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Post by Huddysleftfoot on May 9, 2021 15:23:51 GMT
We're agreed on Ireland. I am campaigning against the constant lies and distortions propagated by anti Brexiteers. I am satisfied with Brexit in that we have broken free of laws made by Brussels enforced by a European Court and no longer on a ship travelling towards a European united states. We are free to make our own laws like USA, Australia, Canada, Japan etc. Laws made by a parliament elected by the British people. I refute that it is bad for the UK economy in the long term and have always conceded that there will short term adverse impacts of leaving a customs union that has been getting tighter and tighter for the last 40 years. When we joined the EEC, Commonwealth countries had to go through huge change having lost much of their UK market. We will have to go through a similar change, but start from a position of having an existing large degree of business with the EU and a trade deal. Just as a matter of interest could you clarify which European laws you didn't like and which laws we were not free to make ourselves. I'd be keen to find out too.
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Post by mrcoke on May 9, 2021 15:55:47 GMT
Just as a matter of interest could you clarify which European laws you didn't like and which laws we were not free to make ourselves. I'd be keen to find out too. Do you only post, or do you actually read other posts? See my response in paragraph 3 , three posts above. I would have thought you more than most on Oatcake would have been opposed to the capitalist dominated European Union. As 4372 points out above the EU's birth started with the corporate interests of the coal and steel industries after WWII. Since then it has steadily evolved increasing control of individual nations and ensuring Europe is run in the interests of big business, with schemes like the CAP which ensure vast amounts of tax payers money goes to the richest farmers. Please read and study these links: www.briefingsforbritain.co.uk/angela-merkel-the-end-of-hopey-changey-eu/www.alter-eu.org/corporate-capture-in-europe-when-big-business-dominates-policy-making-and-threatens-our-right
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Post by mrcoke on May 9, 2021 16:16:26 GMT
Happy Europe Day 2021 The "Europe Day" of the EU was introduced in 1985 by the European Communities (the predecessor organisation of the EU).The date commemorates Schumann Declaration of 9 May 1950, put forward by Robert Schuman, which proposed the pooling of French and West German coal and steel industries. This led to the creation of the European Coal and Steel Community, the first European Community, established on 18 April 1951. Happy Europe Day to you. I am a European and worked for many years for European bosses and had some great colleagues I fondly remember. On this day we should remember the words of one of the founders of European unity: “Europe’s nations should be guided towards the superstate without their people understanding what is happening. This can be accomplished by successive steps, each disguised as having an economic purpose, but which will eventually and irreversibly lead to federation.” en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_MonetHe should have added " in the interests of the capitalist corporations"
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Post by Huddysleftfoot on May 9, 2021 18:31:26 GMT
I'm not necessarily arguing with you. What makes you think capitalism will be any better now we're out? I also was also under the impression that we have always been a sovereign nation.
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Post by mrcoke on May 9, 2021 18:53:48 GMT
On Europe Day there was a wonderful story on The Antiques Roadshow about a WWI stretcher bearer who saved the life of a 20 year old German soldier in the trenches. They were friends for the rest of their lives into their 90s.
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on May 9, 2021 21:41:53 GMT
Happy Europe Day 2021 The "Europe Day" of the EU was introduced in 1985 by the European Communities (the predecessor organisation of the EU).The date commemorates Schumann Declaration of 9 May 1950, put forward by Robert Schuman, which proposed the pooling of French and West German coal and steel industries. This led to the creation of the European Coal and Steel Community, the first European Community, established on 18 April 1951. Happy Europe Day to you. I am a European and worked for many years for European bosses and had some great colleagues I fondly remember. On this day we should remember the words of one of the founders of European unity: “Europe’s nations should be guided towards the superstate without their people understanding what is happening. This can be accomplished by successive steps, each disguised as having an economic purpose, but which will eventually and irreversibly lead to federation.” en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_MonetHe should have added " in the interests of the capitalist corporations"I don't want to undermine your point, but you've attributed a quote that was never said to a man who has never been accused of saying it. fullfact.org/europe/jean-monnet-quote/
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Post by 4372 on May 9, 2021 21:44:04 GMT
Happy Europe Day 2021 The "Europe Day" of the EU was introduced in 1985 by the European Communities (the predecessor organisation of the EU).The date commemorates Schumann Declaration of 9 May 1950, put forward by Robert Schuman, which proposed the pooling of French and West German coal and steel industries. This led to the creation of the European Coal and Steel Community, the first European Community, established on 18 April 1951. Happy Europe Day to you. I am a European and worked for many years for European bosses and had some great colleagues I fondly remember. On this day we should remember the words of one of the founders of European unity: “Europe’s nations should be guided towards the superstate without their people understanding what is happening. This can be accomplished by successive steps, each disguised as having an economic purpose, but which will eventually and irreversibly lead to federation.” en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_MonetHe should have added " in the interests of the capitalist corporations"You must be struggling Sir, if that is your argument. It has taken me less than two minutes to ascertain that that particular quote is of extremely dubious origin. Can I ask if you have established the provenance at all, because at first glance it has HUGE RED FLAGS about it's authenticity. I am sure that you would not want to be using fake quotes in support of your argument.
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Post by mrcoke on May 9, 2021 23:03:32 GMT
Happy Europe Day to you. I am a European and worked for many years for European bosses and had some great colleagues I fondly remember. On this day we should remember the words of one of the founders of European unity: “Europe’s nations should be guided towards the superstate without their people understanding what is happening. This can be accomplished by successive steps, each disguised as having an economic purpose, but which will eventually and irreversibly lead to federation.” en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_MonetHe should have added " in the interests of the capitalist corporations"You must be struggling Sir, if that is your argument. It has taken me less than two minutes to ascertain that that particular quote is of extremely dubious origin. Can I ask if you have established the provenance at all, because at first glance it has HUGE RED FLAGS about it's authenticity. I am sure that you would not want to be using fake quotes in support of your argument. I stand corrected. I would not want to attribute a quotation if was false. If it is indeed false, I unequivocally revoke it; I will not repeat it. I would question though that a quotation that has been generally in circulation for decades should only be deemed questionable as recently as 2017. The problem is of course nowadays people only search back as far as the start of the www. I wonder how far Fullfact searched? As one young lady said to me a couple of years ago, " It must me true I read it on the internet".I think we all know what "ever closer union" means to the Brussels bureaucrats that is referred to in the various treaties. It ultimately means a super state. Maastricht being the critical point in time when it was agreed EU law took precedence over individual national law, and the concept of European citizenship was introduced. Cameron was rebuffed when he tried to exempt the UK from ever closer union, which was too late as Major had sold the country down the river. If Blair had got his way, we would have lost our currency as well, but Brown blocked that, thank God. It is also clear there is no means of reversing the process of ever closer union, as all legislation is drafted by the EU Commission and arbitrated by the ECJ, which has powers over individual states. European Union supporters should really think out the implications of that. The Commission will not be putting forward policies to reverse legislation as "turkeys don't vote for Christmas". Regarding my " argument", I refer you to my reasons for leaving the EU spelt out on 24th October last year, page 1,233. To which I have added my environmental reasons for leaving the EU on page 1,364.
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Post by 4372 on May 10, 2021 8:15:06 GMT
Good on you for acknowledging the apparent falsehood here. I don't have to trawl through French historical documents now..... I can imagine a few on here who would have responded differently to being challenged.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on May 10, 2021 8:18:44 GMT
Happy Europe Day to you. I am a European and worked for many years for European bosses and had some great colleagues I fondly remember. On this day we should remember the words of one of the founders of European unity: “Europe’s nations should be guided towards the superstate without their people understanding what is happening. This can be accomplished by successive steps, each disguised as having an economic purpose, but which will eventually and irreversibly lead to federation.” en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_MonetHe should have added " in the interests of the capitalist corporations"You must be struggling Sir, if that is your argument. It has taken me less than two minutes to ascertain that that particular quote is of extremely dubious origin. Can I ask if you have established the provenance at all, because at first glance it has HUGE RED FLAGS about it's authenticity. I am sure that you would not want to be using fake quotes in support of your argument. Yeah, I wouldn't have thought the renowned but mainly 19th century French impressionist painter had much to say on the European super-state, but you never know
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Post by mrcoke on May 10, 2021 8:46:35 GMT
You must be struggling Sir, if that is your argument. It has taken me less than two minutes to ascertain that that particular quote is of extremely dubious origin. Can I ask if you have established the provenance at all, because at first glance it has HUGE RED FLAGS about it's authenticity. I am sure that you would not want to be using fake quotes in support of your argument. Yeah, I wouldn't have thought the renowned but mainly 19th century French impressionist painter had much to say on the European super-state, but you never know That damn predictive text again!
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Post by 4372 on May 10, 2021 8:50:16 GMT
On Europe Day there was a wonderful story on The Antiques Roadshow about a WWI stretcher bearer who saved the life of a 20 year old German soldier in the trenches. They were friends for the rest of their lives into their 90s. This is a much easier quote to respond to, no problems here. This encapsulates my own ideas well. That the people of different countries have no animosity towards each other at all. I have two First World medals from grandads in the house. None of them spoke about the war when they came home apparently. So I can't say what they made of it all. I like to think though, that their interest was in making sure that no such war could happen again. Pretty much like the example you gave. And of course,they were let down by politicians in the 1930s. The origins of the EU lie in renewed attempts,after WW2 to make sure that people like you referred to on the TV show would never be asked to go to war with each other again. And yet,here we were in 2016. MPs of all people leading populist charges against French and German people, citing the twentieth century conflicts as a way forward. There were people posting on this thread with clear narrow-minded English nationalist views encouraged by populist politicians. I have argued on here before that some people who voted for Brexit are guilty of knowing the price of everything, and the value of nothing. In fairness, you have repeatedly come on here to list, the supposed financial benefits to the UK of leaving the EU as against the cost of remaining. I would refer to such measurements as the price of leaving. Then you mention these two men on the Antiques Road Show, and I think there, you have highlighted at last the value of staying.
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Post by mrcoke on May 10, 2021 9:16:45 GMT
Before someone latches onto this news: www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/labour-liz-truss-rishi-sunak-uk-government-prime-minister-b934170.htmlIt is another example of how out of touch with reality the Labour Party is. When we left the EU we would have had no trade agreements with all those countries the EU had established trade agreements (or "understandings"). If the government had done nothing the UK would have had to move the WTO conditions with those countries. Instead in very quick time Truss has managed to roll over the vast bulk of those agreements, so we have had seamless changeover with 60 - 70 countries. She has resisted some countries attempts to squeeze better conditions out of the UK, secured an improved deal with Japan, better than the EU deal with Japan, and got a commitment with Canada for an improved deal before the end of next year. It takes many years to negotiate a trade deal, 1000s of businesses have be consulted. To try and introduce free ports into any deals when they still don't actually exist is nonsense and could have delayed the trade deals achieved for months. Truss has managed to catch up with the EU on progress on trade deals with Australia and India, which the EU have been working on for years. Much of what Truss has done, anti Brexiteers said couldn't be achieved by "little GB", or would take years to achieve. She has done an amazing job. The EU are against free ports. Rotterdam enjoys a very priviledged position handling huge amounts of goods for other countries. The Dutch do not want to lose that business. It's all part of the "inner circle" of the EU enjoying the benefits of hosting the Parliaments, Commission, Courts, etc in Germany , France, and the low countries. I wonder how long it will be before the EU goes back to operating two bases for the parliament in Brussels and Strasbourg?
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on May 10, 2021 10:30:53 GMT
Yeah, I wouldn't have thought the renowned but mainly 19th century French impressionist painter had much to say on the European super-state, but you never know That damn predictive text again! Well, the joke was on me. I spent a good five minutes trying to find where Monet had said that, all the while thinking, bloody hell, that's a fair bit of foresight!, until I checked back and read 4372's post
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on May 10, 2021 10:37:43 GMT
On Europe Day there was a wonderful story on The Antiques Roadshow about a WWI stretcher bearer who saved the life of a 20 year old German soldier in the trenches. They were friends for the rest of their lives into their 90s. This is a much easier quote to respond to, no problems here. This encapsulates my own ideas well. That the people of different countries have no animosity towards each other at all. I have two First World medals from grandads in the house. None of them spoke about the war when they came home apparently. So I can't say what they made of it all. I like to think though, that their interest was in making sure that no such war could happen again. Pretty much like the example you gave. And of course,they were let down by politicians in the 1930s. The origins of the EU lie in renewed attempts,after WW2 to make sure that people like you referred to on the TV show would never be asked to go to war with each other again. And yet,here we were in 2016. MPs of all people leading populist charges against French and German people, citing the twentieth century conflicts as a way forward. There were people posting on this thread with clear narrow-minded English nationalist views encouraged by populist politicians. I have argued on here before that some people who voted for Brexit are guilty of knowing the price of everything, and the value of nothing. In fairness, you have repeatedly come on here to list, the supposed financial benefits to the UK of leaving the EU as against the cost of remaining. I would refer to such measurements as the price of leaving. Then you mention these two men on the Antiques Road Show, and I think there, you have highlighted at last the value of staying. Excellent post. Populism rarely proves to be a good way to go. It nearly always brings out the baser instincts in people with the result that it increases division rather than bringing people together, as we are now seeing in the UK as a whole, Scotland in particular, and all the flag-waving, legitimisation of anti-immigrant sentiment, hate-crime, phoney culture war and the like. And once you let that genie out of the bottle, you keep having to feed it more and more... (Irrelevant to Brexit, but that story reminds me of a similar one in The Railway Man, a great read and decent film portrayal too).
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Post by thevoid on May 10, 2021 10:57:13 GMT
This is a much easier quote to respond to, no problems here. This encapsulates my own ideas well. That the people of different countries have no animosity towards each other at all. I have two First World medals from grandads in the house. None of them spoke about the war when they came home apparently. So I can't say what they made of it all. I like to think though, that their interest was in making sure that no such war could happen again. Pretty much like the example you gave. And of course,they were let down by politicians in the 1930s. The origins of the EU lie in renewed attempts,after WW2 to make sure that people like you referred to on the TV show would never be asked to go to war with each other again. And yet,here we were in 2016. MPs of all people leading populist charges against French and German people, citing the twentieth century conflicts as a way forward. There were people posting on this thread with clear narrow-minded English nationalist views encouraged by populist politicians. I have argued on here before that some people who voted for Brexit are guilty of knowing the price of everything, and the value of nothing. In fairness, you have repeatedly come on here to list, the supposed financial benefits to the UK of leaving the EU as against the cost of remaining. I would refer to such measurements as the price of leaving. Then you mention these two men on the Antiques Road Show, and I think there, you have highlighted at last the value of staying. Excellent post. Populism rarely proves to be a good way to go. It nearly always brings out the baser instincts in people with the result that it increases division rather than bringing people together, as we are now seeing in the UK as a whole, Scotland in particular, and all the flag-waving, legitimisation of anti-immigrant sentiment, hate-crime, phoney culture war and the like. And once you let that genie out of the bottle, you keep having to feed it more and more... (Irrelevant to Brexit, but that story reminds me of a similar one in The Railway Man, a great read and decent film portrayal too). There's a lot of flag waving going on north of the border. In fact you could say the SNP are the ultimate populists.
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Post by 4372 on May 10, 2021 12:01:54 GMT
LOL I only appreciated the gaffe this morning, I think it was RRP who had nailed it early on. I was too busy checking the source and missed the incorrect source information.
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Post by The Drunken Communist on May 11, 2021 10:29:48 GMT
I see Mr.Barnier has had some interesting things to say, surprised no-one has mentioned it by now considering how loved he is by some on here.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on May 11, 2021 15:51:03 GMT
I see Mr.Barnier has had some interesting things to say, surprised no-one has mentioned it by now considering how loved he is by some on here. Don't recall anyone declaring their love for him Interesting thoughts though. Apparently he's considering a tilt at the French presidency. Obviously looked at Brexit and seen what kind of dog whistle tactics work well? Trying to steal a march on Le Pen?
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Post by wagsastokie on May 12, 2021 8:52:43 GMT
I see one of the first dividends of are long March out of European servitude Will be the ending of live animal exportation for slaughter and about time
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Post by partickpotter on May 12, 2021 13:29:04 GMT
I see one of the first dividends of are long March out of European servitude Will be the ending of live animal exportation for slaughter and about time Worth a wee read about what the RSPCA have to say about this news; UK set to become the first European country to ban live animal exportsAnd worth confirming that banning live animal exports was not possible while being a member of the EU: link
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on May 12, 2021 16:25:59 GMT
I see one of the first dividends of are long March out of European servitude Will be the ending of live animal exportation for slaughter and about time Worth a wee read about what the RSPCA have to say about this news; UK set to become the first European country to ban live animal exportsAnd worth confirming that banning live animal exports was not possible while being a member of the EU: linkWhilst this is indeed great news for animal welfare and the EU should follow suit, a word of caution: the government has launched a consultation on proposals to ban live exports. However, let's hope it goes ahead and the final 6,000 annually live exported animals, down from over a million previously, are saved from such conditions.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on May 13, 2021 19:56:40 GMT
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Post by numpty40 on May 13, 2021 20:10:03 GMT
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on May 13, 2021 20:20:18 GMT
From the article linked I see we need to pull our fingers out on those new Trade Deals and make sure we're net beneficiaries: "The trade balance with non-EU countries rose to -£6.55BN in March, deeper than the -£3.50BN markets were expecting." and "ING tell clients there will continue to be a slow-burning impact of new trade frictions on the UK economy, even if the immediate teething problems have passed."So it seems we're still very much in Brexit damage limitation territory.
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Post by numpty40 on May 13, 2021 21:45:29 GMT
From the article linked I see we need to pull our fingers out on those new Trade Deals and make sure we're net beneficiaries: "The trade balance with non-EU countries rose to -£6.55BN in March, deeper than the -£3.50BN markets were expecting." and "ING tell clients there will continue to be a slow-burning impact of new trade frictions on the UK economy, even if the immediate teething problems have passed."So it seems we're still very much in Brexit damage limitation territory.
We're four months into an independent UK and you see the negatives whereas I see the positives: a) The findings suggest the UK's trade position with the rest of the world is improving and should go some way to quell fears over the countries persistent current account deficit, which is said by currency analysts to be an anchor on long-term Pound Sterling valuations. b) An interesting statistic was reported by the ONS in that the UK imported more goods from non-EU countries than from the EU during the first quarter of 2021, the first time it had done so since records began in January 1997. c) The findings made by the ONS show that the import of goods from non-EU countries, excluding precious metals, increased by £1.5BN (8.4%) in March 2021; mainly driven by imports of clothing. d) Imports of goods from the EU, excluding precious metals, stood at £0.8BN (4.5%) in March 2021. e) The boost in exports meant the UK recorded a smaller than expected trade deficit in March at -£11.71B, which is less than the -£14.40BN markets were anticipating. Your counter argument is the trade balance with non-EU countries rose to -£6.55BN in March, deeper than the -£3.50BN markets were expecting, however the UK trade deficit with the EU prior to Brexit was £79 billion....
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on May 13, 2021 22:51:44 GMT
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Post by mrcoke on May 13, 2021 23:14:08 GMT
The anti Brexit press are scouring every bit of information to seek justification for their position opposing Brexit. It is logical that leaving a customs union after 40 years membership is bound to have an immediate and adverse effect on trade and commerce generally, just as the immediate benefit is the UK is no longer subject to EU regulations (except goods supplied to the EU), the ECOJ (except where we have conceded a specific agreement) The government has already proposed legislation that is not permitted in the EU, which I have already given examples of in previous posts. It will of course take years to reap the full benefits of leaving the EU. It is notable how the anti Brexiteers change their tune each month. Prior to the trade agreement being struck with the EU last December, they were mocking the huge traffic congestion at the ports, but as soon as the agreement is struck the congestion went away and there is no need for lorry parks. Then there were wild claims about the "collapse" of trade in January with large % quoted. No mention that it might be due to the amount of stock building done in December causing the traffic delays, the lock-down, and the fact that many lorry driver were turned back because they did not have proof of a clear Covid test. Also no mention that trade in the opposite direction was also down by a large degree and the UK actually improved its trade balance with the EU! Now the export levels are returning to normal we are getting sad articles saying effectively: well exports may be getting back to normal, but they are less than they would have been had the UK stayed in the EU. Prior to the referendum we had project fear with all sorts of scare stories which have all virtually proved to be untrue - remember the ones about recession, unemployment, house price collapse? Yes there are some minorities who have suffered from Brexit like Northern Ireland and the fishing industry. The fishing industry though is entering a five year transition in quotas and will be in a different position by then. The graph link (see below*) in the post above is interesting as it starts in 2016 the year of the referendum, the result of which was going to destroy our economy. The reality in subsequent years is that the UK had all time record employment, the lowest unemployment for over 40 years, and record exports in 2018 and 2019. The anti Brexit response was " Well we haven't left yet".
I keep my ear close to the ground and whilst some business sectors have lost out from Brexit like fishing, food exports (why is a country dependant on 60 to 80% of its food being imported (depending on whose figures you believe or how you measure it) getting upset about being unable to sell milk and cheese to the EU?), and London financiers (my heart bleeds), most business people are more optimistic about the future economy than ever before in our history. www.theguardian.com/business/2021/apr/12/optimism-business-uk-leaders-record-high-bouncebackwww.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-9459455/Optimism-Britains-business-leaders-hits-record-levels.htmlblogs.deloitte.co.uk/mondaybriefing/2021/04/cfo-optimism-reaches-record-levels.htmlThe economy is only starting to recover from the pandemic and only starting to adjust to life outside the EU, yet in March 2021 the UK exported more than in March 2016. Unemployment is lower than expected and the recovery is faster than expected but the anti Brexit band wagon continues the knock the UK. Things could hardly be further from the doom and gloom forecast by anti Brexiteers. In 2019 we saw a slow down in UK investment as many companies in the UK and foreign investors wanted to wait to see if a trade deal would be struck between the UK and the EU. Consequently a lot of investors held back projects. Then the pandemic caused a further hiatus in investment. Now that business is returning to normal that planned investment is being released and there is a tsunami of investment in the UK. businesscloud.co.uk/investment-in-uk-fintech-hits-record-levels/www.theguardian.com/business/2021/may/02/investors-flock-to-life-science-as-uk-firms-break-funding-recordHaving said all the above, I think there should also be a note of caution. With governments around the world pumping money into their economies to promote post pandemic economic recovery, and the restrictions of travel and mobility of labour, there is a danger of shortages, companies outbidding one another for resources, shortage of some resources, and significant increases in wages. These could generate serious inflation, so governments must exercise a degree of caution and react according to conditions. Provided the pitfalls of capitalism are avoided, there is every reason to be confident that now the UK is out of the grip of the EU, the country can now start to be more self sufficient and get the trade balance back into balance after decades of decline, taking advantage of the rapidly growing world markets. * www.cer.eu/insights/cost-brexit-march-2021
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Post by crapslinger on May 14, 2021 6:06:52 GMT
The anti Brexit press are scouring every bit of information to seek justification for their position opposing Brexit. It is logical that leaving a customs union after 40 years membership is bound to have an immediate and adverse effect on trade and commerce generally, just as the immediate benefit is the UK is no longer subject to EU regulations (except goods supplied to the EU), the ECOJ (except where we have conceded a specific agreement) The government has already proposed legislation that is not permitted in the EU, which I have already given examples of in previous posts. It will of course take years to reap the full benefits of leaving the EU. It is notable how the anti Brexiteers change their tune each month. Prior to the trade agreement being struck with the EU last December, they were mocking the huge traffic congestion at the ports, but as soon as the agreement is struck the congestion went away and there is no need for lorry parks. Then there were wild claims about the "collapse" of trade in January with large % quoted. No mention that it might be due to the amount of stock building done in December causing the traffic delays, the lock-down, and the fact that many lorry driver were turned back because they did not have proof of a clear Covid test. Also no mention that trade in the opposite direction was also down by a large degree and the UK actually improved its trade balance with the EU! Now the export levels are returning to normal we are getting sad articles saying effectively: well exports may be getting back to normal, but they are less than they would have been had the UK stayed in the EU. Prior to the referendum we had project fear with all sorts of scare stories which have all virtually proved to be untrue - remember the ones about recession, unemployment, house price collapse? Yes there are some minorities who have suffered from Brexit like Northern Ireland and the fishing industry. The fishing industry though is entering a five year transition in quotas and will be in a different position by then. The graph link (see below*) in the post above is interesting as it starts in 2016 the year of the referendum, the result of which was going to destroy our economy. The reality in subsequent years is that the UK had all time record employment, the lowest unemployment for over 40 years, and record exports in 2018 and 2019. The anti Brexit response was " Well we haven't left yet".
I keep my ear close to the ground and whilst some business sectors have lost out from Brexit like fishing, food exports (why is a country dependant on 60 to 80% of its food being imported (depending on whose figures you believe or how you measure it) getting upset about being unable to sell milk and cheese to the EU?), and London financiers (my heart bleeds), most business people are more optimistic about the future economy than ever before in our history. www.theguardian.com/business/2021/apr/12/optimism-business-uk-leaders-record-high-bouncebackwww.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-9459455/Optimism-Britains-business-leaders-hits-record-levels.htmlblogs.deloitte.co.uk/mondaybriefing/2021/04/cfo-optimism-reaches-record-levels.htmlThe economy is only starting to recover from the pandemic and only starting to adjust to life outside the EU, yet in March 2021 the UK exported more than in March 2016. Unemployment is lower than expected and the recovery is faster than expected but the anti Brexit band wagon continues the knock the UK. Things could hardly be further from the doom and gloom forecast by anti Brexiteers. In 2019 we saw a slow down in UK investment as many companies in the UK and foreign investors wanted to wait to see if a trade deal would be struck between the UK and the EU. Consequently a lot of investors held back projects. Then the pandemic caused a further hiatus in investment. Now that business is returning to normal that planned investment is being released and there is a tsunami of investment in the UK. businesscloud.co.uk/investment-in-uk-fintech-hits-record-levels/www.theguardian.com/business/2021/may/02/investors-flock-to-life-science-as-uk-firms-break-funding-recordHaving said all the above, I think there should also be a note of caution. With governments around the world pumping money into their economies to promote post pandemic economic recovery, and the restrictions of travel and mobility of labour, there is a danger of shortages, companies outbidding one another for resources, shortage of some resources, and significant increases in wages. These could generate serious inflation, so governments must exercise a degree of caution and react according to conditions. Provided the pitfalls of capitalism are avoided, there is every reason to be confident that now the UK is out of the grip of the EU, the country can now start to be more self sufficient and get the trade balance back into balance after decades of decline, taking advantage of the rapidly growing world markets. * www.cer.eu/insights/cost-brexit-march-2021I wonder why 5 million EU citizens have applied for settled status here
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Post by thevoid on May 14, 2021 7:31:52 GMT
The anti Brexit press are scouring every bit of information to seek justification for their position opposing Brexit. It is logical that leaving a customs union after 40 years membership is bound to have an immediate and adverse effect on trade and commerce generally, just as the immediate benefit is the UK is no longer subject to EU regulations (except goods supplied to the EU), the ECOJ (except where we have conceded a specific agreement) The government has already proposed legislation that is not permitted in the EU, which I have already given examples of in previous posts. It will of course take years to reap the full benefits of leaving the EU. It is notable how the anti Brexiteers change their tune each month. Prior to the trade agreement being struck with the EU last December, they were mocking the huge traffic congestion at the ports, but as soon as the agreement is struck the congestion went away and there is no need for lorry parks. Then there were wild claims about the "collapse" of trade in January with large % quoted. No mention that it might be due to the amount of stock building done in December causing the traffic delays, the lock-down, and the fact that many lorry driver were turned back because they did not have proof of a clear Covid test. Also no mention that trade in the opposite direction was also down by a large degree and the UK actually improved its trade balance with the EU! Now the export levels are returning to normal we are getting sad articles saying effectively: well exports may be getting back to normal, but they are less than they would have been had the UK stayed in the EU. Prior to the referendum we had project fear with all sorts of scare stories which have all virtually proved to be untrue - remember the ones about recession, unemployment, house price collapse? Yes there are some minorities who have suffered from Brexit like Northern Ireland and the fishing industry. The fishing industry though is entering a five year transition in quotas and will be in a different position by then. The graph link (see below*) in the post above is interesting as it starts in 2016 the year of the referendum, the result of which was going to destroy our economy. The reality in subsequent years is that the UK had all time record employment, the lowest unemployment for over 40 years, and record exports in 2018 and 2019. The anti Brexit response was " Well we haven't left yet".
I keep my ear close to the ground and whilst some business sectors have lost out from Brexit like fishing, food exports (why is a country dependant on 60 to 80% of its food being imported (depending on whose figures you believe or how you measure it) getting upset about being unable to sell milk and cheese to the EU?), and London financiers (my heart bleeds), most business people are more optimistic about the future economy than ever before in our history. www.theguardian.com/business/2021/apr/12/optimism-business-uk-leaders-record-high-bouncebackwww.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-9459455/Optimism-Britains-business-leaders-hits-record-levels.htmlblogs.deloitte.co.uk/mondaybriefing/2021/04/cfo-optimism-reaches-record-levels.htmlThe economy is only starting to recover from the pandemic and only starting to adjust to life outside the EU, yet in March 2021 the UK exported more than in March 2016. Unemployment is lower than expected and the recovery is faster than expected but the anti Brexit band wagon continues the knock the UK. Things could hardly be further from the doom and gloom forecast by anti Brexiteers. In 2019 we saw a slow down in UK investment as many companies in the UK and foreign investors wanted to wait to see if a trade deal would be struck between the UK and the EU. Consequently a lot of investors held back projects. Then the pandemic caused a further hiatus in investment. Now that business is returning to normal that planned investment is being released and there is a tsunami of investment in the UK. businesscloud.co.uk/investment-in-uk-fintech-hits-record-levels/www.theguardian.com/business/2021/may/02/investors-flock-to-life-science-as-uk-firms-break-funding-recordHaving said all the above, I think there should also be a note of caution. With governments around the world pumping money into their economies to promote post pandemic economic recovery, and the restrictions of travel and mobility of labour, there is a danger of shortages, companies outbidding one another for resources, shortage of some resources, and significant increases in wages. These could generate serious inflation, so governments must exercise a degree of caution and react according to conditions. Provided the pitfalls of capitalism are avoided, there is every reason to be confident that now the UK is out of the grip of the EU, the country can now start to be more self sufficient and get the trade balance back into balance after decades of decline, taking advantage of the rapidly growing world markets. * www.cer.eu/insights/cost-brexit-march-2021It's like certain people on here gleefully wanting the country to fail in a desperate mission to be proven right. It's transparent as hell.
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