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Post by serpico on Dec 1, 2019 11:37:41 GMT
In the same way that the current Labour Party denounce all New Labour's bad bits but take credit for the good. They are all the same. Was going to say the same thing, they may have been in power for 9 years but it’s not the same cabinet, you can’t really blame something on Johnson that Cameron or May did years ago, Johnson has been in power for what, 4 months ?
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Post by ColonelMustard on Dec 1, 2019 11:37:53 GMT
In the same way that the current Labour Party denounce all New Labour's bad bits but take credit for the good. They are all the same. Except Corbyn and MacDonnel voted against pretty much all the worst ills of New Labour. And Johnson supported the bankers and then served in Mays cabinet, Javid sold derivatives and voted for all the austerity programmes. Otherwise an identical turnaround.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 1, 2019 11:48:05 GMT
In the same way that the current Labour Party denounce all New Labour's bad bits but take credit for the good. They are all the same. Was going to say the same thing, they may have been in power for 9 years but it’s not the same cabinet, you can’t really blame something on Johnson that Cameron or May did years ago, Johnson has been in power for what, 4 months ? Johnson trying to blame Labour for the release of that scumbag was the low point of this campaign though. I don't think the electorate take kindly to be so obviously taken to for being such idiots.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 1, 2019 11:50:15 GMT
In the same way that the current Labour Party denounce all New Labour's bad bits but take credit for the good. They are all the same. Except Corbyn and MacDonnel voted against pretty much all the worst ills of New Labour. And Johnson supported the bankers and then served in Mays cabinet, Javid sold derivatives and voted for all the austerity programmes. Otherwise an identical turnaround. Fair enough, but they acknowledge good points though gritted teeth, if at all.
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 1, 2019 11:52:27 GMT
I think it is 50/50 for either a small(ish) Tory majority between 10 and 15 and a Labour minority one. Those 10 - 15 seats will all be very tight with less than 1% of the vote in those constituencies between 1st and 2nd place. Describing Corbyn as a half decent campaigner is a good description. He highlights wrongs that need righting very well (as you might expect from a perennial protest politician). His solutions though fill me with dread and, I believe, will be counterproductive and deliver even worse situations than exist now. I feel somewhat sorry for the LibDems. They are the perennial protest party who allow good performances in by-elections and other elections, where voters indulge in protest voting, to persuade themselves they have a shot at the big prize. But they are utterly deluded. They always get squeezed in General Elections. The Tories are what the Tories are and what Johnson epitomises (well, since Thatcher got punted). A bumbling blob of vague nothingness just muddling along relying on sound bites and inept opposition. (Thatcher had very clear ideas about where she was going - whether they were the right ideas is another matter).
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 1, 2019 11:54:11 GMT
That is the essence of Johnson’s domestic message.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 1, 2019 11:54:38 GMT
Was going to say the same thing, they may have been in power for 9 years but it’s not the same cabinet, you can’t really blame something on Johnson that Cameron or May did years ago, Johnson has been in power for what, 4 months ? Johnson trying to blame Labour for the release of that scumbag was the low point of this campaign though. I don't think the electorate take kindly to be so obviously taken to for being such idiots. Chuka Umunna for once told the truth on the scumbag: all three main parties had been part of the problem, it started with Labour and continued through. I agree, things like these should be above the blame game.
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Post by raythesailor on Dec 1, 2019 12:00:53 GMT
I was disgusted this morning to hear some Labour MP say “ The Torres let this man out”.
Now it seems they are ALL at it. They should be ashamed of themselves on both sides of the political spectrum.
What a bloody shower and poor state we are in.
It’s like supporting a struggling football club.
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 1, 2019 12:04:21 GMT
Johnson trying to blame Labour for the release of that scumbag was the low point of this campaign though. I don't think the electorate take kindly to be so obviously taken to for being such idiots. Chuka Umunna for once told the truth on the scumbag: all three main parties had been part of the problem, it started with Labour and continued through. I agree, things like these should be above the blame game. There is a political dimension to this incident that is reasonable to have discussed in the election. And that is whether the law needs changing in regards terrorist sentencing. Johnson says it does, Corbyn indicates it doesn’t. I suspect Johnson would come out worse in this debate because the provision already exists to deny people convicted of terrorist offences automatic release. So what is needed is a review of existing regulations rather than new laws.
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Post by serpico on Dec 1, 2019 12:06:54 GMT
Was going to say the same thing, they may have been in power for 9 years but it’s not the same cabinet, you can’t really blame something on Johnson that Cameron or May did years ago, Johnson has been in power for what, 4 months ? Johnson trying to blame Labour for the release of that scumbag was the low point of this campaign though. I don't think the electorate take kindly to be so obviously taken to for being such idiots. There’s probably enough blame to go round for all of them, Johnson was probably trying to preempt any attempts by his opponents to lay the blame at his door, they’re all at it though. As I’ve said in an earlier post, we live in a country where people are banned from entering for their speech (under Mays ridiculous anti free speech laws) but actual convicted terrorists walk the sodding streets! Thats fucked up! Something needs to be done and I don’t think it’s wrong for the candidates to set out how they’d fix this.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 1, 2019 12:08:27 GMT
I think it is 50/50 for either a small(ish) Tory majority between 10 and 15 and a Labour minority one. Those 10 - 15 seats will all be very tight with less than 1% of the vote in those constituencies between 1st and 2nd place. Describing Corbyn as a half decent campaigner is a good description. He highlights wrongs that need righting very well (as you might expect from a perennial protest politician). His solutions though fill me with dread and, I believe, will be counterproductive and deliver even worse situations than exist now. I feel somewhat sorry for the LibDems. They are the perennial protest party who allow good performances in by-elections and other elections, where voters indulge in protest voting, to persuade themselves they have a shot at the big prize. But they are utterly deluded. They always get squeezed in General Elections. The Tories are what the Tories are and what Johnson epitomises (well, since Thatcher got punted). A bumbling blob of vague nothingness just muddling along relying on sound bites and inept opposition. (Thatcher had very clear ideas about where she was going - whether they were the right ideas is another matter). Agree with most of that but this is dread now, I'm not sure how much worse things can get? I'm gutted with Labour's Brexit policy because it takes the focus off what is by any measure, whether you agree with it or not, a very radical manifesto. People are sick of the some of the failings of Capitalism and are at least prepared to listen about nationalisation and such like, which is staggering when you look at the consumption obsessed nineties and noughties.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 1, 2019 12:12:16 GMT
Watching Marr, now. Wanker only attacks Farage and Johnson this way. At least Neil savages everyone!
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Post by serpico on Dec 1, 2019 12:21:07 GMT
Corbyn would have done better if he didn’t look so utterly miserable all the time, I know it shouldn’t matter but it does, every time I see him on TV he just looks and sounds miserable and irritable, Johnson at least sounds enthusiastic even if he’s spouting a load of nonsense at the time.
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Post by GrahamHyde on Dec 1, 2019 12:22:14 GMT
Watching Marr, now. Wanker only attacks Farage and Johnson this way. At least Neil savages everyone! Everyone except for chicken Johnson...
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 1, 2019 12:23:27 GMT
Watching Marr, now. Wanker only attacks Farage and Johnson this way. At least Neil savages everyone! Everyone except for chicken Johnson... Time yet.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 1, 2019 12:25:50 GMT
Corbyn would have done better if he didn’t look so utterly miserable all the time, I know it shouldn’t matter but it does, every time I see him on TV he just looks and sounds miserable and irritable, Johnson at least sounds enthusiastic even if he’s spouting a load of nonsense at the time. When I watch Johnson I feel the need to check where my wallet and wife are! I also think I'll wake up and find I've spent four grand on some new upvc windows I don't want!
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Post by serpico on Dec 1, 2019 12:26:03 GMT
Watching Marr, now. Wanker only attacks Farage and Johnson this way. At least Neil savages everyone! Everyone except for chicken Johnson... He savaged him during the Tory leadership race, I suspect this is one of the reasons he doesn’t want to go back on, Johnson is a big picture man, Neil often focuses his questions on the detail. Remember the GATT24 section C question ? 😄
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Post by GrahamHyde on Dec 1, 2019 12:27:29 GMT
Everyone except for chicken Johnson... Time yet. Yes now the postal vote deadline has passed.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 1, 2019 12:33:52 GMT
Yes now the postal vote deadline has passed. Cynic.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 1, 2019 12:35:36 GMT
Corbyn would have done better if he didn’t look so utterly miserable all the time, I know it shouldn’t matter but it does, every time I see him on TV he just looks and sounds miserable and irritable, Johnson at least sounds enthusiastic even if he’s spouting a load of nonsense at the time. When I watch Johnson I feel the need to check where my wallet and wife are! I also think I'll wake up and find I've spent four grand on some new upvc windows I don't want! You're wife's with me. I couldn't lift your wallet.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 1, 2019 12:37:36 GMT
When I watch Johnson I feel the need to check where my wallet and wife are! I also think I'll wake up and find I've spent four grand on some new upvc windows I don't want! You're wife's with me. I couldn't lift your wallet. Can you ask her what time's she's doing me dinner
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 12:41:19 GMT
Everyone except for chicken Johnson... He savaged him during the Tory leadership race, I suspect this is one of the reasons he doesn’t want to go back on, Johnson is a big picture man, Neil often focuses his questions on the detail. Remember the GATT24 section C question ? 😄 It confuses me to be honest, because for Boris, I genuinely believe he's in a position where he'll get votes whatever he does. For any candidate to have said and done the things he has and be in the lead is mad. Almost any other person in the last 30 years who'd said those things would be deselected. People will vote tory no matter what happens. They unveiled a statue of a Hitler-defender and notorious antisemite yesterday and people still say they're voting tory because of racism in the Labour Party. It's akin to a pound shop Trump.
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Post by bathstoke on Dec 1, 2019 12:49:03 GMT
He savaged him during the Tory leadership race, I suspect this is one of the reasons he doesn’t want to go back on, Johnson is a big picture man, Neil often focuses his questions on the detail. Remember the GATT24 section C question ? 😄 It confuses me to be honest, because for Boris, I genuinely believe he's in a position where he'll get votes whatever he does. For any candidate to have said and done the things he has and be in the lead is mad. Almost any other person in the last 30 years who'd said those things would be deselected. People will vote tory no matter what happens. They unveiled a statue of a Hitler-defender and notorious antisemite yesterday and people still say they're voting tory because of racism in the Labour Party. It's akin to a pound shop Trump. It’s always conveniently ignored that Lady Astor was a Nazi sympathiser, because she was the 1st female MP.
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Post by serpico on Dec 1, 2019 12:49:23 GMT
He savaged him during the Tory leadership race, I suspect this is one of the reasons he doesn’t want to go back on, Johnson is a big picture man, Neil often focuses his questions on the detail. Remember the GATT24 section C question ? 😄 It confuses me to be honest, because for Boris, I genuinely believe he's in a position where he'll get votes whatever he does. For any candidate to have said and done the things he has and be in the lead is mad. Almost any other person in the last 30 years who'd said those things would be deselected. People will vote tory no matter what happens. They unveiled a statue of a Hitler-defender and notorious antisemite yesterday and people still say they're voting tory because of racism in the Labour Party. It's akin to a pound shop Trump. That’s the appeal of trump and Johnson, they say the unsayable, thats why it’s a mistake to attack them on the UNPC things they’ve said, people like it! there will be millions of people who will have agreed with his letterbox comment and he knew the left would hysterically lose their minds over it.
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Post by dutchstokie on Dec 1, 2019 13:18:22 GMT
Context is wasted on momo Momo represents the liberal left middle class who justify a disdain for the poor with a hypocritical hatred of the Tories. His type were beautifully described in the book Poverty Safari. Nearly right Partick….think more along the lines of a champagne socialist
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Post by harryburrows on Dec 1, 2019 13:36:09 GMT
He savaged him during the Tory leadership race, I suspect this is one of the reasons he doesn’t want to go back on, Johnson is a big picture man, Neil often focuses his questions on the detail. Remember the GATT24 section C question ? 😄 It confuses me to be honest, because for Boris, I genuinely believe he's in a position where he'll get votes whatever he does. For any candidate to have said and done the things he has and be in the lead is mad. Almost any other person in the last 30 years who'd said those things would be deselected. People will vote tory no matter what happens. They unveiled a statue of a Hitler-defender and notorious antisemite yesterday and people still say they're voting tory because of racism in the Labour Party. It's akin to a pound shop Trump. Johnson would be practically unelectable in a conventional election year he just happens to be the lesser of 2 evils this time round . Almost any other labour leader would romp home . Johnson is a muppet who isn't capable of high office
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 13:39:21 GMT
It confuses me to be honest, because for Boris, I genuinely believe he's in a position where he'll get votes whatever he does. For any candidate to have said and done the things he has and be in the lead is mad. Almost any other person in the last 30 years who'd said those things would be deselected. People will vote tory no matter what happens. They unveiled a statue of a Hitler-defender and notorious antisemite yesterday and people still say they're voting tory because of racism in the Labour Party. It's akin to a pound shop Trump. It’s always conveniently ignored that Lady Astor was a Nazi sympathiser, because she was the 1st female MP. Anyone seen any comments from the Board of Deputies, the Jewish Chronicle, Hope not Hate etc about glorifying the career of an antisemite, Nazi and out and out racist? It's almost like only certain prejudices count in their world and it's not actually about tackling the issue......
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 13:51:48 GMT
It confuses me to be honest, because for Boris, I genuinely believe he's in a position where he'll get votes whatever he does. For any candidate to have said and done the things he has and be in the lead is mad. Almost any other person in the last 30 years who'd said those things would be deselected. People will vote tory no matter what happens. They unveiled a statue of a Hitler-defender and notorious antisemite yesterday and people still say they're voting tory because of racism in the Labour Party. It's akin to a pound shop Trump. Johnson would be practically unelectable in a conventional election year he just happens to be the lesser of 2 evils this time round . Almost any other labour leader would romp home . Johnson is a muppet who isn't capable of high office I don't think that's true. There's only been 1 labour leader of the past 40 years, it's the one who was backed by the media and completely coincidentally the only one who wasn't even mildly left wing.
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Post by serpico on Dec 1, 2019 14:09:57 GMT
Corbyn being leader and brexit are the two main reasons why labour can’t get elected, I’m not sure a different leader would make much difference though, it’s mostly down to Brexit, the way Labours voters are split on it makes it very difficult for them to bridge the gap between them, whichever way labour came down on brexit it was always going to upset a chunk of their voters and potential voters and Their fence sitting/2nd referendum proposal hasn’t really worked very well because they’re essentially cancelling the first vote, that’s going to upset many northern leavers who would perhaps have voted labour.
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Post by swampmongrel on Dec 1, 2019 14:23:01 GMT
It confuses me to be honest, because for Boris, I genuinely believe he's in a position where he'll get votes whatever he does. For any candidate to have said and done the things he has and be in the lead is mad. Almost any other person in the last 30 years who'd said those things would be deselected. People will vote tory no matter what happens. They unveiled a statue of a Hitler-defender and notorious antisemite yesterday and people still say they're voting tory because of racism in the Labour Party. It's akin to a pound shop Trump. That’s the appeal of trump and Johnson, they say the unsayable, thats why it’s a mistake to attack them on the UNPC things they’ve said, people like it! there will be millions of people who will have agreed with his letterbox comment and he knew the left would hysterically lose their minds over it. I think this is true. In my view, Labour have a problem with anti-Semitism because the public just think it’s weird. I’m not sure they think Corbyn (and crew) necessarily hate Jews and can probably understand that it’s actually more pro-Palestinian than anti-s which drives that sentiment. It just isn’t something that’s of interest to the voters (hence ‘weird’). Islamophobia (which I think does exist to an extent within the Tory Party) at least makes sense to the public who are concerned about terrorism and ‘Rotherham’. Doesn’t mean that the public always agree with ‘letterbox’ type rhetoric but they understand why it’s being discussed.
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