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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2020 10:17:33 GMT
An odd choice of game to talk about IMO. It was the last game of the season and it was obvious their players had downed tools, taking absolutely nothing away from our players. We ruthlessly exposed them on the day.
I would have thought the False 9 game v Man City would have been a better match to talk about, as it completely out foxed Pellegrini on the day, and was a good a performance as you'll see from our time in the PL.
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Post by shrewspotter on Feb 7, 2020 11:35:05 GMT
There was some superb play in those 2 years. Still hard to fathom where it went so badly wrong
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Post by clarkeda on Feb 7, 2020 12:01:06 GMT
An odd choice of game to talk about IMO. It was the last game of the season and it was obvious their players had downed tools, taking absolutely nothing away from our players. We ruthlessly exposed them on the day. I would have thought the False 9 game v Man City would have been a better match to talk about, as it completely out foxed Pellegrini on the day, and was a good a performance as you'll see from our time in the PL. Yeah agree the 3 games Man Utd, Man City, and Everton All very different but amazing for the same reason. I’d like to hear his thinking of F9 on the 2 then The change in tactic for Everton. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2020 12:03:38 GMT
Don't like to say it but he probably would of kept us up He probably wouldn't |
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Post by scfc75 on Feb 7, 2020 12:26:17 GMT
Don't like to say it but he probably would of kept us up He probably wouldn't I have to agree. We were on a steady regression from 2016 which accelerated at the start of the 17/18 season. The fact that, had we turned 2 draws into wins (Watford and Brighton at home most likely), we would’ve stayed up, means that we were definitely ‘saveable’, but Hughes showed no signs of halting the slide. Getting rid of him didn’t relegate us, not appointing the right replacement did for us. |
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Post by OldStokie on Feb 7, 2020 12:36:14 GMT
I don't get the hatred by some fans against Hughes. He definitely gave us some of the best nogger since the 70's. It wasn't all good but there were some amazing times while he was here. Maybe we might have been relegated had he not been sacked, but I doubt it. Personally I think we might have scraped enough points with him to have avoided relegation. He should have been sacked at the end of the season but the main reason we went down is because we made the wrong appointment after Hughes was sacked.
OS.
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Post by cousindupree on Feb 7, 2020 13:11:02 GMT
I don't get the hatred by some fans against Hughes. He definitely gave us some of the best nogger since the 70's. It wasn't all good but there were some amazing times while he was here. Maybe we might have been relegated had he not been sacked, but I doubt it. Personally I think we might have scraped enough points with him to have avoided relegation. He should have been sacked at the end of the season but the main reason we went down is because we made the wrong appointment after Hughes was sacked. OS. Nicely put OS and my view to a tee. Hughes also gets little praise for the speed in which he changed the side he inherited playing Pulisball, and turned them into an attacking side who at times played stunning football not seen since the Waddo years. I will be forever grateful for such good times and so he gets my respect. |
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Post by foxysgloves on Feb 7, 2020 13:41:32 GMT
At his best Hughes was very very good.
At his worst he was very very bad.
Tone maybe never hit the same heights in terms of performance but nor did our performances plummet quite so spectacularly. He seemed able to maintain a level which, while far from entertaining much of the time, enabled us to just about keep our heads above water.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 7, 2020 14:01:19 GMT
At his best Hughes was very very good. At his worst he was very very bad. Tone maybe never hit the same heights in terms of performance but nor did our performances plummet quite so spectacularly. He seemed able to maintain a level which, while far from entertaining much of the time, enabled us to just about keep our heads above water. It helped that he was sacked before our heads disappeared under, which is what should've happened to Hughes. |
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Post by clarkeda on Feb 7, 2020 14:01:31 GMT
At his best Hughes was very very good. At his worst he was very very bad. Tone maybe never hit the same heights in terms of performance but nor did our performances plummet quite so spectacularly. He seemed able to maintain a level which, while far from entertaining much of the time, enabled us to just about keep our heads above water. I disagree that run of form in Pulis last season nearly got us relegated. |
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Post by lawbilloo on Feb 7, 2020 14:32:55 GMT
It's not worth going into all the detais from the Hughes era (yet again) Anyone interested and not hopelessly prejudiced can find it all on Wickipaedia. Look first at the chronic injury list which started with Huth in Dec 2014 and continued through Bojan, Shawcross, Affellay and Butland (those hard to replace) and also included Ireland, Cameron and Muniesa( those with recurring, niggly hamstrings) Then look at how many squad players either reached retirement age or the age of 30+ during these years, such as Shawcross, Cameron, Adam, Whelan, Crouch, Walters, Affellay and Johnson. Then calculate the replacement value of all these backbone players at prevailing Premier league going rates, and set that against the attempt by Peter Coates to come up with some fanciful strategy of "sustainability"
No wonder leslie lost the plot.
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Post by chigstoke on Feb 7, 2020 14:44:09 GMT
At his best Hughes was very very good. At his worst he was very very bad. Tone maybe never hit the same heights in terms of performance but nor did our performances plummet quite so spectacularly. He seemed able to maintain a level which, while far from entertaining much of the time, enabled us to just about keep our heads above water. Not strictly true under Pulis though, we won 3 games out of 18 in 2013 under him, and were plummetting to the relegation zone. Luckily we got 2 on the bounce and it saved our skin really. It's a bloody good job Wigan had an extremely poor goal difference that season.
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Post by anchorman on Feb 7, 2020 21:08:09 GMT
I don't get the hatred by some fans against Hughes. He definitely gave us some of the best nogger since the 70's. It wasn't all good but there were some amazing times while he was here. Maybe we might have been relegated had he not been sacked, but I doubt it. Personally I think we might have scraped enough points with him to have avoided relegation. He should have been sacked at the end of the season but the main reason we went down is because we made the wrong appointment after Hughes was sacked. OS. OS, we had been on the slide for a good while under Hughes and if you listen to some of the former players talking about the lack of discipline, lack of structure, team spirit and a general lack of desire within the dressing room then I'm afraid the finger is pointed fairly & squarely at Mark Hughes.He was arrogant, lazy and negligent in my view and was not capable of rebuilding the core, the spine of the team. He was responsible for our demise and the club should have acted the season before in my opinion. I agree that there was some decent football played over a relatively short period but they could never lace the boots of the 70's team because they could do it far more consistently week in week out and against any team in that league. |
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Post by PotteringThrough on Feb 7, 2020 21:16:17 GMT
I've just watched a video of Robert Huth scoring 2 goals for Leicester away at Man City.
Past it...
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Post by mrred on Feb 7, 2020 22:44:48 GMT
There was some superb play in those 2 years. Still hard to fathom where it went so badly wrong On the contrary, it all started falling apart the following season. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 7, 2020 22:56:08 GMT
I don't get the hatred by some fans against Hughes. He definitely gave us some of the best nogger since the 70's. It wasn't all good but there were some amazing times while he was here. Maybe we might have been relegated had he not been sacked, but I doubt it. Personally I think we might have scraped enough points with him to have avoided relegation. He should have been sacked at the end of the season but the main reason we went down is because we made the wrong appointment after Hughes was sacked. OS. OS, we had been on the slide for a good while under Hughes and if you listen to some of the former players talking about the lack of discipline, lack of structure, team spirit and a general lack of desire within the dressing room then I'm afraid the finger is pointed fairly & squarely at Mark Hughes.He was arrogant, lazy and negligent in my view and was not capable of rebuilding the core, the spine of the team. He was responsible for our demise and the club should have acted the season before in my opinion. I agree that there was some decent football played over a relatively short period but they could never lace the boots of the 70's team because they could do it far more consistently week in week out and against any team in that league. The ‘relatively short period’ was 2-2 and a half years. Must we really rewrite history just because he fucked things up in the end? |
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Post by davejohnno1 on Feb 7, 2020 23:23:41 GMT
OS, we had been on the slide for a good while under Hughes and if you listen to some of the former players talking about the lack of discipline, lack of structure, team spirit and a general lack of desire within the dressing room then I'm afraid the finger is pointed fairly & squarely at Mark Hughes.He was arrogant, lazy and negligent in my view and was not capable of rebuilding the core, the spine of the team. He was responsible for our demise and the club should have acted the season before in my opinion. I agree that there was some decent football played over a relatively short period but they could never lace the boots of the 70's team because they could do it far more consistently week in week out and against any team in that league. The ‘relatively short period’ was 2-2 and a half years. Must we really rewrite history just because he fucked things up in the end? The unforgivable thing with Hughes was that he lost interest. He stopped going to watch games, his presence around the club diminished and standards slipped over a period of time. Some say we stopped him going to Everton and maybe that was it, maybe it wasn't. I'd love to know, in Hughes words, where he thinks it all went sour at stoke. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 7, 2020 23:34:25 GMT
The ‘relatively short period’ was 2-2 and a half years. Must we really rewrite history just because he fucked things up in the end? The unforgivable thing with Hughes was that he lost interest. He stopped going to watch games, his presence around the club diminished and standards slipped over a period of time. Some say we stopped him going to Everton and maybe that was it, maybe it wasn't. I'd love to know, in Hughes words, where he thinks it all went sour at stoke. His decision making certainly went totally haywire and it’s not really clear why. |
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Post by thehoof on Feb 7, 2020 23:34:36 GMT
At his best Hughes was very very good. At his worst he was very very bad. Tone maybe never hit the same heights in terms of performance but nor did our performances plummet quite so spectacularly. He seemed able to maintain a level which, while far from entertaining much of the time, enabled us to just about keep our heads above water. 7-0 at Chelsea, 5-0 at Bolton , 4-0 at home ( Chelsea) , 3-0 every time we went to Man City, 3-0 at a Blackburn side who had sacked their manager they were that bad- and our performances didn’t plummet so spectacularly? |
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Post by Dr Hesham on Feb 8, 2020 3:15:59 GMT
He was a good coach when Coates wanted Stoke to be a top team, he became a below average coach when Coates stopped spending.
For me, he is not good enough for PL.
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Post by generationex on Feb 8, 2020 6:58:59 GMT
Hughes’ Stoke were a real Curate’s egg.
The high point was Christmas 2015, we were superb for about a month, whilst in the background the seeds of Stoke’s destruction were already being sown - Imbula arrived that January, Huth given away, Wolly and assorted no marks added.
By spring ‘16 it was obvious something was seriously wrong, the home game against Spurs stands out, and from then on we were always on the verge of a thrashing.
Even the three top nine finishes were weird - in all of those seasons we looked like relegation favourites by November with results to match. Then we’d have a run of about 4 games when we’d win every game, then a poor run, then a great run for the last few weeks of the season. We sort of finished 9th without ever being 9th until the last day. League Cup form was reasonable, FA Cup laughable.
There were undoubtedly some high points but overall the price has been too high. The catastrophe since 2016 is largely down to Hughes.
It was on his watch that we signed the 6 most expensive players in the history of SCFC. Only one of those is anything other than a multi million pound burden. They will hang over the club for years and we will not know the true cost until Financial Fair Play is resolved.
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Post by jeycov on Feb 8, 2020 7:31:57 GMT
Never happened apparently No, it definitely did happen. It was an incredible (however brief) period in our recent history. But then, just for balance, he lost his way, and got us relegated from the Premier League. We were in decline / free fall but I really think he would have kept us in the Premiership, We would have been a more attractive proposition for players and a new manager and probably still there We’ll never know |
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Post by rawli on Feb 8, 2020 7:39:07 GMT
No, it definitely did happen. It was an incredible (however brief) period in our recent history. But then, just for balance, he lost his way, and got us relegated from the Premier League. We were in decline / free fall but I really think he would have kept us in the Premiership, We would have been a more attractive proposition for players and a new manager and probably still there We’ll never know He couldn't have done worse than Lambert |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2020 12:02:02 GMT
It's a straight shoot out for me over whether Tony Waddington or Mark Hughes delivered the best football and results for Stoke City in the last 50 years. For sure Tony Pulis laid the foundations for the Mark Hughes revolution but it was under Hughes we were really 'cookin'. Waddington, Pulis and Hughes, best we have seen in the modern era. The Lou years were great fun too but it was Div 3 / Div 2, we weren't locking horns with the great and the good of English football. From a purely football point of view , focussed entirely on 90 mins on a Saturday afternoon I agree But huge and deserved respect to macari for everything else , such as nello and the macari centre to help homeless stokies .A good manager and a great man |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2020 12:21:43 GMT
He was a good coach when Coates wanted Stoke to be a top team, he became a below average coach when Coates stopped spending. For me, he is not good enough for PL. Quite the opposite. When he worked on a relative shoestring he did well,when he was given money he fucked it up |
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Post by Gods on Feb 8, 2020 12:25:36 GMT
It's a straight shoot out for me over whether Tony Waddington or Mark Hughes delivered the best football and results for Stoke City in the last 50 years. For sure Tony Pulis laid the foundations for the Mark Hughes revolution but it was under Hughes we were really 'cookin'. Waddington, Pulis and Hughes, best we have seen in the modern era. The Lou years were great fun too but it was Div 3 / Div 2, we weren't locking horns with the great and the good of English football. From a purely football point of view , focussed entirely on 90 mins on a Saturday afternoon I agree But huge and deserved respect to macari for everything else , such as nello and the macari centre to help homeless stokies .A good manager and a great man Indeed. |
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Post by bathstoke on Feb 8, 2020 12:37:06 GMT
Best 2 years of football I have ever seen down stoke ...took Man City Man Utd Liverpool apart with stunning football...that will probably never seen down stoke again in the next 20 years ....cheers sparky Never happened apparently Ok, Ok, So I had a stunning wife that taught me stuff, but she didn’t take me on a romantic trip round Europe(that was the previous wife) But she still broke my heart 💔 I’m over it now of course... |
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Post by djduncanjames on Feb 8, 2020 12:53:55 GMT
He was way too hands off with the squad it seems., Discipline when out the window when the Older players left...
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Post by iglugluk on Feb 8, 2020 12:54:43 GMT
We were in decline / free fall but I really think he would have kept us in the Premiership, We would have been a more attractive proposition for players and a new manager and probably still there We’ll never know He couldn't have done worse than Lambert Personally I agree but many felt, and I'm pretty sure that less goals conceded confirmed, that Lambert stabilised our defensive performance which was needed at the time. The Coates's were negligent in their approach ultimately as far as I'm concerned in that they failed to notice what was clearly happening and therefore stayed inappropriately loyal to a manager who had needed replacing in the previous summer. |
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Post by berahinosgoals on Feb 8, 2020 12:56:16 GMT
He was a good coach when Coates wanted Stoke to be a top team, he became a below average coach when Coates stopped spending. For me, he is not good enough for PL. Quite the opposite. When he worked on a relative shoestring he did well,when he was given money he fucked it up Replacing leaders with rejects doesnt help |
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