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Post by salopstick on Nov 2, 2020 11:36:50 GMT
If there is ever to be electoral reform you need to educate the public who often has little interest or knowledge of politics
Farage could get the debate on proportional representation started better than the Lib Dem’s ever could
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Post by ColonelMustard on Nov 2, 2020 11:45:57 GMT
Don’t disagree with any of your points. And it’s why now should be the time that the actual socialists in the Labour Party have the courage of their conviction, walk away and form a breakaway party with a massive green agenda similar to that in Corbyn’s manifesto, and with PR high on the agenda. But most don’t appear to have a backbone so alas it won’t happen...... Would love a party to actually go all out on green initiatives while taking a no nonsense approach to hate speech and crime. What's not to like in that. But again, until we have some form of PR they'd be pissing in the wind. |
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Post by crapslinger on Nov 2, 2020 12:09:31 GMT
Prestwich, You aren’t wrong that Farage has failed to be elected 7 times, but you are wrong if you think that defines what he’s achieved How many politicians outside of the three parties get elected in England? He couldn’t impact what he has from within any of those parties. The guy has led the UK out of the EU, has grown two of the fastest growing political parties in UKIP and Brexit Party since god knows when, has basically become the right hand man to the President of the United States. Love him or loathe him, it’s very hard to deny that’s he’s one of the most effective politicians in UK history I loathe him but he has illustrated that the only way to effect real change in this cripplingly conservative country is through growing a single issue party. The left should have taken note by now. They tried it with Marxism which resulted in the worst GE result since 1935 !!!! |
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Post by lordb on Nov 2, 2020 12:17:24 GMT
I loathe him but he has illustrated that the only way to effect real change in this cripplingly conservative country is through growing a single issue party. The left should have taken note by now. They tried it with Marxism which resulted in the worst GE result since 1935 !!!! Marxism has never been tried in this country |
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Post by ColonelMustard on Nov 2, 2020 12:36:16 GMT
They tried it with Marxism which resulted in the worst GE result since 1935 !!!! Marxism has never been tried in this country Makes me laugh how many people were actually convinced nationalising the trains and funding the NHS was hard left. |
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Post by spitthedog on Nov 2, 2020 12:42:00 GMT
Marxism has never been tried in this country Makes me laugh how many people were actually convinced nationalising the trains and funding the NHS was hard left. Absolutely Incredible. Shows the level of brainwashing going on. Funding the NHS = Marxism in this country. |
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Post by The battheader chronicles on Nov 2, 2020 13:03:02 GMT
See I struggle with this one, I really try not to hate people with a difference of opinion to me politically.
Farage has said in the past he favours an insurance based system of healthcare, under such a situation it’s very unlikely someone in my position would have survived. I was born 3 months early and with cerebral palsy, again under such a system we didn’t at that time have the money to keep me alive that worries me for people in that situation today
This man is a danger to vulnerable people
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 13:23:40 GMT
The old parties are a bit stale and, I believe, that most people don't and can't relate to them. Not sure that the Lockdown is the main political issue....but I do believe that reform is. Of course the conformists will prefer the status quo...... that's really working isn't it.....for the political class. The Left used to be radical, and the contemporary left think that they are....but they are not really....same old , same old......they are afraid of thinking the unthinkable, thinking outside the box, in fact they'd prefer to constantly look backwards, thinking " We were right weren't we , we told you"....totally out of touch and irrelevant to the working class. Nigel Farage prepares to launch anti-lockdown party called Reform UK f7td5.app.goo.gl/TyCxzSI'd love to know how your mind works at times. This fear you hold for anyone who doesnt agree with your way of thinking being boxed into this category of 'The Left' is fascinating. Lockdown not being the main politcal issue of the time, people not relating to the 2 largest parties leaders despite voting intentions showing they dominate around 75%, conformists of people following government guidelines and the slavish devotion to a man who has less politcal policies than Joe Biden. The ultimate one-trick pony who last year you believed to be the best person to be Prime Minister. Completely agree. Everything always reverts back to being the fault of "The Left" in some way...  (Or making it personal, that's the other one!) |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 13:31:32 GMT
If there is ever to be electoral reform you need to educate the public who often has little interest or knowledge of politics Farage could get the debate on proportional representation started better than the Lib Dem’s ever could You'd need to think of some fairly basic dog whistle type reasons as to why it's in your average uninterested punter's best interests to vote for change, then it might work. But only if you managed to get some big hitters from the other main parties to come onside and that's very unlikely. Having a vote which is actually likely to count towards the make-up of your parliamentary representatives is less important, I'd guess, and certainly less easy to manipulate opinion about, than kicking foreigners out and telling Brussels to fuck off. |
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Nov 2, 2020 13:35:27 GMT
See I struggle with this one, I really try not to hate people with a difference of opinion to me politically. Farage has said in the past he favours an insurance based system of healthcare, under such a situation it’s very unlikely someone in my position would have survived. I was born 3 months early and with cerebral palsy, again under such a system we didn’t at that time have the money to keep me alive that worries me for people in that situation today This man is a danger to vulnerable people As an elected MP he would be an absolute fucking disaster, like you say. I think he's found his niche as a very powerful protester, and he's sticking to it. I can see why as well since he's very good at it. |
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Nov 2, 2020 13:42:11 GMT
The problem I will have at the next election as that I am generally a fan of proportional representation as a voting system, but I know that the people decisively voted against in a 2011 referendum that was billed as a once-in-a-lifetime referendum. To avoid being an undemocratic traitor who ignores the voice of the people, I couldn't possibly vote for a party that only listens to democracy when it suits.
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Post by thevoid on Nov 2, 2020 13:49:26 GMT
I'd love to know how your mind works at times. This fear you hold for anyone who doesnt agree with your way of thinking being boxed into this category of 'The Left' is fascinating. Lockdown not being the main politcal issue of the time, people not relating to the 2 largest parties leaders despite voting intentions showing they dominate around 75%, conformists of people following government guidelines and the slavish devotion to a man who has less politcal policies than Joe Biden. The ultimate one-trick pony who last year you believed to be the best person to be Prime Minister. Completely agree. Everything always reverts back to being the fault of "The Left" in some way... (Or making it personal, that's the other one!) I'll have to pull you up on the 'making it personal' thing as you're one of the worst for it, as has been pointed out numerous times. In fact, one of your main tropes is name dropping posters who are not even involved in the immediate discussion! Anyway, as you were. I wouldn't want you to think I'm stalking you😊 |
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Post by noustie on Nov 2, 2020 13:55:07 GMT
He must have been at a loss as to what to do this November with 'Spoons shut and not being allowed go dinghy spotting in Dover.
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Post by wagsastokie on Nov 2, 2020 14:01:12 GMT
The problem I will have at the next election as that I am generally a fan of proportional representation as a voting system, but I know that the people decisively voted against in a 2011 referendum that was billed as a once-in-a-lifetime referendum. To avoid being an undemocratic traitor who ignores the voice of the people, I couldn't possibly vote for a party that only listens to democracy when it suits. Correct proportional representation is like remain dead in the water |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Nov 2, 2020 14:05:33 GMT
See I struggle with this one, I really try not to hate people with a difference of opinion to me politically. Farage has said in the past he favours an insurance based system of healthcare, under such a situation it’s very unlikely someone in my position would have survived. I was born 3 months early and with cerebral palsy, again under such a system we didn’t at that time have the money to keep me alive that worries me for people in that situation today This man is a danger to vulnerable people My son also has cerebral palsy , 3 months premature and spina bifida.....I think Farage is absolutely right that we should talk about funding of the NHS, rather than just say " the NHS is sacred, don't even go there"....which does seem the position of the Left. Healthcare is already rationed according to post code and NICE guidelines. With increasing demands, population growth, elderly people and their health issues and the possibilities of incredible treatments we HAVE to talk about funding in my opinion. I don't agree with Farage that we should have a total insurance based system , but I'm not sure that is the total detail of what he meant.....it's hard to convey a total coherent policy in 30 second soundbites, but it's just a dangerous and disingenuous to not to discuss funding. Farage is always going to be an easy target as he draws attention to issues that career politicians/ main political parties would prefer to avoid. |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 14:06:43 GMT
Completely agree. Everything always reverts back to being the fault of "The Left" in some way... (Or making it personal, that's the other one!) I'll have to pull you up on the 'making it personal' thing as you're one of the worst for it, as has been pointed out numerous times. In fact, one of your main tropes is name dropping posters who are not even involved in the immediate discussion! Anyway, as you were. I wouldn't want you to think I'm stalking you😊 Is it walkies time again so soon At least that wasn't full of unnecessary abuse and name-calling, so you're making some progress, at least  |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 14:09:11 GMT
The problem I will have at the next election as that I am generally a fan of proportional representation as a voting system, but I know that the people decisively voted against in a 2011 referendum that was billed as a once-in-a-lifetime referendum. To avoid being an undemocratic traitor who ignores the voice of the people, I couldn't possibly vote for a party that only listens to democracy when it suits.  Bravo! He really should just let it go... |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Nov 2, 2020 14:17:32 GMT
See I struggle with this one, I really try not to hate people with a difference of opinion to me politically. Farage has said in the past he favours an insurance based system of healthcare, under such a situation it’s very unlikely someone in my position would have survived. I was born 3 months early and with cerebral palsy, again under such a system we didn’t at that time have the money to keep me alive that worries me for people in that situation today This man is a danger to vulnerable people Appearing in an interview with Andrew Neil, the Brexit Party leader reiterated that Britain should move towards a "private insurance-based system", but he said that only applied to the country's highest earners. "My view is that wealthier people should be encouraged to take up private insurance to lift the burden off a system that is struggling to cope," said Mr Farage. "I want wealthier people to be able to opt-out. I wasn't for one moment proposing those on lower incomes should take up private health insurance, of course I wasn't." Nigel Farage reiterates calls for an ‘insurance-based system’ for the NHS | The New European www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news/nigel-farage-nhs-comments-64946 |
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Nov 2, 2020 15:06:09 GMT
See I struggle with this one, I really try not to hate people with a difference of opinion to me politically. Farage has said in the past he favours an insurance based system of healthcare, under such a situation it’s very unlikely someone in my position would have survived. I was born 3 months early and with cerebral palsy, again under such a system we didn’t at that time have the money to keep me alive that worries me for people in that situation today This man is a danger to vulnerable people Appearing in an interview with Andrew Neil, the Brexit Party leader reiterated that Britain should move towards a "private insurance-based system", but he said that only applied to the country's highest earners. "My view is that wealthier people should be encouraged to take up private insurance to lift the burden off a system that is struggling to cope," said Mr Farage. "I want wealthier people to be able to opt-out. I wasn't for one moment proposing those on lower incomes should take up private health insurance, of course I wasn't." Nigel Farage reiterates calls for an ‘insurance-based system’ for the NHS | The New European www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news/nigel-farage-nhs-comments-64946So he was either misrepresented, has changed his mind, or is saying one thing when he knows the cameras are on and another thing when he thinks they're not. I guess the voters will decide. |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 15:13:45 GMT
See I struggle with this one, I really try not to hate people with a difference of opinion to me politically. Farage has said in the past he favours an insurance based system of healthcare, under such a situation it’s very unlikely someone in my position would have survived. I was born 3 months early and with cerebral palsy, again under such a system we didn’t at that time have the money to keep me alive that worries me for people in that situation today This man is a danger to vulnerable people Appearing in an interview with Andrew Neil, the Brexit Party leader reiterated that Britain should move towards a "private insurance-based system", but he said that only applied to the country's highest earners. "My view is that wealthier people should be encouraged to take up private insurance to lift the burden off a system that is struggling to cope," said Mr Farage. "I want wealthier people to be able to opt-out. I wasn't for one moment proposing those on lower incomes should take up private health insurance, of course I wasn't." Nigel Farage reiterates calls for an ‘insurance-based system’ for the NHS | The New European www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news/nigel-farage-nhs-comments-64946By opt-out does he mean no longer make NI contributions too? I mean, I suspect most wealthier people already effectively do opt-out and go private whenever they can, but they still have to pay NI. So, I assume for it to be at all different he is suggesting no longer paying into the NHS too? |
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Post by thevoid on Nov 2, 2020 15:13:56 GMT
I'll have to pull you up on the 'making it personal' thing as you're one of the worst for it, as has been pointed out numerous times. In fact, one of your main tropes is name dropping posters who are not even involved in the immediate discussion! Anyway, as you were. I wouldn't want you to think I'm stalking you😊 Is it walkies time again so soon At least that wasn't full of unnecessary abuse and name-calling, so you're making some progress, at least I think you'll find that I've replied to probably less than one percent of your overall contributions on here- I don't even glance at the majority of them due to blocking you. So let's put this 'following you around the board' myth to bed, hey? 😆 (You're probably sad enough to work out the percentage of replies to posts- I wouldn't put it past you!) |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Nov 2, 2020 15:26:48 GMT
Appearing in an interview with Andrew Neil, the Brexit Party leader reiterated that Britain should move towards a "private insurance-based system", but he said that only applied to the country's highest earners. "My view is that wealthier people should be encouraged to take up private insurance to lift the burden off a system that is struggling to cope," said Mr Farage. "I want wealthier people to be able to opt-out. I wasn't for one moment proposing those on lower incomes should take up private health insurance, of course I wasn't." Nigel Farage reiterates calls for an ‘insurance-based system’ for the NHS | The New European www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news/nigel-farage-nhs-comments-64946By opt-out does he mean no longer make NI contributions too? I mean, I suspect most wealthier people already effectively do opt-out and go private whenever they can, but they still have to pay NI. So, I assume for it to be at all different he is suggesting no longer paying into the NHS too? I've no idea |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Nov 2, 2020 15:27:15 GMT
Appearing in an interview with Andrew Neil, the Brexit Party leader reiterated that Britain should move towards a "private insurance-based system", but he said that only applied to the country's highest earners. "My view is that wealthier people should be encouraged to take up private insurance to lift the burden off a system that is struggling to cope," said Mr Farage. "I want wealthier people to be able to opt-out. I wasn't for one moment proposing those on lower incomes should take up private health insurance, of course I wasn't." Nigel Farage reiterates calls for an ‘insurance-based system’ for the NHS | The New European www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news/nigel-farage-nhs-comments-64946So he was either misrepresented, has changed his mind, or is saying one thing when he knows the cameras are on and another thing when he thinks they're not. I guess the voters will decide. I've no idea |
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Post by salopstick on Nov 2, 2020 15:33:29 GMT
The problem I will have at the next election as that I am generally a fan of proportional representation as a voting system, but I know that the people decisively voted against in a 2011 referendum that was billed as a once-in-a-lifetime referendum. To avoid being an undemocratic traitor who ignores the voice of the people, I couldn't possibly vote for a party that only listens to democracy when it suits. Behave  Whilst that is quite funny it’s totally different to Brexit. Half the country didn’t realise that referendum was taking place. Brexit had to happen and is a separate argument . I’ve got no problem with a referendum to rejoin takes place in a few years once out. Electoral reform covers a whole spectrum of reforms and is not limited to proportional representation. I’d rather them reform MP criteria and selection process as a start |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 15:38:42 GMT
Is it walkies time again so soon At least that wasn't full of unnecessary abuse and name-calling, so you're making some progress, at least I think you'll find that I've replied to probably less than one percent of your overall contributions on here- I don't even glance at the majority of them due to blocking you. So let's put this 'following you around the board' myth to bed, hey? 😆 (You're probably sad enough to work out the percentage of replies to posts- I wouldn't put it past you!) Apart from having stated quite openly that you do follow me around the board, "to expose my hypocrisy" like it's some kind of weird personal crusade to take yourself and this place waaaaay too seriously, then yes, you're right, firmly put to bed Out of interest, what do you actually do? Block my posts, then struggle with the temptation to have just a quick peep to see if it's something to get angry about, and if so, unblock them so you can reply? If anything's a bit sad, it's that, old fruit. I think you're probably better off mentally leaving them blocked if they bother you that much. It's just a football messageboard, Voidy, try not to take it so seriously that it winds you up to the point you need to resort to name calling and abuse. I see you were getting a bit tetchy again with NicholasJAllcock the other day too. Chill out, there's no need! |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 15:40:57 GMT
By opt-out does he mean no longer make NI contributions too? I mean, I suspect most wealthier people already effectively do opt-out and go private whenever they can, but they still have to pay NI. So, I assume for it to be at all different he is suggesting no longer paying into the NHS too? I've no idea Why post it for discussion then? |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Nov 2, 2020 15:44:50 GMT
Why post it for discussion then? I can't answer your specific question without further investigation. Bit busy at the moment....why not find out for yourself |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 15:49:56 GMT
Why post it for discussion then? I can't answer your specific question without further investigation. Bit busy at the moment....why not find out for yourself What, you can't find out why you posted it for discussion? |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Nov 2, 2020 15:53:08 GMT
I can't answer your specific question without further investigation. Bit busy at the moment....why not find out for yourself What, you can't find out why you posted it for discussion? No the answer to your specific question, asking for more detail. Anyway, as I say I have not got a lot of time to amuse you today. |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Nov 2, 2020 15:55:22 GMT
What, you can't find out why you posted it for discussion? No the answer to your specific question, asking for more detail. Anyway, as I say I have not got a lot of time to amuse you today. I see, my apologies, I thought you were just being obtuse. |
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Bravo!
