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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Nov 25, 2020 17:30:00 GMT
That doesn't really answer either of my questions though does it? You asked me what I expected to see and I answered what I expect to see. If that doesn't answer your question that's your problem. You asked how do you change that and I told you how to change that. If that doesn't answer your question that's your problem. ‘Could be fireworks’ is a remarkably cowardly answer to what you expect to happen, not prepared to put your swingers on the line? Why should he get a run of starts on the back of a handful of decent friendly showings and a cameo at Forest?
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Tymon
Nov 25, 2020 18:57:33 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2020 18:57:33 GMT
Did McClean play last night?? No. I thought you said you'd drop McClean to play him though, generally? I didn’t say that at all, I said for Tymon to play in the position where he’s been most effective.
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Tymon
Nov 25, 2020 19:57:45 GMT
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a likes this
Post by Ron on Nov 25, 2020 19:57:45 GMT
It’s becoming a smaller list. Not LB, Not LWB, LW next on the list of positions he’s not good enough in. Maybe he’s just, not good enough?! He is simply not good enough at all.. people raving after a couple of bang average games in midfield in ore season and league cup and a random decent cameo end of last season. There’s a reason he’s one of few Stoke players I’ve seen down the years get subbed very early or at half time more than a couple of times. He really is not of the required standard. In fact he’s not the only one... one good game is all it takes for a younger player to win the affection of the masses.
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Tymon
Nov 25, 2020 20:11:34 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2020 20:11:34 GMT
It’s becoming a smaller list. Not LB, Not LWB, LW next on the list of positions he’s not good enough in. Maybe he’s just, not good enough?! He is simply not good enough at all.. people raving after a couple of bang average games in midfield in ore season and league cup and a random decent cameo end of last season. There’s a reason he’s one of few Stoke players I’ve seen down the years get subbed very early or at half time more than a couple of times. He really is not of the required standard. In fact he’s not the only one... one good game is all it takes for a younger player to win the affection of the masses. He’s very quick and direct. Maybe he’s best suited as an impact sub for left wing? I am disappointed that he didn’t build on some good performances but that doesn’t mean that there is no place for him.
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Tymon
Nov 25, 2020 20:17:11 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2020 20:17:11 GMT
It's suddenly looking as if some of the younger players in the back up category might not be championship ready, which would make our squad suddenly look a little thin? We need a couple of good additions in January - if we're serious about getting out of this god awful, bog-standard league that is.
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Tymon
Nov 25, 2020 22:04:37 GMT
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Nov 25, 2020 22:04:37 GMT
Tymon looks like he's shitting himself when he's on the pitch.
He's not good enough but I think it's a mental issue, he's just not cut out for it.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 0:28:58 GMT
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Post by a on Nov 26, 2020 0:28:58 GMT
Tymon looks like he's shitting himself when he's on the pitch. He's not good enough but I think it's a mental issue, he's just not cut out for it. And that is without the pressure from crowds. Sadly it’s not meant to be.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 0:32:15 GMT
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 26, 2020 0:32:15 GMT
I’ll ask again.
Where the hell did his selection come from?
And why in a position that we know he can’t play?
Awful management.
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Post by nottsover60 on Nov 26, 2020 1:15:08 GMT
I have seen no attacking attributes apart from his speed) or midfield. You must have missed the Forest game where he assisted for a couple of goals. You mean last season when he came on as a sub and had a decent game against a woeful Forest team. A match he is still living on as he hasn't reproduced this season? How many chances do you give players? He played that game under no expectation with no pressure. At the beginning of this season I gave him my support because I thought he'd had a raw deal at the club. However he threw away the prolonged run he had in the team and of all the young players we've played this season ranks alongside Brown as the most disappointing.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 8:51:59 GMT
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Post by superalexneil on Nov 26, 2020 8:51:59 GMT
Back to standard josh tymon. Rubbish. Get rid Or just play him in the position he’s most effectual in? Which is? Hes crap
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 8:59:02 GMT
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Nov 26, 2020 8:59:02 GMT
No. I thought you said you'd drop McClean to play him though, generally? I didn’t say that at all, I said for Tymon to play in the position where he’s been most effective. I mean you literally responded to the question 'who are you dropping for him' with 'McClean', so... And you also said 'attacking midfield', which is an odd way of saying 'wide left'.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 13:22:09 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2020 13:22:09 GMT
You asked me what I expected to see and I answered what I expect to see. If that doesn't answer your question that's your problem. You asked how do you change that and I told you how to change that. If that doesn't answer your question that's your problem. ‘Could be fireworks’ is a remarkably cowardly answer to what you expect to happen, not prepared to put your swingers on the line? Why should he get a run of starts on the back of a handful of decent friendly showings and a cameo at Forest? According to the manager and his assistant he does really well in training, and they make the decisions, not you.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 13:23:53 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2020 13:23:53 GMT
You must have missed the Forest game where he assisted for a couple of goals. You mean last season when he came on as a sub and had a decent game against a woeful Forest team. A match he is still living on as he hasn't reproduced this season? How many chances do you give players? He played that game under no expectation with no pressure. At the beginning of this season I gave him my support because I thought he'd had a raw deal at the club. However he threw away the prolonged run he had in the team and of all the young players we've played this season ranks alongside Brown as the most disappointing. which "prolonged run" is that?
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 13:24:56 GMT
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Nov 26, 2020 13:24:56 GMT
‘Could be fireworks’ is a remarkably cowardly answer to what you expect to happen, not prepared to put your swingers on the line? Why should he get a run of starts on the back of a handful of decent friendly showings and a cameo at Forest? According to the manager and his assistant he does really well in training, and they make the decisions, not you. Yep. And said run hasn't been forthcoming. What does that tell you?
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 13:28:57 GMT
Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 26, 2020 13:28:57 GMT
Is it me or is training overrated?
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 13:29:33 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2020 13:29:33 GMT
According to the manager and his assistant he does really well in training, and they make the decisions, not you. Yep. And said run hasn't been forthcoming. What does that tell you? As with all questions you ask you already know which answer you want, so I won't bother stating the obvious.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 13:35:44 GMT
Post by The Toxic Avenger on Nov 26, 2020 13:35:44 GMT
Yep. And said run hasn't been forthcoming. What does that tell you? As with all questions you ask you already know which answer you want, so I won't bother stating the obvious. I want to know what you think. You talk in endless riddles, why not tell us what your opinion on Tymon actually is? Do you think he should be starting regularly, yes or no? Instead of who, and why? It's really not rocket science.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 15:02:49 GMT
Post by nottsover60 on Nov 26, 2020 15:02:49 GMT
You mean last season when he came on as a sub and had a decent game against a woeful Forest team. A match he is still living on as he hasn't reproduced this season? How many chances do you give players? He played that game under no expectation with no pressure. At the beginning of this season I gave him my support because I thought he'd had a raw deal at the club. However he threw away the prolonged run he had in the team and of all the young players we've played this season ranks alongside Brown as the most disappointing. which "prolonged run" is that? Well he's started 5 out of 13 league games and come on in 4 others plus he's played the cup games so that's enough to prove he should be a regular if he wants to break into the team. Don't tell me he's played in lots of different positions because that's due in part to him not being good enough in any. Strangely unlike most young players he started promisingly and gradually got worse so for the good of the team had to be dropped. Sorry it' s professional football not schoolboy and a club can't keep playing a young player till he starts ding well if having him in the team is like only having 10 men. MON has said exactly that - young players have to earn their place not get picked cos of age. Josh blew it.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 15:17:25 GMT
Post by Miles Offside on Nov 26, 2020 15:17:25 GMT
Young player, plenty to learn, but nowhere near ready for the first team. A loan out to a lower league club might help him find some form and his best position.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 16:30:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2020 16:30:53 GMT
I didn’t say that at all, I said for Tymon to play in the position where he’s been most effective. I mean you literally responded to the question 'who are you dropping for him' with 'McClean', so... And you also said 'attacking midfield', which is an odd way of saying 'wide left'. Sorry, I didn’t realise a player had to be dropped and that Tymon couldn’t have played in McCleans place with him being unavailable.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 19:52:49 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2020 19:52:49 GMT
which "prolonged run" is that? Well he's started 5 out of 13 league games and come on in 4 others plus he's played the cup games so that's enough to prove he should be a regular if he wants to break into the team. Don't tell me he's played in lots of different positions because that's due in part to him not being good enough in any. Strangely unlike most young players he started promisingly and gradually got worse so for the good of the team had to be dropped. Sorry it' s professional football not schoolboy and a club can't keep playing a young player till he starts ding well if having him in the team is like only having 10 men. MON has said exactly that - young players have to earn their place not get picked cos of age. Josh blew it. He had a decent run in the 4 cup games and we saw good performances. But there has been no run in the league, he's been in and out, never a settled first teamer. Then suddenly he gets cameos and in one made a terrible mostake. Frankly I thought that might be the end of his chances for the foreseeable future, but O'Neill still believes in him, which is good, but his belief is not so strong that he gives him that run of games - 3-4 in succession or even 90 mins in 1 - so this is not beneficial and stops him from gaining the security a player, any player, but young players especially. needs. The result when you're deprived of security is often that you're error prone. Which is exactly what happens, when he plays.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 21:02:57 GMT
Post by nottsover60 on Nov 26, 2020 21:02:57 GMT
Well he's started 5 out of 13 league games and come on in 4 others plus he's played the cup games so that's enough to prove he should be a regular if he wants to break into the team. Don't tell me he's played in lots of different positions because that's due in part to him not being good enough in any. Strangely unlike most young players he started promisingly and gradually got worse so for the good of the team had to be dropped. Sorry it' s professional football not schoolboy and a club can't keep playing a young player till he starts ding well if having him in the team is like only having 10 men. MON has said exactly that - young players have to earn their place not get picked cos of age. Josh blew it. He had a decent run in the 4 cup games and we saw good performances. But there has been no run in the league, he's been in and out, never a settled first teamer. Then suddenly he gets cameos and in one made a terrible mostake. Frankly I thought that might be the end of his chances for the foreseeable future, but O'Neill still believes in him, which is good, but his belief is not so strong that he gives him that run of games - 3-4 in succession or even 90 mins in 1 - so this is not beneficial and stops him from gaining the security a player, any player, but young players especially. needs. The result when you're deprived of security is often that you're error prone. Which is exactly what happens, when he plays. After the Villa cup game he started in 4 of the next five league games but instead of settling into the team my memory is that he got progressively worse culminating in him being dropped after the Swansea game. As I have said a young player is not going to get a long run of games unless he proves himself worthy of it and he didn't. He had a run of 5 consecutive starts, a rest for one match (Brentford) then another game. He nor you have reason to complain that he wasn't given a fair chance. Collins for example has had a far less settled time this season being in and out of the team and playing in at least 3 different positions but every time he plays he looks determined to make his mark yet is 2 years younger than Tymon.
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Tymon
Nov 26, 2020 21:11:58 GMT
Post by nottsover60 on Nov 26, 2020 21:11:58 GMT
And by the way he played the full 90 minutes in three of those and was substituted in the 80th minute of another. It was only the Swansea game when he was taken off after 60. At that stage of the season Campbell had been given far less consistent starts but the difference is that he has now made himself undroppable and even convinced MON that he needs to stay on the pitch for the whole 90 when we need goals. He again is younger than Tymon. Can you explain why you think Tymon deserves preferential treatment?
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Tymon
Nov 27, 2020 13:38:30 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2020 13:38:30 GMT
And by the way he played the full 90 minutes in three of those and was substituted in the 80th minute of another. It was only the Swansea game when he was taken off after 60. At that stage of the season Campbell had been given far less consistent starts but the difference is that he has now made himself undroppable and even convinced MON that he needs to stay on the pitch for the whole 90 when we need goals. He again is younger than Tymon. Can you explain why you think Tymon deserves preferential treatment? Campbell is Campbell, Collins is Collins, Tymon is Tymon. That's what I'd expect the manager, and you, to take into account.
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Tymon
Nov 27, 2020 15:21:38 GMT
Post by nottsover60 on Nov 27, 2020 15:21:38 GMT
And by the way he played the full 90 minutes in three of those and was substituted in the 80th minute of another. It was only the Swansea game when he was taken off after 60. At that stage of the season Campbell had been given far less consistent starts but the difference is that he has now made himself undroppable and even convinced MON that he needs to stay on the pitch for the whole 90 when we need goals. He again is younger than Tymon. Can you explain why you think Tymon deserves preferential treatment? Campbell is Campbell, Collins is Collins, Tymon is Tymon. That's what I'd expect the manager, and you, to take into account. Unfortunately for Tymon though he is 21 and Stoke don't have time to wait for him to produce his best. At the moment when he plays it weakens the team and that has to come before an individual player. I just can't see a future for him at Stoke. You say MON still has faith in him but it must be running out. Being substituted at half time on Tuesday will have done nothing for his confidence but the manager couldn't worry about that. I suspect we won't see much of him in the starting line up this season. Either he has to change his approach to games and become more like Collins and Campbell or move club. I think that players with little self confidence, which is often called arrogance, struggle to succeed in top level sport.
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Tymon
Nov 27, 2020 21:08:39 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2020 21:08:39 GMT
Campbell is Campbell, Collins is Collins, Tymon is Tymon. That's what I'd expect the manager, and you, to take into account. Unfortunately for Tymon though he is 21 and Stoke don't have time to wait for him to produce his best. At the moment when he plays it weakens the team and that has to come before an individual player. I just can't see a future for him at Stoke. You say MON still has faith in him but it must be running out. Being substituted at half time on Tuesday will have done nothing for his confidence but the manager couldn't worry about that. I suspect we won't see much of him in the starting line up this season. Either he has to change his approach to games and become more like Collins and Campbell or move club. I think that players with little self confidence, which is often called arrogance, struggle to succeed in top level sport. As I said before I had already reached that conclusion, but O'Neill, partly because beggars can't be choosers, has a hole in his defence on the left side, and none of his three options are doing well. Until he, perhaps, has a chance to remedy that in the next window, he is stuck with those three. For reasons best known to himself he sees Fox as a central defender, McClean as what McClean is, and that leaves him with the job of trying to help Tymon become a better defender. He's never going to be a Campbell or Collins. Those players are super confident and there's only one way they're going and that's up. Tymon needs an arm around his shoulder, just like Bojan did. O'Neill is happy to offer him that but he, apparently, does not have the ability to coach Tymon, tell him what to do defensively. I won't comment on your despicable definition of lack of confindence as arrogance.
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Tymon
Nov 27, 2020 21:42:10 GMT
Post by nottsover60 on Nov 27, 2020 21:42:10 GMT
Unfortunately for Tymon though he is 21 and Stoke don't have time to wait for him to produce his best. At the moment when he plays it weakens the team and that has to come before an individual player. I just can't see a future for him at Stoke. You say MON still has faith in him but it must be running out. Being substituted at half time on Tuesday will have done nothing for his confidence but the manager couldn't worry about that. I suspect we won't see much of him in the starting line up this season. Either he has to change his approach to games and become more like Collins and Campbell or move club. I think that players with little self confidence, which is often called arrogance, struggle to succeed in top level sport. As I said before I had already reached that conclusion, but O'Neill, partly because beggars can't be choosers, has a hole in his defence on the left side, and none of his three options are doing well. Until he, perhaps, has a chance to remedy that in the next window, he is stuck with those three. For reasons best known to himself he sees Fox as a central defender, McClean as what McClean is, and that leaves him with the job of trying to help Tymon become a better defender. He's never going to be a Campbell or Collins. Those players are super confident and there's only one way they're going and that's up. Tymon needs an arm around his shoulder, just like Bojan did. O'Neill is happy to offer him that but he, apparently, does not have the ability to coach Tymon, tell him what to do defensively. I won't comment on your despicable definition of lack of confindence as arrogance. You misunderstand me. I mean that the self confidence that Campbell and Collins show is often referred to as arrogance but I see it as a positive trait which is a prerequirement for top sportsmen and is something which Tymon lacks.
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Tymon
Nov 27, 2020 21:56:58 GMT
via mobile
Post by bgreen13 on Nov 27, 2020 21:56:58 GMT
Is it me or is training overrated? Yeah, it's you.
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Tymon
Nov 27, 2020 21:58:05 GMT
via mobile
Post by bgreen13 on Nov 27, 2020 21:58:05 GMT
Tymon looks like he's shitting himself when he's on the pitch. He's not good enough but I think it's a mental issue, he's just not cut out for it. Perhaps he could down some bucky and soil himself?
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Tymon
Nov 27, 2020 21:59:07 GMT
via mobile
Post by bgreen13 on Nov 27, 2020 21:59:07 GMT
And he's a mentally weak player. Not sure how he's made it this far but won't get any further.
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