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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 15, 2022 8:27:35 GMT
Of course, but playing devils advocate Russia will have seen the likes of John McCain and Victoria Nuland meeting with groups such as the ultra right wing opposition to Yanukovych and come to the conclusion that both the Obama regime and the EU were meddling in the politics of Ukraine and openly trying to oust the elected leader of an independent nation. You say Soviet provocation, they would say otherwise……. Indeed. They say a lot of things. Pravda… Truth.  America and the UK say a lot of things as well. When we drop the arrogance and hypocrisy it may bring out so-called enemies to the table more often…… |
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Post by partickpotter on Feb 15, 2022 8:50:18 GMT
Indeed. They say a lot of things. Pravda… Truth. America and the UK say a lot of things as well. When we drop the arrogance and hypocrisy it may bring out so-called enemies to the table more often…… Yeah. It’s all down to the arrogance and hypocrisy of the Yanks and the Brits. |
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 15, 2022 9:23:30 GMT
America and the UK say a lot of things as well. When we drop the arrogance and hypocrisy it may bring out so-called enemies to the table more often…… Yeah. It’s all down to the arrogance and hypocrisy of the Yanks and the Brits. I didn't say all you've clearly made that up, you seem to think the whole shit show is purely down to Putin and Russia though which I fundamentally disagree with........ |
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Feb 15, 2022 9:27:22 GMT
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Post by partickpotter on Feb 15, 2022 9:33:46 GMT
Yeah. It’s all down to the arrogance and hypocrisy of the Yanks and the Brits. I didn't say all you've clearly made that up, you seem to think the whole shit show is purely down to Putin and Russia though which I fundamentally disagree with........ It’s akin to a rape defence whereby blame is put on the girl choosing what clothes to wear and her pal helping with that choice. In other words it’s no defence. There is one aggressor here. Russia, who, continuing the metaphor, can’t cope with the breakup of a relationship. A brutally abusive relationship at that. Russia, the rapist bully wanting its bitch back. Absolutely sickening. |
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Feb 15, 2022 9:35:31 GMT
He's certainly made the Western Propaganda machine look like the scare mongering, cringe worthy turd it is. Boris, Biden and Macron will be devastated if true. People will focus on their shit leadership again. |
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Feb 15, 2022 9:39:51 GMT
Any chance of Liz Truss shutting up for a day with her exaggerated, pro war rhetoric? Its becoming both boring and, it would appear, factually incorrect. Recent reports would suggest Europe isn't on the brink of war.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 16, 2022 12:15:21 GMT
Any chance of Liz Truss shutting up for a day with her exaggerated, pro war rhetoric? Its becoming both boring and, it would appear, factually incorrect. Recent reports would suggest Europe isn't on the brink of war. Starmer is trying to out-Churchill her this morning. It’s truly pathetic…. |
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 16, 2022 12:20:49 GMT
I didn't say all you've clearly made that up, you seem to think the whole shit show is purely down to Putin and Russia though which I fundamentally disagree with........ It’s akin to a rape defence whereby blame is put on the girl choosing what clothes to wear and her pal helping with that choice. In other words it’s no defence. There is one aggressor here. Russia, who, continuing the metaphor, can’t cope with the breakup of a relationship. A brutally abusive relationship at that. Russia, the rapist bully wanting its bitch back. Absolutely sickening. It’s not akin to a rape defence at all. And Russia doesn’t even want Ukraine it’s bollocks to say that it does he’d Putin would be perfectly happy with it being a buffer state. And neither does the rest of the world laughably, they are merely a pawn in this. Russia are simply doing want America does and would continue to do under the Monroe Doctrine. Honestly it’s like “Geopolitics for Dummies”. Chapter 1 of 1. Russia, China and Iran bad, the West good. |
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Feb 16, 2022 13:39:04 GMT
Any chance of Liz Truss shutting up for a day with her exaggerated, pro war rhetoric? Its becoming both boring and, it would appear, factually incorrect. Recent reports would suggest Europe isn't on the brink of war. Starmer is trying to out-Churchill her this morning. It’s truly pathetic…. I just can't comprehend what they think they are gaining from this utterly cringe worthy language. It's fucking pathetic. |
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Post by partickpotter on Feb 16, 2022 13:51:11 GMT
It’s akin to a rape defence whereby blame is put on the girl choosing what clothes to wear and her pal helping with that choice. In other words it’s no defence. There is one aggressor here. Russia, who, continuing the metaphor, can’t cope with the breakup of a relationship. A brutally abusive relationship at that. Russia, the rapist bully wanting its bitch back. Absolutely sickening. It’s not akin to a rape defence at all. And Russia doesn’t even want Ukraine it’s bollocks to say that it does he’d Putin would be perfectly happy with it being a buffer state. And neither does the rest of the world laughably, they are merely a pawn in this. Russia are simply doing want America does and would continue to do under the Monroe Doctrine. Honestly it’s like “Geopolitics for Dummies”. Chapter 1 of 1. Russia, China and Iran bad, the West good. “Geopolitics for Dummies”. Chapter 2. The West bad. Russia, China and Iran good. |
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 16, 2022 13:53:51 GMT
It’s not akin to a rape defence at all. And Russia doesn’t even want Ukraine it’s bollocks to say that it does he’d Putin would be perfectly happy with it being a buffer state. And neither does the rest of the world laughably, they are merely a pawn in this. Russia are simply doing want America does and would continue to do under the Monroe Doctrine. Honestly it’s like “Geopolitics for Dummies”. Chapter 1 of 1. Russia, China and Iran bad, the West good. “Geopolitics for Dummies”. Chapter 2. The West bad. Russia, China and Iran good. It's you solely blaming Russia not me solely blaming the West, and get your own feckin' jokes.......  |
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Post by partickpotter on Feb 16, 2022 13:53:54 GMT
Starmer is trying to out-Churchill her this morning. It’s truly pathetic…. I just can't comprehend what they think they are gaining from this utterly cringe worthy language. It's fucking pathetic. Starmer posturing is all about him being “Not Jeremy Corbyn”. Johnson, Truss posturing is a combination of looking the part with the Americans (a long history of that) and trying to use foreign affairs to distract from domestic travails (a long history in that too). |
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Post by partickpotter on Feb 16, 2022 14:03:02 GMT
“Geopolitics for Dummies”. Chapter 2. The West bad. Russia, China and Iran good. It's you solely blaming Russia not me solely blaming the West, and get your own feckin' jokes....... The blame for what is happening in the Ukraine lies fair and square with the Russians trying to exert hegemony over an independent neighbour. In a similar way that America’s troubles with Communist Cuba over the years (with the exception of Kruschev’s opportunism during the missile crisis) was down to the US and how it chose to engage with a near neighbour. Oh, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery as you’ll appreciate. |
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Post by flea79 on Feb 16, 2022 17:24:42 GMT
while moving troops out of the way they have built field hospitals close to the border, very odd?
and ukraine is being bombarded by cyber attacks, and so it begins
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2022 18:34:03 GMT
This is how Russia has always done business. They will ask for the world and get a little slice that Putin can then feed to his people.
I’m 50-50 as to belief on whether they will actually invade. I think NATO will give some large concessions and Russia will scream victory for another 5 years or so again.
Putin is just upset that the world now talks more about China.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 16, 2022 18:53:00 GMT
This is how Russia has always done business. They will ask for the world and get a little slice that Putin can then feed to his people. I’m 50-50 as to belief on whether they will actually invade. I think NATO will give some large concessions and Russia will scream victory for another 5 years or so again. Putin is just upset that the world now talks more about China. If he feels he’s backed into a corner he will absolutely invade. There is only really one thing Putin wants and that’s for Ukraine to be a buffer state and not part of NATO. I’m actually staggered that the likes of Obama and Cameron thought that Putin would just blindly accept Ukraine being invited into NATO, that in itself could be seen as an act of aggression bearing in mind its strategic importance to Russia. I accept that Ukraine should be allowed to choose their own leader, who ton align with etc. however the West quickly declared itself in favour of a new government in 2014 and could have instead listened to Germany and France by sitting round the table at that point but choose not to. Plus that never really bothered us on many many other occasions so not sure we can suddenly argue that is the prominent issue here. Putin is doing what America and many of the western powers would do in a heartbeat if they felt a threat to their territory, their might be a bit less posturing but make no mistake they wouldn’t put it with it if the roles were reversed….. |
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Feb 16, 2022 18:58:48 GMT
I accept that Ukraine shouldn’t be allowed to choose their own leader, who ton align with etc. I assume that's a typo? |
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Post by prestwichpotter on Feb 16, 2022 18:59:20 GMT
I accept that Ukraine shouldn’t be allowed to choose their own leader, who ton align with etc. I assume that's a typo? Sorry yes SHOULD…… |
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Post by superjw on Feb 17, 2022 13:03:34 GMT
Ukraine saying a village has been shelled, Russia denying.
It's all he said, she said.
Although it's this sort of stuff that has the potential to kick all this off
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Post by brotherleelove on Feb 17, 2022 23:32:42 GMT
Ukraine saying a village has been shelled, Russia denying. It's all he said, she said. Although it's this sort of stuff that has the potential to kick all this off An eerie parallel with Hitler's pretext for invading Poland. |
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Feb 18, 2022 9:39:04 GMT
Even by Biden and our media's abysmally low standards, I thought they'd have got bored by saying "war is imminent" for the 40th consecutive day.
Why don't they say something different and constructive for once?
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Post by noustie on Feb 18, 2022 10:19:42 GMT
Ukraine saying a village has been shelled, Russia denying. It's all he said, she said. Although it's this sort of stuff that has the potential to kick all this off An eerie parallel with Hitler's pretext for invading Poland. Remember reading something on this a while back that German SS dressed as Polish soldiers and raided german towns as pre-text to invasion: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_HimmlerHere though I'm not sure who the germans are - for example has Putin called the West's bluff and it's us trying to poke the bear into action because our media seems to have gone absolutely mental? It's like Wag The Dog doped off its tits in search of a figure skating medal! |
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Post by Gob Bluth on Feb 18, 2022 11:11:23 GMT
He's certainly made the Western Propaganda machine look like the scare mongering, cringe worthy turd it is. Boris, Biden and Macron will be devastated if true. People will focus on their shit leadership again. It really wasn't long ago that RT was reporting that there were no troops on the boarder, using terms like purported by the west when describing the position of their troops. Also RT have put a section on their website on the top, like a main category called 'Russia & Former Soviet Union'. Putin's problem is how he escalates the proxy wars in the south and as it stands I don't see how he can do it without it looking like an attack on Ukraine. You could see them setting up camp in the Donbass but if he goes to Kiev that's a big move that I don't think he can sell to the International community or at home in Russia. It wouldn't look like a nervousness around Nato positions or the protection of 'Russian' people, it would look like an invasion. |
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Feb 18, 2022 11:45:59 GMT
He's certainly made the Western Propaganda machine look like the scare mongering, cringe worthy turd it is. Boris, Biden and Macron will be devastated if true. People will focus on their shit leadership again. It really wasn't long ago that RT was reporting that there were no troops on the boarder, using terms like purported by the west when describing the position of their troops. Also RT have put a section on their website on the top, like a main category called 'Russia & Former Soviet Union'. Putin's problem is how he escalates the proxy wars in the south and as it stands I don't see how he can do it without it looking like an attack on Ukraine. You could see them setting up camp in the Donbass but if he goes to Kiev that's a big move that I don't think he can sell to the International community or at home in Russia. It wouldn't look like a nervousness around Nato positions or the protection of 'Russian' people, it would look like an invasion. Yep. Even the biggest Russia sympathisers will not be able to justify him invading Kiev. It would be a truly sickening act. |
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Post by chad on Feb 18, 2022 11:57:33 GMT
An eerie parallel with Hitler's pretext for invading Poland. Remember reading something on this a while back that German SS dressed as Polish soldiers and raided german towns as pre-text to invasion: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_HimmlerHere though I'm not sure who the germans are - for example has Putin called the West's bluff and it's us trying to poke the bear into action because our media seems to have gone absolutely mental? It's like Wag The Dog doped off its tits in search of a figure skating medal! It’s actually more akin to Hitlers invasion of Czechoslovakia There were a lot of German speakers in the Sudetenland and he provoked them into pro German protests. In the end the west gave way but that wasn’t enough and he had to have the whole country. Then that wasn’t enough and he had to have Poland as well Just substitute Putin for Hitler Czechoslovakia for Ukraine Poland for the Baltic States It’s a very worrying time |
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Post by lordb on Feb 18, 2022 12:08:51 GMT
It really wasn't long ago that RT was reporting that there were no troops on the boarder, using terms like purported by the west when describing the position of their troops. Also RT have put a section on their website on the top, like a main category called 'Russia & Former Soviet Union'. Putin's problem is how he escalates the proxy wars in the south and as it stands I don't see how he can do it without it looking like an attack on Ukraine. You could see them setting up camp in the Donbass but if he goes to Kiev that's a big move that I don't think he can sell to the International community or at home in Russia. It wouldn't look like a nervousness around Nato positions or the protection of 'Russian' people, it would look like an invasion. Yep. Even the biggest Russia sympathisers will not be able to justify him invading Kiev. It would be a truly sickening act. The exercises in Belorus placed Russian forces in prime position to attack Kiev |
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Post by partickpotter on Feb 18, 2022 12:16:38 GMT
He's certainly made the Western Propaganda machine look like the scare mongering, cringe worthy turd it is. Boris, Biden and Macron will be devastated if true. People will focus on their shit leadership again. It really wasn't long ago that RT was reporting that there were no troops on the boarder, using terms like purported by the west when describing the position of their troops. Also RT have put a section on their website on the top, like a main category called 'Russia & Former Soviet Union'. Putin's problem is how he escalates the proxy wars in the south and as it stands I don't see how he can do it without it looking like an attack on Ukraine. You could see them setting up camp in the Donbass but if he goes to Kiev that's a big move that I don't think he can sell to the International community or at home in Russia. It wouldn't look like a nervousness around Nato positions or the protection of 'Russian' people, it would look like an invasion. Lots of historic parallels being drawn between today’s situation and Hitler’s conduct that led to the WW2. But there is another one that is just as relevant; Kruschev, Kennedy and the Cuban Missile Crisis. Kruschev thought Kennedy was a weak man, something he chose to test when they met at the Vienna Summit in June,1961 where he bullied and humiliated Kennedy. That led him to completely misjudge Kennedy’s resolve and was the primary reason for him embarking on his Cuban adventure. He did it because he thought he could get away with it. In the end he, of course backed down. There was of course a similar, and significant, back story of NATO missile deployments in Turkey, but it was Kruschev’s assessment of Kennedy that meant he decided to go ahead with the plan of stationing nuclear weapons on Cuban soil. It’s fair to say Putin sees Biden as weak. Is this him, like his predecessor, choosing to see how far he can push Biden? The only problem is how he backs down. Kruschev had the benefit of the West withdrawing those missiles from Turkey (which the West didn’t actually need to do; Kruschev had figured by then he’d misjudged Kennedy and basically wanted out of his Cuban adventure as quickly as possible even if it was unilateral) so he could try and present the situation to his home audience as a victory. (His home audience being the polit bureau. Which didn’t work. He was punted a couple of years later, his reputation destroyed by his rash behaviour over Cuba). I’m not sure the same face saver is in play for Putin. |
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Post by brotherleelove on Feb 18, 2022 12:29:42 GMT
An eerie parallel with Hitler's pretext for invading Poland. Remember reading something on this a while back that German SS dressed as Polish soldiers and raided german towns as pre-text to invasion: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_HimmlerHere though I'm not sure who the germans are - for example has Putin called the West's bluff and it's us trying to poke the bear into action because our media seems to have gone absolutely mental? It's like Wag The Dog doped off its tits in search of a figure skating medal! Countdown to War is a freebie flick worth seeing. |
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Post by flea79 on Feb 18, 2022 13:27:02 GMT
im slightly more worried about the fat leader in DPRK and what he will use this period of instability for, lest we forget they share a border with russia
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