|
|
Post by MilanStokie on Jul 17, 2024 11:37:13 GMT
Some proper weird arguments on here today. Here are a few pointers I would like to add: - The club has invested a ridiculous amount of money on the creation of an academy, staff, facilities and recruitment, which so far has brought about 2-3 really good prospects that have turned a healthy profit - The club decided to create a Technical Director position, which has transformed into a Sporting Director position Therefore, it would be criminal for the stakeholders not to be interested in protecting these investments and it would be within everyone's interest that the development of certain youth players is a high priority. The likes of Sidibe and Tezgel (if not loaned out) must get minutes to aid in their development. And it will be on SS to find appropriate opportunities to make this happen. There is no way JW will be dictating when and where, but for sure he will have handed SS some target numbers to work on. I think you’ve got it with “if not loaned out” there’s no way on this earth they’re going to get sufficient minutes staying here for the good of their development. They should be loaned out. The only argument against in Tezgel’s case is if we fail to bring in the forwards we require for the here and now. To do that deliberately to aid his route into the first team would be absurd. For sure, if we kept both in the camp and barely played them it would be negligent. I can't see that happening, they will either be kept and get plenty of developmental minutes or they will be loaned out at this point. It wouldn't do either of them any good playing another season if u21 footy |
|
|
|
Post by lordb on Jul 17, 2024 12:07:25 GMT
Some proper weird arguments on here today. Here are a few pointers I would like to add: - The club has invested a ridiculous amount of money on the creation of an academy, staff, facilities and recruitment, which so far has brought about 2-3 really good prospects that have turned a healthy profit - The club decided to create a Technical Director position, which has transformed into a Sporting Director position Therefore, it would be criminal for the stakeholders not to be interested in protecting these investments and it would be within everyone's interest that the development of certain youth players is a high priority. The likes of Sidibe and Tezgel (if not loaned out) must get minutes to aid in their development. And it will be on SS to find appropriate opportunities to make this happen. There is no way JW will be dictating when and where, but for sure he will have handed SS some target numbers to work on. I think you’ve got it with “if not loaned out” there’s no way on this earth they’re going to get sufficient minutes staying here for the good of their development. They should be loaned out. The only argument against in Tezgel’s case is if we fail to bring in the forwards we require for the here and now. To do that deliberately to aid his route into the first team would be absurd. 'there’s no way on this earth they’re going to get sufficient minutes staying here' Are you Schumacher? think you will be surprised re how many minutes Sol gets this season |
|
|
|
Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jul 17, 2024 13:11:56 GMT
You’re just spouting absolute shite now. It’s not though is it? Head coaches are at clubs on average for about 2 years, why would they care past the end of the current season? Why would they care how good Sol Sidibe could be in 3 years time? That's how a Lads and Dad's outfit is run, not a professional football team. The first team is not an extension of the academy. Whoever is in charge of picking the first team (in our case the Head coach) is responsible for getting the best result they can in the here and now, not in three years time. The only reason youngsters get played is because they are they best option and very occasionally because there is nothing on the game. The first team is not for developing youngsters who aren't ready for the level the first team is at. You send players out on loan today lower level if the aim is to develop them. Your take on this is completely off the mark. |
|
|
|
Post by monsoonmoon on Jul 17, 2024 14:23:06 GMT
Outstanding. The coach doesn’t care about how they do? 🤣 A manager/coach has no real interest in developing players over 2/3 or more years. Why would they when they know they more than likely won’t be at the club then? Because It will affect their appeal to potential employers in the future. |
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 17, 2024 20:01:15 GMT
It’s not though is it? Head coaches are at clubs on average for about 2 years, why would they care past the end of the current season? Why would they care how good Sol Sidibe could be in 3 years time? That's how a Lads and Dad's outfit is run, not a professional football team. The first team is not an extension of the academy. Whoever is in charge of picking the first team (in our case the Head coach) is responsible for getting the best result they can in the here and now, not in three years time. The only reason youngsters get played is because they are they best option and very occasionally because there is nothing on the game. The first team is not for developing youngsters who aren't ready for the level the first team is at. You send players out on loan today lower level if the aim is to develop them. Your take on this is completely off the mark. It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. |
|
|
|
Post by lordb on Jul 17, 2024 20:41:05 GMT
That's how a Lads and Dad's outfit is run, not a professional football team. The first team is not an extension of the academy. Whoever is in charge of picking the first team (in our case the Head coach) is responsible for getting the best result they can in the here and now, not in three years time. The only reason youngsters get played is because they are they best option and very occasionally because there is nothing on the game. The first team is not for developing youngsters who aren't ready for the level the first team is at. You send players out on loan today lower level if the aim is to develop them. Your take on this is completely off the mark. It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. My take is Walters and Schumacher are on the same page re this Sol just played exemplary in his half at Cork, he's ready |
|
|
|
Post by baconburger on Jul 17, 2024 21:28:20 GMT
It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. My take is Walters and Schumacher are on the same page re this Sol just played exemplary in his half at Cork, he's ready Looked very assured. He's impressive both in the maturity of his play and physically for his age. I'd still be surprised if he gets enough minutes for our first team to be the best option for his development. Outgoings may change the picture but there again incomings could make it more unlikely. |
|
|
|
Post by lordb on Jul 17, 2024 21:33:01 GMT
My take is Walters and Schumacher are on the same page re this Sol just played exemplary in his half at Cork, he's ready Looked very assured. He's impressive both in the maturity of his play and physically for his age. I'd still be surprised if he gets enough minutes for our first team to be the best option for his development. Outgoings may change the picture but there again incomings could make it more unlikely. Would be shocked if he's used sparingly Laurent out, Sol in |
|
|
|
Post by baconburger on Jul 17, 2024 21:40:24 GMT
Looked very assured. He's impressive both in the maturity of his play and physically for his age. I'd still be surprised if he gets enough minutes for our first team to be the best option for his development. Outgoings may change the picture but there again incomings could make it more unlikely. Would be shocked if he's used sparingly Laurent out, Sol in We'll just have to wait and see. I don't think anyone knows how we'll look in 3 weeks never mind 7. |
|
|
|
Post by Bera’s Beano on Jul 17, 2024 22:05:40 GMT
That's how a Lads and Dad's outfit is run, not a professional football team. The first team is not an extension of the academy. Whoever is in charge of picking the first team (in our case the Head coach) is responsible for getting the best result they can in the here and now, not in three years time. The only reason youngsters get played is because they are they best option and very occasionally because there is nothing on the game. The first team is not for developing youngsters who aren't ready for the level the first team is at. You send players out on loan today lower level if the aim is to develop them. Your take on this is completely off the mark. It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. Can’t believe you’re still going back and forth with people over this point. It is 100% self evident, it’s the way the club is going and the way football has been for years. |
|
|
|
Post by a on Jul 17, 2024 22:46:21 GMT
That's how a Lads and Dad's outfit is run, not a professional football team. The first team is not an extension of the academy. Whoever is in charge of picking the first team (in our case the Head coach) is responsible for getting the best result they can in the here and now, not in three years time. The only reason youngsters get played is because they are they best option and very occasionally because there is nothing on the game. The first team is not for developing youngsters who aren't ready for the level the first team is at. You send players out on loan today lower level if the aim is to develop them. Your take on this is completely off the mark. It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. It’s a pre season friendly against Cork. If he stays at the club this season I hope for your sake he plays and plays well. I also hope, if he stays that he plays well too, for the sake of all us fans. |
|
|
|
Post by Bramolini on Jul 17, 2024 23:03:27 GMT
Well he looked the part tonight , no doubt . But it was against a 2nd Division Irish team . I'd like to see him play like that against much stronger opposition . I think he can .
|
|
|
|
Post by rowleyscfc on Jul 18, 2024 7:32:22 GMT
Enjoy him whilst we've got him lads, if he fills out like Mama he's going end up being a monster of a midfielder. Bags of ability and don't think I've seen him give the ball away once
|
|
|
|
Post by baconburger on Jul 18, 2024 7:35:41 GMT
Well he looked the part tonight , no doubt . But it was against a 2nd Division Irish team . I'd like to see him play like that against much stronger opposition . I think he can . He certainly looked like one of if not the best players on show in that second half. If he’s going to play a lot I hope he stays but if he isn’t I hope he goes on loan. The worst of all worlds is him sitting on the bench. If he has another good season we’ll most likely need a Burger replacement nice to have one already in the hutch. |
|
|
|
Post by baconburger on Jul 18, 2024 7:41:40 GMT
Well he looked the part tonight , no doubt . But it was against a 2nd Division Irish team . I'd like to see him play like that against much stronger opposition . I think he can . The opposition was the same for everyone and he looked better than seasoned professionals. Both young CB looked very comfortable. Anderson nearly had a Hoever moment where he tried to do too much on the ball in the wrong area but that apart very encouraging first time I’ve seen him, didn’t know he was in the picture at all. Dixon too looks very composed and strong for his age. I love seeing young players breaking through. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2024 7:42:49 GMT
The Bolton and AZ games will give us a better gauge on where he's at. A good League One team and a good Dutch side.
If he comes through those tests then you'd think he would be nailed on to start the season, and after that it's up to him to keep it going.
I just hope the fans are realistic with him. He's still very young at 17 and if he does stay with us, he will have natural dips throughout the season.
|
|
|
|
Post by baconburger on Jul 18, 2024 7:42:52 GMT
Enjoy him whilst we've got him lads, if he fills out like Mama he's going end up being a monster of a midfielder. Bags of ability and don't think I've seen him give the ball away once Yeah he’s already got far more ability than his Dad. |
|
|
|
Post by baconburger on Jul 18, 2024 7:45:13 GMT
The Bolton and AZ games will give us a better gauge on where he's at. A good League One team and a good Dutch side. If he comes through those tests then you'd think he would be nailed on to start the season, and after that it's up to him to keep it going. I just hope the fans are realistic with him. He's still very young at 17 and if he does stay with us, he will have natural dips throughout the season. Given what we have and the fact we’re likely to add to it I’d still be very surprised to see him starting. Certainly won’t be a disappointing sort of surprised. |
|
|
|
Post by rowleyscfc on Jul 18, 2024 7:47:06 GMT
Enjoy him whilst we've got him lads, if he fills out like Mama he's going end up being a monster of a midfielder. Bags of ability and don't think I've seen him give the ball away once Yeah he’s already got far more ability than his Dad. Night and day in comparison and I think Mama would tell you that himself, although he put one of my favourite crosses of all time in big Mama did |
|
|
|
Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jul 18, 2024 7:47:50 GMT
That's how a Lads and Dad's outfit is run, not a professional football team. The first team is not an extension of the academy. Whoever is in charge of picking the first team (in our case the Head coach) is responsible for getting the best result they can in the here and now, not in three years time. The only reason youngsters get played is because they are they best option and very occasionally because there is nothing on the game. The first team is not for developing youngsters who aren't ready for the level the first team is at. You send players out on loan today lower level if the aim is to develop them. Your take on this is completely off the mark. It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. If Sidibe is the best option he will play. If he isn't he won't. He won't get time in the first team for the purposes of development. Schumacher said this himself a few weeks ago when talking about Sidibe's progress. No club bases their first team selection on the basis of developing their youngsters and no team is dependant on bringing on their young players. It's a brutal industry - most players don't make it and if they haven't got what it takes by the age of 20 they are just let go. There is no way the Sporting Director is going to over rule the Head Coach on team selection. If that happens Schumacher will walk and no self respecting Head Coach would touch the job. |
|
|
|
Post by apb1 on Jul 18, 2024 7:56:13 GMT
He looks like a really exciting prospect. Think he'll definitely play - probably start - in the league cup at Carlisle as well as some of the remaining preseason games. Thus far he seems to have taken on the challenge from Shchuey to come back strong after summer and fit in with first team training. If he plays well in the games mentioned, I can see him go on to appear 15-20 times this season, albeit mainly from the bench. Any more than that would be a sign that we have a serious player on our hands.
Lowe I think needs a loan as many have suggested.
I wonder how Tezgel will progress this season. Is he in the last year of his contract?
|
|
|
|
Post by werrington on Jul 18, 2024 7:58:11 GMT
Schumacher said at the end of last season he would of been in the match day squads had it not been a relegation battle as that wouldn’t of been fair on him
He’ll play a big part this season
|
|
|
|
Post by baconburger on Jul 18, 2024 7:59:15 GMT
It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. If Sidibe is the best option he will play. If he isn't he won't. He won't get time in the first team for the purposes of development. Schumacher said this himself a few weeks ago when talking about Sidibe's progress. No club bases their first team selection on the basis of developing their youngsters and no team is dependant on bringing on their young players. It's a brutal industry - most players don't make it and if they haven't got what it takes by the age of 20 they are just let go. There is no way the Sporting Director is going to over rule the Head Coach on team selection. If that happens Schumacher will walk and no self respecting Head Coach would touch the job. I think there are times of the season and even within games where a good coach/manager will get youngsters on the pitch for development and evaluation but that isn’t mainly at the beginning of a season but he does look unusually mature and a physical match for seasoned pros. |
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Jul 18, 2024 8:03:00 GMT
It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. If Sidibe is the best option he will play. If he isn't he won't. He won't get time in the first team for the purposes of development. Schumacher said this himself a few weeks ago when talking about Sidibe's progress. No club bases their first team selection on the basis of developing their youngsters and no team is dependant on bringing on their young players. It's a brutal industry - most players don't make it and if they haven't got what it takes by the age of 20 they are just let go. There is no way the Sporting Director is going to over rule the Head Coach on team selection. If that happens Schumacher will walk and no self respecting Head Coach would touch the job. Yes he would and that’s how it should work at a club like ours. And there is a way. It’s just the way it works. |
|
|
|
Post by a on Jul 18, 2024 8:58:15 GMT
If Sidibe is the best option he will play. If he isn't he won't. He won't get time in the first team for the purposes of development. Schumacher said this himself a few weeks ago when talking about Sidibe's progress. No club bases their first team selection on the basis of developing their youngsters and no team is dependant on bringing on their young players. It's a brutal industry - most players don't make it and if they haven't got what it takes by the age of 20 they are just let go. There is no way the Sporting Director is going to over rule the Head Coach on team selection. If that happens Schumacher will walk and no self respecting Head Coach would touch the job. Yes he would and that’s how it should work at a club like ours. And there is a way. It’s just the way it works. You genuinely don’t have a clue what you’re talking about. Does the Sporting/Technical Director decide on subs as well then? 😂 |
|
|
|
Post by nottsover60 on Jul 18, 2024 9:11:20 GMT
That's how a Lads and Dad's outfit is run, not a professional football team. The first team is not an extension of the academy. Whoever is in charge of picking the first team (in our case the Head coach) is responsible for getting the best result they can in the here and now, not in three years time. The only reason youngsters get played is because they are they best option and very occasionally because there is nothing on the game. The first team is not for developing youngsters who aren't ready for the level the first team is at. You send players out on loan today lower level if the aim is to develop them. Your take on this is completely off the mark. It’s how lots of managers work and why young players find it such a struggle. Just thinking about the here and now is not the way the club should be run and pathways for the best youngsters are part or that. I think it’s quite evident from this pre season the sporting director or whatever his title is far more involved than what usually happens. Who is saying it’s for players that aren’t ready? We’re in a thread about one who is more than ready. My take is the one that appears to happening. I am sure Tony Scholes always showed his face at these preseason trips abroad |
|
|
|
Post by foxysgloves on Jul 18, 2024 9:15:58 GMT
Compared to Thompson last night he looked a much better option.
Jordan was slow and careless while Sidibe was moving the ball quickly accurately and with intent.
|
|
|
|
Post by nottsover60 on Jul 18, 2024 9:17:07 GMT
If you don’t have trust in the manager to play the right players why is he in the job? You saying a manager should be told who to play is the point I think is bollocks. It’s not about trust, it’s about setting them rules they need to abide by to stick the club ethos. Developing and playing the young plauers that are good enough should be part of that. He’s not the manager. That's what happens at the interview. The club lay down their ethos and ask the candidate if he will buy into it and how. I don't understand the 'managers don' t have the clubs future at heart' stance. The club's short term aim is to get into the Premier which will require our best team which will include our best players in each position. If say we play Tezgel, Sidibe and Dixon every week because the club say they need games for our future in five years time, then we will still be in the Championship. |
|
|
|
Post by nottsover60 on Jul 18, 2024 9:20:31 GMT
Where did Sidibe play last night. It sounds from the report as if he was deep again, controlling the pace of the game and playing forward passes allowing Baker further forward. Schumacher has given him that important role twice and sung his praises afterwards so I don't think there should be any worries about him getting chances this season.
|
|
|
|
Post by rowleyscfc on Jul 18, 2024 10:12:41 GMT
Where did Sidibe play last night. It sounds from the report as if he was deep again, controlling the pace of the game and playing forward passes allowing Baker further forward. Schumacher has given him that important role twice and sung his praises afterwards so I don't think there should be any worries about him getting chances this season. Second half looked a 4-4-2 to me, couldn't really work it out, He looked in a flat 2 in midfield with Johnson |
|
