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Post by wearestoke80 on Jul 12, 2021 18:10:24 GMT
This is what happens when everyone starts drinking at 12 o’clock That's not really an excuse though, is it? Did I say it was ?
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Post by zerps on Jul 12, 2021 18:10:58 GMT
This is what happens when everyone starts drinking at 12 o’clock That's not really an excuse though, is it? I started drinking way earlier than that and can’t remember throwing bottles into crowds of people
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Post by zerps on Jul 12, 2021 18:11:41 GMT
I’ve never seen such a bunch of whoppers as leaving Wembley last night. A lad was knocked out cold in front of us, cars smashed up, other random fans being constantly abused. Constant fighting, bottles and half full cans being thrown into random crowds of people. Me and my mate couldn’t believe how many dickheads were about. I’d have hated to be there with my family and I’ll take them to Stoke games. This was next level dickheadery. Couple that with the racist abuse online afterwards and maybe England fans don’t deserve to win anything. It did piss me off tbh. Typical knuckledraggers that seem to be attracted to English football coupled with a big post covid blowout. Looks like the police completely dropped the ball too and just let people run riot. Either way, not a great look for a country which is looking at a 2030 World Cup bid. There were hardly any police anywhere after the game
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Post by zerps on Jul 12, 2021 18:13:00 GMT
Could have sworn that Shaw was actually in the Italian box when he scored (with our one shot on target). The point that the poster is making, which Is spot on is that Southgate made no change at all ( compared to Mancini’s game deciding subs) and allowed us to be pushed back and lose all momentum. We have seen the same result many times under TP with similar tactics,and it was almost a re-run of the Croatia semi final where we just seemed tactically incapable of countering a change in the opposition approach. We’ve improved under Southgate clearly, but it is about winning not being plucky losers and I’m not sure he has a winner’s mentality himself. People act as if we were hammered yet we didn’t lose an entire game.
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 12, 2021 18:19:03 GMT
Could have sworn that Shaw was actually in the Italian box when he scored (with our one shot on target). The point that the poster is making, which Is spot on is that Southgate made no change at all ( compared to Mancini’s game deciding subs) and allowed us to be pushed back and lose all momentum. We have seen the same result many times under TP with similar tactics,and it was almost a re-run of the Croatia semi final where we just seemed tactically incapable of countering a change in the opposition approach. We’ve improved under Southgate clearly, but it is about winning not being plucky losers and I’m not sure he has a winner’s mentality himself. People act as if we were hammered yet we didn’t lose an entire game. People act like we’ve missed out on a very rare opportunity to win a major football tournament and thinking, entirely reasonably, that we could and should have made a better fist of the game.
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Post by thehoof on Jul 12, 2021 18:25:40 GMT
Could have sworn that Shaw was actually in the Italian box when he scored (with our one shot on target). The point that the poster is making, which Is spot on is that Southgate made no change at all ( compared to Mancini’s game deciding subs) and allowed us to be pushed back and lose all momentum. We have seen the same result many times under TP with similar tactics,and it was almost a re-run of the Croatia semi final where we just seemed tactically incapable of countering a change in the opposition approach. We’ve improved under Southgate clearly, but it is about winning not being plucky losers and I’m not sure he has a winner’s mentality himself. People act as if we were hammered yet we didn’t lose an entire game. No we weren’t hammered by any stretch.
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Post by zerps on Jul 12, 2021 18:28:29 GMT
People act as if we were hammered yet we didn’t lose an entire game. People act like we’ve missed out on a very rare opportunity to win a major football tournament and thinking, entirely reasonably, that we could and should have made a better fist of the game. I thought we played well. Southgate has done a cracking job. We won the first half and lost on penalties. Overanalyse it as much as you want but we’ve been on one hell of a ride and they’ve all done us proud.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2021 18:33:47 GMT
That's not really an excuse though, is it? Did I say it was ? No. But you presented it like it's just 'accepted' that because it was an 8 o'clock kick off, and people had been out all day, mindless violence was to be expected. It's a sad state of affairs, if that's where we're at.
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Post by zerps on Jul 12, 2021 18:47:40 GMT
You could lump more criticism on the ref. Saka and Grealish were assaulted.
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Post by hardcastle on Jul 12, 2021 18:48:39 GMT
This 343 system could be our most effective so long as the wing backs are genuinely wide midfielders (rather than a back five) and the front three play to their potential.
What most pundits have chosen not to comment on is the fact that Sterling (our best player over the tourney as a whole) was a bit off last night and our supposed 'schemer' Mason Mount has - let's be honest - had a pretty mediocre tournement. That's the position we should be looking at to make the thing work. Whether that's a Grealish / Foden or a quickie (Saka, Sancho, Rashford) l don't know.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2021 19:11:48 GMT
No. But you presented it like it's just 'accepted' that because it was an 8 o'clock kick off, and people had been out all day, mindless violence was to be expected. It's a sad state of affairs, if that's where we're at. It is a sad state of affairs. Let's not pretend it's a new thing though, it's always been like that, well for all my football supporting life of 40 years.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jul 12, 2021 19:27:03 GMT
Typical knuckledraggers that seem to be attracted to English football coupled with a big post covid blowout. Looks like the police completely dropped the ball too and just let people run riot. Either way, not a great look for a country which is looking at a 2030 World Cup bid. There were hardly any police anywhere after the game They were all guarding Winston Churchill’s statue I heard……
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Post by alsagerstokie on Jul 12, 2021 19:28:42 GMT
No. But you presented it like it's just 'accepted' that because it was an 8 o'clock kick off, and people had been out all day, mindless violence was to be expected. It's a sad state of affairs, if that's where we're at. It is a sad state of affairs. Let's not pretend it's a new thing though, it's always been like that, well for all my football supporting life of 40 years. What can we call these people then. They are not England Supporters are they. I had several drinks on sat got a train home no trouble. If they cant handle the beer they shouldn't drink. Weather its Forcing there way in,fighting or posting racist abuse. They are not football supporters. I see some Estate Agents in london has commented saying its looking into one of its employees and his now quickly shut down Twitter account he seems to have deleted. Some people maybe secret racists.
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Post by thevoid on Jul 12, 2021 19:29:33 GMT
Typical knuckledraggers that seem to be attracted to English football coupled with a big post covid blowout. Looks like the police completely dropped the ball too and just let people run riot. Either way, not a great look for a country which is looking at a 2030 World Cup bid. There were hardly any police anywhere after the game They were too busy arresting anyone who said that they were English.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jul 12, 2021 19:30:11 GMT
There were hardly any police anywhere after the game They were all guarding Winston Churchill’s statue I heard…… maybe you need to think again before you take cheap shots at the Police. Perhaps you should pop into the hospital where the officers in intensive care after being attacked whilst ISSUING FIRST AID to a member of the public.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jul 12, 2021 19:34:20 GMT
They were all guarding Winston Churchill’s statue I heard…… maybe you need to think again before you take cheap shots at the Police. Perhaps you should pop into the hospital where the officers in intensive care after being attacked whilst ISSUING FIRST AID You think that was the reason for their being no police at a high profile game and it’s me taking cheap shots? There was more police acting as Priti Patel’s personal force storming a building that some Extinction Rebellion members had built a statue on the roof of than there was at Wembley…..
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Post by zerps on Jul 12, 2021 19:38:10 GMT
maybe you need to think again before you take cheap shots at the Police. Perhaps you should pop into the hospital where the officers in intensive care after being attacked whilst ISSUING FIRST AID You think that was the reason for their being no police at a high profile game and it’s me taking cheap shots? There was more police acting as Priti Patel’s personal force storming a building that some Extinction Rebellion members had built a statue on the roof of than there was at Wembley….. It was a free for all yesterday. People even managed to get in for free.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jul 12, 2021 19:47:33 GMT
maybe you need to think again before you take cheap shots at the Police. Perhaps you should pop into the hospital where the officers in intensive care after being attacked whilst ISSUING FIRST AID You think that was the reason for their being no police at a high profile game and it’s me taking cheap shots? There was more police acting as Priti Patel’s personal force storming a building that some Extinction Rebellion members had built a statue on the roof of than there was at Wembley….. How’s that the fault of the Police though? They do what they’re told to do. It’ll be interesting to see how much press coverage this Officers heroics receive. The problem nowadays is that if the Police get stuck in they get hammered for being heavy handed and if they don’t they get criticised. However one things for sure if there’d been carnage last night and lots of robust policing you’d be one of the first to have a pop saying the fans were just having a laugh and the press and social media would be doing similar.
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Post by alsagerstokie on Jul 12, 2021 19:53:48 GMT
Just listend to Danny Mills sounded awful.
He noticed it from 4pm. He had to stop filming at one point. He noticed. Bottles being thrown. Beer going everywhere. Female Sports presenters having to put up with Vile sexist chants. David Seaman suffering abuse. Martin Tyler having a bottle thrown at him. Police Horses being provoked.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2021 19:56:25 GMT
It is a sad state of affairs. Let's not pretend it's a new thing though, it's always been like that, well for all my football supporting life of 40 years. What can we call these people then. They are not England Supporters are they. I had several drinks on sat got a train home no trouble. If they cant handle the beer they shouldn't drink. Weather its Forcing there way in,fighting or posting racist abuse. They are not football supporters. I see some Estate Agents in london has commented saying its looking into one of its employees and his now quickly shut down Twitter account he seems to have deleted. Some people maybe secret racists. They're called Wankers mate. It's that simple, dickheads will be dickheads, always been the case and always will be.
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Post by zerps on Jul 12, 2021 19:57:55 GMT
Just listend to Danny Mills sounded awful. He noticed it from 4pm. He had to stop filming at one point. He noticed. Bottles being thrown. Beer going everywhere. Female Sports presenters having to put up with Vile sexist chants. David Seaman suffering abuse. Martin Tyler having a bottle thrown at him. Police Horses being provoked. Wembley way beforehand was also a warzone There was a bloke walking round with a lit flare up his arse at one point 😂
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Post by thevoid on Jul 12, 2021 20:00:13 GMT
Just listend to Danny Mills sounded awful. He noticed it from 4pm. He had to stop filming at one point. He noticed. Bottles being thrown. Beer going everywhere. Female Sports presenters having to put up with Vile sexist chants. David Seaman suffering abuse. Martin Tyler having a bottle thrown at him. Police Horses being provoked. Pathetic isn't it, anywhere else it'd be a day of celebration. It's a British (not just English) thing, remember the Rangers fans in Manchester? Plus people have probably been back on the beak after a few months off.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jul 12, 2021 20:07:37 GMT
You think that was the reason for their being no police at a high profile game and it’s me taking cheap shots? There was more police acting as Priti Patel’s personal force storming a building that some Extinction Rebellion members had built a statue on the roof of than there was at Wembley….. How’s that the fault of the Police though? They do what they’re told to do. It’ll be interesting to see how much press coverage this Officers heroics receive. The problem nowadays is that if the Police get stuck in they get hammered for being heavy handed and if they don’t they get criticised. However one things for sure if there’d been carnage last night and lots of robust policing you’d be one of the first to have a pop saying the fans were just having a laugh and the press and social media would be doing similar. I'm not suggesting they should have got "stuck in" , I am suggesting they should have at least graced Wembley with their presence......
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Post by zerps on Jul 12, 2021 20:09:45 GMT
Just listend to Danny Mills sounded awful. He noticed it from 4pm. He had to stop filming at one point. He noticed. Bottles being thrown. Beer going everywhere. Female Sports presenters having to put up with Vile sexist chants. David Seaman suffering abuse. Martin Tyler having a bottle thrown at him. Police Horses being provoked. Pathetic isn't it, anywhere else it'd be a day of celebration. It's a British (not just English) thing, remember the Rangers fans in Manchester? Plus people have probably been back on the beak after a few months off. What surprised me was the amount of Dickheads considering the price of the tickets. Bear in mind the Germany tickets were going for £50 and ours were £945 face value. Maybe the police expected this to filter out the dickheads but it was the most violent game I’ve ever witnessed.
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Post by songthrush01 on Jul 12, 2021 20:14:06 GMT
I’ve never seen such a bunch of whoppers as leaving Wembley last night. A lad was knocked out cold in front of us, cars smashed up, other random fans being constantly abused. Constant fighting, bottles and half full cans being thrown into random crowds of people. Me and my mate couldn’t believe how many dickheads were about. I’d have hated to be there with my family and I’ll take them to Stoke games. This was next level dickheadery. Couple that with the racist abuse online afterwards and maybe England fans don’t deserve to win anything. It did piss me off tbh. Typical knuckledraggers that seem to be attracted to English football coupled with a big post covid blowout. Looks like the police completely dropped the ball too and just let people run riot. Either way, not a great look for a country which is looking at a 2030 World Cup bid. get stuffed lammy.
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Post by Olgrligm on Jul 12, 2021 20:35:57 GMT
This is something that I can't get my head around and which makes me think I don't understand modern football any more. The squad for this tournament had Sterling, Saka, Sancho, Bellingham, Foden, Grealish, Mount and Rashford who are somehow all the same type of player but with different ability levels. They all play as an attacking midfielder or a wide forward. In olden times, I'm sure that Sterling, Saka, Sancho and Bellingham would all be wingers, Foden, Grealish and Mount would all be midfield playmakers and Rashford would be a centre forward. It's a shame because there was a time in the second half when England were desperate for a cool head who could just retain possession and dictate the play. It's not a player that we seem to produce. Bellingham is an all-action box-to-box midfielder isn’t he? He’s a number 8. Is he? I must admit that I haven't seen much of him since his debut against us as a tricky left winger.
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Post by alsagerstokie on Jul 12, 2021 20:38:49 GMT
Just listend to Danny Mills sounded awful. He noticed it from 4pm. He had to stop filming at one point. He noticed. Bottles being thrown. Beer going everywhere. Female Sports presenters having to put up with Vile sexist chants. David Seaman suffering abuse. Martin Tyler having a bottle thrown at him. Police Horses being provoked. Pathetic isn't it, anywhere else it'd be a day of celebration. It's a British (not just English) thing, remember the Rangers fans in Manchester? Plus people have probably been back on the beak after a few months off. Not to start a whole new argument but one thing ive said for a long time now is. Weve all seen the devastating impact of the pandemic. Yet as soon as its possible alot of the British public will go back to not giving a shit. Doing what they want when they want and completely forgetting what some have gone through. I know ive said it and its not the total fault but if you cant handle your beer or drugs in some morons cases then you shouldn't touch them. Dread to think what it would of been like if 20,000 Italians would of been allowed at the game aswell.
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Post by colnepotter on Jul 12, 2021 20:51:56 GMT
I’ve never seen such a bunch of whoppers as leaving Wembley last night. A lad was knocked out cold in front of us, cars smashed up, other random fans being constantly abused. Constant fighting, bottles and half full cans being thrown into random crowds of people. Me and my mate couldn’t believe how many dickheads were about. I’d have hated to be there with my family and I’ll take them to Stoke games. This was next level dickheadery. Couple that with the racist abuse online afterwards and maybe England fans don’t deserve to win anything. It did piss me off tbh. I agree. It was terrible. Probably the worst I have ever seen at Wembley, even more so than the Scotland game in 77. The Jocks were pissed for sure, but pretty harmless compared to the casablancas there last night. Security was a complete joke. We really don’t deserve to host the World Cup.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jul 12, 2021 21:01:30 GMT
How’s that the fault of the Police though? They do what they’re told to do. It’ll be interesting to see how much press coverage this Officers heroics receive. The problem nowadays is that if the Police get stuck in they get hammered for being heavy handed and if they don’t they get criticised. However one things for sure if there’d been carnage last night and lots of robust policing you’d be one of the first to have a pop saying the fans were just having a laugh and the press and social media would be doing similar. I'm not suggesting they should have got "stuck in" , I am suggesting they should have at least graced Wembley with their presence...... Surely though that’s not their decision I believe that’s down to what they call private hire. It’s becoming increasingly common that events like this employ their own security. The derby’s the same where G4s do the majority of the Security and the Police support. Not saying it’s right but hardly the Polices fault. I’d imagine the Police would work London and in the case of the stations the BTP who the injured officer who was attacked worked for. It’s a hell of a lot more difficult to police a private venue / stadium than the streets or parks where they’re open to the public. For what’s it worth I think Russia was such a big success because 1- It’s difficult and expensive to get too. 2- Because the Police are allowed to police without being scrutinised or video phoned everywhere they go. The day police are stopped being used as political pawns is the day things will improve. When you say “graced with their presence” do you genuinly think the soft approach would work with the idiots there last night? How would you expect them to deal with them? Pat them on the head and send them home?
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Post by colnepotter on Jul 12, 2021 21:02:36 GMT
How’s that the fault of the Police though? They do what they’re told to do. It’ll be interesting to see how much press coverage this Officers heroics receive. The problem nowadays is that if the Police get stuck in they get hammered for being heavy handed and if they don’t they get criticised. However one things for sure if there’d been carnage last night and lots of robust policing you’d be one of the first to have a pop saying the fans were just having a laugh and the press and social media would be doing similar. I'm not suggesting they should have got "stuck in" , I am suggesting they should have at least graced Wembley with their presence...... Yep. You are right. It was definitely a case of the thin blue line last night. I once went to the Rome derby a few years back and witnessed the Italian version of policing. Pretty impressive use of the Water Cannon I must say, which is exactly what was needed last night I’m afraid, although they should not of let it get to that stage.
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