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Post by essexstokey on Jan 14, 2024 14:59:34 GMT
Dodgy dave this morning refused to say how much he got paid for lobbying government
Rumour is 4 mill
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Post by gawa on Jan 14, 2024 15:25:22 GMT
Wish a country could invade us and take military action to get these charlatans out of government. Would be doing us all a massive favour. Countries a shit show.
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Post by wannabee on Jan 14, 2024 16:05:51 GMT
We just continue to embarass ourselves on the World stage ... Rishi is not the only Conservative PM in recent years that posed a serious Security Risk through lack of judgement Whatever you think of the merits any Administration that halts HS2 to fix Potholes is not to be taken seriously
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Jan 14, 2024 20:00:38 GMT
We just continue to embarass ourselves on the World stage ... Rishi is not the only Conservative PM in recent years that posed a serious Security Risk through lack of judgement Whatever you think of the merits any Administration that halts HS2 to fix Potholes is not to be taken seriously and claims that fixing potholes is the action of a government taking decisions for the long term.......
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 15, 2024 8:34:34 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jan 15, 2024 8:36:39 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jan 15, 2024 8:36:57 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jan 15, 2024 8:39:58 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jan 15, 2024 9:04:24 GMT
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Post by essexstokey on Jan 15, 2024 9:14:00 GMT
Tory literature in romford at Christmas from mp dosent once mention conservatives once that's 4 pages
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Post by gawa on Jan 15, 2024 11:44:45 GMT
This poll must not include the silent majority we keep hearing about.
Good to see torys facing wipe out but not too hopeful about Starmer either. At least the tories are being held to account at last if nothing else.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2024 12:09:27 GMT
This poll must not include the silent majority we keep hearing about. Good to see torys facing wipe out but not too hopeful about Starmer either. At least the tories are being held to account at last if nothing else. The “Conservative Party” were wiped out years ago. There’s little in the current party that is considered right wing. It’s constantly interfering as a “big govt”, its ministers get in the way of policing, it isn’t actually “tough on immigration” etc. Despite that, it’s not being “wiped out”. There’s still a lot of blue on that map. It will be back in 5-10 years. Most parties get 2 terms in govt. In seats lost, the second polling party would likely still be Tory. It’s politics, people aren’t elected on popularity, they are elected on the incompetence of the other party.
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Post by gawa on Jan 15, 2024 12:14:51 GMT
This poll must not include the silent majority we keep hearing about. Good to see torys facing wipe out but not too hopeful about Starmer either. At least the tories are being held to account at last if nothing else. The “Conservative Party” were wiped out years ago. There’s little in the current party that is considered right wing. It’s constantly interfering as a “big govt”, its ministers get in the way of policing, it isn’t actually “tough on immigration” etc. Despite that, it’s not being “wiped out”. There’s still a lot of blue on that map. It will be back in 5-10 years. Most parties get 2 terms in govt. In seats lost, the second polling party would likely still be Tory. It’s politics, people aren’t elected on popularity, they are elected on the incompetence of the other party. I think they're very right wing but they also put themselves and their donors before country which is why things like immigration they're all talk about. They're some of the biggest benefactors from immigration due to the cheap labour which brings in bigger profits which in turn line their pockets. They're facing wipe out in the upcoming election. I have no doubt they'll be back in a few terms when we see much the same from labour. We're like America with a 2 party system where nothing changes unfortunately.
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Post by lordb on Jan 15, 2024 12:15:32 GMT
This poll must not include the silent majority we keep hearing about. Good to see torys facing wipe out but not too hopeful about Starmer either. At least the tories are being held to account at last if nothing else. I think SNP will lose more seats than that
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2024 12:21:49 GMT
The “Conservative Party” were wiped out years ago. There’s little in the current party that is considered right wing. It’s constantly interfering as a “big govt”, its ministers get in the way of policing, it isn’t actually “tough on immigration” etc. Despite that, it’s not being “wiped out”. There’s still a lot of blue on that map. It will be back in 5-10 years. Most parties get 2 terms in govt. In seats lost, the second polling party would likely still be Tory. It’s politics, people aren’t elected on popularity, they are elected on the incompetence of the other party. I think they're very right wing but they also put themselves and their donors before country which is why things like immigration they're all talk about. They're some of the biggest benefactors from immigration due to the cheap labour which brings in bigger profits which in turn line their pockets. They're facing wipe out in the upcoming election. I have no doubt they'll be back in a few terms when we see much the same from labour. We're like America with a 2 party system where nothing changes unfortunately. Plenty changes in America. What elements are “right wing”? I’ve always understood that the biggest political notion of being right wing is the concept of small government. It is not one that the Conservatives practice.
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Post by dutchstokie on Jan 15, 2024 12:29:56 GMT
The “Conservative Party” were wiped out years ago. There’s little in the current party that is considered right wing. It’s constantly interfering as a “big govt”, its ministers get in the way of policing, it isn’t actually “tough on immigration” etc. Despite that, it’s not being “wiped out”. There’s still a lot of blue on that map. It will be back in 5-10 years. Most parties get 2 terms in govt. In seats lost, the second polling party would likely still be Tory. It’s politics, people aren’t elected on popularity, they are elected on the incompetence of the other party. I think they're very right wing but they also put themselves and their donors before country which is why things like immigration they're all talk about. They're some of the biggest benefactors from immigration due to the cheap labour which brings in bigger profits which in turn line their pockets. They're facing wipe out in the upcoming election. I have no doubt they'll be back in a few terms when we see much the same from labour. We're like America with a 2 party system where nothing changes unfortunately. Im glad sommeone else sees it for what it is.....a great big sham. It will carryon regardless of who gets in..... All politicians are as bad as each other.
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Post by adri2008 on Jan 15, 2024 12:53:21 GMT
Policy wise, Sunak and Starmer aren't that far apart at all really. Both technocrats, both relative centrists within their party and both committed to managed decline. Things are ripe for a major shake up and I suspect it'll be coming from the right/populists, probably led by Farage after a clear out at the next election.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Jan 15, 2024 12:54:44 GMT
I think they're very right wing but they also put themselves and their donors before country which is why things like immigration they're all talk about. They're some of the biggest benefactors from immigration due to the cheap labour which brings in bigger profits which in turn line their pockets. They're facing wipe out in the upcoming election. I have no doubt they'll be back in a few terms when we see much the same from labour. We're like America with a 2 party system where nothing changes unfortunately. Plenty changes in America. What elements are “right wing”? I’ve always understood that the biggest political notion of being right wing is the concept of small government. It is not one that the Conservatives practice. Under Truss, the Tories were considered the most right wing government in the world. Obviously since she went, they have shifted back somewhat but they are still the most right government I can remember in this country. www.ft.com/content/d5f1d564-8c08-4711-b11d-9c6c7759f2b8In a snap FT survey of a group of British political scientists across the political spectrum, the consensus was that under Prime Minister Liz Truss and chancellor Kwasi Kwarteng, the Tories now score a stunning 9.4. This puts them well beyond where the Republicans stood under Donald Trump, and just to the right of the Brazilian Social Liberal party that took Jair Bolsonaro to power in 2018. Out of 275 parties in 61 countries, the Tories under Trussonomics rank as the most rightwing of all. It should not then be surprising that such a voluntary swerve to the right spooked the markets far more than other costlier but sensible policies. On the same economic scale where Truss’s government now scores a 9.4, the average UK voter positions themselves at 3.1 and the average Conservative at 4.2. The Tories have plotted a course to the very edge of the economic map, and when they scan the horizon there is nobody to be seen.
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Post by OldStokie on Jan 15, 2024 13:07:26 GMT
Plenty changes in America. What elements are “right wing”? I’ve always understood that the biggest political notion of being right wing is the concept of small government. It is not one that the Conservatives practice. Under Truss, the Tories were considered the most right wing government in the world. Obviously since she went, they have shifted back somewhat but they are still the most right government I can remember in this country. www.ft.com/content/d5f1d564-8c08-4711-b11d-9c6c7759f2b8In a snap FT survey of a group of British political scientists across the political spectrum, the consensus was that under Prime Minister Liz Truss and chancellor Kwasi Kwarteng, the Tories now score a stunning 9.4. This puts them well beyond where the Republicans stood under Donald Trump, and just to the right of the Brazilian Social Liberal party that took Jair Bolsonaro to power in 2018. Out of 275 parties in 61 countries, the Tories under Trussonomics rank as the most rightwing of all. It should not then be surprising that such a voluntary swerve to the right spooked the markets far more than other costlier but sensible policies. On the same economic scale where Truss’s government now scores a 9.4, the average UK voter positions themselves at 3.1 and the average Conservative at 4.2. The Tories have plotted a course to the very edge of the economic map, and when they scan the horizon there is nobody to be seen. I would put them a close second to Thatcher's mob, Paul. M.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2024 13:09:13 GMT
Plenty changes in America. What elements are “right wing”? I’ve always understood that the biggest political notion of being right wing is the concept of small government. It is not one that the Conservatives practice. Under Truss, the Tories were considered the most right wing government in the world. Obviously since she went, they have shifted back somewhat but they are still the most right government I can remember in this country. www.ft.com/content/d5f1d564-8c08-4711-b11d-9c6c7759f2b8The financial times also published this piece as well: www.ft.com/content/e8f64d85-5936-4666-94a8-a2b3b135f3ecarguing that they are a haven from the hard right. Both are laughable. The Tory Party, like Labour are two parties that are desperate for control of as much of everyone’s daily lives as they can take. I don’t see that as right wing. Truss was a PM for about a day, so not really that relevant to a party’s control of 13 years. Tories have spent fortunes on the NHS (poorly) and have continued to raise taxes. They say they don’t like immigrants but they allow for more than any other govt. They say that they care about free speech but they want to ban as much peaceful protest as possible. They say they care about law and order but then you have the Home Office trying to interfere with as much of policing as possible. They are not really that right wing to me, they are just wankers who are out for themselves. They say one thing and do another.
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Post by gawa on Jan 15, 2024 13:11:53 GMT
I think they're very right wing but they also put themselves and their donors before country which is why things like immigration they're all talk about. They're some of the biggest benefactors from immigration due to the cheap labour which brings in bigger profits which in turn line their pockets. They're facing wipe out in the upcoming election. I have no doubt they'll be back in a few terms when we see much the same from labour. We're like America with a 2 party system where nothing changes unfortunately. Plenty changes in America. What elements are “right wing”? I’ve always understood that the biggest political notion of being right wing is the concept of small government. It is not one that the Conservatives practice. In the 80s under Thatchers government I don't believe the general public were as greatly opposed to unions, worker rights and human rights. Nowadays if you support these things you're considering a socialist. The right to protest is another example of something being taken away from us which if you oppose you're a socialist. People fleeing war we have no sympathy for, if you do you're woke. Being opposed to 10s of thousands women and children being murdered by a regime is seen as being woke and many other things. Over the last 10 years central politics has moved further right in my opinion. I see alot of similarities between Cameron and Starmer. Protests against the Iraq war were never considered hate marches. We've never spoken about our public sector staff in such disdain as we've now became accustomed to. This last 10 years has normalised holding negative views of anyone worse off or more vulnerable than ourselves while turning a blind eye on inequality.
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 16, 2024 8:06:05 GMT
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 16, 2024 8:09:02 GMT
The financial times also published this piece as well: www.ft.com/content/e8f64d85-5936-4666-94a8-a2b3b135f3ecarguing that they are a haven from the hard right. Both are laughable. The Tory Party, like Labour are two parties that are desperate for control of as much of everyone’s daily lives as they can take. I don’t see that as right wing. Truss was a PM for about a day, so not really that relevant to a party’s control of 13 years. Tories have spent fortunes on the NHS (poorly) and have continued to raise taxes. They say they don’t like immigrants but they allow for more than any other govt. They say that they care about free speech but they want to ban as much peaceful protest as possible. They say they care about law and order but then you have the Home Office trying to interfere with as much of policing as possible. They are not really that right wing to me, they are just wankers who are out for themselves. They say one thing and do another. They are right wing. Just completely incompetent at achieving their right wing goals.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jan 16, 2024 8:30:35 GMT
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Post by adri2008 on Jan 16, 2024 9:40:04 GMT
I'm involved in a few IT projects for various public sector bodies and some of the IT systems in use are ridiculously antiquated. The problem is that workers/management have become accustomed to doing things in a very particular (and outdated) way over many years so the default is now to do nothing as it would involve mass retraining and disruption. It really needs someone to force changes to occur - they'd be very unpopular of course but you'd then have a leap forward in productivity and the services provided.
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Post by dutchstokie on Jan 16, 2024 10:55:43 GMT
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Post by thepremierbanksy on Jan 16, 2024 11:03:02 GMT
The financial times also published this piece as well: www.ft.com/content/e8f64d85-5936-4666-94a8-a2b3b135f3ecarguing that they are a haven from the hard right. Both are laughable. The Tory Party, like Labour are two parties that are desperate for control of as much of everyone’s daily lives as they can take. I don’t see that as right wing. Truss was a PM for about a day, so not really that relevant to a party’s control of 13 years. Tories have spent fortunes on the NHS (poorly) and have continued to raise taxes. They say they don’t like immigrants but they allow for more than any other govt. They say that they care about free speech but they want to ban as much peaceful protest as possible. They say they care about law and order but then you have the Home Office trying to interfere with as much of policing as possible. They are not really that right wing to me, they are just wankers who are out for themselves. They say one thing and do another. This (bold bit) rather ignores the fact that she was voted in by her own party having proposed the fiscal policy that then cost the country billions.
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Post by atillathehoneybee on Jan 16, 2024 11:05:16 GMT
I think they're very right wing but they also put themselves and their donors before country which is why things like immigration they're all talk about. They're some of the biggest benefactors from immigration due to the cheap labour which brings in bigger profits which in turn line their pockets. They're facing wipe out in the upcoming election. I have no doubt they'll be back in a few terms when we see much the same from labour. We're like America with a 2 party system where nothing changes unfortunately. Plenty changes in America. What elements are “right wing”? I’ve always understood that the biggest political notion of being right wing is the concept of small government. It is not one that the Conservatives practice. Imagine the " Special Friendship " between Trump and Captain Wishy Washy... The Don will eat him alive...
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Post by atillathehoneybee on Jan 16, 2024 11:09:26 GMT
The “Conservative Party” were wiped out years ago. There’s little in the current party that is considered right wing. It’s constantly interfering as a “big govt”, its ministers get in the way of policing, it isn’t actually “tough on immigration” etc. Despite that, it’s not being “wiped out”. There’s still a lot of blue on that map. It will be back in 5-10 years. Most parties get 2 terms in govt. In seats lost, the second polling party would likely still be Tory. It’s politics, people aren’t elected on popularity, they are elected on the incompetence of the other party. I think they're very right wing but they also put themselves and their donors before country which is why things like immigration they're all talk about. They're some of the biggest benefactors from immigration due to the cheap labour which brings in bigger profits which in turn line their pockets. They're facing wipe out in the upcoming election. I have no doubt they'll be back in a few terms when we see much the same from labour. We're like America with a 2 party system where nothing changes unfortunately. Agreed. And Wishy Washy will be dumped before he completes 1 term, as his " Blame the Tories " rhetoric will start to wear a bit thin, I can see a Andy Burnham type leader taking over, winning one election, then The Tories getting back in with a Dave Cameron type leader...
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Post by gawa on Jan 16, 2024 11:26:21 GMT
I think they're very right wing but they also put themselves and their donors before country which is why things like immigration they're all talk about. They're some of the biggest benefactors from immigration due to the cheap labour which brings in bigger profits which in turn line their pockets. They're facing wipe out in the upcoming election. I have no doubt they'll be back in a few terms when we see much the same from labour. We're like America with a 2 party system where nothing changes unfortunately. Agreed. And Wishy Washy will be dumped before he completes 1 term, as his " Blame the Tories " rhetoric will start to wear a bit thin, I can see a Andy Burnham type leader taking over, winning one election, then The Tories getting back in with a Dave Cameron type leader... I can see the tories being back in power after one term to be honest. People want big changes and I don't see Starmer delivering them.
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