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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Oct 29, 2020 19:22:19 GMT
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Post by salopstick on Oct 29, 2020 20:04:52 GMT
Personally I don't think Corbyn is inherently and avidly anti semitic.He is Anti zionist with respect to Israel and the plight of the Palestinians. In my opinion He does sincerely want fairness and justice, being motivated by injustices But This whole affair illustrates something I've been saying for many years. Those politicians ( and their followers) have found a voice through Labour to draw attention to " issues" and " causes".....Sometimes this standing alongside the oppressed has resulted in Corbyn/ Labour becoming too closely identified with some organisations such as Hamas, the IRA etc...Naive at the least. But at worst they have lost focus on their core purpose...... to represent the working class in THIS country. Rightly or wrongly that working class does not share his enthusiasm for anti zionism....whether some people think that they should or not. So he has simply given ammunition to his opponents.....to be associated with the IRA for example, is a vote loser. It makes me think whether the modern day "left" actually want power, let alone seeming competent to exert it. Spot on. His causes abroad seem more important to him than the needs of his electorate. Rightly or wrongly that’ alienates potential voters
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2020 20:19:28 GMT
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Post by raythesailor on Oct 29, 2020 20:33:25 GMT
Criticism of Israel and its policies is NOT ANTI SEMANTIC. It is a disgust in their policies and behaviour and nothing to do with the race or religion which they choose to hide behind to disguise there arrogant stance regarding Palestine. Shamefully the US of A is equably guilty in their non condemnation of them.
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Post by ColonelMustard on Oct 29, 2020 21:01:58 GMT
I had stopped my Labour dd but not formally resigned as a member. So I went through my emails today and voted for the leftwing grassroots slate on the NEC elections. Fuck Starmer. Freedom for Palestine.
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Oct 29, 2020 21:12:36 GMT
I had stopped my Labour dd but not formally resigned as a member. So I went through my emails today and voted for the leftwing grassroots slate on the NEC elections. Fuck Starmer. Freedom for Palestine. Way to go, Champ. That'll be sure to win back the vast swathes of British working class northerners who've deserted the party in recent years.
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Post by ColonelMustard on Oct 29, 2020 21:19:02 GMT
I had stopped my Labour dd but not formally resigned as a member. So I went through my emails today and voted for the leftwing grassroots slate on the NEC elections. Fuck Starmer. Freedom for Palestine. Way to go, Champ. That'll be sure to win back the vast swathes of British working class northerners who've deserted the party in recent years. According to most people I know, I am a working class northerner. And "the red wall" vote went down in every election this century except 2017. We can disagree on an electoral strategy but I'd say one of the biggest problems has been an unwillingness to make the arguments, in a right wing media environment. Winning back Scotland, taking back the red wall and holding the cities is only possible by trying to be all things to all people. Which always goes well. Any positive vision of this country cannot be built around wavering voter whims. A left wing party needs to make the difficult arguments. Cause no fucker else will.
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Oct 29, 2020 21:24:05 GMT
positive vision of this country That would be a great place for Labour to start the rebuilding process.
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Post by crapslinger on Oct 29, 2020 21:34:21 GMT
Let's be honest, Starmer needs to distance himself from Corbyn and this is an opportunity taken in a similar way it was to get rid of Long Bailey. Don't know if it's enough to cause a split but you never know, both the main parties seem like they could split. He's taking a leaf out of Blairs book, ridding the party of the left wing racist lunatics that have infiltrated it, he needs to cut close ties with trade unions now and he will be half way to setting up an electable option.
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Post by ColonelMustard on Oct 29, 2020 21:34:44 GMT
positive vision of this country That would be a great place for Labour to start the rebuilding process. The 2017 manifesto was excellent. And popular. There were the seeds of plenty of positive there. And the massive numbers under 40 imply it's for the future.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 29, 2020 21:36:09 GMT
Let's be honest, Starmer needs to distance himself from Corbyn and this is an opportunity taken in a similar way it was to get rid of Long Bailey. Don't know if it's enough to cause a split but you never know, both the main parties seem like they could split. He's taking a leaf out of Blairs book, ridding the party of the left wing racist lunatics that have infiltrated it, he needs to cut close ties with trade unions now and he will be half way to setting up an electable option. And a step closer to joining the throng of wankers who justify poor kids going hungry.
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Post by crapslinger on Oct 29, 2020 21:37:21 GMT
I had stopped my Labour dd but not formally resigned as a member. So I went through my emails today and voted for the leftwing grassroots slate on the NEC elections. Fuck Starmer. Freedom for Palestine. Yeh dude
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Post by crapslinger on Oct 29, 2020 21:39:53 GMT
That would be a great place for Labour to start the rebuilding process. The 2017 manifesto was excellent. And popular. There were the seeds of plenty of positive there. And the massive numbers under 40 imply it's for the future. it's in the bin with the future of true socialism in the UK, it failed to overthrow Chicken May and was crushed to death by Boris the Buffon dead as a dodo.
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Post by crapslinger on Oct 29, 2020 21:46:05 GMT
He's taking a leaf out of Blairs book, ridding the party of the left wing racist lunatics that have infiltrated it, he needs to cut close ties with trade unions now and he will be half way to setting up an electable option. And a step closer to joining the throng of wankers who justify poor kids going hungry. I haven't in all honesty seen one starving child where I live is it a different story in Normacot ?
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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 29, 2020 21:55:33 GMT
And a step closer to joining the throng of wankers who justify poor kids going hungry. I haven't in all honesty seen one starving child where I live You see what you want to see. No doubt you consider them scroungers anyway, such was the glorious 'win'.
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Post by ColonelMustard on Oct 29, 2020 22:01:41 GMT
The 2017 manifesto was excellent. And popular. There were the seeds of plenty of positive there. And the massive numbers under 40 imply it's for the future. (rofl) it's in the bin with the future of true socialism in the UK, it failed to overthrow Chicken May and was crushed to death by Boris the Buffon (whistle) dead as a dodo. Tell me (or almost any commentator) at any point of the last twenty years that a Labour leader like Corbyn syanding on that platform would get 12 million votes and I'd say it wouldnt happen. Or that someone calling themselves a democratic socialist could get to the last two in the primaries. There is a massive appetite for change. It happens to be coinciding with a leveraging of nationalism to counter the inevitable coming together of the global population. Your obituary for the left is understandable on a heady day for you. NZ. Bolivia. Chile. Trump? Netenhayu is still manipulating power but Israel is losing support. There are many signs that it's not all going the way of the nationlist/ garrison state agenda. Let's see how it pans out.
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Post by ColonelMustard on Oct 29, 2020 22:13:23 GMT
Got to hand it to Gove. Hes a true cnut. Superb trolling of Starmers vacuous opportunism. I will try to find a link.
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Post by crapslinger on Oct 29, 2020 22:42:58 GMT
I haven't in all honesty seen one starving child where I live You see what you want to see. No doubt you consider them scroungers anyway, such was the glorious 'win'. I see what I see not what others tell me what I should be seeing loser.
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Post by Soro's Sorrows on Oct 29, 2020 23:01:56 GMT
it's in the bin with the future of true socialism in the UK, it failed to overthrow Chicken May and was crushed to death by Boris the Buffon dead as a dodo. Tell me (or almost any commentator) at any point of the last twenty years that a Labour leader like Corbyn syanding on that platform would get 12 million votes and I'd say it wouldnt happen. Or that someone calling themselves a democratic socialist could get to the last two in the primaries. There is a massive appetite for change. It happens to be coinciding with a leveraging of nationalism to counter the inevitable coming together of the global population. Your obituary for the left is understandable on a heady day for you. NZ. Bolivia. Chile. Trump? Netenhayu is still manipulating power but Israel is losing support. There are many signs that it's not all going the way of the nationlist/ garrison state agenda. Let's see how it pans out. That's all could have, should have, would have bollux though isn't it, he won fuck all. Last year Stoke on Trent like countless other never before voted Tory, areas went Blue, for the first time since records began. Stoke FFS, who the fuck would have thought could happen? Corbyn, and momentum have absolutely destroyed the Labour Party! Do you think the average working class man gives a flying fuck about Palestine or most of the other fights he picked, Whatever You, huddy, prestwich, mom oand the rest of the gang think the rest of the country don't agree with you and look what we are left with. Shame on you you selfish bastards! This is what you voted for!
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Post by thisisouryear on Oct 29, 2020 23:05:17 GMT
Let's be honest, Starmer needs to distance himself from Corbyn and this is an opportunity taken in a similar way it was to get rid of Long Bailey. Don't know if it's enough to cause a split but you never know, both the main parties seem like they could split. He's taking a leaf out of Blairs book, ridding the party of the left wing racist lunatics that have infiltrated it, he needs to cut close ties with trade unions now and he will be half way to setting up an electable option. There will be many not agreeing with what he is doing but he has to be able to appeal to more people than Corbyn could and making the ruthless decisions he is will appeal to many. The country needs someone to take up the middle ground because neither left or right should have it all their own way. It has to be balanced, nobody will be completely pleased but everyone has different views and a compromise is the healthiest option for the country. The majority of people have views which may be considered left or right, I don't really think of left and right in a way you would attack the left. I have views which will likely be a mixture of both I don't care for getting caught up in all that nonsense. You attack the left and I bet you have some views which would be considered left wing, to me it's just crazy that people get caught up in all that rhetoric. I see many comments where people are blaming the left and right and it's like they have all been sucked in to some sort of turf war, it's weird.
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Post by followyoudown on Oct 29, 2020 23:21:59 GMT
Nope I suggest you up about the scope of findings, report was to rule on the Labour party and people acting directly for them, not individual cases - they did state they found over 20 examples of Corbyn and his team interfering in the disputes process, including the complaint against him re the mural. So you are agreeing the the Labour Party are NOT institutionally anti-Semitic but 15 of it's most senior representatives including it's deputy leader are? It's utter bollocks. You don't understand institutional racism do you, institutional racism means someone of a different ethnicity, religion or whatever will get a different outcome / treatment from an organisation than someone who is not like them, this doesn't mean that everyone in the organisation are racists, just as not being found to be institutionally racist doesn't mean that no one is racist. So yeah utter bollocks is a good summary of your straw man arguments. You know whats strange if Raheem Sterling says an article written by a black journalist is racist you will accept that if a jewish person makes any sort of complaint against a member of the labour party its a bad faith smear, made up, exgarrated, part of a conspiracy or utter bollocks blah de blah.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Oct 29, 2020 23:31:09 GMT
🤣🤣🤣
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Post by adri2008 on Oct 29, 2020 23:32:21 GMT
I have no time for BoJo and friends but Labour have to provide a viable alternative to have any chance of being in power. The antisemitism stuff was unpleasant but not the deal breaker for alot of people. More that Corbyn's version of Labour involved too much hoping for the best with a 'shit or bust' economic strategy as Angela Rayner put it - not appealing for people who have something to lose.
Starmer is a far more sensible candidate and he'll appeal to alot of voters who held their nose and voted Tory in the last election.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Oct 29, 2020 23:32:31 GMT
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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 29, 2020 23:42:28 GMT
So you are agreeing the the Labour Party are NOT institutionally anti-Semitic but 15 of it's most senior representatives including it's deputy leader are? It's utter bollocks. You don't understand institutional racism do you, institutional racism means someone of a different ethnicity, religion or whatever will get a different outcome / treatment from an organisation than someone who is not like them, this doesn't mean that everyone in the organisation are racists, just as not being found to be institutionally racist doesn't mean that no one is racist. So yeah utter bollocks is a good summary of your straw man arguments. You know whats strange if Raheem Sterling says an article written by a black journalist is racist you will accept that if a jewish person makes any sort of complaint against a member of the labour party its a bad faith smear, made up, exgarrated, part of a conspiracy or utter bollocks blah de blah. Absolute cobblers
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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 29, 2020 23:46:33 GMT
You see what you want to see. No doubt you consider them scroungers anyway, such was the glorious 'win'. I see what I see not what others tell me what I should be seeing loser. Yes, you see what you want to see from your ingrained bigotry and the insatiable desire to punch down, rather than up, which thrives within you.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Oct 29, 2020 23:50:04 GMT
Another shameless fuckwit who takes zero responsibility for his treacherous, murderous and flawed actions. A pox on all these vile tossers.
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Post by bucknall67 on Oct 29, 2020 23:55:00 GMT
Criticism of Israel and its policies is NOT ANTI SEMANTIC. It is a disgust in their policies and behaviour and nothing to do with the race or religion which they choose to hide behind to disguise there arrogant stance regarding Palestine. Shamefully the US of A is equably guilty in their non condemnation of them. Anti semantic?? That deserves a thread of its own!!
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Post by thevoid on Oct 30, 2020 2:55:56 GMT
I hope they're safe distancing when they're standing with him.
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Post by thevoid on Oct 30, 2020 3:00:49 GMT
I had stopped my Labour dd but not formally resigned as a member. So I went through my emails today and voted for the leftwing grassroots slate on the NEC elections. Fuck Starmer. Freedom for Palestine. Who gives a shit about Palestine? We're facing a national crisis here. Let Palestine worry about Palestine.
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