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Post by Gary Hackett on Feb 24, 2019 9:25:24 GMT
Steve Davis at Crewe did a very similar job and nearly took the Wolves job off the back of that. 6 months later he couldn't win a game for toffee and now he's unemployed. Very similar job? P 272 W 84 D 71 L 117 As I said his first 2 years at Crewe were very similar to Jones at Luton, you're taking his last 2 and a half years into account there where he then got them relegated after he was offered the wolves job and leaving them back in the bottom half of league 2 before getting fired. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 9:26:29 GMT
Very similar job? P 272 W 84 D 71 L 117 As I said his first 2 years at Crewe were very similar to Jones at Luton, you're taking his last 2 and a half years into account there where he then got them relegated after he was offered the wolves job and leaving them back in the bottom half of league 2 before getting fired. Sound like excuses to me. |
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Post by Gary Hackett on Feb 24, 2019 9:32:20 GMT
As I said his first 2 years at Crewe were very similar to Jones at Luton, you're taking his last 2 and a half years into account there where he then got them relegated after he was offered the wolves job and leaving them back in the bottom half of league 2 before getting fired. Sound like excuses to me. It's fact. He inherited a Crewe team bottom half of league 2, got them promoted within 6 months. Won the JPT the year after and kept them mid table in league one. Wolves came sniffing then it all went wrong. Relegated from league 1 and had something like 3 wins in 6 months in league 2 and got fired. Them are the facts. Jones is the one making the excuses. |
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 24, 2019 9:32:30 GMT
Steve Davis at Crewe did a very similar job and nearly took the Wolves job off the back of that. 6 months later he couldn't win a game for toffee and now he's unemployed. Only a fool with an agenda would judge Jones at this point. He's inherited a complete shower of shite, with team morale at an all time low. If anyone thinks that a complete turnaround is possible in a few months, then they're deluded. No one expected an immediate complete turnaround, did anyone expect us get even worse with little or no evidence we will improve ? |
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Post by Goonie on Feb 24, 2019 9:32:36 GMT
The Stoke job = massive rebuild
Time required: 2 full seasons minimum
Manager required: young, hungry, enthusiastic, progressive
Supporters required: patient and realistic
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 24, 2019 9:33:34 GMT
Very similar job? P 272 W 84 D 71 L 117 As I said his first 2 years at Crewe were very similar to Jones at Luton, you're taking his last 2 and a half years into account there where he then got them relegated after he was offered the wolves job and leaving them back in the bottom half of league 2 before getting fired. Alex Neil had been manager of the mighty Hamilton Academicals before he went to Norwich and got them promoted. Anyone can play this game, you can't apply a blanket generalisation because some managers have failed in similar situations and some have succeeded. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 9:35:43 GMT
Very similar job? P 272 W 84 D 71 L 117 As I said his first 2 years at Crewe were very similar to Jones at Luton, you're taking his last 2 and a half years into account there where he then got them relegated after he was offered the wolves job and leaving them back in the bottom half of league 2 before getting fired. You’re talking out of your arse. |
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Post by steewee on Feb 24, 2019 9:35:50 GMT
I think a large amount of getting results in the lower leagues is down to luck. If you happen on a group of players with a couple of good ones in the mix, then you're on to a winner. Keeping that going once you lose a few players is the difficult bit. Unless you're in the top leagues with masses of cash able to assemble squads of ridiculous talent, then you're always going to need luck on your side of you're going to progress. Exceptions being negative football which generally heralds richer rewards but lots of fan dissatisfaction!
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Post by nottsover60 on Feb 24, 2019 9:44:23 GMT
Didn't Farke at Norwich say earlier this season that it took him all of last season (and I've just checked he was appointed in May 2017 so had a full pre season) to turn them round and get them playing the way he wants. Now they are reaping the rewards of patience. Grow up and realise doing things properly takes time.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 9:51:23 GMT
He's been a manager for 5 minutes and has achieved the square root of fuck all so far. what are you talking about? Taking Luton up and having them at the top of League One isn’t ‘the square root of fuck all’. That’s more than great hope du jour Frank Lampard has achieved. You can rightly highlight a lack of experience to date but he has enjoyed success in that time. It took him a few windows to get the Luton squad how he wanted it and it’ll take him the same here. Which brings me back to my point last night. Why weren't people prepared to give Rowett at least two windows to put things right? And I'm referring to what was being said right at the very start of the season, before we knew that his signings weren't going to cut it for us. It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and it definitely went on and not just on here but down the ground also. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 24, 2019 9:54:01 GMT
Taking Luton up and having them at the top of League One isn’t ‘the square root of fuck all’. That’s more than great hope du jour Frank Lampard has achieved. You can rightly highlight a lack of experience to date but he has enjoyed success in that time. It took him a few windows to get the Luton squad how he wanted it and it’ll take him the same here. Which brings me back to my point last night. Why weren't people prepared to give Rowett at least two windows to put things right? And I'm referring to what was being said right at the very start of the season, before we knew that his signings weren't going to cut it for us. It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and it definitely went on and not just on here but down the ground also. Who was saying it right at the very start of the season? There was hardly a groundswell. People weren't prepared to give him another window because he'd so egregiously fucked up the first one. The players we were starting to be linked with were to replace the players he himself had signed at considerable expense. |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 24, 2019 9:59:02 GMT
Which brings me back to my point last night. Why weren't people prepared to give Rowett at least two windows to put things right? And I'm referring to what was being said right at the very start of the season, before we knew that his signings weren't going to cut it for us. It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and it definitely went on and not just on here but down the ground also. Who was saying it right at the very start of the season? There was hardly a groundswell. People weren't prepared to give him another window because he'd so egregiously fucked up the first one. The players we were starting to be linked with were to replace the players he himself had signed at considerable expense. Nath's first window has been an unfathomable bag of wank to be fair! |
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Post by chigstoke on Feb 24, 2019 10:01:56 GMT
It's incredible how many want him to fuck off already.
Whether you like it or not, he is the Stoke City manager, and will no doubt be here for the long haul. Would it be nice for performances to have improved? Fucking too right.
The hope is that we start off next season very strongly. Get rid of the shit we don't need, bring in young and hungry players (not the Wimmer style hungry). But if it doesn't go well next season, I can see the Peter Coates stonk on for Mr Moyes being harder than ever before.
Let's just wait and see. But call him a fucking charlatan, get a grip. What the fuck were people expecting? For Stoke City to start playing like bastarding Brazil in the 70's?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 10:02:56 GMT
Which brings me back to my point last night. Why weren't people prepared to give Rowett at least two windows to put things right? And I'm referring to what was being said right at the very start of the season, before we knew that his signings weren't going to cut it for us. It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and it definitely went on and not just on here but down the ground also. Who was saying it right at the very start of the season? There was hardly a groundswell. People weren't prepared to give him another window because he'd so egregiously fucked up the first one. The players we were starting to be linked with were to replace the players he himself had signed at considerable expense. It happened mate, it definitely happened. If I new the name of every single person who was slating Rowett from an earlier stage than this I still wouldn't have the time to put them on here. |
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Post by rawli on Feb 24, 2019 10:26:05 GMT
Taking Luton up and having them at the top of League One isn’t ‘the square root of fuck all’. That’s more than great hope du jour Frank Lampard has achieved. You can rightly highlight a lack of experience to date but he has enjoyed success in that time. It took him a few windows to get the Luton squad how he wanted it and it’ll take him the same here. Which brings me back to my point last night. Why weren't people prepared to give Rowett at least two windows to put things right? And I'm referring to what was being said right at the very start of the season, before we knew that his signings weren't going to cut it for us. It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and it definitely went on and not just on here but down the ground also. Rowett didn't want to be here. I think he realised quickly that the club was toxic both below him (players) and above him (the Chief executive). I think in the end he talked himself out of the job deliberately. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 24, 2019 10:28:58 GMT
Who was saying it right at the very start of the season? There was hardly a groundswell. People weren't prepared to give him another window because he'd so egregiously fucked up the first one. The players we were starting to be linked with were to replace the players he himself had signed at considerable expense. Nath's first window has been an unfathomable bag of wank to be fair! For a January window I think it was reasonable. We've signed two players who improve us and add things we didn't have before. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 24, 2019 10:30:13 GMT
Who was saying it right at the very start of the season? There was hardly a groundswell. People weren't prepared to give him another window because he'd so egregiously fucked up the first one. The players we were starting to be linked with were to replace the players he himself had signed at considerable expense. It happened mate, it definitely happened. If I new the name of every single person who was slating Rowett from an earlier stage than this I still wouldn't have the time to put them on here. There was the odd malcontent who was concerned about his style and that he hadn't been promoted before but it was the minority you'll always get with any appointment. The last universally popular appointment we made was, erm, Brian Little. |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 24, 2019 10:41:19 GMT
Nath's first window has been an unfathomable bag of wank to be fair! For a January window I think it was reasonable. We've signed two players who improve us and add things we didn't have before. We stripped the team of the tiny bit of pace it had and left ourselves without a passable left sided defender at the club. It was a shocking window. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 24, 2019 10:54:23 GMT
For a January window I think it was reasonable. We've signed two players who improve us and add things we didn't have before. We stripped the team of the tiny bit of pace it had and left ourselves without a passable left sided defender at the club. It was a shocking window. Does Pieters represent the tiny bit of pace? Jesus. It was a questionable decision to let him go now, absolutely, but I don't see it as a massive difference maker. We've signed the focal point Jones wanted who should prove a very good player at this level. We've signed a leader at the back, something we've been entirely bereft of for a while. Given it was generally the quietest January window everywhere for a fair old while, which is saying something, it was ok. |
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Post by Trouserdog on Feb 24, 2019 11:18:58 GMT
We really need this season to be over as soon as possible.
Having seen the crap he's got to work with, overseen their comically bad attempt at playing a diamond at Brentford, then having taken a nervous glance towards the bottom the league table, I think Nath's pulled on his Gary Rowett mask and decided to scrape his way to safety.
As awful as it is to watch, I can't say I blame him.
We've lined up in the 4-3-3 Rowettball formation for large parts of games, which as we know, results in us barely testing the opposition keeper but at least having a chance of keeping a clean sheet. As soon as we're safe from relegation, we might see NJ try the diamond again, which will be the point Bojan finally gets his chance, assuming he hasn't pissed Jones off with his understandable outburst in the press.
I've not been impressed by NJ's substitutions or in-game management at all, but as angry as I can get during and after these awful games, I can't argue for anything other than sticking with Nj and allowing him the time that'll be neede dto sort this rabble out.
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Post by crapslinger on Feb 24, 2019 11:20:55 GMT
We stripped the team of the tiny bit of pace it had and left ourselves without a passable left sided defender at the club. It was a shocking window. Does Pieters represent the tiny bit of pace? Jesus. It was a questionable decision to let him go now, absolutely, but I don't see it as a massive difference maker. We've signed the focal point Jones wanted who should prove a very good player at this level. We've signed a leader at the back, something we've been entirely bereft of for a while. Given it was generally the quietest January window everywhere for a fair old while, which is saying something, it was ok. Didn't we show an interest in these two players last year ?, were they Jones signings ? or is someone else responsible for our overall recruitment ! |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 24, 2019 11:22:16 GMT
We stripped the team of the tiny bit of pace it had and left ourselves without a passable left sided defender at the club. It was a shocking window. Does Pieters represent the tiny bit of pace? Jesus. It was a questionable decision to let him go now, absolutely, but I don't see it as a massive difference maker. We've signed the focal point Jones wanted who should prove a very good player at this level. We've signed a leader at the back, something we've been entirely bereft of for a while. Given it was generally the quietest January window everywhere for a fair old while, which is saying something, it was ok. Campbell is the pace and seemingly one of the few players on earth who could play a Jones system. It was an embittered window facilitated by the usual morons. "Fast attacking football". You could fucking weep, you really could. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 11:22:54 GMT
We really need this season to be over as soon as possible. Having seen the crap he's got to work with, overseen their comically bad attempt at playing a diamond at Brentford, then having taken a nervous glance towards the bottom the league table, I think Nath's pulled on his Gary Rowett mask and decided to scrape his way to safety. As awful as it is to watch, I can't say I blame him. We've lined up in the 4-3-3 Rowettball formation for large parts of games, which as we know, results in us barely testing the opposition keeper but at least having a chance of keeping a clean sheet. As soon as we're safe from relegation, we might see NJ try the diamond again, which will be the point Bojan finally gets his chance, assuming he hasn't pissed Jones off with his understandable outburst in the press. I've not been impressed by NJ's substitutions or in-game management at all, but as angry as I can get during and after these awful games, I can't argue for anything other than sticking with Nj and allowing him the time that'll be neede dto sort this rabble out. I have been hoping the same - once we know we can’t get dragged into a relegation battle we will see how he really wants to play. Perhaps the last few games of the season will be better. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2019 11:24:05 GMT
Does Pieters represent the tiny bit of pace? Jesus. It was a questionable decision to let him go now, absolutely, but I don't see it as a massive difference maker. We've signed the focal point Jones wanted who should prove a very good player at this level. We've signed a leader at the back, something we've been entirely bereft of for a while. Given it was generally the quietest January window everywhere for a fair old while, which is saying something, it was ok. Campbell is the pace and seemingly one of the few players on earth who could play a Jones system. It was an embittered window facilitated by the usual morons. "Fast attacking football". You could fucking weep, you really could. Or, as his contract is up in the summer, he’s already Sao he doesn’t want to stay. That’s what I’ve been wondering as it does seem very odd. |
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Post by Edward Tattsyrup on Feb 24, 2019 11:25:05 GMT
Wait until the cull next season. We will be promoted under Jones. The summer cull is the only thing I have left to look forward to. I hope its like the Dynasty massacre. |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 24, 2019 11:26:13 GMT
Does Pieters represent the tiny bit of pace? Jesus. It was a questionable decision to let him go now, absolutely, but I don't see it as a massive difference maker. We've signed the focal point Jones wanted who should prove a very good player at this level. We've signed a leader at the back, something we've been entirely bereft of for a while. Given it was generally the quietest January window everywhere for a fair old while, which is saying something, it was ok. Campbell is the pace and seemingly one of the few players on earth who could play a Jones system. It was an embittered window facilitated by the usual morons. "Fast attacking football". You could fucking weep, you really could. The Campbell one is a tough call. One the one hand, he does have pace, he had shown promise, he is probably the best option for a run alongside Vokes. On the other, is he ready yet? Could a run now with these wasters actually do his development more harm than good? If he gets the smell in his nostrils at Shrewsbury and he comes bac a better, more confident player raring to go then, might that work out better for us and for him long term? |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Feb 24, 2019 11:27:13 GMT
Does Pieters represent the tiny bit of pace? Jesus. It was a questionable decision to let him go now, absolutely, but I don't see it as a massive difference maker. We've signed the focal point Jones wanted who should prove a very good player at this level. We've signed a leader at the back, something we've been entirely bereft of for a while. Given it was generally the quietest January window everywhere for a fair old while, which is saying something, it was ok. Didn't we show an interest in these two players last year ?, were they Jones signings ? or is someone else responsible for our overall recruitment ! Jones would have signed off on them even if he didn't identify them himself. |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Feb 24, 2019 11:27:49 GMT
Campbell is the pace and seemingly one of the few players on earth who could play a Jones system. It was an embittered window facilitated by the usual morons. "Fast attacking football". You could fucking weep, you really could. The Campbell one is a tough call. One the one hand, he does have pace, he had shown promise, he is probably the best option for a run alongside Vokes. On the other, is he ready yet? Could a run now with these wasters actually do his development more harm than good? If he gets the smell in his nostrils at Shrewsbury and he comes bac a better, more confident player raring to go then, might that work out better for us and for him long term? He's better than what we're currently seeing rob. This is a window that has somehow left us with a left winger up front and a central midfielder at left back. Utterly bizarre. |
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Post by potterpaul on Feb 24, 2019 11:34:34 GMT
Campbell is the pace and seemingly one of the few players on earth who could play a Jones system. It was an embittered window facilitated by the usual morons. "Fast attacking football". You could fucking weep, you really could. The Campbell one is a tough call. One the one hand, he does have pace, he had shown promise, he is probably the best option for a run alongside Vokes. On the other, is he ready yet? Could a run now with these wasters actually do his development more harm than good? If he gets the smell in his nostrils at Shrewsbury and he comes bac a better, more confident player raring to go then, might that work out better for us and for him long term? I could understand a loan to Luton where he may get first hand insight to the workings of the diamond. Do Shrewsbury set up that way? If not it all sounds pretty pointless as the majority of next season he'll be sitting out a good portion of season until he's caught up. |
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Post by Edward Tattsyrup on Feb 24, 2019 11:38:57 GMT
We can't keep sacking managers, absolutely agree. Despite our obvious weaknesses, today though was a managerial disasterclass. Fucking horrific. Whilst I don't completely disagree with the pojnts you made. The Vokes injury was a forced change and what other option did he have available. Charlie ran out of steam and there again were limited option from the bench becuase this squad is completely shambolic. I think Natahan is gradually working out who has a future and who doesn't, he has cut some of those adrift already and that has a negative impact on the match day squad.Let's see what the summer bring and make a judgement from there. The majority of this squad have massively failed the last 4 managers and are a disgrace to the club, but nothing wrong with the process? I'd love to see this squad massacred in the summer, I'm not even sure there is one I'd keep. Let's see where we are Nov and decide from there, we can't keep panaking every three months. |
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