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Israel
Jan 19, 2024 17:44:23 GMT
Post by foster on Jan 19, 2024 17:44:23 GMT
I probably shouldn't have said Israeli Apologists, I should have said equally condemn but there were plenty on here on this thread and on the Pro Palestinian Protests berating the use of the phrase Not au fait how to properly copy old posts This is just one example which you can look up the original exchange from the date Oct 30, 2023 at 3:53pm via mobile QuotelikedislikePost OptionsPost by bayernoatcake on Oct 30, 2023 at 3:53pm Huddysleftfoot Avatar Oct 30, 2023 at 3:18pm Huddysleftfoot said: bayernoatcake Avatar Oct 30, 2023 at 2:35pm bayernoatcake said: BayernIsraeli’s see it as a call to genocide.(From the River to the Sea) It’s vile. Huddy It's nothing of the sort. Behave yourself man. Bayern So you’re dismissing how it makes them feel then. That’s really not on and if it against any other race you’d be calling it out for what it is. Gawa later commented that Bayern was literally calling Huddy a Racist I’ve been calling both sides out. Something you can’t seem to get your head around. Mate, he tried to point score from a post you made 4 months ago. That's hardcore. The fact that no one liked it, (but rather criticised it for being grade 'A' loser material), is neither here nor there. You got owned brah.
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Jan 19, 2024 17:46:26 GMT
Maybe I'm being ignorant but maybe it's because your average European thinks I could go on holiday to Israel. Asked the same about Syria, Palestine or Yemen maybe not so much. As I say I don't know... Agree mate, but unless you're religious I can't see why any European would really want to go to Israel. I see this as another case of us following the lead of the US. As a nation we've been castrated for a long time. Looking at who we choose to support and denounce, I think we've lost track of our identity and morality. Guess a lot of it dates back to us going cap in hand to the yanks during WW2 and them effectively bankrupting us. The yanks won't miss a chance to fuck someone over. And we've been their bitch ever since. Hence why Obama told us we'd be back of the queue for trade deals if we voted brexit and would no longer be their little grass and plant in the EU. Who knows.
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Israel
Jan 19, 2024 17:54:43 GMT
via mobile
Post by bayernoatcake on Jan 19, 2024 17:54:43 GMT
I’ve been calling both sides out. Something you can’t seem to get your head around. Yeah you've been encouraging both sides to kill one another, whilst getting a hard on for starting a war with Iran....... Nonsense apart from the Iran thing.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jan 19, 2024 17:59:13 GMT
Yeah you've been encouraging both sides to kill one another, whilst getting a hard on for starting a war with Iran....... Nonsense apart from the Iran thing. It’s a rarity he’s half right to be fair
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Post by gawa on Jan 19, 2024 20:34:12 GMT
Fair play Chile and Mexico
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Post by gawa on Jan 19, 2024 21:05:47 GMT
I’ve been calling both sides out. Something you can’t seem to get your head around. Mate, he tried to point score from a post you made 4 months ago. That's hardcore. The fact that no one liked it, (but rather criticised it for being grade 'A' loser material), is neither here nor there. You got owned brah. I think we've all maybe misread wannabes initial post and are discussing different things. Only reading back now I can see wannabe is talking about equally condemnation of the "to the river to the sea" phrase whereas John and I were talking about equal condemnation of the conflict. I thought it was a strange example to pick but if he's focusing on that phrase then it makes a bit more sense on second reading.
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Israel
Jan 19, 2024 21:17:36 GMT
via mobile
Post by iancransonsknees on Jan 19, 2024 21:17:36 GMT
Nonsense apart from the Iran thing. It’s a rarity he’s half right to be fair Who's apologising tonight?
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jan 19, 2024 23:10:31 GMT
Mate, he tried to point score from a post you made 4 months ago. That's hardcore. The fact that no one liked it, (but rather criticised it for being grade 'A' loser material), is neither here nor there. You got owned brah. I think we've all maybe misread wannabes initial post and are discussing different things. Only reading back now I can see wannabe is talking about equally condemnation of the "to the river to the sea" phrase whereas John and I were talking about equal condemnation of the conflict. I thought it was a strange example to pick but if he's focusing on that phrase then it makes a bit more sense on second reading. Yes absolutely. What I thought wannabee was talking about, is that for months now, we've had politicians and journalists telling us that the 'from the river to the sea' claim was antisemitic (when many of us on here, were saying that it wasn't) and now we've got the Israeli leader using exactly the same words. And there is absolutely nothing wrong in him highlighting Bayern's post, it was plain wrong, as Netanyahu has so clearly demonstrated.
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Israel
Jan 19, 2024 23:21:09 GMT
via mobile
Post by musik on Jan 19, 2024 23:21:09 GMT
Ukraine Gaza Yemen
It's like an epidemic. And the only one on the Swedish news is the last one now.
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Post by wannabee on Jan 20, 2024 0:12:52 GMT
I think we've all maybe misread wannabes initial post and are discussing different things. Only reading back now I can see wannabe is talking about equally condemnation of the "to the river to the sea" phrase whereas John and I were talking about equal condemnation of the conflict. I thought it was a strange example to pick but if he's focusing on that phrase then it makes a bit more sense on second reading. Yes absolutely. What I thought wannabee was talking about, is that for months now, we've had politicians and journalists telling us that the 'from the river to the sea' claim was antisemitic (when many of us on here, were saying that it wasn't) and now we've got the Israeli leader using exactly the same words. And there is absolutely nothing wrong in him highlighting Bayern's post, it was plain wrong, as Netanyahu has so clearly demonstrated. Thank you Paul and Gawa, I already said I shouldn't have used the term Israeli Apologists and I regret it. For months we have been fed a line that using the phrase "From the River to the Sea" was proof positive that Hamas was intent on the annihilation of Nuclear Power Israel. The most frequent usage of this phrase reported in British Media was during the Pro Palestinian Rallies in London and it reached its Zeneth in the lead up to the Rememberance Weekend Some on here agreed swayed by the Media hype and the emotions attached to that Weekend, most did not. In fact the majority on this MB believed the opposite and Foster to his credit was one of the first to call it out that it was obvious Israe'ls intent was the Genocide of the Palestinian people (posted I believe 10th November) I thought it was obvious what my comment replied under your post Paul of Netanyahu uttering the very same phrase "From the River to the Sea" in his most recent speech describing what the Final Solution should be I shall be less cryptic in future
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 20, 2024 8:18:02 GMT
Yes absolutely. What I thought wannabee was talking about, is that for months now, we've had politicians and journalists telling us that the 'from the river to the sea' claim was antisemitic (when many of us on here, were saying that it wasn't) and now we've got the Israeli leader using exactly the same words. And there is absolutely nothing wrong in him highlighting Bayern's post, it was plain wrong, as Netanyahu has so clearly demonstrated. Thank you Paul and Gawa, I already said I shouldn't have used the term Israeli Apologists and I regret it. For months we have been fed a line that using the phrase "From the River to the Sea" was proof positive that Hamas was intent on the annihilation of Nuclear Power Israel. The most frequent usage of this phrase reported in British Media was during the Pro Palestinian Rallies in London and it reached its Zeneth in the lead up to the Rememberance Weekend Some on here agreed swayed by the Media hype and the emotions attached to that Weekend, most did not. In fact the majority on this MB believed the opposite and Foster to his credit was one of the first to call it out that it was obvious Israe'ls intent was the Genocide of the Palestinian people (posted I believe 10th November) I thought it was obvious what my comment replied under your post Paul of Netanyahu uttering the very same phrase "From the River to the Sea" in his most recent speech describing what the Final Solution should be I shall be less cryptic in future Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, so wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jan 20, 2024 9:31:40 GMT
Thank you Paul and Gawa, I already said I shouldn't have used the term Israeli Apologists and I regret it. For months we have been fed a line that using the phrase "From the River to the Sea" was proof positive that Hamas was intent on the annihilation of Nuclear Power Israel. The most frequent usage of this phrase reported in British Media was during the Pro Palestinian Rallies in London and it reached its Zeneth in the lead up to the Rememberance Weekend Some on here agreed swayed by the Media hype and the emotions attached to that Weekend, most did not. In fact the majority on this MB believed the opposite and Foster to his credit was one of the first to call it out that it was obvious Israe'ls intent was the Genocide of the Palestinian people (posted I believe 10th November) I thought it was obvious what my comment replied under your post Paul of Netanyahu uttering the very same phrase "From the River to the Sea" in his most recent speech describing what the Final Solution should be I shall be less cryptic in future Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, do wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to deal as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, From me there are a lot of people mire knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here? you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. I think it’s just becoming very difficult to defend Israel at this stage of the conflict, that’s the crux of it…..
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Post by iancransonsknees on Jan 20, 2024 9:51:17 GMT
Thank you Paul and Gawa, I already said I shouldn't have used the term Israeli Apologists and I regret it. For months we have been fed a line that using the phrase "From the River to the Sea" was proof positive that Hamas was intent on the annihilation of Nuclear Power Israel. The most frequent usage of this phrase reported in British Media was during the Pro Palestinian Rallies in London and it reached its Zeneth in the lead up to the Rememberance Weekend Some on here agreed swayed by the Media hype and the emotions attached to that Weekend, most did not. In fact the majority on this MB believed the opposite and Foster to his credit was one of the first to call it out that it was obvious Israe'ls intent was the Genocide of the Palestinian people (posted I believe 10th November) I thought it was obvious what my comment replied under your post Paul of Netanyahu uttering the very same phrase "From the River to the Sea" in his most recent speech describing what the Final Solution should be I shall be less cryptic in future Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, do wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to deal as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, From me there are a lot of people mire knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here? you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. Great post, probably represents what an awful lot of posters feel.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jan 20, 2024 10:23:05 GMT
Thank you Paul and Gawa, I already said I shouldn't have used the term Israeli Apologists and I regret it. For months we have been fed a line that using the phrase "From the River to the Sea" was proof positive that Hamas was intent on the annihilation of Nuclear Power Israel. The most frequent usage of this phrase reported in British Media was during the Pro Palestinian Rallies in London and it reached its Zeneth in the lead up to the Rememberance Weekend Some on here agreed swayed by the Media hype and the emotions attached to that Weekend, most did not. In fact the majority on this MB believed the opposite and Foster to his credit was one of the first to call it out that it was obvious Israe'ls intent was the Genocide of the Palestinian people (posted I believe 10th November) I thought it was obvious what my comment replied under your post Paul of Netanyahu uttering the very same phrase "From the River to the Sea" in his most recent speech describing what the Final Solution should be I shall be less cryptic in future Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, do wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. Well said John bang on. You’ll be definately be in the running for next years most intelligent poster My points probably a lot more simplistic but there are times when it feels like there’s a “competition” between posters as to who can - be the most shocked - have the most hatred towards Israel - be the most disgusted by what other posters say. When actually the majority feel like you’ve so well expressed in your post. It’s a terribly sad situation where way too many innocent people on both sides have lost their lives. I think we can all agree that. Ultimately a message board not reality so there’s little difference anyone can make by getting angry.
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 20, 2024 10:25:40 GMT
Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, do wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. Well said John bang on. You’ll be definately be in the running for next years most intelligent poster My points probably a lot more simplistic but there are times when it feels like there’s a “competition” between posters as to who can - be the most shocked - have the most hatred towards Israel - be the most disgusted by what other posters say. When actually the majority feel like you’ve so well expressed in your post. It’s a terribly sad situation where way too many innocent people on both sides have lost their lives. I think we can all agree that. Ultimately a message board not reality so there’s little difference anyone can make by getting angry. Steady on....I've met Felonious , I had a headache after 20 minutes due to the depth of the debate....I'm on tablets now.
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Post by iancransonsknees on Jan 20, 2024 10:29:21 GMT
Well said John bang on. You’ll be definately be in the running for next years most intelligent poster My points probably a lot more simplistic but there are times when it feels like there’s a “competition” between posters as to who can - be the most shocked - have the most hatred towards Israel - be the most disgusted by what other posters say. When actually the majority feel like you’ve so well expressed in your post. It’s a terribly sad situation where way too many innocent people on both sides have lost their lives. I think we can all agree that. Ultimately a message board not reality so there’s little difference anyone can make by getting angry. Steady on....I've met Felonious , I had a headache after 20 minutes due to the depth of the debate....I'm on tablets now. I guess that happens when you meet the most intelligent poster. It'd be like an amoeba meeting Einstein if I ever stumbled across him on a footpath chasing some veteran runners like Northy.
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Post by iancransonsknees on Jan 20, 2024 10:35:31 GMT
Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, do wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. Well said John bang on. You’ll be definately be in the running for next years most intelligent poster My points probably a lot more simplistic but there are times when it feels like there’s a “competition” between posters as to who can - be the most shocked - have the most hatred towards Israel - be the most disgusted by what other posters say. When actually the majority feel like you’ve so well expressed in your post. It’s a terribly sad situation where way too many innocent people on both sides have lost their lives. I think we can all agree that. Ultimately a message board not reality so there’s little difference anyone can make by getting angry.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jan 20, 2024 10:47:17 GMT
Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, do wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. Well said John bang on. You’ll be definately be in the running for next years most intelligent poster My points probably a lot more simplistic but there are times when it feels like there’s a “competition” between posters as to who can - be the most shocked - have the most hatred towards Israel - be the most disgusted by what other posters say. When actually the majority feel like you’ve so well expressed in your post. It’s a terribly sad situation where way too many innocent people on both sides have lost their lives. I think we can all agree that. Ultimately a message board not reality so there’s little difference anyone can make by getting angry. Is it ok to be angry about anything on here with it being “just a message board?” The death of thousands of innocent people tends to promote a response for most people with a pulse. There’s threads on here about kids who have suffered the most horrific abuse and died of neglect or at the hands of grooming gangs for example, is it ok to be angry about them? People just post about what they are passionate about ultimately, they’re not shouting at the screen they’re just making a point. You get passionate defending a man born into immense privilege and wealth who wears a giant robe and opulent crown for example, and that’s absolutely fine. Reply, ignore, block it’s all good……
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Post by iancransonsknees on Jan 20, 2024 10:52:45 GMT
Well said John bang on. You’ll be definately be in the running for next years most intelligent poster My points probably a lot more simplistic but there are times when it feels like there’s a “competition” between posters as to who can - be the most shocked - have the most hatred towards Israel - be the most disgusted by what other posters say. When actually the majority feel like you’ve so well expressed in your post. It’s a terribly sad situation where way too many innocent people on both sides have lost their lives. I think we can all agree that. Ultimately a message board not reality so there’s little difference anyone can make by getting angry. Is it ok to be angry about anything on here with it being “just a message board?” The death of thousands of innocent people tends to promote a response for most people with a pulse. There’s threads on here about kids who have suffered the most horrific abuse and died of neglect or at the hands of grooming gangs for example, is it ok to be angry about them? People just post about what they are passionate about ultimately, they’re not shouting at the screen they’re just making a point. You get passionate defending a man born into immense privilege and wealth who wears a giant robe and opulent crown for example, and that’s absolutely fine. Reply, ignore, block it’s all good…… Don't just ignore Bruce Lee.
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Israel
Jan 20, 2024 10:55:57 GMT
via mobile
Post by Paul Spencer on Jan 20, 2024 10:55:57 GMT
Thank you Paul and Gawa, I already said I shouldn't have used the term Israeli Apologists and I regret it. For months we have been fed a line that using the phrase "From the River to the Sea" was proof positive that Hamas was intent on the annihilation of Nuclear Power Israel. The most frequent usage of this phrase reported in British Media was during the Pro Palestinian Rallies in London and it reached its Zeneth in the lead up to the Rememberance Weekend Some on here agreed swayed by the Media hype and the emotions attached to that Weekend, most did not. In fact the majority on this MB believed the opposite and Foster to his credit was one of the first to call it out that it was obvious Israe'ls intent was the Genocide of the Palestinian people (posted I believe 10th November) I thought it was obvious what my comment replied under your post Paul of Netanyahu uttering the very same phrase "From the River to the Sea" in his most recent speech describing what the Final Solution should be I shall be less cryptic in future Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, so wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. As you said originally BJR, you haven't read all the posts and if you've missed stuff (as you've also suggested), then you've missed stuff and it is what it is. I see absolutely zero point in asking what it might have been that you've missed, as those (highly emotive) arguments/discussions were done/settled at the time and to reopen them again, would seem potentially quite dangerous, simply to satisfy your curiosity.
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Post by gawa on Jan 20, 2024 10:59:22 GMT
Thank you Paul and Gawa, I already said I shouldn't have used the term Israeli Apologists and I regret it. For months we have been fed a line that using the phrase "From the River to the Sea" was proof positive that Hamas was intent on the annihilation of Nuclear Power Israel. The most frequent usage of this phrase reported in British Media was during the Pro Palestinian Rallies in London and it reached its Zeneth in the lead up to the Rememberance Weekend Some on here agreed swayed by the Media hype and the emotions attached to that Weekend, most did not. In fact the majority on this MB believed the opposite and Foster to his credit was one of the first to call it out that it was obvious Israe'ls intent was the Genocide of the Palestinian people (posted I believe 10th November) I thought it was obvious what my comment replied under your post Paul of Netanyahu uttering the very same phrase "From the River to the Sea" in his most recent speech describing what the Final Solution should be I shall be less cryptic in future Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, so wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. Plenty of people were excusing Israels actions and trying to justify them. And it wasn't just "woke lefties" who picked up on it either. Personally I've got more respect for those who have changed stance after following the conflict as some people seem too stubborn to do that.The destination of where you end up with your opinion is much more important than the journey. I genuinely don't remember you being particularly involved in this thread at the start which I think you admitted yourself, so not sure why you suddenly want to go on this crusade to say nobody was justifying Israels actions and that I'm an extremist with my views which nobody is on the same scale of Israels side. If you don't want to hear it from me, wannabe or another snowflake. Here's Foster calling it out Some real Israeli terror tactic sympathising whoppers appearing in this thread over the past couple of days. All I'll say is stop being racist and disregard skin colour and religion for a second, and then look at things from an objective point of view.
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Israel
Jan 20, 2024 11:20:40 GMT
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 20, 2024 11:20:40 GMT
Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, so wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. As you said originally BJR, you haven't read all the posts and if you've missed stuff (as you've also suggested), then you've missed stuff and it is what it is. I see absolutely zero point in asking what it might have been that you've missed, as those (highly emotive) arguments/discussions were done/settled at the time and to reopen them again, would seem potentially quite dangerous, simply to satisfy your curiosity. I agree Paul No point in resurrecting everything,( it's a bit like the Brexit thread).....my point was IRRESPECTIVE of the past posts, it seems to me there NOW is somewhat of a consensus ( amongst those who post) that Israel is committing something approaching Genocide.
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Israel
Jan 20, 2024 11:26:18 GMT
Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jan 20, 2024 11:26:18 GMT
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Israel
Jan 20, 2024 11:27:38 GMT
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 20, 2024 11:27:38 GMT
Wannabee , when I responded to your post I wasn't particularly picking up on the use of the word " apologist"....I just genuinely can't recall any strong support whatsoever for what Israel are doing, so wondered what I'd missed.It still does seem to me thst there is almost general agreement that what Israel are doing is abhorent. I posted on Oct 8th Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. Which could be interpreted as genocide. In fairness to Bayern he has said that he condemns both sides....I don't know what more he can do, perhaps people don't believe him. Perhaps we always think there is a hidden agenda, I think the reasons for not posting on a thread could be many fold.....not being interested, not agreeing but not wanting to feel as though you are being attacked, someone has already said what you would have said, For me there are a lot of people more knowledgeable and the time factor....you just know if you post something you might be embarking on a two day argument, often on repeated back and forth points( Brexit). I am grateful to the posts of many on here, you included, for insights and information I would not already have ( I don't have a telly, so don't watch mainstream media)...this Israel thread and the Post office thread have been a credit to the posters and show the value of the Oatcake. Sometimes it gets too personal and people take sides instead of just sticking to the arguments. Plenty of people were excusing Israels actions and trying to justify them. And it wasn't just "woke lefties" who picked up on it either. Personally I've got more respect for those who have changed stance after following the conflict as some people seem too stubborn to do that.The destination of where you end up with your opinion is much more important than the journey. I genuinely don't remember you being particularly involved in this thread at the start which I think you admitted yourself, so not sure why you suddenly want to go on this crusade to say nobody was justifying Israels actions and that I'm an extremist with my views which nobody is on the same scale of Israels side. If you don't want to hear it from me, wannabe or another snowflake. Here's Foster calling it out Some real Israeli terror tactic sympathising whoppers appearing in this thread over the past couple of days. All I'll say is stop being racist and disregard skin colour and religion for a second, and then look at things from an objective point of view. I did post on October 8th, Gawa Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. For reasons I have explained I had no reason to keep posting. I'm not on a crusade. I'm just responding to posts( such as yours now) I was simply pointing out that , it seems to me, that there is a consensus ( recently if you like) on here that Israel's actions virtually amount to genocide. I don't know, nor am I really bothered by how that fits in with the past. I thought I was " reading " the debate wrongly ( and I don't recall calling you or anyone a snowflake... for the record I don't think you are ( not that I use the term) and I respect you as a poster)
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Israel
Jan 20, 2024 11:35:38 GMT
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 20, 2024 11:35:38 GMT
Genocide For me Paul, that's why the two State solution ( which I used to believe in) will no longer work. Israel would not allow what they see as a rogue state to exist on their border. The excuse will be that Hamas have vowed to destroy Israel, and they will make no distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. Unfortunately a further long-term implication( which I have previously posted) is that I believe people will cease to make a distinction between Jews and Zionists and between Palestinians and Hamas ( which will simply be reduced to " terrrorists), things will be polarised, and not just in the Middle East.
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Israel
Jan 20, 2024 11:39:10 GMT
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jan 20, 2024 11:39:10 GMT
Well said John bang on. You’ll be definately be in the running for next years most intelligent poster My points probably a lot more simplistic but there are times when it feels like there’s a “competition” between posters as to who can - be the most shocked - have the most hatred towards Israel - be the most disgusted by what other posters say. When actually the majority feel like you’ve so well expressed in your post. It’s a terribly sad situation where way too many innocent people on both sides have lost their lives. I think we can all agree that. Ultimately a message board not reality so there’s little difference anyone can make by getting angry. Is it ok to be angry about anything on here with it being “just a message board?” The death of thousands of innocent people tends to promote a response for most people with a pulse. There’s threads on here about kids who have suffered the most horrific abuse and died of neglect or at the hands of grooming gangs for example, is it ok to be angry about them? People just post about what they are passionate about ultimately, they’re not shouting at the screen they’re just making a point. You get passionate defending a man born into immense privilege and wealth who wears a giant robe and opulent crown for example, and that’s absolutely fine. Reply, ignore, block it’s all good…… There’s nothing wrong with having an opinion or feeling strongly about something. I guess it all comes down to how you do it and how you say it. I just tend to put my energies more into things that I can actually do something about (I’m not going into the details) and that are closer to home and that I can see blossom or change for the better. I guess it’s priorities as you say. I don’t watch the news that much (it all comes from here) so maybe that’s why I’m not so affected and why I actually try to change things closer to home.
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Israel
Jan 20, 2024 11:43:11 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jan 20, 2024 11:43:11 GMT
Plenty of people were excusing Israels actions and trying to justify them. And it wasn't just "woke lefties" who picked up on it either. Personally I've got more respect for those who have changed stance after following the conflict as some people seem too stubborn to do that.The destination of where you end up with your opinion is much more important than the journey. I genuinely don't remember you being particularly involved in this thread at the start which I think you admitted yourself, so not sure why you suddenly want to go on this crusade to say nobody was justifying Israels actions and that I'm an extremist with my views which nobody is on the same scale of Israels side. If you don't want to hear it from me, wannabe or another snowflake. Here's Foster calling it out I did post on October 8th, Gawa Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. For reasons I have explained I had no reason to keep posting. I'm not on a crusade. I'm just responding to posts( such as yours now) I was simply pointing out that , it seems to me, that there is a consensus ( recently if you like) on here that Israel's actions virtually amount to genocide. I don't know, nor am I really bothered by how that fits in with the past. I thought I was " reading " the debate wrongly To be fair BJR the discussion we're having now was started by yourself yesterday, specifically asking what had gone on in the past? I have not read every post Wannabee, but are there any/ many Israeli apologists on here. I can't recall any?...at least none who Don’t condemn both sides.
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Israel
Jan 20, 2024 11:46:09 GMT
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 20, 2024 11:46:09 GMT
I did post on October 8th, Gawa Unfortunately the Hamas attack might give Israel the excuse to virtually annihilate the West Bank and Gaza strip, given the West's support for Israel. For reasons I have explained I had no reason to keep posting. I'm not on a crusade. I'm just responding to posts( such as yours now) I was simply pointing out that , it seems to me, that there is a consensus ( recently if you like) on here that Israel's actions virtually amount to genocide. I don't know, nor am I really bothered by how that fits in with the past. I thought I was " reading " the debate wrongly To be fair BJR the discussion we're having now was started by yourself yesterday, specifically asking what had gone on in the past? I have not read every post Wannabee, but are there any/ many Israeli apologists on here. I can't recall any?...at least none who Don’t condemn both sides. To be honest Paul......I don't know what we ARE discussing at the moment
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jan 20, 2024 11:49:09 GMT
Genocide For me Paul, that's why the two State solution ( which I used to believe in) will no longer work. Israel would not allow what they see as a rogue state to exist on their border. The excuse will be that Hamas have vowed to destroy Israel, and they will make no distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. Unfortunately a further long-term implication( which I have previously posted) is that I believe people will cease to make a distinction between Jews and Zionists and between Palestinians and Hamas ( which will simply be reduced to " terrrorists), things will be polarised, and not just in the Middle East. It’s so important that as people continue to call Israel out on their actions they make a clear distinction between Zionists and Jews, that point can’t be made enough. Not all Jews are Zionists and not all Zionists are Jews. Anyone championing the Palestinian cause must be very vocal on that……
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jan 20, 2024 11:52:08 GMT
Genocide For me Paul, that's why the two State solution ( which I used to believe in) will no longer work. Israel would not allow what they see as a rogue state to exist on their border. The excuse will be that Hamas have vowed to destroy Israel, and they will make no distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. Unfortunately a further long-term implication( which I have previously posted) is that I believe people will cease to make a distinction between Jews and Zionists and between Palestinians and Hamas ( which will simply be reduced to " terrrorists), things will be polarised, and not just in the Middle East. It’s so important that as people continue to call Israel out on their actions they make a clear distinction between Zionists and Jews, that point can’t be made enough. Not all Jews are Zionists and not all Zionists are Jews. Anyone championing the Palestinian cause must be very vocal on that…… I think that is true Prestwich....but my point is that I think, in light of October 7th and subsequent events, people will do so , less and less....I'm not thinking about Posters on the EE board, but the wider world.....I hope I'm wrong Ki just want to EDIT this which does relate to order recent posts. I agree with everything you have said about the distinctions between Zionism/ Judaism, Hamas/Palestinian. and its importannce. You know much more about it than me and have explained it clearly and consistently....So I have not felt the need to post( possibly amongst other reasons).
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