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Post by bathstoke on Sept 1, 2019 17:07:21 GMT
Your post has another similarity to Nazism. It contains little truths, but massive lies. The EU is our biggest trading partner & accounts for 46% of our business. Would like to know what you mean by ‘little truths and massive lies’ from the above comparison? Please itemise from the list so that we can all be clear on this... True democracy is all I care about!! I’ll tell you what, don’t cut & paste some $#!t you found on the tinternet next time & maybe people won’t pick up on its fakeness |
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Post by bathstoke on Sept 1, 2019 17:14:53 GMT
Your post has another similarity to Nazism. It contains little truths, but massive lies. The EU is our biggest trading partner & accounts for 46% of our business. Really? Does that 46% include the goods that we send to Rotterdam for export to the rest of the world? No |
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Post by claytonscrubs on Sept 1, 2019 17:15:11 GMT
Would like to know what you mean by ‘little truths and massive lies’ from the above comparison? Please itemise from the list so that we can all be clear on this... True democracy is all I care about!! I’ll tell you what, don’t cut & paste some $#!t you found on the tinternet next time & maybe people won’t pick up on its fakeness Still waiting for a legitimate answer and you still can’t reply? Maybe you should be running Corbyn’s campaign... |
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Post by bathstoke on Sept 1, 2019 17:21:03 GMT
I’ll tell you what, don’t cut & paste some $#!t you found on the tinternet next time & maybe people won’t pick up on its fakeness Still waiting for a legitimate answer and you still can’t reply? Maybe you should be running Corbyn’s campaign... I’m not going to critic something you found of the web. It’s a piece of whimsical $#!t without basis in reality. Go back from whence you found it & ask them. |
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Post by claytonscrubs on Sept 1, 2019 17:38:10 GMT
Still waiting for a legitimate answer and you still can’t reply? Maybe you should be running Corbyn’s campaign... I’m not going to critic something you found of the web. It’s a piece of whimsical $#!t without basis in reality. Go back from whence you found it & ask them. No I don’t think so... please answer the question. You must have a view on the relevant points or do you? By the way it’s critique not critic. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2019 17:38:16 GMT
Well said ian
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Post by trickydicky73 on Sept 1, 2019 19:22:24 GMT
If you look at what happened in March with Letwin and Cooper regarding an extension they suceeded in pasing an Act of Parliament which was passed into law to force May to ask for an extension. The whole point of proroguing parliament is to reduce the time available to MP's to attempt to do something similar. What Gove is saying is that even if they do the Government may ignore the law anyway. Which would be a Leave government ignoring the law the claim to be one of the fundamental strands of the Leave campaign. Asside from the rank hypocracy it puts this country on a dangerous path if we have a government wich considers itself not to be accountable to either parliament or the law. Its amazing the way you just pass off parliamentary precedence as no big deal, my point already made that the cooper letwin bill is the first time ever parliament has passed a law to force the government to directly do something. This law was done in 1 day so to to claim the extra 4 days closing somehow affects this is just disingenuous. Parliament will not vote for the only deal the EU will offer but will vote to stop the UK leaving so just where does that leave us while parliament makes up its mind ? It's bollocks. They voted to trigger Article 50 and are now trying to stop it running it's course. They are trying to muster legislation in a week to stop No Deal, but they couldn't agree to a deal in 3 years. They are transparent, lying bastards, not protectors of democracy. Fuck 'em. |
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Post by bathstoke on Sept 1, 2019 19:53:33 GMT
I’m not going to critic something you found of the web. It’s a piece of whimsical $#!t without basis in reality. Go back from whence you found it & ask them. No I don’t think so... please answer the question. You must have a view on the relevant points or do you? By the way it’s critique not critic. “No I don’t think so” WTFRU, Noel Coward. Go £@#& MoggyXx |
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Post by bathstoke on Sept 1, 2019 20:12:31 GMT
Mary, if you’re short of decent w@#&!n material I can’t point you in the right direction, but that is plain w@#&! |
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Post by claytonscrubs on Sept 1, 2019 20:16:32 GMT
No I don’t think so... please answer the question. You must have a view on the relevant points or do you? By the way it’s critique not critic. “No I don’t think so” WTFRU, Noel Coward. Go £@#& MoggyXx Sorry but I think you have a problem or two... and still haven’t answered my question? Very sad and typical that you have to resort to insults because you’ve got nothing more productive to say! |
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Post by bathstoke on Sept 1, 2019 20:20:21 GMT
“No I don’t think so” WTFRU, Noel Coward. Go £@#& MoggyXx Sorry but I think you have a problem or two... and still haven’t answered my question? Very sad and typical that you have to resort to insults because you’ve got nothing more productive to say! Mr Cut & paste man says others have nothing to say |
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Post by claytonscrubs on Sept 1, 2019 20:24:53 GMT
Sorry but I think you have a problem or two... and still haven’t answered my question? Very sad and typical that you have to resort to insults because you’ve got nothing more productive to say! Mr Cut & paste man says others have nothing to say Oh dear, that just sums everything up then... 🙄 |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2019 20:49:54 GMT
Mary, if you’re short of decent w@#&!n material I can’t point you in the right direction, but that is plain w@#&! I know the guy who makes them is a right tit but it's not about him bath I posted it for the Ian duncan Smith interview |
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Post by tuum on Sept 2, 2019 4:37:40 GMT
Really? Does that 46% include the goods that we send to Rotterdam for export to the rest of the world? No Thanks. I did some basic research and found that our exports to the EU have been decreasing for about 15 years now although in the last 2 years it has increased back up to the 46%. I think that the 46% does include the "Rotterdam effect". However, the RE is not as big as I originally thought...perhaps accounting for 4-8% of the 46%. I thought your number was high but I was confusing exports with GDP. In terms of GDP the EU accounts for about 9% of our GDP. This looks relatively small but I don't know whether 9% is statistically significant or not in the grand scheme of things. I could check other countries GDP ratios but I have work to do unfortunately. I will leave all the detailed stuff to the economists among us. |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 2, 2019 5:20:13 GMT
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Post by Northy on Sept 2, 2019 6:25:00 GMT
Anti democratic? The party manifesto was to deliver Brexit wasn't it, May saying no deal better than a bad deal many times, how is that undemocratic? If they didn't like what was in the manifesto, the major point, surely they should have had principles and stood aside for another candidate? |
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Post by Northy on Sept 2, 2019 6:26:45 GMT
I see the BBC are full in remainiac this morning, guests to Gordon Brown, Long Bailey, Sandbach, I wonder if they will have 3 prominent leave people on ...
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Sept 2, 2019 6:50:28 GMT
For me Momo there is a bitof a problem in your strategy that seems to be ..."Tories totally evil, back Labour whatever" I don't think that is what the current debate is about. You are fighting the wrong current battle. Paul Mason , Owen Jones, McDonnell, Momentum etc seem to be fighting the same battle.....get rid of this Tory government at all costs. To do so there seems a presumption that a " socialist" Labour government would follow. in my opinion by no means certain, in fact highly unlikely. In their stance they are actually siding with Adonis, Soros, House of Lords, Central bankers, Blair, Major, Clarke etc etc.....very uncomfortable bedfellows despised by " momentum".....and in my opinion very happy to exploit this so called" left's" mistaken belief in staying in the EU. Those that exploit the working class would be very happy with the ( political arrangement) status quo because this system works for them. Momentum are encouraging people to take to the streets to support this ( political arrangement) status quo.....from what I've seen those actually on the streets seem to me to be a type of " ideological middle class ( alongside others who have real genuine concerns about the implications of a proper BREXIT) . By the stance that Labour have taken they have given the ( largely Northern) working class traditional Labour voter who voted for Brexit nowhere to go. To vote BREXIT they have now become Nazis. They have argued thst anyone who takes a different view is Far right. The ordinary person who wants to exit the EU has become far right. 17.4 m electors. They have tried to shift the" centre ground" and it has suited the media and powers to be to let them do so. By feeling abandoned those people will look elsewhere. For me current Labour have not come to terms with; 1 Many working class people are st heart patriotic, they don't need a referendum campaign to influence their thoughts snd beliefs.....they actually love thr country and don't want interference from outside....a simple concept really. 2 They have concerns about immigration ( lack of integration and sheer numbers) and its affects on their communities. No one is listening. 3 They wouldn't mind some real change that gives their children some hope for the future rather than a role in being a cog in the muti national global machines. 4 They don't really want more pity and benefits to be labelled disabled, dependent and hopeless rather a bit of hope ( but by playing this card too often Labour have encouraged collusion of many who see dependency as the only way to survive). Many of the working class work hard or want to work hard to better themselves.....all too often Labour have had a big problem with people who become really successful through the system ( except for millionaire Politicians). 5 In my opinion traditional Labour supporters don't like the hypocrisy of politicians eg those who make extortionate claims on expenses or those like Abbot who sends her own children to private school and yet believes that the state system is best for everyone else. What happened to leading by example ( that's why Jesus was successful). 6 By not honouring the referendum result it is a kick in the teeth for the electorate and not democratic and this alone has been the root cause of all the other parliamentary issues....we know best. Labour's stance is much more likely to lead to a Tory government for the foreseeable future.....the current Labour politicians are so poor in leadership and strategy that they seem to have given up on trying to win an election on a radical ( and by radical I don't mean tweaking the system, tax the rich , give a bit more to the poor and disabled) optimistic and empowering strategy for change. The only influence that they can perceive having is on the back of the EU, not through their own vision and dynamism. They are a poor lot. |
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Post by bathstoke on Sept 2, 2019 7:05:18 GMT
For me Momo there is a bitof a problem in your strategy that seems to be ..."Tories totally evil, back Labour whatever" I don't think that is what the current debate is about. You are fighting the wrong current battle. Paul Mason , Owen Jones, McDonnell, Momentum etc seem to be fighting the same battle.....get rid of this Tory government at all costs. To do so there seems a presumption that a " socialist" Labour government would follow. in my opinion by no means certain, in fact highly unlikely. In their stance they are actually siding with Adonis, Soros, House of Lords, Central bankers, Blair, Major, Clarke etc etc.....very uncomfortable bedfellows despised by " momentum".....and in my opinion very happy to exploit this so called" left's" mistaken belief in staying in the EU. Those that exploit the working class would be very happy with the ( political arrangement) status quo because this system works for them. Momentum are encouraging people to take to the streets to support this ( political arrangement) status quo.....from what I've seen those actually on the streets seem to me to be a type of " ideological middle class ( alongside others who have real genuine concerns about the implications of a proper BREXIT) . By the stance that Labour have taken they have given the ( largely Northern) working class traditional Labour voter who voted for Brexit nowhere to go. To vote BREXIT they have now become Nazis. They have argued thst anyone who takes a different view is Far right. The ordinary person who wants to exit the EU has become far right. 17.4 m electors. They have tried to shift the" centre ground" and it has suited the media and powers to be to let them do so. By feeling abandoned those people will look elsewhere. For me current Labour have not come to terms with; 1 Many working class people are st heart patriotic, they don't need a referendum campaign to influence their thoughts snd beliefs.....they actually love thr country and don't want interference from outside....a simple concept really. 2 They have concerns about immigration ( lack of integration and sheer numbers) and its affects on thrir communities. No one is listening. 3 They wouldn't mind some real change that gives their children some hope for the future rather than a role in bring a cog in the muti national global machines. 4 They don't really want more pity and benefits to be labelled disabled, dependent and hopeless rather a bit of hope ( but by playing this card too often Labour have encouraged collusion of many who see dependency as the only wsy to survive). Many of the working class eork hard or want to work hard to better themselves.....all too often Labour have had a big problem with people who become really successful through the system ( except for millionaire Politicians). 5 In my opinion traditional Labour supporters don't like the hypocrisy of politicians eg those who make extortionate claims on expenses or those like Abbot who sends her own children to private school and yet believes that the state system is best for everyone else. What happened to leading by example ( that's why Jesus was successful). 6 By not honouring the referendum result it is a kick in the teeth for the electorate and not democratic and this alone has been the root cause of all the other parliamentary issues....we know best. Labour's stance is much more likely to lead to a Tory government for the foreseeable future.....the current Labour politicians are so poor in leadership and strategy that they seem to have given up on trying to win an election on a radical ( and by radical I don't mean tweaking the system, tax the rich , give a bit more to the poor and disabled) optimistic and empowering strategy for change. The only influence that they can perceive having is on the back of the EU, not through their own vision and dynamism. They are a poor lot. Aside from your stance that Labour are totally evil, back Torys whatever, Can you get your keyboard fixed! I’m not surprised it’s broke, the amount that you post. Harry’s keyboard is also broken & needs fixing. Makes you think, dunt eet! |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 2, 2019 7:06:10 GMT
For me Momo there is a bitof a problem in your strategy that seems to be ..."Tories totally evil, back Labour whatever" I don't think that is what the current debate is about. You are fighting the wrong current battle. Paul Mason , Owen Jones, McDonnell, Momentum etc seem to be fighting the same battle.....get rid of this Tory government at all costs. To do so there seems a presumption that a " socialist" Labour government would follow. in my opinion by no means certain, in fact highly unlikely. In their stance they are actually siding with Adonis, Soros, House of Lords, Central bankers, Blair, Major, Clarke etc etc.....very uncomfortable bedfellows despised by " momentum".....and in my opinion very happy to exploit this so called" left's" mistaken belief in staying in the EU. Those that exploit the working class would be very happy with the ( political arrangement) status quo because this system works for them. Momentum are encouraging people to take to the streets to support this ( political arrangement) status quo.....from what I've seen those actually on the streets seem to me to be a type of " ideological middle class ( alongside others who have real genuine concerns about the implications of a proper BREXIT) . By the stance that Labour have taken they have given the ( largely Northern) working class traditional Labour voter who voted for Brexit nowhere to go. To vote BREXIT they have now become Nazis. They have argued thst anyone who takes a different view is Far right. The ordinary person who wants to exit the EU has become far right. 17.4 m electors. They have tried to shift the" centre ground" and it has suited the media and powers to be to let them do so. By feeling abandoned those people will look elsewhere. For me current Labour have not come to terms with; 1 Many working class people are st heart patriotic, they don't need a referendum campaign to influence their thoughts snd beliefs.....they actually love thr country and don't want interference from outside....a simple concept really. 2 They have concerns about immigration ( lack of integration and sheer numbers) and its affects on thrir communities. No one is listening. 3 They wouldn't mind some real change that gives their children some hope for the future rather than a role in bring a cog in the muti national global machines. 4 They don't really want more pity and benefits to be labelled disabled, dependent and hopeless rather a bit of hope ( but by playing this card too often Labour have encouraged collusion of many who see dependency as the only wsy to survive). Many of the working class eork hard or want to work hard to better themselves.....all too often Labour have had a big problem with people who become really successful through the system ( except for millionaire Politicians). 5 In my opinion traditional Labour supporters don't like the hypocrisy of politicians eg those who make extortionate claims on expenses or those like Abbot who sends her own children to private school and yet believes that the state system is best for everyone else. What happened to leading by example ( that's why Jesus was successful). 6 By not honouring the referendum result it is a kick in the teeth for the electorate and not democratic and this alone has been the root cause of all the other parliamentary issues....we know best. Labour's stance is much more likely to lead to a Tory government for the foreseeable future.....the current Labour politicians are so poor in leadership and strategy that they seem to have given up on trying to win an election on a radical ( and by radical I don't mean tweaking the system, tax the rich , give a bit more to the poor and disabled) optimistic and empowering strategy for change. The only influence that they can perceive having is on the back of the EU, not through their own vision and dynamism. They are a poor lot. It's nothing to with that. It's to do with entitled right wing bastards avoiding scrutiny, making threats and imposing THEIR Brexit on everyone without check or debate. Utter wankers. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Sept 2, 2019 7:21:25 GMT
For me Momo there is a bitof a problem in your strategy that seems to be ..."Tories totally evil, back Labour whatever" I don't think that is what the current debate is about. You are fighting the wrong current battle. Paul Mason , Owen Jones, McDonnell, Momentum etc seem to be fighting the same battle.....get rid of this Tory government at all costs. To do so there seems a presumption that a " socialist" Labour government would follow. in my opinion by no means certain, in fact highly unlikely. In their stance they are actually siding with Adonis, Soros, House of Lords, Central bankers, Blair, Major, Clarke etc etc.....very uncomfortable bedfellows despised by " momentum".....and in my opinion very happy to exploit this so called" left's" mistaken belief in staying in the EU. Those that exploit the working class would be very happy with the ( political arrangement) status quo because this system works for them. Momentum are encouraging people to take to the streets to support this ( political arrangement) status quo.....from what I've seen those actually on the streets seem to me to be a type of " ideological middle class ( alongside others who have real genuine concerns about the implications of a proper BREXIT) . By the stance that Labour have taken they have given the ( largely Northern) working class traditional Labour voter who voted for Brexit nowhere to go. To vote BREXIT they have now become Nazis. They have argued thst anyone who takes a different view is Far right. The ordinary person who wants to exit the EU has become far right. 17.4 m electors. They have tried to shift the" centre ground" and it has suited the media and powers to be to let them do so. By feeling abandoned those people will look elsewhere. For me current Labour have not come to terms with; 1 Many working class people are st heart patriotic, they don't need a referendum campaign to influence their thoughts snd beliefs.....they actually love thr country and don't want interference from outside....a simple concept really. 2 They have concerns about immigration ( lack of integration and sheer numbers) and its affects on thrir communities. No one is listening. 3 They wouldn't mind some real change that gives their children some hope for the future rather than a role in bring a cog in the muti national global machines. 4 They don't really want more pity and benefits to be labelled disabled, dependent and hopeless rather a bit of hope ( but by playing this card too often Labour have encouraged collusion of many who see dependency as the only wsy to survive). Many of the working class eork hard or want to work hard to better themselves.....all too often Labour have had a big problem with people who become really successful through the system ( except for millionaire Politicians). 5 In my opinion traditional Labour supporters don't like the hypocrisy of politicians eg those who make extortionate claims on expenses or those like Abbot who sends her own children to private school and yet believes that the state system is best for everyone else. What happened to leading by example ( that's why Jesus was successful). 6 By not honouring the referendum result it is a kick in the teeth for the electorate and not democratic and this alone has been the root cause of all the other parliamentary issues....we know best. Labour's stance is much more likely to lead to a Tory government for the foreseeable future.....the current Labour politicians are so poor in leadership and strategy that they seem to have given up on trying to win an election on a radical ( and by radical I don't mean tweaking the system, tax the rich , give a bit more to the poor and disabled) optimistic and empowering strategy for change. The only influence that they can perceive having is on the back of the EU, not through their own vision and dynamism. They are a poor lot. Aside from your stance that Labour are totally evil, back Torys whatever, Can you get your keyboard fixed! I’m not surprised it’s broke, the amount that you post. Harry’s keyboard is also broken & needs fixing. Makes you think, dunt eet! Actually Bath I don't support the Tories and I don't think that Labour supporters are totally evil. I think that the Labour party have got it totally wrong though. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Sept 2, 2019 7:27:06 GMT
For me Momo there is a bitof a problem in your strategy that seems to be ..."Tories totally evil, back Labour whatever" I don't think that is what the current debate is about. You are fighting the wrong current battle. Paul Mason , Owen Jones, McDonnell, Momentum etc seem to be fighting the same battle.....get rid of this Tory government at all costs. To do so there seems a presumption that a " socialist" Labour government would follow. in my opinion by no means certain, in fact highly unlikely. In their stance they are actually siding with Adonis, Soros, House of Lords, Central bankers, Blair, Major, Clarke etc etc.....very uncomfortable bedfellows despised by " momentum".....and in my opinion very happy to exploit this so called" left's" mistaken belief in staying in the EU. Those that exploit the working class would be very happy with the ( political arrangement) status quo because this system works for them. Momentum are encouraging people to take to the streets to support this ( political arrangement) status quo.....from what I've seen those actually on the streets seem to me to be a type of " ideological middle class ( alongside others who have real genuine concerns about the implications of a proper BREXIT) . By the stance that Labour have taken they have given the ( largely Northern) working class traditional Labour voter who voted for Brexit nowhere to go. To vote BREXIT they have now become Nazis. They have argued thst anyone who takes a different view is Far right. The ordinary person who wants to exit the EU has become far right. 17.4 m electors. They have tried to shift the" centre ground" and it has suited the media and powers to be to let them do so. By feeling abandoned those people will look elsewhere. For me current Labour have not come to terms with; 1 Many working class people are st heart patriotic, they don't need a referendum campaign to influence their thoughts snd beliefs.....they actually love thr country and don't want interference from outside....a simple concept really. 2 They have concerns about immigration ( lack of integration and sheer numbers) and its affects on thrir communities. No one is listening. 3 They wouldn't mind some real change that gives their children some hope for the future rather than a role in bring a cog in the muti national global machines. 4 They don't really want more pity and benefits to be labelled disabled, dependent and hopeless rather a bit of hope ( but by playing this card too often Labour have encouraged collusion of many who see dependency as the only wsy to survive). Many of the working class eork hard or want to work hard to better themselves.....all too often Labour have had a big problem with people who become really successful through the system ( except for millionaire Politicians). 5 In my opinion traditional Labour supporters don't like the hypocrisy of politicians eg those who make extortionate claims on expenses or those like Abbot who sends her own children to private school and yet believes that the state system is best for everyone else. What happened to leading by example ( that's why Jesus was successful). 6 By not honouring the referendum result it is a kick in the teeth for the electorate and not democratic and this alone has been the root cause of all the other parliamentary issues....we know best. Labour's stance is much more likely to lead to a Tory government for the foreseeable future.....the current Labour politicians are so poor in leadership and strategy that they seem to have given up on trying to win an election on a radical ( and by radical I don't mean tweaking the system, tax the rich , give a bit more to the poor and disabled) optimistic and empowering strategy for change. The only influence that they can perceive having is on the back of the EU, not through their own vision and dynamism. They are a poor lot. It's nothing to with that. It's to do with entitled right wing bastards avoiding scrutiny, making threats and imposing THEIR Brexit on everyone without check or debate. Utter wankers. I don't think it is though Momo. Labour seem to have become incapable of listening and the extreme side of Labour seem to just keep repeating what you are saying. Reminds me very much of Militant in he 80s. Many of us would have liked to have voted Labour but I'm afraid that this lot seem to have become irrelevant. It's not just about the Tories, Labour need to show that they are better. They just don't seem credible anymore, even a bit hysterical. I can't stand the Lib Dems but at least they are clear on BREXIT. |
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Post by lommack on Sept 2, 2019 7:28:05 GMT
For me Momo there is a bitof a problem in your strategy that seems to be ..."Tories totally evil, back Labour whatever" I don't think that is what the current debate is about. You are fighting the wrong current battle. Paul Mason , Owen Jones, McDonnell, Momentum etc seem to be fighting the same battle.....get rid of this Tory government at all costs. To do so there seems a presumption that a " socialist" Labour government would follow. in my opinion by no means certain, in fact highly unlikely. In their stance they are actually siding with Adonis, Soros, House of Lords, Central bankers, Blair, Major, Clarke etc etc.....very uncomfortable bedfellows despised by " momentum".....and in my opinion very happy to exploit this so called" left's" mistaken belief in staying in the EU. Those that exploit the working class would be very happy with the ( political arrangement) status quo because this system works for them. Momentum are encouraging people to take to the streets to support this ( political arrangement) status quo.....from what I've seen those actually on the streets seem to me to be a type of " ideological middle class ( alongside others who have real genuine concerns about the implications of a proper BREXIT) . By the stance that Labour have taken they have given the ( largely Northern) working class traditional Labour voter who voted for Brexit nowhere to go. To vote BREXIT they have now become Nazis. They have argued thst anyone who takes a different view is Far right. The ordinary person who wants to exit the EU has become far right. 17.4 m electors. They have tried to shift the" centre ground" and it has suited the media and powers to be to let them do so. By feeling abandoned those people will look elsewhere. For me current Labour have not come to terms with; 1 Many working class people are st heart patriotic, they don't need a referendum campaign to influence their thoughts snd beliefs.....they actually love thr country and don't want interference from outside....a simple concept really. 2 They have concerns about immigration ( lack of integration and sheer numbers) and its affects on thrir communities. No one is listening. 3 They wouldn't mind some real change that gives their children some hope for the future rather than a role in bring a cog in the muti national global machines. 4 They don't really want more pity and benefits to be labelled disabled, dependent and hopeless rather a bit of hope ( but by playing this card too often Labour have encouraged collusion of many who see dependency as the only wsy to survive). Many of the working class eork hard or want to work hard to better themselves.....all too often Labour have had a big problem with people who become really successful through the system ( except for millionaire Politicians). 5 In my opinion traditional Labour supporters don't like the hypocrisy of politicians eg those who make extortionate claims on expenses or those like Abbot who sends her own children to private school and yet believes that the state system is best for everyone else. What happened to leading by example ( that's why Jesus was successful). 6 By not honouring the referendum result it is a kick in the teeth for the electorate and not democratic and this alone has been the root cause of all the other parliamentary issues....we know best. Labour's stance is much more likely to lead to a Tory government for the foreseeable future.....the current Labour politicians are so poor in leadership and strategy that they seem to have given up on trying to win an election on a radical ( and by radical I don't mean tweaking the system, tax the rich , give a bit more to the poor and disabled) optimistic and empowering strategy for change. The only influence that they can perceive having is on the back of the EU, not through their own vision and dynamism. They are a poor lot. Copy and paste |
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Post by bathstoke on Sept 2, 2019 7:28:28 GMT
Aside from your stance that Labour are totally evil, back Torys whatever, Can you get your keyboard fixed! I’m not surprised it’s broke, the amount that you post. Harry’s keyboard is also broken & needs fixing. Makes you think, dunt eet! Actually Bath I don't support the Tories and I don't think that Labour supporters are totally evil. I think that the Labour party have got it totally wrong though. & the Torys have got it right!?! |
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Post by LL Cool Dave on Sept 2, 2019 7:30:05 GMT
I see the BBC are full in remainiac this morning, guests to Gordon Brown, Long Bailey, Sandbach, I wonder if they will have 3 prominent leave people on ... The BBC bias depends on what BBC you're watching/listening to. The Radio 4 Today program is massively biased towards brexit. I wonder why? |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Sept 2, 2019 7:31:30 GMT
Actually Bath I don't support the Tories and I don't think that Labour supporters are totally evil. I think that the Labour party have got it totally wrong though. & the Torys have got it right!?! At the moment Johnson is the only one ( in parliament) that has got it right on BREXIT....it remains to be seen if he can/ will deliver BREXIT. But the main issue at the moment is BREXIT, which is not party political. |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Sept 2, 2019 7:43:18 GMT
For me Momo there is a bitof a problem in your strategy that seems to be ..."Tories totally evil, back Labour whatever" I don't think that is what the current debate is about. You are fighting the wrong current battle. Paul Mason , Owen Jones, McDonnell, Momentum etc seem to be fighting the same battle.....get rid of this Tory government at all costs. To do so there seems a presumption that a " socialist" Labour government would follow. in my opinion by no means certain, in fact highly unlikely. In their stance they are actually siding with Adonis, Soros, House of Lords, Central bankers, Blair, Major, Clarke etc etc.....very uncomfortable bedfellows despised by " momentum".....and in my opinion very happy to exploit this so called" left's" mistaken belief in staying in the EU. Those that exploit the working class would be very happy with the ( political arrangement) status quo because this system works for them. Momentum are encouraging people to take to the streets to support this ( political arrangement) status quo.....from what I've seen those actually on the streets seem to me to be a type of " ideological middle class ( alongside others who have real genuine concerns about the implications of a proper BREXIT) . By the stance that Labour have taken they have given the ( largely Northern) working class traditional Labour voter who voted for Brexit nowhere to go. To vote BREXIT they have now become Nazis. They have argued thst anyone who takes a different view is Far right. The ordinary person who wants to exit the EU has become far right. 17.4 m electors. They have tried to shift the" centre ground" and it has suited the media and powers to be to let them do so. By feeling abandoned those people will look elsewhere. For me current Labour have not come to terms with; 1 Many working class people are st heart patriotic, they don't need a referendum campaign to influence their thoughts snd beliefs.....they actually love thr country and don't want interference from outside....a simple concept really. 2 They have concerns about immigration ( lack of integration and sheer numbers) and its affects on thrir communities. No one is listening. 3 They wouldn't mind some real change that gives their children some hope for the future rather than a role in bring a cog in the muti national global machines. 4 They don't really want more pity and benefits to be labelled disabled, dependent and hopeless rather a bit of hope ( but by playing this card too often Labour have encouraged collusion of many who see dependency as the only wsy to survive). Many of the working class eork hard or want to work hard to better themselves.....all too often Labour have had a big problem with people who become really successful through the system ( except for millionaire Politicians). 5 In my opinion traditional Labour supporters don't like the hypocrisy of politicians eg those who make extortionate claims on expenses or those like Abbot who sends her own children to private school and yet believes that the state system is best for everyone else. What happened to leading by example ( that's why Jesus was successful). 6 By not honouring the referendum result it is a kick in the teeth for the electorate and not democratic and this alone has been the root cause of all the other parliamentary issues....we know best. Labour's stance is much more likely to lead to a Tory government for the foreseeable future.....the current Labour politicians are so poor in leadership and strategy that they seem to have given up on trying to win an election on a radical ( and by radical I don't mean tweaking the system, tax the rich , give a bit more to the poor and disabled) optimistic and empowering strategy for change. The only influence that they can perceive having is on the back of the EU, not through their own vision and dynamism. They are a poor lot. Copy and paste Funny, but I have heard a lot of that from former Labour voters, who wouldn't vote for them now. A massive reason for the Brexit result was the arrogance of Labour not listening to their genuine concerns about levels of immigration, for instance. Something which John Mann warned the Labour leadership about. It fell on deaf ears. So the people I know, support workers, care workers (real working class people) are completely disillusioned with Labour, a party they thought supported them. Not one I know has No Deal as their major concern. |
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 2, 2019 7:46:03 GMT
It's nothing to with that. It's to do with entitled right wing bastards avoiding scrutiny, making threats and imposing THEIR Brexit on everyone without check or debate. Utter wankers. I don't think it is though Momo. Labour seem to have become incapable of listening and the extreme side of Labour seem to just keep repeating what you are saying. Reminds me very much of Militant in he 80s. Many of us would have liked to have voted Labour but I'm afraid that this lot seem to have become irrelevant. It's not just about the Tories, Labour need to show that they are better. They just don't seem credible anymore, even a bit hysterical. I can't stand the Lib Dems but at least they are clear on BREXIT. Which bit aren't you getting John? The enforced closure of parliament and shutting down scrutiny and debate? The threat to ignore the law of the land should legislation be passed this week The threat to sack MP's who don't agree with a very narrow blinkered entitled view of Brexit We are currently living in a right wing dictatorship under any measure. |
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Post by lommack on Sept 2, 2019 7:46:56 GMT
Funny, but I have heard a lot of that from former Labour voters, who wouldn't vote for them now. A massive reason for the Brexit result was the arrogance of Labour not listening to their genuine concerns about levels of immigration, for instance. Something which John Mann warned the Labour leadership about. It fell on deaf ears. So the people I know, support workers, care workers (real working class people) are completely disillusioned with Labour, a party they thought supported them. Not one I know has No Deal as their major concern. Are you Brexit at any cost? |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Sept 2, 2019 7:52:27 GMT
Funny, but I have heard a lot of that from former Labour voters, who wouldn't vote for them now. A massive reason for the Brexit result was the arrogance of Labour not listening to their genuine concerns about levels of immigration, for instance. Something which John Mann warned the Labour leadership about. It fell on deaf ears. So the people I know, support workers, care workers (real working class people) are completely disillusioned with Labour, a party they thought supported them. Not one I know has No Deal as their major concern. Are you Brexit at any cost? I would prefer a free trade deal, but I think our parliament trying to take no deal off the table weakens our hand in negotiating with the EU for one. I said it at the time when Corbyn and others started shouting about it. |
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