and certainly not a reason to sack a manager 5 games into the season. There’s decisive management and thoughtful management, Walters seem to have failed on both counts in MY opinion. Of course its opinion, but I have seen some serious underperforming in some of our players this season, another perspective might be that there are people working within the club who might have more idea about why that is the case and why that might be unacceptable.
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Post by RAF on Sept 16, 2024 16:12:17 GMT
It's ok he worked aaaaard! Proper qualification right there!
H
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Post by pushon on Sept 16, 2024 16:17:21 GMT
Exactly this. Where did the 'he's got too big for his boots' crap come from suddenly? Stinks of small town mentality to me. We have been seriously underperforming. Needs someone to get a grip. He nearly got us relegated last season FFS! He's just doing his job, otherwise there is no point in having someone if they are just there to go along with everything. He is inexperienced as a DOF and for my mind been given to much power by Coates, so I think questions will be raised, including the timing of the decision. As for seriously underperforming, 7 wins out of the last 10 does not indicate that assertion. We’ve have some bad performances but losing at Watford who blow hot and cold, WBA who are top and even Oxford who are unbeaten at home is not a disastrous start. I’d say it was par for course for a team in the making and certainly not a reason to sack a manager 5 games into the season. There’s decisive management and thoughtful management, Walters seem to have failed on both counts in MY opinion. Yes but, Schumacher was not 'the manager' he was the 'Head Coach' of the first team, made responsible for generating acceptable results/performances by the team. The same results/performances were deemed not acceptable by the 'Powers that be' so his services were dispensed with, it happens in business. Jon Walters was not the paramount assassin, he was assigned to pull the trigger.
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Post by milky on Sept 16, 2024 16:17:32 GMT
Any credit in the bank he has will evaporate if this next appointment goes tits up especially if SS gets another gig and starts making a good fist of it.
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Post by pavel on Sept 16, 2024 16:23:22 GMT
He is inexperienced as a DOF and for my mind been given to much power by Coates, so I think questions will be raised, including the timing of the decision. As for seriously underperforming, 7 wins out of the last 10 does not indicate that assertion. We’ve have some bad performances but losing at Watford who blow hot and cold, WBA who are top and even Oxford who are unbeaten at home is not a disastrous start. I’d say it was par for course for a team in the making and certainly not a reason to sack a manager 5 games into the season. There’s decisive management and thoughtful management, Walters seem to have failed on both counts in MY opinion. Yes but, Schumacher was not 'the manager' he was the 'Head Coach' of the first team, made responsible for generating acceptable results/performances by the team. The same results/performances were deemed not acceptable by the 'Powers that be' so his services were dispensed with, it happens in business. Jon Walters was not the paramount assassin, he was assigned to pull the trigger. In reality we don’t know who was responsible, though anecdotal evidence appears to point to Walter’s being the instigator. As for acceptable results if 7 wins out of the last 10 is not acceptable, what is!
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Post by Trouserdog on Sept 16, 2024 16:23:39 GMT
The problem with this model, that so many wanted us to embrace, is if you get a bad DOF, it's probably going to cause a lot more damage than just employing a bad manager.
Whether this applies to Walters we'll have to see!
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Post by cheadlepotter on Sept 16, 2024 16:27:47 GMT
The problem with this model, that so many wanted us to embrace, is if you get a bad DOF, it's probably going to cause a lot more damage than just employing a bad manager. Whether this applies to Walters we'll have to see! The way we implemented said model was a big problem. We’re now at the point where it should have started, the SD/DOF (that wasn’t chosen by the existing manager for crying out loud) choosing the manager. Cheerleading days are over, Super Jon has to get this one right and it’s all on him.
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Post by pushon on Sept 16, 2024 16:30:59 GMT
The problem with this model, that so many wanted us to embrace, is if you get a bad DOF, it's probably going to cause a lot more damage than just employing a bad manager. Whether this applies to Walters we'll have to see! Yes, in effect Walters has taken over the role of 'Manager' as we seem to have cancelled that role in the club structure. It puts more distance between results and the Owner/Directors responsibility.
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Post by pavel on Sept 16, 2024 16:32:40 GMT
The problem with this model, that so many wanted us to embrace, is if you get a bad DOF, it's probably going to cause a lot more damage than just employing a bad manager. Whether this applies to Walters we'll have to see! Indeed it can and with respect to Walters we’ll find out soon enough I suppose. I just think we’re taking the gambling ethos of Bet365 a bit too far in terms of the club! Seriously, if only we were managed as well as Bet365 we would be in the pink as they say.
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 16, 2024 16:40:07 GMT
The problem with this model, that so many wanted us to embrace, is if you get a bad DOF, it's probably going to cause a lot more damage than just employing a bad manager. Whether this applies to Walters we'll have to see! Agreed and Walters managerial experience is? Answer came there no e!
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 16, 2024 16:41:30 GMT
The problem with this model, that so many wanted us to embrace, is if you get a bad DOF, it's probably going to cause a lot more damage than just employing a bad manager. Whether this applies to Walters we'll have to see! Walters has no managerial experience whatsoever
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Post by Trouserdog on Sept 16, 2024 16:46:35 GMT
The problem with this model, that so many wanted us to embrace, is if you get a bad DOF, it's probably going to cause a lot more damage than just employing a bad manager. Whether this applies to Walters we'll have to see! Walters has no managerial experience whatsoever True, but up until now we've looked like we're going in the right direction under him. Recruitment has been better, there are youngsters being given opportunities...but this is a massive call he's made.
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Post by stokief on Sept 16, 2024 17:05:38 GMT
For a start, you only gain experience by being given a chance in the first place, I'm speaking of SJKW here. We've seen too many managers come in with their 'entourage' signing players that they've known before and where did that get us? We haven't spent all of this time and effort and money on an Academy to not see any of our own coming through and being given their chance in a team, not messed about from one week to the next. This has shifted our focus to a DOF and Head Coach. Supposedly a blueprint for a new way forward and whether people like it or not, it's where we are at and, here I go again, should be given a chance. We have no idea what goes on behind the scenes. We were floundering and dicing with relegation. The way I see it, SJW came in and steadied a very unsteady ship. Do folk just want him to meekly watch on until it's too late to sort cr@p out? I don't want to see any manager fail at Stoke but I always thought it would end this way with SS. Totally out of his depth. You're bang in trouble when your team have to have a sit down with you to tell you how to avoid relegation. What comes next? Well, I still live in hope that we get a coach who can get the respect of the players who are a fickle bunch as we know these days. SJW has been bold enough to say it was a decision that had to be made. He knows the buck stops with him. I trust him right now more than I did a Coach who thought Ennis was the answer so if SS has moaned behind the scenes about not having much say in the transfers I can't blame 'em for leaving it that way. I just wish we would take stock and make the right decision not some hurried half-ass appointment. The new Coach needs to be a good man-manager, obviously a good coach tactically and able to gain the trust and respect of this group of players. He'll need to have a strong character to sort this all out. Over to you SJW !!
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Post by silsdenstokie on Sept 16, 2024 17:19:19 GMT
I said at the time that it was a stupid decision to give him such a key job and nothing has changed my mind. Totally agree, never managed and probably never will. Just a parasite living from the talent of others. We seek to have the roles the wrong way round with the inexperienced ( in management) of JW overuling Schuey who has a decent record at least at Plymouth A parasite eh……wow Prior to today I think hes done a good job
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Post by richardparker on Sept 16, 2024 17:23:46 GMT
Did Schuey call him a wool?
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Post by stokiejoe on Sept 16, 2024 17:41:36 GMT
Totally agree, never managed and probably never will. Just a parasite living from the talent of others. We seek to have the roles the wrong way round with the inexperienced ( in management) of JW overuling Schuey who has a decent record at least at Plymouth A parasite eh……wow Prior to today I think hes done a good job Parasite definition "an organism that lives in or on an organism of another species (its host) and benefits by deriving nutrients at the other's expense." So no managerial experience but lives on the benefit of Schuey but making sure he avoids any blame himself. What has he done that's good?
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Post by bagnallboothen on Sept 16, 2024 17:44:01 GMT
The problem with this model, that so many wanted us to embrace, is if you get a bad DOF, it's probably going to cause a lot more damage than just employing a bad manager. Whether this applies to Walters we'll have to see! Indeed it can and with respect to Walters we’ll find out soon enough I suppose. I just think we’re taking the gambling ethos of Bet365 a bit too far in terms of the club! Seriously, if only we were managed as well as Bet365 we would be in the pink as they say. There is a reason John Coates is not running bet365 and probably a reason his sister bought him a football club to keep him occupied.
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Post by Goonie on Sept 16, 2024 17:47:29 GMT
As I see it SS was there to train and manage the players as well as picking the team and deploying tactics
I don't think Schumacher has met the brief set out for him, hence the club (JC and SJW I assume) agreed to pull the trigger # I'm sure this decision was not made lightly
I just hope they can finally get a coach in who can meet the brief, which I again assume, is promotion ASAP - we have to get it right sooner or later
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