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Post by stokiesteve on Sept 30, 2019 7:20:07 GMT
Can anyone remember Birmingham not winning at home for an age? They thought the stadium had some curse on it and Barry Fry had to piss on all four corner flags to lift the curse! 😂
Maybe Nathan should try something similar
Just a thought.
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Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 8:03:31 GMT
We are indeed cursed. When I was a kid I had a mate lived in the gypsy camp by the Fowl Lea Brook, bottom of Mare's fields between Hartshill and Cliffe Vale, we all called them the Romany Boswells. The D road's there now. After we won the league cup he told me we won that cos the gypsy curse ran out the year before. He said they'd renewed the curse for another 100 years, so SCFC is cursed til 2072. He's a sound lad and straight up and no reason lie to me. I mentioned this the other day in the "If...." thread. The curse was because the club evicted a Romany gypsy camp ftom a field in Stoke so they could have the football ground there.
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Cursed
Sept 30, 2019 8:09:04 GMT
Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 8:09:04 GMT
Can anyone remember Birmingham not winning at home for an age? They thought the stadium had some curse on it and Barry Fry had to piss on all four corner flags to lift the curse! 😂 Maybe Nathan should try something similar Just a thought. My feeling is if the Coates family part with a bit of their vast wealth and recompense the Boswell family and make a sincere apology on behalf of the club, there's a chance they might lift the curse. Peace and reconciliation is the best way forward I reckon.
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Post by callas12 on Sept 30, 2019 8:11:58 GMT
We are indeed cursed. When I was a kid I had a mate lived in the gypsy camp by the Fowl Lea Brook, bottom of Mare's fields between Hartshill and Cliffe Vale, we all called them the Romany Boswells. The D road's there now. After we won the league cup he told me we won that cos the gypsy curse ran out the year before. He said they'd renewed the curse for another 100 years, so SCFC is cursed til 2072. He's a sound lad and straight up and no reason lie to me. I mentioned this the other day in the "If...." thread. The curse was because the club evicted a Romany gypsy camp ftom a field in Stoke so they could have the football ground there. I've liked this post but would have disliked if there was an option..! Interesting story that with spooky goings on, certainly makes you wonder doesnt it?! Shall we blame Scholes for moving em on or was that under Jez Moxeys watch 😉
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2019 8:16:13 GMT
We are indeed cursed. When I was a kid I had a mate lived in the gypsy camp by the Fowl Lea Brook, bottom of Mare's fields between Hartshill and Cliffe Vale, we all called them the Romany Boswells. The D road's there now. After we won the league cup he told me we won that cos the gypsy curse ran out the year before. He said they'd renewed the curse for another 100 years, so SCFC is cursed til 2072. He's a sound lad and straight up and no reason lie to me. I mentioned this the other day in the "If...." thread. The curse was because the club evicted a Romany gypsy camp ftom a field in Stoke so they could have the football ground there. My dad knows or at least knew the Boswells very very well, often spoke about them when discussing his childhood
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Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 8:32:33 GMT
We are indeed cursed. When I was a kid I had a mate lived in the gypsy camp by the Fowl Lea Brook, bottom of Mare's fields between Hartshill and Cliffe Vale, we all called them the Romany Boswells. The D road's there now. After we won the league cup he told me we won that cos the gypsy curse ran out the year before. He said they'd renewed the curse for another 100 years, so SCFC is cursed til 2072. He's a sound lad and straight up and no reason lie to me. I mentioned this the other day in the "If...." thread. The curse was because the club evicted a Romany gypsy camp ftom a field in Stoke so they could have the football ground there. I've liked this post but would have disliked if there was an option..! Interesting story that with spooky goings on, certainly makes you wonder doesnt it?! Shall we blame Scholes for moving em on or was that under Jez Moxeys watch 😉 I'm convinced the Romany think they've cursed us. Whether curses are real is a matter of opinion obviously. The consensus in the science community is the paranormal isn't proved yet, though having studied quantum physics I would debate that Yeah I'm kinda convinced it's real sadly :/ Musta been under Jez's watch, I don't think Scholes was around in 1871! Weird you can't dislike my post, cos I can dislike posts in this browser. Shame cos I've never had a post disliked before
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Cursed
Sept 30, 2019 8:36:38 GMT
Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 8:36:38 GMT
We are indeed cursed. When I was a kid I had a mate lived in the gypsy camp by the Fowl Lea Brook, bottom of Mare's fields between Hartshill and Cliffe Vale, we all called them the Romany Boswells. The D road's there now. After we won the league cup he told me we won that cos the gypsy curse ran out the year before. He said they'd renewed the curse for another 100 years, so SCFC is cursed til 2072. He's a sound lad and straight up and no reason lie to me. I mentioned this the other day in the "If...." thread. The curse was because the club evicted a Romany gypsy camp ftom a field in Stoke so they could have the football ground there. My dad knows or at least knew the Boswells very very well, often spoke about them when discussing his childhood Oh wow nice one. Lovely people the ones I knew when i was a kid. Last I heard of my mate Rabbi was he was a knife thrower in a circus, but that's going back a bit.
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Post by callas12 on Sept 30, 2019 8:38:34 GMT
I've liked this post but would have disliked if there was an option..! Interesting story that with spooky goings on, certainly makes you wonder doesnt it?! Shall we blame Scholes for moving em on or was that under Jez Moxeys watch 😉 I'm convinced the Romany think they've cursed us. Whether curses are real is a matter of opinion obviously. The consensus in the science community is the paranormal isn't proved yet, though having studied quantum physics I would debate that Yeah I'm kinda convinced it's real sadly :/ Musta been under Jez's watch, I don't think Scholes was around in 1871! Weird you can't dislike my post, cos I can dislike posts in this browser. Shame cos I've never had a post disliked before Lol. Was definitely a dislike of the meaning behind your post as opposed your actual post 😜 1871, that must of been under Dudley Kernicks watch! 'Who the hell was Dudley Kernick'!!
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Cursed
Sept 30, 2019 8:41:36 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2019 8:41:36 GMT
My dad knows or at least knew the Boswells very very well, often spoke about them when discussing his childhood Oh wow nice one. Lovely people the ones I knew when i was a kid. Last I heard of my mate Rabbi he was he was a knife thrower in a circus, but that's going back a bit. My dad spoke very highly of them and growing up with them, he has some stories.
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Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 8:46:13 GMT
I'm convinced the Romany think they've cursed us. Whether curses are real is a matter of opinion obviously. The consensus in the science community is the paranormal isn't proved yet, though having studied quantum physics I would debate that Yeah I'm kinda convinced it's real sadly :/ Musta been under Jez's watch, I don't think Scholes was around in 1871! Weird you can't dislike my post, cos I can dislike posts in this browser. Shame cos I've never had a post disliked before Lol. Was definitely a dislike of the meaning behind your post as opposed your actual post 😜 1871, that must of been under Dudley Kernicks watch! 'Who the hell was Dudley Kernick'!! Lol I knew that's what you meant mate And yes who the hell was Dudley Kernick?? Edit, had to remove the rofl thing cos it was making me dizzy!
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Post by callas12 on Sept 30, 2019 8:50:41 GMT
Lol. Was definitely a dislike of the meaning behind your post as opposed your actual post 😜 1871, that must of been under Dudley Kernicks watch! 'Who the hell was Dudley Kernick'!! Lol I knew that's what you meant mate And yes who the hell was Dudley Kernick?? Edit, had to remove the rofl thing cos it was making me dizzy! Showing our age there arent we?! I remember buying that book as a kid coz it was about Stoke & had Stoke pictures in it!
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Post by bathstoke on Sept 30, 2019 8:56:20 GMT
If we are cursed, then why did we have our most profitable period in our history from 08-18...
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Post by somersetstokie on Sept 30, 2019 8:59:34 GMT
Yes, Dudley. One time Exeter City player, and Stoke's renowned Commercial Manager up until the mid 80's. Surprisingly he often seems to get a mention on here. For those not in on the joke, "Who the hell is Dudley Kernick" is the tongue in cheek title of his autobiography, and about his life in football, and I believe it is still available.
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Cursed
Sept 30, 2019 9:12:44 GMT
Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 9:12:44 GMT
Lol I knew that's what you meant mate And yes who the hell was Dudley Kernick?? Edit, had to remove the rofl thing cos it was making me dizzy! Showing our age there arent we?! I remember buying that book as a kid coz it was about Stoke & had Stoke pictures in it! Actually as it happens, I can't remember that book, sounds good, I often Google stoke pictures lol.... I am showing my age though, cos I mentioned playing by the Fowl Lea Brook before the D road was there!
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Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 9:18:19 GMT
If we are cursed, then why did we have our most profitable period in our history from 08-18... I think he said the curse was for not winning trophies. Mind you didn't we once win the old second division? You have got a point there, I hope you're right! Oh yes! And the Autoglass trophy! We won it two times!!
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Cursed
Sept 30, 2019 9:25:58 GMT
Post by future100 on Sept 30, 2019 9:25:58 GMT
If we are cursed, then why did we have our most profitable period in our history from 08-18... I think he said the curse was for not winning trophies. Mind you didn't we once win the old second division? You have got a point there, I hope you're right! Oh yes! And the Autoglass trophy! We won it two times!! Why is it that only gypsies can lay curses? fortunately our managers Christian beliefs would allow him to dismiss such tripe.
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Post by riverman on Sept 30, 2019 9:41:59 GMT
Christian beliefs,curses, it's all tripe I'm afraid.
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Post by OldStokie on Sept 30, 2019 10:30:39 GMT
Christian beliefs,curses, it's all tripe I'm afraid. Prove it. OS.
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Post by lawrieleslie on Sept 30, 2019 10:31:36 GMT
Christian beliefs,curses, it's all tripe I'm afraid. Do you have to be a Christian to have christian morals and values? I don’t think so. I had this conversation with our local church vicar after the Armed Forces Remembrance Service last year. I was there and he came up to me and asked about my medals. The conversation went on to could he rely on me to come regularly to church. I replied that I am not a Christian which confused him as to why I had attended Remembrance Service. I told him because I have christian morals and values but not beliefs. He shook my hand as if to say I understand. Sorry it’s off topic a bit a lot.
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Post by riverman on Sept 30, 2019 10:43:21 GMT
The morals and beliefs you talk about were around for millennia before christ so why label them as solely Christian. I prefer humanist.
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Cursed
Sept 30, 2019 10:46:51 GMT
Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 10:46:51 GMT
I think he said the curse was for not winning trophies. Mind you didn't we once win the old second division? You have got a point there, I hope you're right! Oh yes! And the Autoglass trophy! We won it two times!! Why is it that only gypsies can lay curses? fortunately our managers Christian beliefs would allow him to dismiss such tripe. Nobody said only gypsies can lay curses. Whether Christian beliefs, or any beliefs, can dismiss them, depends on the individual, in my opinion.
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Post by nott1 on Sept 30, 2019 10:48:37 GMT
The only curse we have is being stuck with Jones.....soon to be lifted!
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Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 11:10:47 GMT
Christian beliefs,curses, it's all tripe I'm afraid. Personally I don't follow Christianity. I see it as a relatively modern formalism of spirituality and morals. If by "It's all" you mean paranormal phenonema in general, then the jury's still out on that. I'll quote professor Dean Radin, a physicist and leading paranormal researcher: "Psi has been shown to exist in thousands of experiments. There are disagreements over how to interprets the evidence, but the fact is that virtually all scientists who have studied the evidence, including the hard nosed sceptics, now agree that something interesting is going on that merits serious scientific attention. Very few scientists and science journalists are aware of this dramatic shift in informed opinion." You're entitled to your opinion of course, but this stuff can't simply be dismissed as tripe. In my opinion.
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Post by sportsman on Sept 30, 2019 11:13:33 GMT
We could do with digging a king up near the ground like Leicester did when they went on to win the title.
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Post by somersetstokie on Sept 30, 2019 11:27:54 GMT
Anybody can lay a curse if so minded. Gypsies are just associated with curses to such a great extent as it is part of their culture and as a result it is second nature or habitual for them to use them.
As I say anyone can use or cast curses. The strength or effectiveness of a curse depends upon the nature and strength of the intent as related to the users invocation. The stronger the belief or conviction that it will work, the more potent the "message" in use. In many cultures, especially in older or primitive societies, the mere fact of a curse being laid was often sufficient for it to have an impact. Fear, credulity, imagination and supersition did the rest. The probability of a curse being effective depended as much upon the recipient or target as the initiator. If everyone "believed" that a curse was active then that is/was all that was required for it to have some effect.
If you look into football in general it is surprising how many stories of curses exist or are perpetuated regarding particular clubs, usually without any particular substance or proof. Usually such stories surface or are retold by fans whose clubs are having a particularly bad time, and usually they follow a familiar pattern, and almost always seem to historically involve Gypsies. Hence the Barry Fry story that is a particularly memorable example. It is also curious that most stories of curses in football relate to performances in the FA Cup, although that is perhaps no surprise because of the very high occurence of superstition and ritual that seems to attach to the competition.
I dont believe that Stoke are cursed, but they may certainly be on an incredible run of bad luck. The thing is that once you feel as individuals that luck is against you it is like a self fullfilling prophecy. You are in a situation where you are simply waiting for things to go wrong, although that may be an unfounded or irrational expectation, and if you are expecting something to go wrong then it probably will. All the bad breaks and unlucky incidents seem to be magnified in effect and importance.
In all situations of this nature it can be the simplest thing that can act to change your perspective or point of view. If you feel particularly that you are in a run of bad luck it just needs some often little thing to go in your favour and break the cycle. In football terms this might be a simple but significant event like the ball going into the opposition net off their defender, or the wind carrying your goalkeepers long kick into the net at the other end. Suddenly you can believe that the Gods are on your side at last and everything looks different.
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Post by adi on Sept 30, 2019 11:32:44 GMT
Christian beliefs,curses, it's all tripe I'm afraid. Prove it. OS. I think the point is to prove the existence rather than the other way round 🤔😬
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Post by riverman on Sept 30, 2019 11:40:31 GMT
Christian beliefs,curses, it's all tripe I'm afraid. Personally I don't follow Christianity. I see it as a relatively modern formalism of spirituality and morals. If by "It's all" you mean paranormal phenonema in general, then the jury's still out on that. I'll quote professor Dean Radin, a physicist and leading paranormal researcher: "Psi has been shown to exist in thousands of experiments. There are disagreements over how to interprets the evidence, but the fact is that virtually all scientists who have studied the evidence, including the hard nosed sceptics, now agree that something interesting is going on that merits serious scientific attention. Very few scientists and science journalists are aware of this dramatic shift in informed opinion." You're entitled to your opinion of course, but this stuff can't simply be dismissed as tripe. In my opinion. Fair enough Dave I totally respect your view but I just can't see how any human being can possess any sort of magical power to suspend the laws of physics and nature. To say that the Butler st roof blowing off or Kenwyn not connecting with that ball was down to the will of some mere mortal years ago just doesn't hold truck with me I'm afraid.Until science proves otherwise I think I'll agree to disagree.
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Cursed
Sept 30, 2019 12:24:16 GMT
Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 12:24:16 GMT
Anybody can lay a curse if so minded. Gypsies are just associated with curses to such a great extent as it is part of their culture and as a result it is second nature or habitual for them to use them. As I say anyone can use or cast curses. The strength or effectiveness of a curse depends upon the nature and strength of the intent as related to the users invocation. The stronger the belief or conviction that it will work, the more potent the "message" in use. In many cultures, especially in older or primitive societies, the mere fact of a curse being laid was often sufficient for it to have an impact. Fear, credulity, imagination and supersition did the rest. The probability of a curse being effective depended as much upon the recipient or target as the initiator. If everyone "believed" that a curse was active then that is/was all that was required for it to have some effect. If you look into football in general it is surprising how many stories of curses exist or are perpetuated regarding particular clubs, usually without any particular substance or proof. Usually such stories surface or are retold by fans whose clubs are having a particularly bad time, and usually they follow a familiar pattern, and almost always seem to historically involve Gypsies. Hence the Barry Fry story that is a particularly memorable example. It is also curious that most stories of curses in football relate to performances in the FA Cup, although that is perhaps no surprise because of the very high occurence of superstition and ritual that seems to attach to the competition. I dont believe that Stoke are cursed, but they may certainly be on an incredible run of bad luck. The thing is that once you feel as individuals that luck is against you it is like a self fullfilling prophecy. You are in a situation where you are simply waiting for things to go wrong, although that may be an unfounded or irrational expectation, and if you are expecting something to go wrong then it probably will. All the bad breaks and unlucky incidents seem to be magnified in effect and importance. In all situations of this nature it can be the simplest thing that can act to change your perspective or point of view. If you feel particularly that you are in a run of bad luck it just needs some often little thing to go in your favour and break the cycle. In football terms this might be a simple but significant event like the ball going into the opposition net off their defender, or the wind carrying your goalkeepers long kick into the net at the other end. Suddenly you can believe that the Gods are on your side at last and everything looks different. Nice one you took it to the next level! Of course, we don't need the curse lifted. Its all in the mind, we can just collectively decide it's not effective. I do believe the gypsies did curse us, but like you say, that doesn't mean it has to work. It all being in the mind doesn't mean it's not real, quite the opposite, it implies it IS real, and that it's up to us what that reality is. The view of things, the paradigm, that quantum physics implies, would suggest that the whole universe is in he mind, and quite a few physicists view it that way, including some eminent and famous ones.
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Cursed
Sept 30, 2019 12:34:38 GMT
Post by davethebass on Sept 30, 2019 12:34:38 GMT
Prove it. OS. I think the point is to prove the existence rather than the other way round 🤔😬 I think the point is we can't prove it either way yet, so its a matter of opinion. There's compelling evidence for psychic and spiritual phenomena. No matter how much evidence there is though, things are only considered to be 'proved' in science when there's a consensus. And most people simply are unaware of the evidence that has accrued.
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Post by somersetstokie on Sept 30, 2019 12:35:36 GMT
One "rule" of self doubt or lack of conviction is expressed in the saying that "You make your own luck". Whether that luck falls to chance or fate or you have to work at it is not always determinable. I think it was Gary Player, the Golfer, who once said that the harder he practiced, the luckier he got!
If you can make your own luck, you can make your own bad luck. Therefore perceived misfortune can sometimes be purely down to a particular mind set, especially if you believe that the world is against you. The truth is that if you set about changing the situation or challenging your bad luck, you are more likely to turn things in your favour than if you just resign yourself to your fate or give up in some way. The power of positive thinking can be a remarkable thing if you allow it to.
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