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Post by Gob Bluth on Oct 13, 2022 10:01:54 GMT
Is she having a go at her parents? Braverman was born to Christie and Uma Fernandes (née Mootien-Pillay),[5] both of Indian origin,[6][7] who emigrated to Britain in the 1960s from Kenya and Mauritius respectively. Her mother, of Hindu Tamil Mauritian descent, was a nurse and a councillor in Brent.[7] Her father, of Goan ancestry (who formerly was an Indian in Kenya),[8] worked for a housing association.[9] Braverman is the niece of Mahen Kundasamy, former Mauritian High Commissioner to London.[5][10] I don't know what it is about the sons and daughters of immigrants as politicians but they often seem almost pathologically obsessed with being ultra-tough towards subsequent immigrants. Do they think this will somehow endear them more to native Britons and "make-up" for the fact that they're descendants of immigrants themselves? If so, two things. First, it won't. Second, you just look a massive and ungrateful hypocrite. It's really, really weird. It's wanting to stop EU migration but giving your German wife a job logic. |
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Post by oggyoggy on Oct 13, 2022 10:12:28 GMT
Why would the Conservative party with an 80 seat majority call an election they would lose? It literally makes zero sense. I agree. I don’t buy the talk of an election. Surely if they oust Truss, get Sunak in then he will have around 18 months or so to limit the damage caused. I imagine Sunak would get at least a 5 point immediate boost in the polls for not being Truss and being shown to be right about Truss’ economic plan in the leadership hustings. The questions are:would Sunak take the job? I guess only if he felt that he would be kept on as leader for the election after even if the tories take a hammering from labour at this next election. But would the tories do that? Recent governments have been about getting through each day or week, and seem to not think about the future at all. Like Watford FC. The second question is would the party implode entirely and end up with another nutter in charge if they let members choose again, and be in a similar situation to now, but months closer to having to call an election. That could see a total wipeout of the tories for a generation if the country continues on its steady downhill trajectory and the tories are infighting over the next leader for weeks again. What a mess. |
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Oct 13, 2022 10:33:36 GMT
Why would the Conservative party with an 80 seat majority call an election they would lose? It literally makes zero sense. To play devil's advocate : perhaps to minimise the scale of defeat? If they think it's going to get worse/significantly worse they may end up with a landslide defeat Just a theory, would imagine they will change leader/PM again first gambling that they will get an upturn I'd say the chances of it happening are less than 1%. Also the idea that Starmer would do anything drastically different to improve the economy is for the birds. The media are cheering on all this chaos at the moment with dramatic statements that are nearly always wrong. Just look at the state of some of the tweets of the past few days comparitive to what actually happened, ie the shite proven liar Peston was putting out about the pound. The pound is pretty much exactly where it has been for the past two weeks. Truss is looking horribly out her depth but replacing her now does nothing for the Tory party. If polling continues as it is for the next 12 to 18 months then I suspect they will get someone else in as there will be nothing to lose. Plus you just know there will be some bad moments for Labour in the next 24 months, they can't help but come out with monumental clangers in the build up to an election. Don't take the above as support for Truss btw. This Conservative Party is a shambles of an outfit. |
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Post by lordb on Oct 13, 2022 10:37:49 GMT
To play devil's advocate : perhaps to minimise the scale of defeat? If they think it's going to get worse/significantly worse they may end up with a landslide defeat Just a theory, would imagine they will change leader/PM again first gambling that they will get an upturn I'd say the chances of it happening are less than 1%. Also the idea that Starmer would do anything drastically different to improve the economy is for the birds. The media are cheering on all this chaos at the moment with dramatic statements that are nearly always wrong. Just look at the state of some of the tweets of the past few days comparitive to what actually happened, ie the shite proven liar Peston was putting out about the pound. The pound is pretty much exactly where it has been for the past two weeks. Truss is looking horribly out her depth but replacing her now does nothing for the Tory party. If polling continues as it is for the next 12 to 18 months then I suspect they will get someone else in as there will be nothing to lose. Plus you just know there will be some bad moments for Labour in the next 24 months, they can't help but come out with monumental clangers in the build up to an election. Don't take the above as support for Truss btw. This Conservative Party is a shambles of an outfit. 19 months now I think |
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Post by lordb on Oct 13, 2022 10:40:09 GMT
I'd say the chances of it happening are less than 1%. Also the idea that Starmer would do anything drastically different to improve the economy is for the birds. The media are cheering on all this chaos at the moment with dramatic statements that are nearly always wrong. Just look at the state of some of the tweets of the past few days comparitive to what actually happened, ie the shite proven liar Peston was putting out about the pound. The pound is pretty much exactly where it has been for the past two weeks. Truss is looking horribly out her depth but replacing her now does nothing for the Tory party. If polling continues as it is for the next 12 to 18 months then I suspect they will get someone else in as there will be nothing to lose. Plus you just know there will be some bad moments for Labour in the next 24 months, they can't help but come out with monumental clangers in the build up to an election. Don't take the above as support for Truss btw. This Conservative Party is a shambles of an outfit. 19 months now I think Longer January 2025 I was thinking it was May 2024 |
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Post by oggyoggy on Oct 13, 2022 10:49:37 GMT
To play devil's advocate : perhaps to minimise the scale of defeat? If they think it's going to get worse/significantly worse they may end up with a landslide defeat Just a theory, would imagine they will change leader/PM again first gambling that they will get an upturn I'd say the chances of it happening are less than 1%. Also the idea that Starmer would do anything drastically different to improve the economy is for the birds. The media are cheering on all this chaos at the moment with dramatic statements that are nearly always wrong. Just look at the state of some of the tweets of the past few days comparitive to what actually happened, ie the shite proven liar Peston was putting out about the pound. The pound is pretty much exactly where it has been for the past two weeks. Truss is looking horribly out her depth but replacing her now does nothing for the Tory party. If polling continues as it is for the next 12 to 18 months then I suspect they will get someone else in as there will be nothing to lose. Plus you just know there will be some bad moments for Labour in the next 24 months, they can't help but come out with monumental clangers in the build up to an election. Don't take the above as support for Truss btw. This Conservative Party is a shambles of an outfit. Starmer’s approach is very different. No unfunded tax cuts for a start, so all the upheaval since Kwarteng’s mini budget would have been avoided, so interest rises wouldn’t be so steep, and mortgages would be cheaper and government borrowing would be cheaper and pension funds wouldn’t need bailing out. Windfall tax to cover a large amount of the energy cap costs, so billions less in public debt and interest repayments. For the medium term, we know of his plans to invest in a national green energy company and insulation of homes, creating jobs and longer term reducing energy costs due to less reliance from gas and coal. There are a few major differences for a start. |
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Post by prestwichpotter on Oct 13, 2022 11:15:28 GMT
Tory civil war imminent....
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Post by essexstokey on Oct 13, 2022 11:30:11 GMT
Tory civil war imminent.... Wow there really going for blue on blue self district button arnt they Lol |
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Post by FullerMagic on Oct 13, 2022 11:31:18 GMT
U-Turn Central - self-preservation society.
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Oct 13, 2022 11:38:16 GMT
To play devil's advocate : perhaps to minimise the scale of defeat? If they think it's going to get worse/significantly worse they may end up with a landslide defeat Just a theory, would imagine they will change leader/PM again first gambling that they will get an upturn I'd say the chances of it happening are less than 1%. Also the idea that Starmer would do anything drastically different to improve the economy is for the birds. The media are cheering on all this chaos at the moment with dramatic statements that are nearly always wrong. Just look at the state of some of the tweets of the past few days comparitive to what actually happened, ie the shite proven liar Peston was putting out about the pound. The pound is pretty much exactly where it has been for the past two weeks. Truss is looking horribly out her depth but replacing her now does nothing for the Tory party. If polling continues as it is for the next 12 to 18 months then I suspect they will get someone else in as there will be nothing to lose. Plus you just know there will be some bad moments for Labour in the next 24 months, they can't help but come out with monumental clangers in the build up to an election. Don't take the above as support for Truss btw. This Conservative Party is a shambles of an outfit. The pound has not fallen further because of the markets assuming base rate rises will be significant. In the meantime mortgage rates are rising rapidly and the cost of government borrowing is back up to where it was before the last boe intervention. I see the value of the company pension I've been paying into for 6 years is currently less than the total contributions made. Neither covid nor the invasion managed to achieve that, but the Tory mini budget did. I have a while to go before Im hopefully in a position to draw the pension , but for those currently taking their funds on a drawdown scheme it must be pretty scary. |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Oct 13, 2022 11:50:34 GMT
U-Turn Central - self-preservation society. The thing is it doesn't matter how many u-turns they do now, the damage is already done and the trust (in specific) individuals has been lost. I said on the Monday after the budget, that their only way out, would be to scrap the tax cuts and Kwarteng would have to resign to save Truss. The markets don't trust his competence but she may have left it too late now to save even her own skin. |
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Post by FullerMagic on Oct 13, 2022 12:00:36 GMT
U-Turn Central - self-preservation society. The thing is it doesn't matter how many u-turns they do now, the damage is already done and the trust (in specific) individuals has been lost. I said on the Monday after the budget, that their only way out, would be to scrap the tax cuts and Kwarteng would have to resign to save Truss. The markets don't trust his competence but she may have left it too late now to save even her own skin. Yep, she's finished now regardless - and you'd think Kwarteng will be out in the next week or so, but that won't cut it. |
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Post by Gob Bluth on Oct 13, 2022 12:14:20 GMT
IMF saying Fiscal and Monetary policy need to align in intent. The lady said it three times and I assume all three were aimed at the idiots we have in charge.
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Post by Gob Bluth on Oct 13, 2022 12:15:40 GMT
Why would the Conservative party with an 80 seat majority call an election they would lose? It literally makes zero sense. Agreed which is strange that Harry Cole is reporting it. |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Oct 13, 2022 12:17:49 GMT
Tory civil war imminent.... Nadine wants a general election in the assumption that her seat would be safe. If actual voting reflected the polls currently, she'd be out on her nicely shaped arse (one for Dutchstokie!) |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Oct 13, 2022 12:19:30 GMT
The thing is it doesn't matter how many u-turns they do now, the damage is already done and the trust (in specific) individuals has been lost. I said on the Monday after the budget, that their only way out, would be to scrap the tax cuts and Kwarteng would have to resign to save Truss. The markets don't trust his competence but she may have left it too late now to save even her own skin. Yep, she's finished now regardless - and you'd think Kwarteng will be out in the next week or so, but that won't cut it. How long before a Tory tries to claim Truss is still really a Lib Dem and that's the root of the problem.... |
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Post by Gawa on Oct 13, 2022 12:26:52 GMT
The most depressing thing about it all is that even if/when we do manage to oust the tories, we're just getting a right leaning corrupt labour party in replacement.
Now don't get me wrong, the current labour party as it is, is still a vast improvement on the dross we've been served up the last 12 years. But it doesn't inspire confidence for the radical change which is required. The future feels very bleak indeed.
I'm disappointed as well by the lack of coverage on "the labour files" in the media in the past week, and seemingly a lack of discussion on it here too. The behaviour of the media and the labour right wing during Corbyns tenure is abysmal and shameful and people like Keir Starmer are right at the centre of it.
An ideal world would see Starmer ousted and Corbyn or one of the true labour left wingers to take over leadership before a GE. Unfortunately though I feel we're set for Starmer contending the next election. And while I look forward to finally seeing the back of the tory scum which are universally detested across the UK (bar some areas of england, the super wealthy and the not very bright), I don't have confidence that Labour under Starmer will sort the problems which need to be sorted.
It leaves people like myself feeling very disillusioned and unrepresented. Hopefully Starmer is an improvement but he's not the leader I'd want. However I'd take him over any tory every day of the week.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Oct 13, 2022 12:29:22 GMT
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Post by adri2008 on Oct 13, 2022 12:47:33 GMT
I think a lot of this is basically chickens coming to roost. Economic catastrophe in 2008 was delayed by allowing insolvent banks to re-capitalise but instead of gradually reigning things in, the government (along with stupidly low interest rates) has actively been encouraging mass borrowing and surging house prices so that the minute the cheap credit was turned off, everything comes crashing down.
Truss has then made the situation worse by introducing a shit or bust growth strategy with zero attempt to reassure markets that they actually had some sort of plan to bring expenditure under control.
Labour will be inheriting a shit show and a definite poisoned chalice.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Oct 13, 2022 13:27:26 GMT
The most depressing thing about it all is that even if/when we do manage to oust the tories, we're just getting a right leaning corrupt labour party in replacement. Now don't get me wrong, the current labour party as it is, is still a vast improvement on the dross we've been served up the last 12 years. But it doesn't inspire confidence for the radical change which is required. The future feels very bleak indeed. I'm disappointed as well by the lack of coverage on "the labour files" in the media in the past week, and seemingly a lack of discussion on it here too. The behaviour of the media and the labour right wing during Corbyns tenure is abysmal and shameful and people like Keir Starmer are right at the centre of it. An ideal world would see Starmer ousted and Corbyn or one of the true labour left wingers to take over leadership before a GE. Unfortunately though I feel we're set for Starmer contending the next election. And while I look forward to finally seeing the back of the tory scum which are universally detested across the UK (bar some areas of england, the super wealthy and the not very bright), I don't have confidence that Labour under Starmer will sort the problems which need to be sorted. It leaves people like myself feeling very disillusioned and unrepresented. Hopefully Starmer is an improvement but he's not the leader I'd want. However I'd take him over any tory every day of the week. Well, my thinking on this hasn't altered: I don't presume for one second that the next government, if it is a Labour one, will create a Utopia in this country nor that it will be without its own set of problems and controversies. However, 15 years of this Tory government by the time the next election has to come around, and not forgetting what happened under previous Tory administrations, should put to bed any lingering doubts as to whether they give a shit about anything other than making money for themselves and their rich supporters. And if the country as a whole gets better almost as a tangential bonus, well, all well and good. By contrast, let's see whether the next government at least tries to help out ordinary people and to improve the public services that ordinary people rely on daily. Radical change under Starmer is unlikely. Moving in the right direction generally is. And perhaps, just perhaps, if enough Labour governments are in power for long enough, we might move towards a more modern, northern European way of managing the country so that tax burdens are shared more equitably, the proceeds go towards improving society as a whole and our people are more content. But, England being the conservative Conservative country that it fundamentally is, there won't be any substantial appetite for radical change. The press for one will go to town over anything that will be seen as too progressive. I think you just have to accept that and be pragmatic about the small steps in the right direction, however frustrating and distasteful the rate of progress might seem. A case of not throwing the baby out with the bathwater, I suppose! |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Oct 13, 2022 13:30:05 GMT
I think a lot of this is basically chickens coming to roost. Economic catastrophe in 2008 was delayed by allowing insolvent banks to re-capitalise but instead of gradually reigning things in, the government (along with stupidly low interest rates) has actively been encouraging mass borrowing and surging house prices so that the minute the cheap credit was turned off, everything comes crashing down. Truss has then made the situation worse by introducing a shit or bust growth strategy with zero attempt to reassure markets that they actually had some sort of plan to bring expenditure under control. Labour will be inheriting a shit show and a definite poisoned chalice. Agreed. I think you can trace a lot of our current woes back to the City boys and the financial crash. |
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Post by adri2008 on Oct 13, 2022 13:45:08 GMT
The most depressing thing about it all is that even if/when we do manage to oust the tories, we're just getting a right leaning corrupt labour party in replacement. Now don't get me wrong, the current labour party as it is, is still a vast improvement on the dross we've been served up the last 12 years. But it doesn't inspire confidence for the radical change which is required. The future feels very bleak indeed. I'm disappointed as well by the lack of coverage on "the labour files" in the media in the past week, and seemingly a lack of discussion on it here too. The behaviour of the media and the labour right wing during Corbyns tenure is abysmal and shameful and people like Keir Starmer are right at the centre of it. An ideal world would see Starmer ousted and Corbyn or one of the true labour left wingers to take over leadership before a GE. Unfortunately though I feel we're set for Starmer contending the next election. And while I look forward to finally seeing the back of the tory scum which are universally detested across the UK (bar some areas of england, the super wealthy and the not very bright), I don't have confidence that Labour under Starmer will sort the problems which need to be sorted. It leaves people like myself feeling very disillusioned and unrepresented. Hopefully Starmer is an improvement but he's not the leader I'd want. However I'd take him over any tory every day of the week. Well, my thinking on this hasn't altered: I don't presume for one second that the next government, if it is a Labour one, will create a Utopia in this country nor that it will be without its own set of problems and controversies. However, 15 years of this Tory government by the time the next election has to come around, and not forgetting what happened under previous Tory administrations, should put to bed any lingering doubts as to whether they give a shit about anything other than making money for themselves and their rich supporters. And if the country as a whole gets better almost as a tangential bonus, well, all well and good. By contrast, let's see whether the next government at least tries to help out ordinary people and to improve the public services that ordinary people rely on daily. Radical change under Starmer is unlikely. Moving in the right direction generally is. And perhaps, just perhaps, if enough Labour governments are in power for long enough, we might move towards a more modern, northern European way of managing the country so that tax burdens are shared more equitably, the proceeds go towards improving society as a whole and our people are more content. But, England being the conservative Conservative country that it fundamentally is, there won't be any substantial appetite for radical change. The press for one will go to town over anything that will be seen as too progressive. I think you just have to accept that and be pragmatic about the small steps in the right direction, however frustrating and distasteful the rate of progress might seem. A case of not throwing the baby out with the bathwater, I suppose! Incremental change is the way forward in my opinion - Tony Blair for all his ills understood this. Most people aren't interested in left nor right wing ideology, they simply want the country to be run in a reasonable manner. If you have a mortgage, decent job etc. you don't want everything chucked up in the air in a 'shit or bust' style shake up whether its a Corbyn style one or Truss's version. |
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Post by dutchstokie on Oct 13, 2022 13:54:56 GMT
Tory civil war imminent.... Nadine wants a general election in the assumption that her seat would be safe. If actual voting reflected the polls currently, she'd be out on her nicely shaped arse (one for Dutchstokie!) Oi oi,....... look at her.....just look at her !  Theres lacy black knickers and stockings on under that clobber Im telling ya !  Which is about the only redeeming feature lets be fair. Ive voted Tory all my life, but this fuckin shit show going on now, well, shes the ONLY visual bright spot in an otherwise clusterfuck of a party right now. Come on be honest mate, would you rather look at Therese Coffey ?  |
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Post by Kewstokie on Oct 13, 2022 14:25:32 GMT
Tory civil war imminent.... Nadine wants a general election in the assumption that her seat would be safe. If actual voting reflected the polls currently, she'd be out on her nicely shaped arse (one for Dutchstokie!) She’s going to the House of Lords anyway. Another issue for Truss, with numerous Tory MP’s on Johnson’s resignation honours list. Last thing the Tories need are by-election losses chipping away at the majority. It’ll take fewer rebels with a conscience for a no confidence vote to succeed. |
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Post by thewonderstuff on Oct 13, 2022 15:06:56 GMT
Kwasi Canned?
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Post by teenagefanclub on Oct 13, 2022 15:24:37 GMT
So my old man told me a week after Boris was removed that the tories had a major plan behind the scenes to get Boris back in number 10 by Christmas.
I called bollocks on this as my dad is 88 and how would he know anyway. But after a week he found the article which said Boris would be back as PM within months.
As shit as he was, he wasn’t this shit.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Oct 13, 2022 15:34:25 GMT
So my old man told me a week after Boris was removed that the tories had a major plan behind the scenes to get Boris back in number 10 by Christmas. I called bollocks on this as my dad is 88 and how would he know anyway. But after a week he found the article which said Boris would be back as PM within months. As shit as he was, he wasn’t this shit. Are they really that cynical as to go through a sham leadership contest including Sunak purely to elect some complete idiot to make Johnson look "good" by comparison? Is the British electorate really that stupid? Surely that would be too much of a complete pisstake out of the British people even for our supine standards! |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Oct 13, 2022 15:39:12 GMT
Nadine wants a general election in the assumption that her seat would be safe. If actual voting reflected the polls currently, she'd be out on her nicely shaped arse (one for Dutchstokie!) Oi oi,....... look at her.....just look at her ! Theres lacy black knickers and stockings on under that clobber Im telling ya ! Which is about the only redeeming feature lets be fair. Ive voted Tory all my life, but this fuckin shit show going on now, well, shes the ONLY visual bright spot in an otherwise clusterfuck of a party right now. Come on be honest mate, would you rather look at Therese Coffey ? I'm with you on Dorries! |
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Post by wannabee on Oct 13, 2022 15:45:14 GMT
Why would the Conservative party with an 80 seat majority call an election they would lose? It literally makes zero sense. Agreed which is strange that Harry Cole is reporting it. The Tory MPs are revolting ... but most people knew that already |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Oct 13, 2022 16:54:40 GMT
He's probably out and about trying to sell Stonehenge to some billionaire Texan. |
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