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Post by Paul Spencer on Jul 25, 2022 22:21:14 GMT
You didn't watch it, did you? She was asked an uncomfortable question about Nadine Dorries and she elected to avoid answering that question by claiming that she had deleted twitter from her phone and therefore she didn't have the appropriate knowledge to answer the question ... it didn't matter which device she had deleted twitter from, she was claiming that she didn't have access to twitter, so that absolved her from having to give an answer to the question.
It was a lie. Her twitter account is extremely active.
Yes I did watch the programme, all of it. How can you say it was a lie when you can’t possibly know if she has deleted Twitter from her phone? Like I said, it’s becoming a much overused word.
Come on CS you're better than that.
I've already said, that it was irrelevant which device she had claimed to have deleted twitter from, she was (in order to avoid answering a question) suggesting that she didn't have access to Twitter.
It was a lie.
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jul 25, 2022 22:24:22 GMT
He has led the country for 2.5 years through Brexit, Covid and Ukraine. I'm not a Boris fan at all, but it is ridiculous to say that he hasn't been a leader. And as leader as Mayor of London. You might not like what he did , or how he did it, or what he stood for. But he wa a leader. You don't have to like him.
He hasn't be booted out by his own MP's over policy, he's been booted out because of his lying and his cronyism, those aren't the qualities of a 'leader' and that's why they had no choice but to get rid of him.
Whether I like him or not has got bugger all to do with it.
But , undeniably he has got to a position of leadership. The top job in the country and the capital. Many leaders, like most Football managers, end their tenure by the " sack" or similar. But they were leaders. |
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Jul 25, 2022 22:27:27 GMT
He hasn't at all. He was elected with an 80 seat majority with the expectation that he would be a leader but within 2.5 years, he's been booted out of government by his own MP's, proving that he was actually never capable of being a leader in the first place. He has led the country for 2.5 years through Brexit, Covid and Ukraine. I'm not a Boris fan at all, but it is ridiculous to say that he hasn't been a leader. And as leader as Mayor of London. You might not like what he did , or how he did it, or what he stood for. But he wa a leader. You don't have to like him. By that logic, anyone who gets voted into a position of power is a good leader - including Cameron, Major, Macron, Merkel, Biden etc. It also means anyone not voted into power is not a good leader, which would include Farage (which means he definitely isn't better than Johnson, by this logic). Surely it's more logical that you find out who is a good leader once they are voted into power? Some are good, some are bad, and many fall somewhere in between. |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jul 25, 2022 22:29:16 GMT
He hasn't be booted out by his own MP's over policy, he's been booted out because of his lying and his cronyism, those aren't the qualities of a 'leader' and that's why they had no choice but to get rid of him.
Whether I like him or not has got bugger all to do with it.
But , undeniably he has got to a position of leadership. The top job in the country and the capital. Many leaders, like most Football managers, end their tenure by the " sack" or similar. But they were leaders.
Yep, indeed he did bluff his way to the top job and once he got there, they realised that actually, he wasn't capable of being a leader at all, so they booted him out.
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Post by ChesterStokie on Jul 25, 2022 22:29:54 GMT
He has led the country for 2.5 years through Brexit, Covid and Ukraine. I'm not a Boris fan at all, but it is ridiculous to say that he hasn't been a leader. And as leader as Mayor of London. You might not like what he did , or how he did it, or what he stood for. But he wa a leader. You don't have to like him. He hasn't be booted out by his own MP's over policy, he's been booted out because of his lying and his cronyism, those aren't the qualities of a 'leader' and that's why they had no choice but to get rid of him. Whether I like him or not has got bugger all to do with it.
Boris delights in sailing close to the wind and throughout most of his previous leadership career, eg as Mayor of London, he has got away with it. But the level of scrutiny that any modern PM faces meant that he was never going to get away with it for long as PM, so his Premiership was doomed to failure. |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jul 25, 2022 22:30:51 GMT
He hasn't be booted out by his own MP's over policy, he's been booted out because of his lying and his cronyism, those aren't the qualities of a 'leader' and that's why they had no choice but to get rid of him. Whether I like him or not has got bugger all to do with it.
Boris delights in sailing close to the wind and throughout most of his previous leadership career, eg as Mayor of London, he has got away with it. But the level of scrutiny that any modern PM faces meant that he was never going to get away with it for long as PM, so his Premiership was doomed to failure.
Perfectly put.
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Post by Foster on Jul 25, 2022 22:31:59 GMT
He hasn't be booted out by his own MP's over policy, he's been booted out because of his lying and his cronyism, those aren't the qualities of a 'leader' and that's why they had no choice but to get rid of him. Whether I like him or not has got bugger all to do with it.
But , undeniably he has got to a position of leadership. The top job in the country and the capital. Many leaders, like most Football managers, end their tenure by the " sack" or similar. But they were leaders. I think most 'leaders' of nations are bullshitters but like to bestow upon themselves the characteristics of being a true leader with its glorious connotations. Those characteristics of bravery, integrity, courage, etc are often portrayed by everyday folk in dire conditions and in defending their fellow man, or by making sacrifices for others. Not these full of shit, self serving politicians who would sell their own mothers to help them get ahead. Maybe I'm describing a 'hero' and what it means to be a leader requires none of those attributes. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jul 25, 2022 22:32:49 GMT
But , undeniably he has got to a position of leadership. The top job in the country and the capital. Many leaders, like most Football managers, end their tenure by the " sack" or similar. But they were leaders.
Yep, indeed he did bluff his way to the top job and once he got there, they realised that actually, he wasn't capable of being a leader at all, so they booted him out.
He did lead fo 2.5 years ( and 2 terms as London Mayor). I'm not a Boris fan , but he did undoubtedly lead on many fronts. |
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Post by Foster on Jul 25, 2022 22:37:04 GMT
Yep, indeed he did bluff his way to the top job and once he got there, they realised that actually, he wasn't capable of being a leader at all, so they booted him out.
He did lead fo 2.5 years ( and 2 terms as London Mayor). I'm not a Boris fan , but he did undoubtedly lead on many fronts. Wouldn't leading imply moving forwards? In which case, he's failed and taken us backwards. So yeah, he's a poor leader if that's how you want to put it. Leader in title only. |
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Jul 25, 2022 22:37:30 GMT
Apologies for that. Who do you favour then?.pragmaticallyspeaking, who is your number one?....although I thought we were talking about leadership qualities, irrespective of the message. I'm not a fan of any two Tories left, but I don't quite understand how many are so quick to play down Starmer as an option without at least giving him a chance. I quite like how Sunak speaks and conducts himself in these debates, but that's testament to how well politicians are taught to sway people without themselves having any conviction in what they say. I think for many, it's basically people who are conservative (with a small 'c') who don't want to say that they would never vote for anyone left of the Conservative Party. Which is fine - each to their own - but I don't understand why they don't just say that instead of pretending that they are some vote-in-waiting for the Labour Party if only Starmer wasn't the leader. When Corbyn was leader, the same people said that they would vote Labour if only there was someone normal and competent. Now Starmer is in charge, they would only vote for Labour if Lisa Nandy was the leader. When Nandy becomes leader, they'll probably have an issue with the font used on Labour leaflets, and that will be the reason they won't vote Labour. |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jul 25, 2022 22:39:52 GMT
Yep, indeed he did bluff his way to the top job and once he got there, they realised that actually, he wasn't capable of being a leader at all, so they booted him out.
He did lead fo 2.5 years ( and 2 terms as London Mayor). I'm not a Boris fan , but he did undoubtedly lead on many fronts.
During his tenure, he completely trashed the reputation of the office of state bestowed upon him.
If you want to describe that as 'leadership', then fine but his colleagues simply couldn't take any more and removed him from that role in (relatively) an extremely short space of time because he was clearly unfit to be anywhere near the despatch box.
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jul 25, 2022 22:42:23 GMT
He has led the country for 2.5 years through Brexit, Covid and Ukraine. I'm not a Boris fan at all, but it is ridiculous to say that he hasn't been a leader. And as leader as Mayor of London. You might not like what he did , or how he did it, or what he stood for. But he wa a leader. You don't have to like him. By that logic, anyone who gets voted into a position of power is a good leader - including Cameron, Major, Macron, Merkel, Biden etc. It also means anyone not voted into power is not a good leader, which would include Farage (which means he definitely isn't better than Johnson, by this logic). Surely it's more logical that you find out who is a good leader once they are voted into power? Some are good, some are bad, and many fall somewhere in between. I can agree with most of that Rip, but the context of this little debate was a comparison of Sunak, Truss and Johnson. I'm saying that he shows/ showed at least as much leadership qualities as the other two, irrespective of how good he turned out to be or whether people liked him. Farage was voted into power as an MEP, a representative of the UK in the EU Parliament, and he showed leadership there.( everything should not be judged by membership of the UK Parliament) Also , perhaps a sign of a great leader, he led a movement ( Brexit) without be6 elected. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jul 25, 2022 22:43:00 GMT
He did lead fo 2.5 years ( and 2 terms as London Mayor). I'm not a Boris fan , but he did undoubtedly lead on many fronts. Wouldn't leading imply moving forwards? In which case, he's failed and taken us backwards. So yeah, he's a poor leader if that's how you want to put it. Leader in title only. Depends how you judge what he did. |
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Post by Foster on Jul 25, 2022 22:43:40 GMT
He did lead fo 2.5 years ( and 2 terms as London Mayor). I'm not a Boris fan , but he did undoubtedly lead on many fronts. During his tenure, he completely trashed the reputation of the office of state bestowed upon him. If you want to describe that as 'leadership' fine but his colleagues simply couldn't take any more and removed him from that role in an extremely short space of time because he was clearly unfit for office.
Having the ability to blag people and win votes doesn't make you a leader by default. Neither does skirting the rules and managing to hang on to a position you've performed badly in. I think we should all agree that being a leader means being a 'good' leader. Otherwise you've failed and can be considered no leader at all. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jul 25, 2022 22:45:42 GMT
He did lead fo 2.5 years ( and 2 terms as London Mayor). I'm not a Boris fan , but he did undoubtedly lead on many fronts.
During his tenure, he completely trashed the reputation of the office of state bestowed upon him.
If you want to describe that as 'leadership', then fine but his colleagues simply couldn't take any more and removed him from that role in (relatively) an extremely short space of time because he was clearly unfit to be anywhere near the despatch box.
I. Not particularly defending Boris but clearly in his roles as Mayor of London and Prime Minister he was a Leader.....some would e en back him now, compared to what is on offer. |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jul 25, 2022 22:47:56 GMT
During his tenure, he completely trashed the reputation of the office of state bestowed upon him. If you want to describe that as 'leadership' fine but his colleagues simply couldn't take any more and removed him from that role in an extremely short space of time because he was clearly unfit for office.
Having the ability to blag people and win votes doesn't make you a leader by default. Neither does skirting the rules and managing to hang on to a position you've performed badly in. I think we should all agree that being a leader means being a 'good' leader. Otherwise you've failed and can be considered no leader at all.
Exactly.
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Post by Foster on Jul 25, 2022 22:49:29 GMT
During his tenure, he completely trashed the reputation of the office of state bestowed upon him. If you want to describe that as 'leadership', then fine but his colleagues simply couldn't take any more and removed him from that role in (relatively) an extremely short space of time because he was clearly unfit to be anywhere near the despatch box.
I. Not particularly defending Boris but clearly in his roles as Mayor of London and Prime Minister he was a Leader.....some would e en back him now, compared to what is on offer. You're just being a WUM now mate. No one can seriously think of Boris in some of the ways you've used to describe him. Especially since you're 'not a fan'. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jul 25, 2022 22:51:01 GMT
I. Not particularly defending Boris but clearly in his roles as Mayor of London and Prime Minister he was a Leader.....some would e en back him now, compared to what is on offer. You're just being a WUM now mate. No one can seriously think of Boris in some of the ways you've used to describe him. Especially since you're 'not a fan'. Not really Fos, Hitler had leadership qualities, but I'm not a fan. |
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Post by spitthedog on Jul 25, 2022 22:52:53 GMT
We would have learned just as much tonight if the presenter had just asked them what they thought about the UK hosting the next Eurovision Song Contest.
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Post by Foster on Jul 25, 2022 22:57:30 GMT
You're just being a WUM now mate. No one can seriously think of Boris in some of the ways you've used to describe him. Especially since you're 'not a fan'. Not really Fos, Hitler had leadership qualities, but I'm not a fan. Although Hitler was an evil bastard, he was a leader in that he unified people and had conviction in what he believed in. I don't recall him rugby tackling kids, wearing hi viz gear or saying 'hasta la vista schatzi'. He would never have gone in for that shit. And no, I'm not a fan. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jul 25, 2022 23:02:23 GMT
Not really Fos, Hitler had leadership qualities, but I'm not a fan. Although Hitler was an evil bastard, he was a leader in that he unified people and had conviction in what he believed in. I don't recall him rugby tackling kids, wearing hi viz gear or saying 'hasta la vista schatzi'. He would never have gone in for that shit. And no, I'm not a fan. I don't think he unified everybody. |
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Post by Foster on Jul 25, 2022 23:05:07 GMT
Although Hitler was an evil bastard, he was a leader in that he unified people and had conviction in what he believed in. I don't recall him rugby tackling kids, wearing hi viz gear or saying 'hasta la vista schatzi'. He would never have gone in for that shit. And no, I'm not a fan. I don't think he unified everybody. More people than Johnson though. And no need to be pedantic. You don't like it when others do it to you. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Jul 25, 2022 23:11:27 GMT
I don't think he unified everybody. More people than Johnson though. And no need to be pedantic. You don't like it when others do it to you. I don't follow you really Foter. Worldwide, I think Hitler was probably more divisive than Johnson. Having said that , it isn't necessarily a bad thing for a leader to be divisive. Another leader, Jesus, was divisive. I don't particularly mind what people post. |
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Post by Foster on Jul 25, 2022 23:13:23 GMT
More people than Johnson though. And no need to be pedantic. You don't like it when others do it to you. I don't follow you really Foter. Worldwide, I think Hitler was probably more divisive than Johnson. Having said that , it isn't necessarily a bad thing for a leader to be divisive. Another leader, Jesus, was divisive. I don't particularly mind what people post. Likewise Hitler wasn't the leader of the world was he. Like BJ wasn't. So by your own logic it was a shit example. |
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Post by Foster on Jul 25, 2022 23:21:01 GMT
More people than Johnson though. And no need to be pedantic. You don't like it when others do it to you. I don't follow you really Foter. Worldwide, I think Hitler was probably more divisive than Johnson. Having said that , it isn't necessarily a bad thing for a leader to be divisive. Another leader, Jesus, was divisive. I don't particularly mind what people post. Not really sure why you're comparing Boris to Hitler now. Unless it's some weird attempt to shed a positive light on Boris  As for Jesus, well its debatable as to whether or not he even existed so that's another story. Though if he did he had conviction. Something Boris has none of. |
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Post by wannabee on Jul 26, 2022 0:10:12 GMT
Truss is getting shafted from all sides here currently. As she arches and giggles coquetteishly |
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Post by wannabee on Jul 26, 2022 0:23:36 GMT
This may as well be being held on the moon than Stoke on Trent for all they've addressed the problems people round here face. Pair of utter cunts. To be fair the location is incidental even FYD is in a darkened room in Croydon Realistically how many Stokies are paid up members of the Conservative Party who will get to vote on the enthronement? |
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Post by wannabee on Jul 26, 2022 0:31:18 GMT
Why does Rishi keep talking about Tory values when they're basic normal human values. Like they don't apply to people unless they're Tories. Because Rishi understands the purpose of the Debate is to appeal to the 160K odd Tory members that get to vote who the next PM is |
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Post by wannabee on Jul 26, 2022 1:17:23 GMT
Didn't Liz just say she deleted twitter off her phone when all this started?? So this tweet 45 mins before the programme wasn't her or she lied in live TV? I have no idea how to use Twitter but surely it’s possible to put out a tweet without using a phone, eg by using a laptop or PC? It’s a shame when people are in such a rush to call someone a liar. It’s becoming a much overused word. Like you I'm appalled at the skepticism of the ability of Liz Truss to accomplish extraordinary feats They are equally comparable to to Kim Jung Un's Supreme Leader of North Korea feats such as being able to drive a car at 3 years of age, never needing to defecate, playing a round of golf in 27 under par He's got nothing on our Liz |
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Post by wannabee on Jul 26, 2022 1:36:51 GMT
Apologies if I've cluttered up the board
Couldn't be arsed to watch it live
Went out for a few sherbets, deferred coverage then reaction on here
What a farce
Is that the best we have to offer?
Gawd help us !
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