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Post by partickpotter on Jun 24, 2022 8:36:08 GMT
Redwhinenblue likes to whine about this nonsensical notion from time to time. OK, make that all the time. It’s what he does. I wouldn’t let it worry you. Pernicious and predictable ad hominem as usual! “Tedious, tedious man”. Couldn’t have put it better myself. Well, more mouse than man. But otherwise a wonderfully succinct summary.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 24, 2022 8:39:07 GMT
Pernicious and predictable ad hominem as usual! “Tedious, tedious man”. Couldn’t have put it better myself. Well, more mouse than man. But otherwise a wonderfully succinct summary. Always with the personal stuff, partick...
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Post by knype on Jun 24, 2022 8:39:42 GMT
So in your opinion we are a right wing country? My opinion is that we are not! You haven't presented any argument, you just spit out bile and use the "Racist" term to anything central of your far left views Well, the evidence of the last 43 years of government would tend to suggest I'm right. We haven't had a socialist government for best part of half a century, largely as a result of English voting patterns. The last bit is plain daft. Not only am I not far left, but also right-wing does not mean racist, although it's very telling that you instantly went there! Thats because the ardent left on here automatically label anyone who doesn't agree with their socialist or even marxist views as far right racists...
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Post by partickpotter on Jun 24, 2022 8:42:46 GMT
“Tedious, tedious man”. Couldn’t have put it better myself. Well, more mouse than man. But otherwise a wonderfully succinct summary. Always with the personal stuff, partick... “Pissy” too. That also works.
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Post by partickpotter on Jun 24, 2022 8:44:31 GMT
Well, the evidence of the last 43 years of government would tend to suggest I'm right. We haven't had a socialist government for best part of half a century, largely as a result of English voting patterns. The last bit is plain daft. Not only am I not far left, but also right-wing does not mean racist, although it's very telling that you instantly went there! Thats because the ardent left on here automatically label anyone who doesn't agree with their socialist or even marxist views as far right racists... I wouldn’t describe Redwhinenblue and his sidekicks as “ardent left”; more “limp left” or “lame left”, possibly “lamentable left”.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jun 24, 2022 8:46:42 GMT
You think the polls are a ringing endorsement of Starmer's Labour with everything going on with Johnson, really? Labour should be head and shoulders ahead, and again for what feels like the 50th time look at the raw data the lead is built on a shift from Tory to Don't Know. I don't hate Starmer I just think he's shit. Spineless, unprincipled, untrustworthy and shit. I think the same about Johnson but then I expected nothing less from him. It is possible to walk and chew gum at the same time. Your only response is "Starmer is a better option surely?" Based on what? And it won't wash with the electorate whether you keep getting pissy about it or not........... Calm down, prestwich, you're the only one chucking names around and getting a bit wound up. I'm having a discussion with you about why you hate Starmer so much and concentrate so much invective on him, rather than the government. I find it a bit odd. Yes, I think Starmer's Labour is a better option than Johnson's government, in much the same way that I thought Blair's Labour would be a better option than a Tory government. I'd be interested to know what you thought of Blair at the time, much the same, I expect, but who knows. The fact is that, like all governments, Blair's was far from perfect, but it also improved things that matter like health and education. These are things that I hope any government improves - the current one is very much making things worse on those fronts, and I hope the next Labour government will reverse that trend. I wasn't wrong in hoping that Blair's government would do so (in amongst the many things that they got wrong, particularly in foreign policy) and I hope I'm not going to be wrong if Starmer's Labour gets elected. However, one thing's for sure, the Tory Party won't make those improvements, nor will they level up, reduce inequality, poverty etc. Perhaps Starmer's govt won't either but given the history of the two parties, they're much the safer bet, not least because they contain many MPs that align much more comfortably with your views. I'm perfectly calm. This notion of finding it odd that I criticise Starmer (I don't hate him as I've already said) and not the government (I criticise both as I've already said) is in itself odd considering I'm a faceless no mark on an internet forum (as I've already said) and not preaching to millions of people on Question Time. Your problem is your inability to read peoples posts before parroting the same line over and over..............
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 24, 2022 8:46:44 GMT
Well, the evidence of the last 43 years of government would tend to suggest I'm right. We haven't had a socialist government for best part of half a century, largely as a result of English voting patterns. The last bit is plain daft. Not only am I not far left, but also right-wing does not mean racist, although it's very telling that you instantly went there! Thats because the ardent left on here automatically label anyone who doesn't agree with their socialist or even marxist views as far right racists... Well, they don't. Whoever the "ardent Left" that you refer to is on here, I doubt very much that disagreeing with socialist or marxist views instantly makes you a racist, but happy for you to prove me otherwise. Have to say it is a bit oddly defensive on the racism front, as nothing I said was remotely concerned with racism!
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 24, 2022 8:47:17 GMT
Thats because the ardent left on here automatically label anyone who doesn't agree with their socialist or even marxist views as far right racists... I wouldn’t describe Redwhinenblue and his sidekicks as “ardent left”; more “limp left” or “lame left”, possibly “lamentable left”. Why always the personal stuff, partick? It's just not necessary
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jun 24, 2022 8:51:16 GMT
Well, the evidence of the last 43 years of government would tend to suggest I'm right. We haven't had a socialist government for best part of half a century, largely as a result of English voting patterns. The last bit is plain daft. Not only am I not far left, but also right-wing does not mean racist, although it's very telling that you instantly went there! Thats because the ardent left on here automatically label anyone who doesn't agree with their socialist or even marxist views as far right racists... Quite simply not true. Racism can and has to be called out every time. Don't you agree?
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Post by knype on Jun 24, 2022 8:55:13 GMT
Thats because the ardent left on here automatically label anyone who doesn't agree with their socialist or even marxist views as far right racists... Well, they don't. Whoever the "ardent Left" that you refer to is on here, I doubt very much that disagreeing with socialist or marxist views instantly makes you a racist, but happy for you to prove me otherwise. Have to say it is a bit oddly defensive on the racism front, as nothing I said was remotely concerned with racism! You, Essex and Huddy are all one and the same!
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Post by knype on Jun 24, 2022 8:56:07 GMT
Thats because the ardent left on here automatically label anyone who doesn't agree with their socialist or even marxist views as far right racists... Quite simply not true. Racism can and has to be called out every time. Don't you agree? It is simply true, you throw the racist tag around and tag people in certain categories when you know nothing about them!
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 24, 2022 8:58:54 GMT
Calm down, prestwich, you're the only one chucking names around and getting a bit wound up. I'm having a discussion with you about why you hate Starmer so much and concentrate so much invective on him, rather than the government. I find it a bit odd. Yes, I think Starmer's Labour is a better option than Johnson's government, in much the same way that I thought Blair's Labour would be a better option than a Tory government. I'd be interested to know what you thought of Blair at the time, much the same, I expect, but who knows. The fact is that, like all governments, Blair's was far from perfect, but it also improved things that matter like health and education. These are things that I hope any government improves - the current one is very much making things worse on those fronts, and I hope the next Labour government will reverse that trend. I wasn't wrong in hoping that Blair's government would do so (in amongst the many things that they got wrong, particularly in foreign policy) and I hope I'm not going to be wrong if Starmer's Labour gets elected. However, one thing's for sure, the Tory Party won't make those improvements, nor will they level up, reduce inequality, poverty etc. Perhaps Starmer's govt won't either but given the history of the two parties, they're much the safer bet, not least because they contain many MPs that align much more comfortably with your views. I'm perfectly calm. This notion of finding it odd that I criticise Starmer (I don't hate him as I've already said) and not the government (I criticise both as I've already said) is in itself odd considering I'm a faceless no mark on an internet forum (as I've already said) and not preaching to millions of people on Question Time. Your problem is your inability to read peoples posts before parroting the same line over and over.............. It's a meaningless internet forum where people shoot the breeze about all sorts of things, preferably without name-calling and getting a bit wound up on the way, but it doesn't really matter whether it has any impact in the real world. We'll just have to agree to disagree. I'd settle for a Starmer-led Labour government in the hope that it's, at the very least, better than what we have now or are likely to get under the current Tory Party. You wouldn't. Fair enough.
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Post by followyoudown on Jun 24, 2022 8:59:24 GMT
"Events Dear Boy, Events " Macmillan You really need to catch up if you want to comment on this shit show The link you posted is VERY old news Since the first botched IOPC investigation Jennifer Arcuri has come forward with documentary evidence to support a charge of MALFEASANCE IN A PUBLIC OFFICE The GLA has no authority to prosecute that charge.only the IOPC The GLA Ethics Committee is collating the documtation to present to IOPC Which part of that are you failing to understand www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/29/fresh-revelations-about-jennifer-arcuri-affair-threaten-to-damage-boris-johnsonAn short extract commenting on what happened after the first IOPC investigation and what might now happen after Jennifer Arcuri new documentation may help you The IOPC left it to the Greater London Authority (GLA) to decide whether Mr Johnson’s failure to register his interest with Ms Arcuri breached its Code of Conduct.
At the time of writing the GLA has not yet ruled on this. But Ms Arcuri’s diary entries, which she has agreed to share with the GLA, raised possibility of the authority referring the whole issue back to the IOPC which could, in turn, trigger a criminal investigation into misconduct in public office. www.hickmanandrose.co.uk/will-the-publication-of-jennifer-arcuri-diaries-change-the-game-on-boris-johnson-misconduct-allegations/I have said several times I don't have confidence in IOPC doing a proper investigation 2nd time around but one way or another the whole gruby mess will come out via John Ware Thats all very interesting but it just really shows what a load of garbage you have been claiming. To summarise again the only investigation is by the GLA ethics committee as I have repeatedly said and you have denied, there is no second IOPC investigation ongoing its a figment of your imagination, the ethics committee may refer another political complaint there but considering the issue of payments has already been found to be above board, you are even dafter than you seem if you think the non declaral of an alleged affair leads to any criminal action in this world or the next.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jun 24, 2022 9:02:44 GMT
Well, they don't. Whoever the "ardent Left" that you refer to is on here, I doubt very much that disagreeing with socialist or marxist views instantly makes you a racist, but happy for you to prove me otherwise. Have to say it is a bit oddly defensive on the racism front, as nothing I said was remotely concerned with racism! You, Essex and Huddy are all one and the same! I suppose in the sense that none of us agrees with your support for the current government and Johnson and the assumption that there is no better alternative, yes, you're right. Other than that, it's just plain daft.
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jun 24, 2022 9:02:52 GMT
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 24, 2022 9:04:13 GMT
Be interesting to see where we are shipping refugees to tomorrow to divert from today's cluster fuck results. I'll take Easter Island in the sweep I'll go the Falklands 😁
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jun 24, 2022 9:04:47 GMT
Quite simply not true. Racism can and has to be called out every time. Don't you agree? It is simply true, you throw the racist tag around and tag people in certain categories when you know nothing about them! I call out racism when a racist makes racist posts on a public messageboard. You're complaining no one knows you yet here you are making assumptions about others?
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 24, 2022 9:06:43 GMT
No too many rotten apples in the corrupt racist Tory party You need to be careful slinging unsubstantiated racist accusations on social media. I’m no great fan of the current Tory incumbents but racists they are not. Oh, hang on, when has truth and fact ever stopped your slander and insults though? These are facts claimed by one of there own lords
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jun 24, 2022 9:12:54 GMT
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Jun 24, 2022 9:13:44 GMT
You need to be careful slinging unsubstantiated racist accusations on social media. I’m no great fan of the current Tory incumbents but racists they are not. Oh, hang on, when has truth and fact ever stopped your slander and insults though? These are facts claimed by one of there own lords Johnson has been recorded making racist comments.
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Post by partickpotter on Jun 24, 2022 9:14:53 GMT
Be interesting to see where we are shipping refugees to tomorrow to divert from today's cluster fuck results. I'll take Easter Island in the sweep I'll go the Falklands 😁 Please do. Or anywhere without good internet connection.
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Post by lordb on Jun 24, 2022 9:15:34 GMT
Blimey, last night's results really haven't gone down at all well. You should be pleased, it makes Bozo's departure and replacement by a sensible moderate candidate and Tory polling upturn much more likely. Alternatively, pray that Starmer gets his FPN and sticks to his promise to resign. Perhaps then Labour will elect a new leader you approve of to lead them to another glorious defeat. Last nights results were to be expected although I didn’t expect such a swing for the Lib Dems and I expected Labour to win more convincingly…..…. You might have done but the swings to both the Liberals and Labour exceeded all expectations
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 24, 2022 9:18:31 GMT
Well, they don't. Whoever the "ardent Left" that you refer to is on here, I doubt very much that disagreeing with socialist or marxist views instantly makes you a racist, but happy for you to prove me otherwise. Have to say it is a bit oddly defensive on the racism front, as nothing I said was remotely concerned with racism! You, Essex and Huddy are all one and the same! Were all anti Tory and hate the years and years of Tory lies I agree but were definitely not the same person
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Post by thevoid on Jun 24, 2022 9:19:13 GMT
I don't think Essex has fully grasped that if Boris falls on his sword a new leader would give the Tories a better chance at the next election. You can only go up from this. I'd say you're right on that. Pretty obvious that people have had enough though. I voted for Blair (yeah, I know) because I felt the country needed a change from the Tories and I'm at that point again now.
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Post by thevoid on Jun 24, 2022 9:20:07 GMT
I don't think Essex has fully grasped that if Boris falls on his sword a new leader would give the Tories a better chance at the next election. You can only go up from this. I think that depends on who they replace him with. But if a “sensible and moderate” candidate with no baggage was chosen I agree they’d climb up the polls quickly against this lame duck of a Labour leader….. Can't really argue with that. Starmer's more monochrome than Major
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jun 24, 2022 9:22:08 GMT
Last nights results were to be expected although I didn’t expect such a swing for the Lib Dems and I expected Labour to win more convincingly…..…. You might have done but the swings to both the Liberals and Labour exceeded all expectations The Labour victory was based on pure apathy from those who normally vote Tory. A win is a win but you can't dress it up any other way..........
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Post by oggyoggy on Jun 24, 2022 9:36:52 GMT
Starmer needs to step up. But the Tories have an enormous jump up to make to avoid further humiliation and capitulation, let alone to win the next election. Fingers crossed Johnson clings to power and continues to destroy the worst thing about this country - the tory party. I don’t think Starmer is capable of stepping up. He has zero charisma and apparently no political message. He doesn’t seem to stand for anything. I wish it was different because I suspect the one thing you and I would agree on, Oggy, is we need to get rid of this PM and this government as soon as possible. But, sadly, Starmer is not the man to do it. Starmer may not win a labour majority. But he is inoffensive to lib dem voters, and even tories who hate Johnson don’t hate Starmer like they did Corbyn and so may vote lib dem to oust Johnson even if it leads to a Starmer led government. There is a clear anti tory majority while Johnson is PM, and voters are beginning to realise in our undemocratic voting system, it is all about who you are voting against, rather than for. So if we see trends as they are going with anti tory voting for whichever party has the best chance of beating the tories, the tories will be denied their majority. If the Tories replace Johnson, that may change.
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Post by yeokel on Jun 24, 2022 9:45:06 GMT
I don’t think Starmer is capable of stepping up. He has zero charisma and apparently no political message. He doesn’t seem to stand for anything. I wish it was different because I suspect the one thing you and I would agree on, Oggy, is we need to get rid of this PM and this government as soon as possible. But, sadly, Starmer is not the man to do it. Starmer may not win a labour majority. But he is inoffensive to lib dem voters, and even tories who hate Johnson don’t hate Starmer like they did Corbyn and so may vote lib dem to oust Johnson even if it leads to a Starmer led government. There is a clear anti tory majority while Johnson is PM, and voters are beginning to realise in our undemocratic voting system, it is all about who you are voting against, rather than for. So if we see trends as they are going with anti tory voting for whichever party has the best chance of beating the tories, the tories will be denied their majority. If the Tories replace Johnson, that may change. The last time I voted “against” something instead of “for” something was in 2010 when I voted LibDem to help keep the Tories out. But we ended up with a Tory government anyway and I’m sure I don’t need to remind you of who was to blame for that. I suspect that there are many, many more like me who will never make that mistake again and will never trust the Liberal party again.
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Post by knype on Jun 24, 2022 9:51:22 GMT
It is simply true, you throw the racist tag around and tag people in certain categories when you know nothing about them! I call out racism when a racist makes racist posts on a public messageboard. You're complaining no one knows you yet here you are making assumptions about others? Utter lies again
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Post by oggyoggy on Jun 24, 2022 9:54:05 GMT
Starmer may not win a labour majority. But he is inoffensive to lib dem voters, and even tories who hate Johnson don’t hate Starmer like they did Corbyn and so may vote lib dem to oust Johnson even if it leads to a Starmer led government. There is a clear anti tory majority while Johnson is PM, and voters are beginning to realise in our undemocratic voting system, it is all about who you are voting against, rather than for. So if we see trends as they are going with anti tory voting for whichever party has the best chance of beating the tories, the tories will be denied their majority. If the Tories replace Johnson, that may change. The last time I voted “against” something instead of “for” something was in 2010 when I voted LibDem to help keep the Tories out. But we ended up with a Tory government anyway and I’m sure I don’t need to remind you of who was to blame for that. I suspect that there are many, many more like me who will never make that mistake again and will never trust the Liberal party again. Blaming the lib dems for tory policies now is idiotic! Think about almost every positive policy that came out of the coalition then have a look at where those policies came from: Seed investment tax relief for business investment - lib dems Legalise gay marriage- lib dems Increases to minimum wage - lib dems Increase tax free income threshold - lib dems National green investment bank - lib dems Apprenticeship schemes - lib dems Pupil premiums in schools - lib dems Proper separation of high street and investment banks - lib dems Shared parental leave - lib dems More free childcare- lib dems So basically the vast majority of good that was done during the coalition was lib dem policy and not tory policy. Don’t blame the lib dems for Brown not wanting to form a government with them and Cameron wanting to. They were then walked all over and have been punished since. But is that anger many have against the lib dems worth more of what we have now?
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