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Post by claytonscrubs on Dec 18, 2019 8:40:53 GMT
My money’s on Keir Starmer...the failed lawyer who thought up Labour’s disastrous EU policy...https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1203910/Brexit-news-UK-election-latest-Jeremy-Corbyn-Labour-Party-Boris-Johnson-referendum .
BREAKING NEWS... We now go live to Labour’s Christmas party, where it’s all kicking off!!
😀
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Dec 18, 2019 8:55:51 GMT
My money’s on Keir Starmer...the failed lawyer who thought up Labour’s disastrous EU policy. BREAKING NEWS... We now go live to Labour’s Christmas party, where it’s all kicking off!! 😀 Labour have got a real problem to offer something different by somebody different.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 18, 2019 9:16:00 GMT
My money’s on Keir Starmer...the failed lawyer who thought up Labour’s disastrous EU policy. BREAKING NEWS... We now go live to Labour’s Christmas party, where it’s all kicking off!! 😀 Labour have got a real problem to offer something different by somebody different. I'd be very interested to know who your choice of Leader would be, John.
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Post by salopstick on Dec 18, 2019 9:20:00 GMT
I keep reading people thought their policies were good.
But on the news there was always the question how can they afford all that.
Reading a bit more on it leads me to concede that there is an argument to privatise everything. However it was too much at once.
If they had cherry picked the top priority and concentrated on them maybe easier to get done.
Look at broadband. It was sold as free broadband for everyone etc etc. It was never sold with the focus on purely how it would me a massive plus for education and industry. So it became a joke of free porn and Netflix instead of a massive educational policy changes and great business tool. Free porn should have just been an added bonus.
Labours priority should always be the economy and jobs because from a good economy all the other stuff like the NHS and rights become tributaries. Without that economy you can’t fund the branches. If you put focus on the tributaries the question will always be “affordability and jobs”
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Post by salopstick on Dec 18, 2019 9:20:50 GMT
Labour have got a real problem to offer something different by somebody different. I'd be very interested to know who your choice of Leader would be, John. A kier Starmer type modifies to exclude Tony Blair’s influence who accepts and embraces brexit
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Post by Davef on Dec 18, 2019 9:39:09 GMT
I fear Labour will go nowhere with most of the names currently in the frame as their leader.
One man I think could give them back a bit of credibility is Stephen Kinnock. Despite his constituency being a leave area and him campaigning for remain in 2016, he won a massive majority at the election (which is important) and has been a politician of compromise, refusing to become involved in the ridiculous People's Vote circus.
His name won't help his cause of course, but Labour could do a lot worse.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2019 9:43:09 GMT
That should have been the case since 1945 but they've proven over the decades that borrowing, taxing and freebie-filled manifestos are their only policies.
As employment laws have improved over the years Labour's original vote winning core policy has dwindled so it's been all NHS, NHS, NHS. You could argue that the NHS is the only long term success story of Labour since 1945 as pretty much everything else they've introduced, including the Welfare State, has proven to be nothing but a collection of short term bribes to the same targeted audience.
They continually fail to adopt a tough stance with the people in our society who take the piss because they're too scared to be seen to be attacking the working class when, if anything, they've done more to help people maintain a non-working lifestyle than any other party.
They've also failed to work out the link between poorly managed immigration and the undercover worsening of the employment practices that they've always wanted to protect. Many studies have shown that despite EU immigration being beneficial to the UK as a whole the lowest earning 30% of our workers have seen their income stagnate thanks to the availability of cheaper labour. I've come across multiple instances of people being told not to come into work for a week or two due to lack of work while the eastern European workforce complete what work there is - the only reason being that they're cheaper.
The best Labour leader would be one that left the party when Corbyn became leader and had the balls to predict the disaster that they've become. Anyone who decided to stay with Corbyn and promote his fucking idiotic policies should be seen as being as stupid as he is and shouldn't be allowed to get anywhere near No. 10.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 18, 2019 9:44:25 GMT
Labour HQ need to listen to this, again,again and again.
This took place on the 2nd Decemeber, 10 days before the General Election;
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Post by salopstick on Dec 18, 2019 9:48:48 GMT
I fear Labour will go nowhere with most of the names currently in the frame as their leader. One man I think could give them back a bit of credibility is Stephen Kinnock. Despite his constituency being a leave area and him campaigning for remain in 2016, he won a massive majority at the election (which is important) and has been a politician of compromise, refusing to become involved in the ridiculous People's Vote circus. His name won't help his cause of course, but Labour could do a lot worse. I agree with some of that Dave he does speak well. This kinnock name does go against him though. His parents have done really well out of the EU and kinnock has had a very privileged life. His constituency has seen a steady decline in the labour vote apart from 2017 which was probably due to Corbyn’s first promise to enact Brexit and suggests it was too big to turn blue this time. I still think that Labour need to vote enmasse for Boris bill on Friday. That would be the first step in acknowledging their Brexit policy was wrong and contributed to them losing. They can then concentrate on fighting Boris to get his workers rights bill done
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Dec 18, 2019 9:51:14 GMT
Labour have got a real problem to offer something different by somebody different. I'd be very interested to know who your choice of Leader would be, John. I think Labour have got themselves into a bit of a hole. I think it all started when Corbyn was " kindly" put forward as a candidate for the leadership as a nod to the left.. I think that backfired badly. Some have said that the socialist policies actually were not too bad...but Politically for me they read the mood completely wrongly....it was about BREXIT and it was about listening to the working class,ordinary people. We don't like being told what to do and being ignored. They should have CLEARLY backed BREXIT and kept the message simple...no need have promised loads of other stuff. Combine their policy with an ineffectual leader who looked unstatesmanlike and has a history ( ira, Hamas etc)( and clearly would have liked to have been a passionate leaver)... they didn't have much chance It is now a fractured party, probably an ineffectual opposition for a lengthy honeymoon period and may not be capable of being fixed. Not my cup of tea but David Milliband would have been able to hold his own and appeared priministerial which is important. Gisela Stuart would have been excellent in my opinion. Of the current crop... Lisa Nandy I think could be good and at least comes from the North. Kier Starmer again comes over as thoughtful and could be statesman like....I have doubts about him if he was put under pressure as a " leader"...and the first thing that should come out of his mouth should be" Labour fully accept the decision to leave the EU and we intend to make the UK a great country for the working men and women of the country".... people don't want the rights and wrongs of the referendum run again. I honestly think that any of the others/ front bench/ Yvette Cooper would be the end of Labour. Edging my bets.... Lisa Nandy as leader, Kier as deputy..... I've no idea really. What about you Wizard,?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2019 9:57:35 GMT
I fear Labour will go nowhere with most of the names currently in the frame as their leader. One man I think could give them back a bit of credibility is Stephen Kinnock. Despite his constituency being a leave area and him campaigning for remain in 2016, he won a massive majority at the election (which is important) and has been a politician of compromise, refusing to become involved in the ridiculous People's Vote circus. His name won't help his cause of course, but Labour could do a lot worse. Stephen Kinnock continued to blart out the same crap on Question Time. The breaking up of the NHS and millions of kids in poverty threats didn't work during the election campaign because the electorate aren't stupid. They know the Tories won't dismantle the NHS and they know that relative poverty isn't poverty. Labour have to 'get real' and stop campaigning as if the entire population is made up of students. Any party that tries to get into power by telling us that nurses are forced to use food banks isn't going to get anywhere. It's condescending shit and the people know it.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 18, 2019 10:06:32 GMT
I'd be very interested to know who your choice of Leader would be, John. I think Labour have got themselves into a bit of a hole. I think it all started when Corbyn was " kindly" put forward as a candidate for the leadership as a nod to the left.. I think that backfired badly. Some have said that the socialist policies actually were not too bad...but Politically for me they read the mood completely wrongly....it was about BREXIT and it was about listening to the working class,ordinary people. We don't like being told what to do and being ignored. They should have CLEARLY backed BREXIT and kept the message simple...no need have promised loads of other stuff. Combine their policy with an ineffectual leader who looked unstatesmanlike and has a history ( ira, Hamas etc)( and clearly would have liked to have been a passionate leaver)... they didn't have much chance It is now a fractured party, probably an ineffectual opposition for a lengthy honeymoon period and may not be capable of being fixed. Not my cup of tea but David Milliband would have been able to hold his own and appeared priministerial which is important. Gisela Stuart would have been excellent in my opinion. Of the current crop... Lisa Nandy I think could be good and at least comes from the North. Kier Starmer again comes over as thoughtful and could be statesman like....I have doubts about him if he was put under pressure as a " leader"...and the first thing that should come out of his mouth should be" Labour fully accept the decision to leave the EU and we intend to make the UK a great country for the working men and women of the country".... people don't want the rights and wrongs of the referendum run again. I honestly think that any of the others/ front bench/ Yvette Cooper would be the end of Labour. Edging my bets.... Lisa Nandy as leader, Kier as deputy..... I've no idea really. What about you Wizard,? To be honest John, I think it's more a question of who Labour don't want as leader. Rebecca Long Bailey or Dawn Butler (as The Corbynistas want) would sound the death knell..they'd take decades to recover. I've never listened to Steven Kinnock and stayed awake..A complete personality vacuum. The only person I would endorse would be Dan Jarvis up in Sheffield. Ive been touting him for yonks Lacks a little bit of political experience in High Office so I'd make him deputy to Keir Starmer. He'd do well 'up North and his Military Career is outstanding. But I can't imagine Corbyn or McDonnell would agree. They and their ilk need removing first.
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Dec 18, 2019 10:12:07 GMT
I think Labour have got themselves into a bit of a hole. I think it all started when Corbyn was " kindly" put forward as a candidate for the leadership as a nod to the left.. I think that backfired badly. Some have said that the socialist policies actually were not too bad...but Politically for me they read the mood completely wrongly....it was about BREXIT and it was about listening to the working class,ordinary people. We don't like being told what to do and being ignored. They should have CLEARLY backed BREXIT and kept the message simple...no need have promised loads of other stuff. Combine their policy with an ineffectual leader who looked unstatesmanlike and has a history ( ira, Hamas etc)( and clearly would have liked to have been a passionate leaver)... they didn't have much chance It is now a fractured party, probably an ineffectual opposition for a lengthy honeymoon period and may not be capable of being fixed. Not my cup of tea but David Milliband would have been able to hold his own and appeared priministerial which is important. Gisela Stuart would have been excellent in my opinion. Of the current crop... Lisa Nandy I think could be good and at least comes from the North. Kier Starmer again comes over as thoughtful and could be statesman like....I have doubts about him if he was put under pressure as a " leader"...and the first thing that should come out of his mouth should be" Labour fully accept the decision to leave the EU and we intend to make the UK a great country for the working men and women of the country".... people don't want the rights and wrongs of the referendum run again. I honestly think that any of the others/ front bench/ Yvette Cooper would be the end of Labour. Edging my bets.... Lisa Nandy as leader, Kier as deputy..... I've no idea really. What about you Wizard,? To be honest John, I think it's more a question of who Labour don't want as leader. Rebecca Long Bailey or Dawn Butler (as The Corbynistas want) would sound the death knell..they'd take decades to recover. I've never listened to Steven Kinnock and stayed awake..A complete personality vacuum. The only person I would endorse would be Dan Jarvis up in Sheffield. Ive been touting him for yonks Lacks a little bit of political experience in High Office so I'd make him deputy to Keir Starmer. He'd do well 'up North and his Military Career is outstanding. But I can't imagine Corbyn or McDonnell would agree. They and their ilk need removing first. I don't know much about Dan Wizard, I'll keep a lookout for him. I agree about Long Bailey, Butler, Kinnock (and Rayner,) 100%
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Post by salopstick on Dec 18, 2019 10:14:13 GMT
I think Labour have got themselves into a bit of a hole. I think it all started when Corbyn was " kindly" put forward as a candidate for the leadership as a nod to the left.. I think that backfired badly. Some have said that the socialist policies actually were not too bad...but Politically for me they read the mood completely wrongly....it was about BREXIT and it was about listening to the working class,ordinary people. We don't like being told what to do and being ignored. They should have CLEARLY backed BREXIT and kept the message simple...no need have promised loads of other stuff. Combine their policy with an ineffectual leader who looked unstatesmanlike and has a history ( ira, Hamas etc)( and clearly would have liked to have been a passionate leaver)... they didn't have much chance It is now a fractured party, probably an ineffectual opposition for a lengthy honeymoon period and may not be capable of being fixed. Not my cup of tea but David Milliband would have been able to hold his own and appeared priministerial which is important. Gisela Stuart would have been excellent in my opinion. Of the current crop... Lisa Nandy I think could be good and at least comes from the North. Kier Starmer again comes over as thoughtful and could be statesman like....I have doubts about him if he was put under pressure as a " leader"...and the first thing that should come out of his mouth should be" Labour fully accept the decision to leave the EU and we intend to make the UK a great country for the working men and women of the country".... people don't want the rights and wrongs of the referendum run again. I honestly think that any of the others/ front bench/ Yvette Cooper would be the end of Labour. Edging my bets.... Lisa Nandy as leader, Kier as deputy..... I've no idea really. What about you Wizard,? To be honest John, I think it's more a question of who Labour don't want as leader. Rebecca Long Bailey or Dawn Butler (as The Corbynistas want) would sound the death knell..they'd take decades to recover. I've never listened to Steven Kinnock and stayed awake..A complete personality vacuum. The only person I would endorse would be Dan Jarvis up in Sheffield. Ive been touting him for yonks Lacks a little bit of political experience in High Office so I'd make him deputy to Keir Starmer. He'd do well 'up North and his Military Career is outstanding. But I can't imagine Corbyn or McDonnell would agree. They and their ilk need removing first. Not in safe labour London seats. They will be on that train til they can’t function any more
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 18, 2019 10:21:20 GMT
To be honest John, I think it's more a question of who Labour don't want as leader. Rebecca Long Bailey or Dawn Butler (as The Corbynistas want) would sound the death knell..they'd take decades to recover. I've never listened to Steven Kinnock and stayed awake..A complete personality vacuum. The only person I would endorse would be Dan Jarvis up in Sheffield. Ive been touting him for yonks Lacks a little bit of political experience in High Office so I'd make him deputy to Keir Starmer. He'd do well 'up North and his Military Career is outstanding. But I can't imagine Corbyn or McDonnell would agree. They and their ilk need removing first. Not in safe labour London seats. They will be on that train til they can’t function any more Sadly, I suspect you're right.
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Post by serpico on Dec 18, 2019 10:28:31 GMT
I fear Labour will go nowhere with most of the names currently in the frame as their leader. One man I think could give them back a bit of credibility is Stephen Kinnock. Despite his constituency being a leave area and him campaigning for remain in 2016, he won a massive majority at the election (which is important) and has been a politician of compromise, refusing to become involved in the ridiculous People's Vote circus. His name won't help his cause of course, but Labour could do a lot worse. it will almost certainly be a women, won't it ? you can't indulge in identity politics if you're the only major party thats not had a women as leader. I think it will be Long-Bailey, terrible choice imo but thats who is looking most likely.
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Post by wagsastokie on Dec 18, 2019 10:29:43 GMT
Keir starmer If he is the answer God knows what the question is
Typical slimy smarmy lawyer Getting him to answer the question is like trying to pin blamange to the wall with a drawing pin
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Post by serpico on Dec 18, 2019 12:25:53 GMT
Thornberry has thrown her hat into the ring. MP from islington, just what the labour party need
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2019 12:26:56 GMT
Thornberry has thrown her hat into the ring. Apparently someone threw it straight back at her.....
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Post by serpico on Dec 18, 2019 12:27:48 GMT
Thornberry has thrown her hat into the ring. Apparently someone threw it straight back at her.....
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2019 12:27:52 GMT
Interesting. I agree with him on a lot of that......
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Post by auntiegeorge on Dec 18, 2019 12:37:48 GMT
Starmer will be the candidate to beat. It's all his for the taking.
Thornberry....what an utter joke. Not a chance.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 18, 2019 13:02:57 GMT
I think Labour have got themselves into a bit of a hole. I think it all started when Corbyn was " kindly" put forward as a candidate for the leadership as a nod to the left.. I think that backfired badly. Some have said that the socialist policies actually were not too bad...but Politically for me they read the mood completely wrongly....it was about BREXIT and it was about listening to the working class,ordinary people. We don't like being told what to do and being ignored. They should have CLEARLY backed BREXIT and kept the message simple...no need have promised loads of other stuff. Combine their policy with an ineffectual leader who looked unstatesmanlike and has a history ( ira, Hamas etc)( and clearly would have liked to have been a passionate leaver)... they didn't have much chance It is now a fractured party, probably an ineffectual opposition for a lengthy honeymoon period and may not be capable of being fixed. Not my cup of tea but David Milliband would have been able to hold his own and appeared priministerial which is important. Gisela Stuart would have been excellent in my opinion. Of the current crop... Lisa Nandy I think could be good and at least comes from the North. Kier Starmer again comes over as thoughtful and could be statesman like....I have doubts about him if he was put under pressure as a " leader"...and the first thing that should come out of his mouth should be" Labour fully accept the decision to leave the EU and we intend to make the UK a great country for the working men and women of the country".... people don't want the rights and wrongs of the referendum run again. I honestly think that any of the others/ front bench/ Yvette Cooper would be the end of Labour. Edging my bets.... Lisa Nandy as leader, Kier as deputy..... I've no idea really. What about you Wizard,? To be honest John, I think it's more a question of who Labour don't want as leader. Rebecca Long Bailey or Dawn Butler (as The Corbynistas want) would sound the death knell..they'd take decades to recover. I've never listened to Steven Kinnock and stayed awake..A complete personality vacuum. The only person I would endorse would be Dan Jarvis up in Sheffield. Ive been touting him for yonks Lacks a little bit of political experience in High Office so I'd make him deputy to Keir Starmer. He'd do well 'up North and his Military Career is outstanding. But I can't imagine Corbyn or McDonnell would agree. They and their ilk need removing first. It'll be a Becky and Dicky dream ticket! 😁
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Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Dec 18, 2019 13:18:21 GMT
I like Lisa Nandy but it would seem like box ticking, female, tick, Northern, tick! She was good on Newsnight last night.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 18, 2019 14:36:58 GMT
I think Labour have got themselves into a bit of a hole. I think it all started when Corbyn was " kindly" put forward as a candidate for the leadership as a nod to the left.. I think that backfired badly. Some have said that the socialist policies actually were not too bad...but Politically for me they read the mood completely wrongly....it was about BREXIT and it was about listening to the working class,ordinary people. We don't like being told what to do and being ignored. They should have CLEARLY backed BREXIT and kept the message simple...no need have promised loads of other stuff. Combine their policy with an ineffectual leader who looked unstatesmanlike and has a history ( ira, Hamas etc)( and clearly would have liked to have been a passionate leaver)... they didn't have much chance It is now a fractured party, probably an ineffectual opposition for a lengthy honeymoon period and may not be capable of being fixed. Not my cup of tea but David Milliband would have been able to hold his own and appeared priministerial which is important. Gisela Stuart would have been excellent in my opinion. Of the current crop... Lisa Nandy I think could be good and at least comes from the North. Kier Starmer again comes over as thoughtful and could be statesman like....I have doubts about him if he was put under pressure as a " leader"...and the first thing that should come out of his mouth should be" Labour fully accept the decision to leave the EU and we intend to make the UK a great country for the working men and women of the country".... people don't want the rights and wrongs of the referendum run again. I honestly think that any of the others/ front bench/ Yvette Cooper would be the end of Labour. Edging my bets.... Lisa Nandy as leader, Kier as deputy..... I've no idea really. What about you Wizard,? To be honest John, I think it's more a question of who Labour don't want as leader. Rebecca Long Bailey or Dawn Butler (as The Corbynistas want) would sound the death knell..they'd take decades to recover. I've never listened to Steven Kinnock and stayed awake..A complete personality vacuum. The only person I would endorse would be Dan Jarvis up in Sheffield. Ive been touting him for yonks Lacks a little bit of political experience in High Office so I'd make him deputy to Keir Starmer. He'd do well 'up North and his Military Career is outstanding. But I can't imagine Corbyn or McDonnell would agree. They and their ilk need removing first. Had to Google him, mate. Why are people like him never to the fore, yet utter dickheads like Butler and Burgon are? Rachel Reeves is another who seems reasonable, and one I just heard on LBC called Bridget Phillipson came across well. Don't know where they are, wing wise, but I think we need someone pragmatic and sensible to lead the opposition. Someone who can appeal to the working class, not someone who is disdainful of them, would be a start.
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Post by salopstick on Dec 18, 2019 14:47:22 GMT
Starmer will be the candidate to beat. It's all his for the taking. Thornberry....what an utter joke. Not a chance. She said the next leader should be elected for their "political nous and strategic vision", Why is she running then
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Post by Davef on Dec 18, 2019 14:56:34 GMT
Is Thornberry going to release her leadership manifesto and campaign against it?
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 18, 2019 14:58:13 GMT
This is a game changer guys Femi has joined the Labour party
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 18, 2019 15:05:41 GMT
I see that cunt Blair has been dripping his poison all morning. Get the fuck to the Hague you right wing twat.
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Post by salopstick on Dec 18, 2019 15:08:52 GMT
Apparently labour lost more remain votes than leave votes
In addition Labour claims they underestimated* the feeling over Brexit
*completely disregarded
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