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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2020 12:43:14 GMT
Sorry but even Ferguson took over a team that had quality in it, and even then, it still took him several years before they played like he wanted them to play (which was to win everything). We don't have any players left that can hold up in the PL based on current form. Not Butland, not Shawcross, not anyone else, because their actual PL experience is limited. We have a couple of players, who might just be ready soon, and some younger lads, but, according to even our own manager, they're not good enough to hold down a regular place in a bpttom third championship side. You see O'Neill as a manager that will remove players with big egos. Then do tell me what is he doing bigging up mister super ego, never caring for what happens to the team, Tom Ince? OK I'm saying: Ferguson learned his trade in the lower reaches of the Scottish league before moving to Aberdeen. At ManU he was very quick to remove any player who developed a big ego or started to think they were "un-droppable". He shifted some really big names, the only one he regretted was Jaap Stam . He was appointed in November 1986, and ManU were runners-up to Liverpool in 87-88, so he didn't hang around long did he? More relevant to what I was saying Ferguson appointed Archie Knox as his assistant when he arrived at ManU, and in his autobiographies he always speaks highly of the many assistants he has had down the years, possibly his most important signings. Interesting that they didn't hang around long, he clearly didn't want to be too dependant on his right hand man like Clough was with Taylor. I didn't say any of our present squad was fit for the PL. I said MON should not go into next season not trying to reach the play-offs, which I'm certain he won't, and is the main point I take issue with you. A team that wins the Championship is not ready for the Prem these days. They all spend heavily when promoted. Norwich were Champions 12 months ago and signed and loaned 12 new players. Ditto for Sheffield United and Villa. MON has just dropped Ince from the team (again) after his performance against Wigan, when Ince was one of the first players he took off. MON has little choice for right sided players and I'm sure he will find alternatives as soon as he can. MON has removed players from the club who clearly don't want to be here. What a manager says in public is not necessarily the same as what he says behind closed doors. We fans can say what we like about players, but the manager has to think what is the best way to motivate an employee, and publicly criticising an individual is inadvisable. Edit. Come to think of it, playing McClean on the right a couple of games ago, was probably MON trying to find an alternative to Ince. I just can't stomach this Stokie hyperbole. One day we're certain that we're done for and will be playing L1 next season, a few days later we beat a team that's below us, and instantly we're planning how to take on Liverpool and dethrone them. Bah! A little more humility and reality wouldn't hurt. Not saying that we're now allowed to dream, but let's stay up first!
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Post by mrcoke on Jul 8, 2020 20:38:26 GMT
The reality is 4 years ago Wilder took over at Sheffield United. At the start of the 2016 - 17 season, they achieved 1 draw and 3 losses in their first 4 matches and were bottom of League 1.
Tonight Sheffield United are in 7th place in the Premiership and pushing for a place in Europe.
When we played them in pre-season in our relegation year, you could tell from the atmosphere at Bramall Lane that their supporters were 100% behind the manager and the club was going places. They were also very generous applauding Shaqiri for his performance when he went off.
The fans can make a huge influence on the success of a club. Both a positive impact and a negative impact. I chose the former.
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Post by wakefieldstokie on Jul 8, 2020 21:46:31 GMT
If we can pull off a win tomorrow I think it will be enough, but itβs a big IF.
Not impossible though. Even with our shit shower
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Post by StaffordPotter on Jul 8, 2020 21:49:12 GMT
It would typical of us to beat Leeds, then get relegated.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2020 22:03:02 GMT
Helda Costa and Dallas both fit again for Leeds and back in contention......
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Post by SamB_SCFC on Jul 8, 2020 23:04:40 GMT
Just hope we're positive. We're not strong enough defensively to play for a draw and try to hold on, if we get put under sustained pressure we will always crumble. We need to defend from the front and have a go. Assume that we're going to concede 2 so we need 2 or 3 ourselves to get a result then see where it takes us.
Would rather see us lose with a fight than attempt to sit back and hand them an easy win like we did against Wigan.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2020 5:51:38 GMT
The reality is 4 years ago Wilder took over at Sheffield United. At the start of the 2016 - 17 season, they achieved 1 draw and 3 losses in their first 4 matches and were bottom of League 1.Tonight Sheffield United are in 7th place in the Premiership and pushing for a place in Europe. When we played them in pre-season in our relegation year, you could tell from the atmosphere at Bramall Lane that their supporters were 100% behind the manager and the club was going places. They were also very generous applauding Shaqiri for his performance when he went off. The fans can make a huge influence on the success of a club. Both a positive impact and a negative impact. I chose the former. The reality is we're Stoke City currently one place above relegation. We could still be playing League 1 next season, and no team ever won promotion to the PL from L1.... Just take it one game at a time.
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Post by stokeykez on Jul 9, 2020 6:49:55 GMT
We have to go there and be positive, hold our shape and hopefully capitalise on any chance we have. Luton with the worst goal difference nicked 1-0 off them 3 weeks ago. Praying we can avoid hitting the self destruct button at any time
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Jul 9, 2020 8:07:15 GMT
I wonder which performance we are going to get tonight, The Middlesboro and Wigan ones, or the Barnsley one. It has to be the latter one, if we are hoping to get anything from this game. If its the 2 former, we could be on a hiding to nothing.
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Post by jeycov on Jul 9, 2020 8:16:41 GMT
We also need our best players for the remaining fixtures and hope they remain injury free and available I think that every team may consider trying to wind up Powell not to mention some crunching tackles coming our way Some discipline and composure needed here, realistically a point from this game would be an excellent outcome. If not we really do need to protect our goal difference
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Post by scfcno1fan on Jul 9, 2020 8:20:14 GMT
Yes Iβm usually pessimistic at the best of times but I really canβt see anything other than a routine 2 0 leeds victory.
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Post by realstokebloke on Jul 9, 2020 9:11:21 GMT
We are capable of winning against Leeds . Correct of course.
But that doesn't explain why we didn't wipe the floor with Reading, Colin Wanker's mob and Wigan - all considerably worse than Leeds.
Genuinely can't decide if we're in for a pasting or a landmark performance and win.
Let's face it, we have both in the locker.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Jul 9, 2020 9:22:10 GMT
We are capable of winning against Leeds . Correct of course.Β
But that doesn't explain why we didn't wipe the floor with Reading, Colin Wanker's mob and Wigan - all considerably worse than Leeds.
Genuinely can't decide if we're in for a pasting or a landmark performance and win.
Let's face it, we have both in the locker.A turgid nil nil would be a good result for me!
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Post by chiswickpotter on Jul 9, 2020 9:23:14 GMT
We are capable of winning against Leeds . Correct of course.Β
But that doesn't explain why we didn't wipe the floor with Reading, Colin Wanker's mob and Wigan - all considerably worse than Leeds.
Genuinely can't decide if we're in for a pasting or a landmark performance and win.
Let's face it, we have both in the locker.Wigan was a poor performance but they are clearly a decent side. Reading was a rusty game by both teams and we had enough chances, McClean alone, to beat Boro. I would test key players for an hour tonight as Sunday and next Wednesday are our most winnable games. Sorensen for Powell, Thomson for Clucas and Ince for Campbell as a minimum, maybe more
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2020 9:35:05 GMT
Helda Costa and Dallas both fit again for Leeds and back in contention...... No danger. Smithy and Bruno will sort em:
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Post by towraytek on Jul 9, 2020 10:01:32 GMT
I'm hoping history repeats itself. In April 1968, Stoke faced Leeds at the Victoria Ground with Stoke threatened with relegation and Leeds needing a win to take them to top of the table. A Peter Dobing hat trick gave Stoke a 3-2 win. More of the same tonight please.
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Post by OldStokie on Jul 9, 2020 10:02:36 GMT
I'll settle for a vile, stinking, horrible, shithouse 0-0 draw like the Preston Boxing Day game many yonks ago. Everything is relative.
OS.
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Post by spiderpuss on Jul 9, 2020 10:11:08 GMT
I'll settle for a vile, stinking, horrible, shithouse 0-0 draw like the Preston Boxing Day game many yonks ago. Everything is relative. OS. Absolutely, I don't care if it's the most mind-crushing 0-0 ever. Let's get 10 men behind it and bore them out of existence.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2020 10:47:41 GMT
It would typical of us to beat Leeds, then get relegated. Is that typical of us ?
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Post by spiderpuss on Jul 9, 2020 10:55:19 GMT
It would typical of us to beat Leeds, then get relegated. Is that typical of us ? Our last relegation to the division below was the most meek surrender ever. We didn't beat anyone!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2020 10:59:41 GMT
Our last relegation to the division below was the most meek surrender ever. We didn't beat anyone! Pompey aside past few mins was no fight, yep. This team has lifted itself off the bottom, beat some decent sides and scored a few goals.
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Post by lordb on Jul 9, 2020 11:06:26 GMT
I wonder which performance we are going to get tonight, The Middlesboro and Wigan ones, or the Barnsley one. It has to be the latter one, if we are hoping to get anything from this game. If its the 2 former, we could be on a hiding to nothing. 'The Middlesboro and Wigan ones' Completely different performances if we make as many good chances tonight as we did v Boro even with average finishing we should score at least 2 Wigan we had 1 good chance from a set piece
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Post by realstokebloke on Jul 9, 2020 11:08:58 GMT
I'll settle for a vile, stinking, horrible, shithouse 0-0 draw like the Preston Boxing Day game many yonks ago. Everything is relative. OS. Agreed - if it is some Dunkirk - esque rearguard action with every man jack throwing himself into the fray, then of course.
The trouble might be however, if we set up for and try and play for a draw, I think we'll come very unstuck - we usually do.
I'd rather we go at them from the off, putting them under pressure.
Get a Tyreese hat trick in the bag first half and even we should be able to hold out a 0 - 3 lead? π€
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Post by bertiestan on Jul 9, 2020 11:35:55 GMT
Keep it tight n create a chance for Campbell....bang 0.1....gooooooooarn Stoke!!!!!
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Post by chuffedstokie on Jul 9, 2020 11:37:32 GMT
I'm hoping history repeats itself. In April 1968, Stoke faced Leeds at the Victoria Ground with Stoke threatened with relegation and Leeds needing a win to take them to top of the table. A Peter Dobing hat trick gave Stoke a 3-2 win. More of the same tonight please. That requires guts and passion. π€
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Post by Gods on Jul 9, 2020 11:55:29 GMT
I can't see beyond a regulation 2-0 defeat.
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Post by apb1 on Jul 9, 2020 12:01:54 GMT
I'll settle for a vile, stinking, horrible, shithouse 0-0 draw like the Preston Boxing Day game many yonks ago. Everything is relative. OS. Agreed - if it is some Dunkirk - esque rearguard action with every man jack throwing himself into the fray, then of course.
The trouble might be however, if we set up for and try and play for a draw, I think we'll come very unstuck - we usually do.
I'd rather we go at them from the off, putting them under pressure.
Get a Tyreese hat trick in the bag first half and even we should be able to hold out a 0 - 3 lead? π€That was sort of our game plan at West Brom, and we hung on to just one there!
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Post by mrcoke on Jul 9, 2020 12:35:02 GMT
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Post by stokecitystar2011 on Jul 9, 2020 12:44:30 GMT
Firstly you never know with our lot - what's coming!
This could be more about Brom going top, sure few of this Leeds team blew it before?
Maybe jitters, can only hope - up the Potters!
We can only hope.
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Post by bertiestan on Jul 9, 2020 13:26:20 GMT
Now Iβm not getting ahead of myself here but I feel if anyone can engineer a positive result at Leeds it will be O Neill...after saturdays win and going into this with a bit of positivity we are in better shape...keep it tight and snatch itπ€π»
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