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Post by Huddysleftfoot on Feb 24, 2023 13:45:25 GMT
He's been wrong about every single thing he's ever got involved in .... not that he's bothered, still picks up his MEP pension when done, and is bankrolled by unsavoury characters intent on destroying this country. Another psychopathic grifter who should be in Jail.
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Post by prettything on Feb 24, 2023 13:45:41 GMT
I’ll never understand why the general public was able to vote on a concept, rather than a plan. It was an utterly stupid decision. Moreover, the sheer amount of time that politicians have spent trying to achieve this concept and then debate it over and over and over again has surely helped contribute to the economic woes of the country. It’s called democracy You have missed the point entirely.
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Post by wannabee on Feb 24, 2023 13:45:50 GMT
I’ll never understand why the general public was able to vote on a concept, rather than a plan. It was an utterly stupid decision. Moreover, the sheer amount of time that politicians have spent trying to achieve this concept and then debate it over and over and over again has surely helped contribute to the economic woes of the country. It was an overwhelming nostalgic desire to return to a period where Britain was actually relevant At the time things were shit from 6 years of Austerity and things couldn't get any shiter, could they .... they did In part that wish has been fulfilled as we now have the WW11 experience of Food Rationing
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Post by toppercorner on Feb 24, 2023 15:45:16 GMT
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Feb 25, 2023 7:36:44 GMT
Brexit deal incoming. Good news.
First step on the road towards undoing all the damage that's being done.
Sit back and watch the dickheads in the Tory Party tear it apart.
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Post by wannabee on Feb 25, 2023 11:54:26 GMT
Brexit deal incoming. Good news. First step on the road towards undoing all the damage that's being done. Sit back and watch the dickheads in the Tory Party tear it apart. Undoubtedly there's a Deal on the table but will Rishi sign it without DUP accepting it? Cleverly has already said it won't The ludicrously self named "Spartans" are not a threat to a Deal but could pose Political Problems for Rishi down the road. It would be delicious if a Deal is presented to Parliament and Rishi enforced a 3 line whip, back it or be sacked from the Party. The DUP have a Mighty High Horse in which to climb down from. Their natural position is to say NO to everything can they now say YES and thereby restore NI Parliament. Inevitably in any Deal not everything you ask for will be granted An added problem for DUP outside of the Protocol is that at the last NI GE they came second to Sinn Fein in seats won. Therefore if NI Parliament is restored a Nationalist Sinn Fein Michelle O'Neil will be elected First Minister of NI for the first time in the history of the Statelet. The Leader of DUP Jeffrey Robinson has avoided much of this ignominy by back tracking on his pre Election pledge of taking up his seat in NI Parliament and becoming Deputy First Minister by handing his seat to another member of his Party who had failed to be elected in the normal fashion and he remained an MP No doubt there will be furious activity in London, Brussels, Belfast and Dublin over the weekend both from the Politicians and Spin Doctors I hope they come to a sensible conclusion for everyone's benefit It has now reached a point to either "shit or get off the pot" as I can't see Brussels or London expanding anymore time on this for the foreseeable, there just isn't the Bandwidth with so many other issues to resolve
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Post by mrcoke on Feb 25, 2023 12:48:33 GMT
I am off to Portugal tomorrow for a few days. If anyone wants any tomatoes or fresh veg bringing back, just let me know. You have posted on the wrong thread, the shortages are very little if anything to do with Brexit. The primary cause are extreme weather, energy costs, and UK government policy on energy making UK electricity costs the highest in Europe. Despite the UK's economic performance being at least as good if not better than its peers, It seems that since the UK has left the EU that every problem the country faces us due to Brexit not the pandemic, the war in Ukraine, or UK government policies. Rabid anti Brexit journalists, tweeters, and posters blame everything that is unsatisfactory on Brexit. Regarding the food shortages in the UK. This article by the Guardian: www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/22/problem-shortage-fresh-food-uk-supermarkets identifies the reasons as: "poor weather reducing the harvest in Europe and north Africa, as well lower supplies from UK and Dutch producers hit by the jump in energy bills to heat glasshouses". The UK, other countries and the Netherlands in particular, " have reduced how many crops they have planted over the winter" due to the soaring costs of "energy required to light and heat greenhouses and the cost of the fertiliser used on plants." " Faced with higher costs for glasshouse crops, some retailers chose to rely more heavily this year on sourcing from Spain and north Africa, leaving them more vulnerable to the weather-triggered shortages." UK businesses have received less financial support from the government than their European counterparts. There is no mention of Brexit in the above article, which I'm sure the Guardian would do if there was any reason. The UK is highly dependent on imports at this time of year with a substantial amount from the EU. Those EU countries are producing less because of energy costs and fertiliser costs so naturally they are going to satisfy their home markets before exporting food. These are even some foolish people blaming a shortage of people to harvest crops in the UK in the muddle of winter! You really couldn't make it up. The last time anyone mentioned crop pickers shortages was last August. An independent source has carried out an unbiased investigation: www.euronews.com/green/2023/02/24/fact-check-is-brexit-to-blame-for-britains-fruit-and-vegetable-shortagesThis report finds "Contrary to some of the reaction on social media, Brexit has a minimal role to play in the immediate shortage, according to experts.""Unusual weather is primarily to be blamed for the short supply, according to Andrew Opie, director of the British Retail Consortium which represents all the major supermarkets""The situation was aggravated by diminished tomato production in greenhouses of big producer countries like the Netherlands, primarily due to high energy costs, experts said."" ...... the British Growers Association says one of the big issues arising from Brexit for the fresh produce sector - attracting workers from EU countries - has been mitigated by the Seasonal Workers Permit Scheme."Why is it just the UK that is short of fresh food?: "The location of the UK and its isolation from mainland Europe, however, has played a significant part and is the differentiator from the situation in EU countries without shortages of fruit and vegetables." “It is less costly for a supplier to supply to the Netherlands and other countries in the northern part, because they don't have these 25 miles of the English Channel to negotiate because that adds a cost,” said Chris White of Fruit Net."There is a shortage so foreign producers as less inclined to send to the UK and avoid border controls that are there to protect consumers and prefer to sell within the EU.
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Post by toppercorner on Feb 25, 2023 13:10:21 GMT
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Post by prettything on Feb 25, 2023 13:38:27 GMT
I am off to Portugal tomorrow for a few days. If anyone wants any tomatoes or fresh veg bringing back, just let me know. You have posted on the wrong thread, the shortages are very little if anything to do with Brexit. The primary cause are extreme weather, energy costs, and UK government policy on energy making UK electricity costs the highest in Europe. Despite the UK's economic performance being at least as good if not better than its peers, It seems that since the UK has left the EU that every problem the country faces us due to Brexit not the pandemic, the war in Ukraine, or UK government policies. Rabid anti Brexit journalists, tweeters, and posters blame everything that is unsatisfactory on Brexit. Regarding the food shortages in the UK. This article by the Guardian: www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/22/problem-shortage-fresh-food-uk-supermarkets identifies the reasons as: "poor weather reducing the harvest in Europe and north Africa, as well lower supplies from UK and Dutch producers hit by the jump in energy bills to heat glasshouses". The UK, other countries and the Netherlands in particular, " have reduced how many crops they have planted over the winter" due to the soaring costs of "energy required to light and heat greenhouses and the cost of the fertiliser used on plants." " Faced with higher costs for glasshouse crops, some retailers chose to rely more heavily this year on sourcing from Spain and north Africa, leaving them more vulnerable to the weather-triggered shortages." UK businesses have received less financial support from the government than their European counterparts. There is no mention of Brexit in the above article, which I'm sure the Guardian would do if there was any reason. The UK is highly dependent on imports at this time of year with a substantial amount from the EU. Those EU countries are producing less because of energy costs and fertiliser costs so naturally they are going to satisfy their home markets before exporting food. These are even some foolish people blaming a shortage of people to harvest crops in the UK in the muddle of winter! You really couldn't make it up. The last time anyone mentioned crop pickers shortages was last August. An independent source has carried out an unbiased investigation: www.euronews.com/green/2023/02/24/fact-check-is-brexit-to-blame-for-britains-fruit-and-vegetable-shortagesThis report finds "Contrary to some of the reaction on social media, Brexit has a minimal role to play in the immediate shortage, according to experts.""Unusual weather is primarily to be blamed for the short supply, according to Andrew Opie, director of the British Retail Consortium which represents all the major supermarkets""The situation was aggravated by diminished tomato production in greenhouses of big producer countries like the Netherlands, primarily due to high energy costs, experts said."" ...... the British Growers Association says one of the big issues arising from Brexit for the fresh produce sector - attracting workers from EU countries - has been mitigated by the Seasonal Workers Permit Scheme."Why is it just the UK that is short of fresh food?: "The location of the UK and its isolation from mainland Europe, however, has played a significant part and is the differentiator from the situation in EU countries without shortages of fruit and vegetables." “It is less costly for a supplier to supply to the Netherlands and other countries in the northern part, because they don't have these 25 miles of the English Channel to negotiate because that adds a cost,” said Chris White of Fruit Net."There is a shortage so foreign producers as less inclined to send to the UK and avoid border controls that are there to protect consumers and prefer to sell within the EU. Brexit does indeed play a role in extreme events like this. UK buyers are unable to source other suppliers within the EU as quickly as if they were in it. Paperwork and other administrative procedures have to be undertaken and slows down the process considerably compared to EU members in sourcing other suppliers . That’s way this situation may last for weeks rather than days.
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Post by Davef on Feb 25, 2023 13:44:03 GMT
You have posted on the wrong thread, the shortages are very little if anything to do with Brexit. The primary cause are extreme weather, energy costs, and UK government policy on energy making UK electricity costs the highest in Europe. Despite the UK's economic performance being at least as good if not better than its peers, It seems that since the UK has left the EU that every problem the country faces us due to Brexit not the pandemic, the war in Ukraine, or UK government policies. Rabid anti Brexit journalists, tweeters, and posters blame everything that is unsatisfactory on Brexit. Regarding the food shortages in the UK. This article by the Guardian: www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/22/problem-shortage-fresh-food-uk-supermarkets identifies the reasons as: "poor weather reducing the harvest in Europe and north Africa, as well lower supplies from UK and Dutch producers hit by the jump in energy bills to heat glasshouses". The UK, other countries and the Netherlands in particular, " have reduced how many crops they have planted over the winter" due to the soaring costs of "energy required to light and heat greenhouses and the cost of the fertiliser used on plants." " Faced with higher costs for glasshouse crops, some retailers chose to rely more heavily this year on sourcing from Spain and north Africa, leaving them more vulnerable to the weather-triggered shortages." UK businesses have received less financial support from the government than their European counterparts. There is no mention of Brexit in the above article, which I'm sure the Guardian would do if there was any reason. The UK is highly dependent on imports at this time of year with a substantial amount from the EU. Those EU countries are producing less because of energy costs and fertiliser costs so naturally they are going to satisfy their home markets before exporting food. These are even some foolish people blaming a shortage of people to harvest crops in the UK in the muddle of winter! You really couldn't make it up. The last time anyone mentioned crop pickers shortages was last August. An independent source has carried out an unbiased investigation: www.euronews.com/green/2023/02/24/fact-check-is-brexit-to-blame-for-britains-fruit-and-vegetable-shortagesThis report finds "Contrary to some of the reaction on social media, Brexit has a minimal role to play in the immediate shortage, according to experts.""Unusual weather is primarily to be blamed for the short supply, according to Andrew Opie, director of the British Retail Consortium which represents all the major supermarkets""The situation was aggravated by diminished tomato production in greenhouses of big producer countries like the Netherlands, primarily due to high energy costs, experts said."" ...... the British Growers Association says one of the big issues arising from Brexit for the fresh produce sector - attracting workers from EU countries - has been mitigated by the Seasonal Workers Permit Scheme."Why is it just the UK that is short of fresh food?: "The location of the UK and its isolation from mainland Europe, however, has played a significant part and is the differentiator from the situation in EU countries without shortages of fruit and vegetables." “It is less costly for a supplier to supply to the Netherlands and other countries in the northern part, because they don't have these 25 miles of the English Channel to negotiate because that adds a cost,” said Chris White of Fruit Net."There is a shortage so foreign producers as less inclined to send to the UK and avoid border controls that are there to protect consumers and prefer to sell within the EU. Brexit does indeed play a role in extreme events like this. UK buyers are unable to source other suppliers within the EU as quickly as if they were in it. Paperwork and other administrative procedures have to be undertaken and slows down the process considerably compared to EU members in sourcing other suppliers . That’s way this situation may last for weeks rather than days. Why are Ireland struggling with tomato shortages?
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Post by wannabee on Feb 25, 2023 13:49:45 GMT
I am off to Portugal tomorrow for a few days. If anyone wants any tomatoes or fresh veg bringing back, just let me know. You have posted on the wrong thread, the shortages are very little if anything to do with Brexit. The primary cause are extreme weather, energy costs, and UK government policy on energy making UK electricity costs the highest in Europe. Despite the UK's economic performance being at least as good if not better than its peers, It seems that since the UK has left the EU that every problem the country faces us due to Brexit not the pandemic, the war in Ukraine, or UK government policies. Rabid anti Brexit journalists, tweeters, and posters blame everything that is unsatisfactory on Brexit. Regarding the food shortages in the UK. This article by the Guardian: www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/22/problem-shortage-fresh-food-uk-supermarkets identifies the reasons as: "poor weather reducing the harvest in Europe and north Africa, as well lower supplies from UK and Dutch producers hit by the jump in energy bills to heat glasshouses". The UK, other countries and the Netherlands in particular, " have reduced how many crops they have planted over the winter" due to the soaring costs of "energy required to light and heat greenhouses and the cost of the fertiliser used on plants." " Faced with higher costs for glasshouse crops, some retailers chose to rely more heavily this year on sourcing from Spain and north Africa, leaving them more vulnerable to the weather-triggered shortages." UK businesses have received less financial support from the government than their European counterparts. There is no mention of Brexit in the above article, which I'm sure the Guardian would do if there was any reason. The UK is highly dependent on imports at this time of year with a substantial amount from the EU. Those EU countries are producing less because of energy costs and fertiliser costs so naturally they are going to satisfy their home markets before exporting food. These are even some foolish people blaming a shortage of people to harvest crops in the UK in the muddle of winter! You really couldn't make it up. The last time anyone mentioned crop pickers shortages was last August. An independent source has carried out an unbiased investigation: www.euronews.com/green/2023/02/24/fact-check-is-brexit-to-blame-for-britains-fruit-and-vegetable-shortagesThis report finds "Contrary to some of the reaction on social media, Brexit has a minimal role to play in the immediate shortage, according to experts.""Unusual weather is primarily to be blamed for the short supply, according to Andrew Opie, director of the British Retail Consortium which represents all the major supermarkets""The situation was aggravated by diminished tomato production in greenhouses of big producer countries like the Netherlands, primarily due to high energy costs, experts said."" ...... the British Growers Association says one of the big issues arising from Brexit for the fresh produce sector - attracting workers from EU countries - has been mitigated by the Seasonal Workers Permit Scheme."Why is it just the UK that is short of fresh food?: "The location of the UK and its isolation from mainland Europe, however, has played a significant part and is the differentiator from the situation in EU countries without shortages of fruit and vegetables." “It is less costly for a supplier to supply to the Netherlands and other countries in the northern part, because they don't have these 25 miles of the English Channel to negotiate because that adds a cost,” said Chris White of Fruit Net."There is a shortage so foreign producers as less inclined to send to the UK and avoid border controls that are there to protect consumers and prefer to sell within the EU.
Fair play Mr Coke you can always be relied upon to raise a chuckle The clue is in your own post last paragraph highlighted When produce yields are unseasonably less than normal of course producers will choose Markets that are easier to supply. UK in their wisdom decided to put up additional red tape and cost making the decision a no brainer. So much for Food Security You have previously relied on whataboutery to justify Brexit, obviously this won't work in this case as: There are no fruit shortages in EU Heck there are no shortages in Kherson on the Black Sea
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Feb 25, 2023 13:54:26 GMT
I am off to Portugal tomorrow for a few days. If anyone wants any tomatoes or fresh veg bringing back, just let me know. You have posted on the wrong thread, the shortages are very little if anything to do with Brexit. The primary cause are extreme weather, energy costs, and UK government policy on energy making UK electricity costs the highest in Europe. Despite the UK's economic performance being at least as good if not better than its peers, It seems that since the UK has left the EU that every problem the country faces us due to Brexit not the pandemic, the war in Ukraine, or UK government policies. Rabid anti Brexit journalists, tweeters, and posters blame everything that is unsatisfactory on Brexit. Regarding the food shortages in the UK. This article by the Guardian: www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/22/problem-shortage-fresh-food-uk-supermarkets identifies the reasons as: "poor weather reducing the harvest in Europe and north Africa, as well lower supplies from UK and Dutch producers hit by the jump in energy bills to heat glasshouses". The UK, other countries and the Netherlands in particular, " have reduced how many crops they have planted over the winter" due to the soaring costs of "energy required to light and heat greenhouses and the cost of the fertiliser used on plants." " Faced with higher costs for glasshouse crops, some retailers chose to rely more heavily this year on sourcing from Spain and north Africa, leaving them more vulnerable to the weather-triggered shortages." UK businesses have received less financial support from the government than their European counterparts. There is no mention of Brexit in the above article, which I'm sure the Guardian would do if there was any reason. The UK is highly dependent on imports at this time of year with a substantial amount from the EU. Those EU countries are producing less because of energy costs and fertiliser costs so naturally they are going to satisfy their home markets before exporting food. These are even some foolish people blaming a shortage of people to harvest crops in the UK in the muddle of winter! You really couldn't make it up. The last time anyone mentioned crop pickers shortages was last August. An independent source has carried out an unbiased investigation: www.euronews.com/green/2023/02/24/fact-check-is-brexit-to-blame-for-britains-fruit-and-vegetable-shortagesThis report finds "Contrary to some of the reaction on social media, Brexit has a minimal role to play in the immediate shortage, according to experts.""Unusual weather is primarily to be blamed for the short supply, according to Andrew Opie, director of the British Retail Consortium which represents all the major supermarkets""The situation was aggravated by diminished tomato production in greenhouses of big producer countries like the Netherlands, primarily due to high energy costs, experts said."" ...... the British Growers Association says one of the big issues arising from Brexit for the fresh produce sector - attracting workers from EU countries - has been mitigated by the Seasonal Workers Permit Scheme."Why is it just the UK that is short of fresh food?: "The location of the UK and its isolation from mainland Europe, however, has played a significant part and is the differentiator from the situation in EU countries without shortages of fruit and vegetables." “It is less costly for a supplier to supply to the Netherlands and other countries in the northern part, because they don't have these 25 miles of the English Channel to negotiate because that adds a cost,” said Chris White of Fruit Net."There is a shortage so foreign producers as less inclined to send to the UK and avoid border controls that are there to protect consumers and prefer to sell within the EU. From your links: " Navigating extra Brexit-imposed cost and bureaucracy of getting the fresh fruit and vegetables across the Channel is clearly proving too costly for some producers, which is why tomatoes are reaching supermarkets in France, Belgium or the Netherlands but not Britain."
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Post by prettything on Feb 25, 2023 13:54:46 GMT
Brexit does indeed play a role in extreme events like this. UK buyers are unable to source other suppliers within the EU as quickly as if they were in it. Paperwork and other administrative procedures have to be undertaken and slows down the process considerably compared to EU members in sourcing other suppliers . That’s way this situation may last for weeks rather than days. Why are Ireland struggling with tomato shortages? I imagine it’s a combination of issues in regard to Ireland. Why is there no shortages in the rest of the EU?
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Post by wannabee on Feb 25, 2023 14:02:51 GMT
Brexit does indeed play a role in extreme events like this. UK buyers are unable to source other suppliers within the EU as quickly as if they were in it. Paperwork and other administrative procedures have to be undertaken and slows down the process considerably compared to EU members in sourcing other suppliers . That’s way this situation may last for weeks rather than days. Why are Ireland struggling with tomato shortages? Location, location, location A considerable amount or fruit produce destined for Ireland North/South arrive from Mainland Europe via Tunnel I'd be surprised if supply chain channels to Southern Ireland are not urgently rerouted to sea direct
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Post by Davef on Feb 25, 2023 14:04:20 GMT
Why are Ireland struggling with tomato shortages? I imagine it’s a combination of issues in regard to Ireland. Why is there no shortages in the rest of the EU? Ireland are in the EU. What sets them aside from the rest of the other countries?
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Post by wannabee on Feb 25, 2023 14:06:52 GMT
See above
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Post by prettything on Feb 25, 2023 14:07:42 GMT
I know they are in the EU. The rest of the EU aren’t experiencing such problems.
Why is this?
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Post by mrcoke on Feb 25, 2023 15:00:46 GMT
You have posted on the wrong thread, the shortages are very little if anything to do with Brexit. The primary cause are extreme weather, energy costs, and UK government policy on energy making UK electricity costs the highest in Europe. Despite the UK's economic performance being at least as good if not better than its peers, It seems that since the UK has left the EU that every problem the country faces us due to Brexit not the pandemic, the war in Ukraine, or UK government policies. Rabid anti Brexit journalists, tweeters, and posters blame everything that is unsatisfactory on Brexit. Regarding the food shortages in the UK. This article by the Guardian: www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/22/problem-shortage-fresh-food-uk-supermarkets identifies the reasons as: "poor weather reducing the harvest in Europe and north Africa, as well lower supplies from UK and Dutch producers hit by the jump in energy bills to heat glasshouses". The UK, other countries and the Netherlands in particular, " have reduced how many crops they have planted over the winter" due to the soaring costs of "energy required to light and heat greenhouses and the cost of the fertiliser used on plants." " Faced with higher costs for glasshouse crops, some retailers chose to rely more heavily this year on sourcing from Spain and north Africa, leaving them more vulnerable to the weather-triggered shortages." UK businesses have received less financial support from the government than their European counterparts. There is no mention of Brexit in the above article, which I'm sure the Guardian would do if there was any reason. The UK is highly dependent on imports at this time of year with a substantial amount from the EU. Those EU countries are producing less because of energy costs and fertiliser costs so naturally they are going to satisfy their home markets before exporting food. These are even some foolish people blaming a shortage of people to harvest crops in the UK in the muddle of winter! You really couldn't make it up. The last time anyone mentioned crop pickers shortages was last August. An independent source has carried out an unbiased investigation: www.euronews.com/green/2023/02/24/fact-check-is-brexit-to-blame-for-britains-fruit-and-vegetable-shortagesThis report finds "Contrary to some of the reaction on social media, Brexit has a minimal role to play in the immediate shortage, according to experts.""Unusual weather is primarily to be blamed for the short supply, according to Andrew Opie, director of the British Retail Consortium which represents all the major supermarkets""The situation was aggravated by diminished tomato production in greenhouses of big producer countries like the Netherlands, primarily due to high energy costs, experts said."" ...... the British Growers Association says one of the big issues arising from Brexit for the fresh produce sector - attracting workers from EU countries - has been mitigated by the Seasonal Workers Permit Scheme."Why is it just the UK that is short of fresh food?: "The location of the UK and its isolation from mainland Europe, however, has played a significant part and is the differentiator from the situation in EU countries without shortages of fruit and vegetables." “It is less costly for a supplier to supply to the Netherlands and other countries in the northern part, because they don't have these 25 miles of the English Channel to negotiate because that adds a cost,” said Chris White of Fruit Net."There is a shortage so foreign producers as less inclined to send to the UK and avoid border controls that are there to protect consumers and prefer to sell within the EU. From your links: " Navigating extra Brexit-imposed cost and bureaucracy of getting the fresh fruit and vegetables across the Channel is clearly proving too costly for some producers, which is why tomatoes are reaching supermarkets in France, Belgium or the Netherlands but not Britain." As the link says it is a minimal issue. You are clutching at straws. If you were a producer in Spain and short of product due to the weather, and there is high demand in the Netherlands as the Dutch have reduced output due to energy and fertiliser costs, would you send it to them or the UK? Using red tape as an excuse is just a blind. The Channel is a far bigger barrier. All these problems have a silver lining. UK farming will be more profitable and drive investment in vertical farming, automation, robotics, etc. Most important agricultural workers will earn more money in the future and we have ended "slave labour" from Europe. The issues will get worse in the future. In decades to come it will be too hot to produce crops in Spain due to global warming. It is in our best long term interests now to reduce our dependence on the EU for food. We managed OK in the 50s when we just ate what was in season and bought produce from the Commonwealth.
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Post by cvillestokie on Feb 25, 2023 16:55:36 GMT
From your links: " Navigating extra Brexit-imposed cost and bureaucracy of getting the fresh fruit and vegetables across the Channel is clearly proving too costly for some producers, which is why tomatoes are reaching supermarkets in France, Belgium or the Netherlands but not Britain." As the link says it is a minimal issue. You are clutching at straws. If you were a producer in Spain and short of product due to the weather, and there is high demand in the Netherlands as the Dutch have reduced output due to energy and fertiliser costs, would you send it to them or the UK? Using red tape as an excuse is just a blind. The Channel is a far bigger barrier. All these problems have a silver lining. UK farming will be more profitable and drive investment in vertical farming, automation, robotics, etc. Most important agricultural workers will earn more money in the future and we have ended "slave labour" from Europe. The issues will get worse in the future. In decades to come it will be too hot to produce crops in Spain due to global warming. It is in our best long term interests now to reduce our dependence on the EU for food. We managed OK in the 50s when we just ate what was in season and bought produce from the Commonwealth. The population size has increased by about 30% since the 50’s. That not only means more mouths to feed, it also means less space available to feed them. What worked in the 50s may not work as well 70 years later.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Feb 25, 2023 17:41:50 GMT
As the link says it is a minimal issue. You are clutching at straws. If you were a producer in Spain and short of product due to the weather, and there is high demand in the Netherlands as the Dutch have reduced output due to energy and fertiliser costs, would you send it to them or the UK? Using red tape as an excuse is just a blind. The Channel is a far bigger barrier. All these problems have a silver lining. UK farming will be more profitable and drive investment in vertical farming, automation, robotics, etc. Most important agricultural workers will earn more money in the future and we have ended "slave labour" from Europe. The issues will get worse in the future. In decades to come it will be too hot to produce crops in Spain due to global warming. It is in our best long term interests now to reduce our dependence on the EU for food. We managed OK in the 50s when we just ate what was in season and bought produce from the Commonwealth. The population size has increased by about 30% since the 50’s. That not only means more mouths to feed, it also means less space available to feed them. What worked in the 50s may not work as well 70 years later. Going back to the 50s seems to underpin much of the thinking of many Brexiteers. That and wlifully ignoring any evidence that shows how damaging Brexit is. Everyone knows it, most people acknowledge it. Obviously, some are so dug in now that it's impossible to do so for fear of losing face, which is a shame. Imagine the excuses that'll be necessary if we ever implement the import controls we've been avoiding for over two years now! whatukthinks.org/eu/questions/in-highsight-do-you-think-britain-was-right-or-wrong-to-vote-to-leave-the-eu/Hopefully, this increasing awareness of the historic nature of our mistake will make it easier for politicians to make slow, steady moves to undo all the damage.
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Post by wannabee on Feb 25, 2023 18:15:05 GMT
From your links: " Navigating extra Brexit-imposed cost and bureaucracy of getting the fresh fruit and vegetables across the Channel is clearly proving too costly for some producers, which is why tomatoes are reaching supermarkets in France, Belgium or the Netherlands but not Britain." As the link says it is a minimal issue. You are clutching at straws. If you were a producer in Spain and short of product due to the weather, and there is high demand in the Netherlands as the Dutch have reduced output due to energy and fertiliser costs, would you send it to them or the UK? Using red tape as an excuse is just a blind. The Channel is a far bigger barrier. All these problems have a silver lining. UK farming will be more profitable and drive investment in vertical farming, automation, robotics, etc. Most important agricultural workers will earn more money in the future and we have ended "slave labour" from Europe. The issues will get worse in the future. In decades to come it will be too hot to produce crops in Spain due to global warming. It is in our best long term interests now to reduce our dependence on the EU for food. We managed OK in the 50s when we just ate what was in season and bought produce from the Commonwealth. You are Terese Coffey, which is a bit of a Turnup and I claim my £5
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Post by Davef on Feb 25, 2023 18:35:27 GMT
I know they are in the EU. The rest of the EU aren’t experiencing such problems. Why is this? Ireland are an EU country. If Brexit is the reason why there's a shortage of tomatoes in the UK, why do they have a shortage?
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Post by prettything on Feb 25, 2023 18:48:07 GMT
I know they are in the EU. The rest of the EU aren’t experiencing such problems. Why is this? Ireland are an EU country. If Brexit is the reason why there's a shortage of tomatoes in the UK, why do they have a shortage? Why does the rest of Europe have tomatoes but Ireland doesn’t? Maybe suppliers are concentrating on mainland Europe because it’s cheaper, and with rising logistical costs and Ireland being a pretty small customer than when the whole of the UK was a member of the EU, suppliers are finding it less cost effective? What do you think is the reason? (I never said it was THE reason,I did say it was a contributing factor for the UK, due to difficulties in changing suppliers in EU based trade)
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Post by smallthorner on Feb 25, 2023 19:52:07 GMT
Ireland are an EU country. If Brexit is the reason why there's a shortage of tomatoes in the UK, why do they have a shortage? Why does the rest of Europe have tomatoes but Ireland doesn’t? Maybe suppliers are concentrating on mainland Europe because it’s cheaper, and with rising logistical costs and Ireland being a pretty small customer than when the whole of the UK was a member of the EU, suppliers are finding it less cost effective? What do you think is the reason? (I never said it was THE reason,I did say it was a contributing factor for the UK, due to difficulties in changing suppliers in EU based trade) Correct. Particulary issues with Holland.
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Post by wannabee on Feb 25, 2023 19:54:35 GMT
I know they are in the EU. The rest of the EU aren’t experiencing such problems. Why is this? Ireland are an EU country. If Brexit is the reason why there's a shortage of tomatoes in the UK, why do they have a shortage? You've asked the same question 3 times which I've answered twice. I'll have another go Some Quotes from Belfast News Letter Newspaper Mr Lappin said that the empty shelves in supermarkets may be down to using different supply chains.
A lot of the supermarket products come via England so there’s issues there coming via Belfast port. With the wholesalers here that 99% of independent greengrocers buy from, their produce is imported and brought through Dublin so there’s no issues that way.”As I explained earlier many Multinational Supermarkets (Tesco, Asda, M&S, Lidl etc) buy fruit from EU and transport to UK via Tunnel and then onward to Northern or Southern Ireland. Supermarkets in Southern Ireland who buy from EU and Ship from Mainland Europe to Dublin have no supply problem as the Article states www.newsletter.co.uk/news/national/tomato-shortage-asda-and-tesco-in-northern-ireland-introduce-customer-limit-of-three-on-certain-fruit-and-veg-4037757
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Post by mrcoke on Feb 25, 2023 19:55:55 GMT
Ireland are an EU country. If Brexit is the reason why there's a shortage of tomatoes in the UK, why do they have a shortage? Why does the rest of Europe have tomatoes but Ireland doesn’t? Maybe suppliers are concentrating on mainland Europe because it’s cheaper, and with rising logistical costs and Ireland being a pretty small customer than when the whole of the UK was a member of the EU, suppliers are finding it less cost effective? What do you think is the reason? (I never said it was THE reason,I did say it was a contributing factor for the UK, due to difficulties in changing suppliers in EU based trade) Here is an explanation from Ireland: www.irishtimes.com/food/2023/02/21/supply-of-vegetables-to-ireland-disrupted-by-poor-weather-and-energy-costs/
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Post by wannabee on Feb 25, 2023 20:23:55 GMT
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Post by generationex on Feb 25, 2023 21:35:17 GMT
My Dad lives in France. He can’t come back too often these days because he has a dog and it’s now a major hassle.
I asked about the food shortages and he had no idea what I was on about.
Sooner or later those that caused this never ending chaos must take responsibility. My instinct is (as it was at the time) that their dogma - and lack of humility - will always deny the increasingly obvious failures that will become more apparent as the excuses run out. Their fall back will be : ‘not enough Brexit’.
It takes a strong mind to accept your belief system was based in fantasy.
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Feb 25, 2023 22:06:01 GMT
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Post by mrcoke on Feb 25, 2023 22:44:51 GMT
This post is in reply to the posts responding to my post on the fallacy that Brexit is to blame for food shortages. When I talk about returning to the 1950s I mean in terms of eating/consumer habits, i.e. such things as eating food in season and less red meat which is in decline, less packaging/ more loose products, paper bags, glass bottles, etc. For example Britain is almost totally self-sufficient in strawberries from May through to October, but imports massively during the winter and is only 65% self-sufficient overall. We could be totally self sufficient - see below. In terms of food self sufficiency the 1950s was a low point in UK history. During the subsequent decades self sufficiency improved to a peak in the 1980s, but then went into a decline due to cheap food available from Europe. In 1984, the UK was 95% self-sufficient in indigenous food types, by 2009 it had dropped to 72%. The EU CAP subsidised farmers throughout Europe to massively over produce making food cheap and plentiful. We all have got into the habit of walking into supermarkets and buying any produce on any day of the year and wasting huge amounts throughout the food chain. People talk about crops rotting in fields due to lack of labour, but the reality is crops were rotting in fields before 2016 due to over production and supermarkets opting for the cheapest supplier. The Dutch and Belgians have proven to be the most astute investing heavily in modern methods, better produce, and becoming the most food productive nations in the world. In the last 20 years the Dutch have doubled production of food, pioneered cell-cultured meat, vertical farming, seed technology and robotics in milking and harvesting. There are 24,000 acres of greenhouses. In terms of water consumption the Dutch are 50 times more efficient at producing tomatoes than the world average. So just a small % reduction in their production is going to impact on their exports to other countries. As a consequence the UK has grown increasingly dependent on imports. UK farming has failed to keep up with the modern methods in the world. This has been particularly true in the case of productivity; where other nations have invested heavily in automation, robotics, and vertical farming, the UK has depended on cheap labour from southern and Eastern Europe. This all has to change for two main reasons. Climate change is going to reduce harvests in southern Europe. The CAP has encouraged intensive farming and a huge dependence on chemicals for fertilisers and pesticides, which are polluting Europe's waters and has to stop in the long term. This begs the question will the UK change? The answer is it is already changing as I have been posting in my quarterly reviews. Who is doing the investing in vertical farming in the UK? The Dutch are: www.agritechfuture.com/vertical-farming/taste-of-the-future-vertical-farming-is-finally-growing-up-in-the-uk/Climate change is working to the UK's advantage with wine production growing rapidly. The same will happen with other crops. The UK is close to self sufficiency in a number of food products namely beef, lamb, milk, poultry, eggs, wheat, and some root vegetables. We can do much better, for example Belgium is the world’s top exporter of pre-cooked potato products, with 90 per cent of its production exported to over 100 countries. The UK consume the most frozen potatoes in Europe, eating around 1.1m tonnes, and imports circa 760,000 tonnes pa. We could produce all our own potatoes. Regarding other produce "within the next 10 years, the UK could be in a position where we no longer have to fly in soft fruits and herbs from southern Europe, North Africa, the Caribbean or anywhere else” according to: www.euronews.com/green/2022/06/09/world-s-largest-vertical-farm-is-being-built-in-the-uk-and-it-s-the-size-of-96-tennis-courWhilst self sufficiency is important, security is more important and the UK needs to spread its dependency, which is also happening with trade deals, free from EU interference.
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