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Post by partickpotter on Dec 4, 2018 17:58:30 GMT
God help us. A shambolic government vs a shambolic opposition. What a fucking mess. Not as bad as a Government with no legitimacy and a lost mandate being allowed to limp on for another 4 years. The people's vote is a hateful prospect but should happen in the form of a General Election and take it from there. I don't think that will work. The problem is Brexit is not party political - so a general election won't solve anything. It's actually the reason why we are in such a mess today. May's misjudgement way back meant she was in trouble in negotiating Brexit both in Europe and in Westminster. I must admit I have no idea of how this thing will resolve itself - other than some sort of national government which will see Brexit delivered. The only thing is there ain't enough Brexit MPs to make that happen. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Dec 4, 2018 17:59:14 GMT
Whichever side of the Political divide you sit on, these are unprecedented and tumultuous times. It's hard to know what will happen but an election has to be on the cards surely I think it depends (to some extent) on how many votes Theresa May loses next vote by. 1)She might resign..but then we'd have a Conservative Party Leadership contest in the middle of all this mess. 2)There could be a general election but isn't that dependent on two thirds of MPs passing an amendment? (hardly likely) 3)There could be a second Referendum 4)We might go out on WTO rules (No deal) What are the odds on May not backing her own deal and saying it's best to revoke Article 50 because it's in 'The National Interest' (ie My interest) Whatever else you might think NEVER forget that its The Conservative Party that's fucked up. They've led us into this mess and they need to clean all this shit up The referendum ballot said 'the' Government will implement your decision, not a ''Conservative' Government will implement. At the time there was a sitting Con Government. That responsibility was reinforced after last years GE. There is ZERO evidence that Labour would have done any better. In fact, their official line of 'a' Customs Union and staying in "the" Single Market (and FoM) would have produced an even softer Brexit. The 17.4 million included millions and millions of Labour voters. |
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Post by oggyoggy on Dec 4, 2018 17:59:30 GMT
Oh the sweet irony of an EU Judge deciding the UK Parliament can pass a UK law to stop Brexit. Thanks Manuel. Actually the ECJ is determining the correct interpretation of EU law. That is the function of the ECJ after all. |
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Post by Clayton Wood on Dec 4, 2018 18:00:29 GMT
Will us peasants get to see the "Full Legal Advice"? Or are we too thick and unworthy of such privileged information. If this reveals anything sinister many politicians will be pondering their next move as will the populace. Interesting times ahead for sure. Why should we? We are thick, racist fucks, after all. I'm relying on Oggy to review the full legal advice and give impartial advice to this board. |
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 4, 2018 18:04:14 GMT
Whichever side of the Political divide you sit on, these are unprecedented and tumultuous times. It's hard to know what will happen but an election has to be on the cards surely I think it depends (to some extent) on how many votes Theresa May loses next vote by. 1)She might resign..but then we'd have a Conservative Party Leadership contest in the middle of all this mess. 2)There could be a general election but isn't that dependent on two thirds of MPs passing an amendment? (hardly likely) 3)There could be a second Referendum 4)We might go out on WTO rules (No deal) What are the odds on May not backing her own deal and saying it's best to revoke Article 50 because it's in 'The National Interest' (ie My interest) Whatever else you might think NEVER forget that its The Conservative Party that's fucked up. They've led us into this mess and they need to clean all this shit up Good analysis - well until the last bit. The Tories delivered the referendum Blair and Brown promised but reneged on. It, the referendum, had to happen. It was a ballot the country clearly wanted - otherwise the turnout would have been pish and Remain would have strolled home. But, of course, leave won, and what we have been left with is the political class of all parties fighting against a clear mandate. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Dec 4, 2018 18:04:23 GMT
Farage quits UKIP.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 4, 2018 18:06:36 GMT
Why should we? We are thick, racist fucks, after all. I'm relying on Oggy to review the full legal advice and give impartial advice to this board. Every day is another kick in the teeth for the working class, and anyone who supports democracy. I knew this would happen as soon as it was mooted. It's utterly predictable, I called it from day one. We were not supposed to vote Leave. It is not allowed. Whoever you vote for from now on, it's pointless. All British governments are puppets. Fuck May(for the Potters), fuck Corbyn and fuck the Cable Guy. It's over. |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 4, 2018 18:07:15 GMT
I think it depends (to some extent) on how many votes Theresa May loses next vote by. 1)She might resign..but then we'd have a Conservative Party Leadership contest in the middle of all this mess. 2)There could be a general election but isn't that dependent on two thirds of MPs passing an amendment? (hardly likely) 3)There could be a second Referendum 4)We might go out on WTO rules (No deal) What are the odds on May not backing her own deal and saying it's best to revoke Article 50 because it's in 'The National Interest' (ie My interest) Whatever else you might think NEVER forget that its The Conservative Party that's fucked up. They've led us into this mess and they need to clean all this shit up Good analysis - well until the last bit. The Tories delivered the referendum Blair and Brown promised but reneged on. It, the referendum, had to happen. It was a ballot the country clearly wanted - otherwise the turnout would have been pish and Remain would have strolled home. But, of course, leave won, and what we have been left with is the political class of all parties fighting against a clear mandate. Thank you. |
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sharpy
Academy Starlet
Posts: 104
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Post by sharpy on Dec 4, 2018 18:11:27 GMT
From what i gather many points in this "Full legal advise" contained sensitive national secruity details both from which the UK and the EU would not want published. Ken clarke hit on the notion had this been the case then these papers should have been allowed a reading in the privy council and therefore this motion would never reached the house. But that`s to easy ain`t it. Im with Tricky on all this now, it`s wearing us all down.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 4, 2018 18:17:27 GMT
All the latest contempt shit is just bollocks. It's just another vehicle for stopping Brexit. I can't believe people are buying this. It's all deception.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Dec 4, 2018 18:23:00 GMT
Oh the sweet irony of an EU Judge deciding the UK Parliament can pass a UK law to stop Brexit. Thanks Manuel. Actually the ECJ is determining the correct interpretation of EU law. That is the function of the ECJ after all. This is not an interpretation from the ECJ. Manuel Campos Sanchez-Bordona advises the ECJ (of which he is a member) and in 60% - 80% of the time the ECJ have followed his advice. This is his legal "opinion". Mr Manuel Campos Sanchez-Bordona's comments.... He believes that UK MP's should realise there is a "third option" before they vote next Tuesday. He believes there's no need for a second UK referendum because of the Miller case. Note that the vote he's talking about next week and R (Miller) v Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union [2017] are not EU law. He press released his 'opinion' deliberately before a vote in the HoC. His advice on A50 has already gone to the ECJ and they will produce their ruling in a couple of weeks. He (The EU) just wanted to get the curveball out there early. |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 4, 2018 18:26:12 GMT
Hate to say it, but he can fuck off as well. He's backed off lately. Has he been paid off? |
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Post by Clayton Wood on Dec 4, 2018 18:41:21 GMT
When asked yesterday about advice on the status of a coastal state replacing the Common Fisheries Policy the AG said he didn't have anything. He ASSUMED that legal advisers to Defra had covered it and would write to the questioner when he'd found out. How can a central plank of the withdrawal agreement have no central legal advice? A pound to a penny the majority of issues won't have had any advice to publish.
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Dec 4, 2018 19:04:37 GMT
Holly fucking Molley.
I know I'm biased but Corbyn looks like an imbecile trying to talk about Brexit in the HoC just now.
If I'm a Celeb isn't your thing check out the BBC' s Parliament channel for real entertainment.
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Post by wagsastokie on Dec 4, 2018 19:50:56 GMT
Actually the ECJ is determining the correct interpretation of EU law. That is the function of the ECJ after all. This is not an interpretation from the ECJ. Manuel Campos Sanchez-Bordona advises the ECJ (of which he is a member) and in 60% - 80% of the time the ECJ have followed his advice. This is his legal "opinion". Mr Manuel Campos Sanchez-Bordona's comments.... He believes that UK MP's should realise there is a "third option" before they vote next Tuesday. He believes there's no need for a second UK referendum because of the Miller case. Note that the vote he's talking about next week and R (Miller) v Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union [2017] are not EU law. He press released his 'opinion' deliberately before a vote in the HoC. His advice on A50 has already gone to the ECJ and they will produce their ruling in a couple of weeks. He (The EU) just wanted to get the curveball out there early. Now if I didn’t know that the Eu is run by honest decent people I would think that had been leaked so as to put pressure on the leavers to back may’s deal Whilst there’s still a chance to leave I’d be wrong though as the eu’s surely never been duplicitous in the past |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Dec 4, 2018 19:57:12 GMT
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Dec 4, 2018 19:59:10 GMT
Hate to say it, but he can fuck off as well. He's backed off lately. Has he been paid off? He knows well enough that he's a fantastic protestor but a poor politician - hence why he's never been elected as an MP. I said some time ago that no-one would be happier than him if the referendum result was overturned - it would give him a reason to exist (politically). You could be right about him being paid off. Or he's just happy to sit in the background, watch the government fuck it up, then Brexit falls flat on its arse and he can keep up his well-paid position as an anti-EU MEP. |
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Post by henry on Dec 4, 2018 20:22:12 GMT
Just another in a very long and growing line of snakes. |
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Dec 4, 2018 20:32:20 GMT
Just another in a very long and growing line of snakes. He's about to join the Tories.. |
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Post by henry on Dec 4, 2018 20:50:07 GMT
Just another in a very long and growing line of snakes. He's about to join the Tories.. Couldn't give a flying fuck who's red, blue, yellow, green anymore. Wonder when the result of the referendum is not upheld, fuck sticks like Damon Albarn will take to the stage again proclaiming "democracy is dead". I hope the EU totally butt rape this spineless country, followed by anarchy on the streets and the deployment of a European Army to keep the peace. Politicians - wankers to man / woman. Over to your lot Huddy, i can't fucking wait. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2018 21:20:55 GMT
I'm absolutely bloody furious about the way this shower in Parliament have deliberately and steadily made damned sure that the referendum result will eventually be overturned. They are supposedly there to represent the people of their constituency - they should therefore vote in accordance with how their constituency voted in the referendum never mind all this "voting with my conscience" crap.
The vast majority (if not all) of them don't deserve our votes in the next General Election - they're all a shower of spineless, gutless, duplicitous shits who have no intention of "honouring the result".
Brexit means Brexit - you're having a laugh !
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 4, 2018 21:30:11 GMT
I'm absolutely bloody furious about the way this shower in Parliament have deliberately and steadily made damned sure that the referendum result will eventually be overturned. They are supposedly there to represent the people of their constituency - they should therefore vote in accordance with how their constituency voted in the referendum never mind all this "voting with my conscience" crap. The vast majority (if not all) of them don't deserve our votes in the next General Election - they're all a shower of spineless, gutless, duplicitous shits who have no intention of "honouring the result". Brexit means Brexit - you're having a laugh ! It's not even that long since the expenses scandal, either, and Rog linked one to something dodgy recently. And then they come up with the People's Vote and people fall for it hook, line and sinker.. It's actually quite scary when you think who is running the country. Sinister. |
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Post by Gods on Dec 4, 2018 22:12:50 GMT
Dominic Grieve is a very clever man!
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 4, 2018 22:58:20 GMT
Dominic Grieve is a very clever man! He's playing a very dangerous game - as is Westminster generally. This BBC opinion piece headline sums it up nicely: Brexit debate: Parliament 'taking back control'The question is who is Parliament taking back control from. They may argue it is from the omnishambles that is the Theresa May Government. But, it seems to me, it is really about taking back control from the people who voted leave. The contempt for the electorate shown by the likes of Vince Cable is now coming to the fore with many more politicians. |
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Post by Gods on Dec 4, 2018 23:14:25 GMT
Dominic Grieve is a very clever man! He's playing a very dangerous game - as is Westminster generally. This BBC opinion piece headline sums it up nicely: Brexit debate: Parliament 'taking back control'The question is who is Parliament taking back control from. They may argue it is from the omnishambles that is the Theresa May Government. But, it seems to me, it is really about taking back control from the people who voted leave. The contempt for the electorate shown by the likes of Vince Cable is now coming to the fore with many more politicians. Taking back control is precisely what parliament should do. It's madness to run the country with random referendums. No one does it anywhere in the civilised world. |
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Dec 4, 2018 23:18:02 GMT
He's playing a very dangerous game - as is Westminster generally. This BBC opinion piece headline sums it up nicely: Brexit debate: Parliament 'taking back control'The question is who is Parliament taking back control from. They may argue it is from the omnishambles that is the Theresa May Government. But, it seems to me, it is really about taking back control from the people who voted leave. The contempt for the electorate shown by the likes of Vince Cable is now coming to the fore with many more politicians. Taking back control is precisely what parliament should do. It's madness to run the country with random referendums. No one does it anywhere in the civilised world. I think Switzerland does God's iirc |
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Post by harryburrows on Dec 4, 2018 23:23:16 GMT
He's playing a very dangerous game - as is Westminster generally. This BBC opinion piece headline sums it up nicely: Brexit debate: Parliament 'taking back control'The question is who is Parliament taking back control from. They may argue it is from the omnishambles that is the Theresa May Government. But, it seems to me, it is really about taking back control from the people who voted leave. The contempt for the electorate shown by the likes of Vince Cable is now coming to the fore with many more politicians. Taking back control is precisely what parliament should do. It's madness to run the country with random referendums. No one does it anywhere in the civilised world. It is when the electorate make the wrong decisions isn't it |
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Post by countofmontecristo on Dec 4, 2018 23:25:49 GMT
He's playing a very dangerous game - as is Westminster generally. This BBC opinion piece headline sums it up nicely: Brexit debate: Parliament 'taking back control'The question is who is Parliament taking back control from. They may argue it is from the omnishambles that is the Theresa May Government. But, it seems to me, it is really about taking back control from the people who voted leave. The contempt for the electorate shown by the likes of Vince Cable is now coming to the fore with many more politicians. Taking back control is precisely what parliament should do. It's madness to run the country with random referendums. No one does it anywhere in the civilised world. ..... just the 26 held so far across the EU regarding membership. How very uncivilised. |
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Post by Gods on Dec 4, 2018 23:46:19 GMT
Holly fucking Molley. I know I'm biased but Corbyn looks like an imbecile trying to talk about Brexit in the HoC just now. If I'm a Celeb isn't your thing check out the BBC' s Parliament channel for real entertainment. Corbyn is hopeless. Basically another brexit loon. He comes at it from the angle that the EU is just a cosy business club preventing him from implementing true socialism in the UK. I'd say he is every bit as nuts as Doc Fox, BoJo, Dickie Davis, Farrage and the rest of them, another one howling at the moon and ready for the funny farm. If you want the worst of all world's then it's brexit and a Corbyn led administration. Neither would be best for all of us. |
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Post by trickydicky73 on Dec 4, 2018 23:58:55 GMT
Taking back control is precisely what parliament should do. It's madness to run the country with random referendums. No one does it anywhere in the civilised world. It is when the electorate make the wrong decisions isn't it I actually hope it all goes to shit, now. Most of the people who voted for Brexit had nothing to lose, and politicians have made sure they have been put in their place. How dare you vote against instruction? People on here and in the media actively revelling in the public vote being overturned. A promise of honouring the result broken. We should have been bigger and better than this. We are the laughing stock of Europe now. It is not about which way you voted, its about your vote not meaning anything unless they say it does. I hope this haunts Labour and the Tories in the same way that Nick Clegg's broken promise on tuition fees haunted him. I can't begin to tell you how fucking angry I am about this. People in France are rioting over less. Sadly, I don't think there's enough people with bollocks in this country to even muster a protest. |
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